General Adulthood, Planning for the Future: Business, College, Budgeting, Investments, etc! $$$ - General

An update on the Acorns investment app: So far my account is up to $178, $40 of that was directly put in by me, the rest by automatic withdrawal of spare change in $5-$10 increments. So a great savings tool, but so far I do not have enough money in the account to earn more than pennies from the investments. But, I am earning from it. 10 cents here, 23 there. Still more than a savings account.

Budgeting program? I want to switch away from YNAB4 after it decided to erase all of my history from 2.12.16 to 10.04.2017 after upgrading Windows. I've seen some tools recommended here but it seems like you're tied to the USA or Canada if you want to make an account for the ones I've seen.

[QUOTE=PredGD;52085180]Budgeting program? I want to switch away from YNAB4 after it decided to erase all of my history from 2.12.16 to 10.04.2017 after upgrading Windows. I've seen some tools recommended here but it seems like you're tied to the USA or Canada if you want to make an account for the ones I've seen.[/QUOTE] i built my own excel spreadsheet. one sheet for an overview and summary and one sheet for logging expenses each month. can create my own categories and log the data however i want. really flexible that way. i'm sure google sheets will work as well if you dont have excel.

I know nothing about this stuff, but isn't there a few tiers of loans for college? first are like scholarships and stuff which you don't pay back, then government loans, then private loans right? So could one theoretically go to college without needing to get money from their family? I'm asking because my sister is graduating next month and my dad told me he paid 40k total over the 4 years. Like we don't have that kind of money, couldn't she have just got more loans?

Scholarships and grants are pretty much free money. No need to pay those back. Federal loans are provided by the government and can be broken down into two categories: Subsidized and unsubsidized. Subbed loans allow your interest to build without you having to pay it until you graduate. Unsubbed loans require interest to be paid after you take the loan out. Both types of loans, however, do not require actual monthly payment of the actual balance until after you graduate. Private or personal loans require you to start paying almost immediately after taking them out. These are usually from a personal bank or lender.

[QUOTE=Pascall;52092389]Scholarships and grants are pretty much free money. No need to pay those back. Federal loans are provided by the government and can be broken down into two categories: Subsidized and unsubsidized. Subbed loans allow your interest to build without you having to pay it until you graduate. Unsubbed loans require interest to be paid after you take the loan out. Both types of loans, however, do not require actual monthly payment of the actual balance until after you graduate. Private or personal loans require you to start paying almost immediately after taking them out. These are usually from a personal bank or lender.[/QUOTE] So she could have taken out more loans but would have had to start paying immediately? if the grants/gov loans don't pay enough you're basically screwed?

If she took the loans out from a private lender under the stipulation that she would have to begin payments immediately, yes. Some institutions also offer personal student loans which don't require payment until after graduation but it's dependent on the lender. But if you can't accrue enough money to pay per semester then yeah, essentially you're screwed. Which is why it's always necessary to fill out your FAFSA every year, apply for any and all scholarships that you're eligible for, and dont go beyond your means. I could never afford to go to CalArts and racking up $160,000 in student loans would be stupid so I'm not gonna do that. College is about exploiting all avenues of funding and always be aware of how much you're borrowing. People tend to forget that they need to pay everything back once they're done. [editline]12th April 2017[/editline] Do remember though, loan payments can be around 100-300 a month, dependent on the lender. So it's better than paying a few thousand dollars per semester up front.

[QUOTE=Pascall;52094282]If she took the loans out from a private lender under the stipulation that she would have to begin payments immediately, yes. Some institutions also offer personal student loans which don't require payment until after graduation but it's dependent on the lender. But if you can't accrue enough money to pay per semester then yeah, essentially you're screwed. Which is why it's always necessary to fill out your FAFSA every year, apply for any and all scholarships that you're eligible for, and dont go beyond your means. I could never afford to go to CalArts and racking up $160,000 in student loans would be stupid so I'm not gonna do that. College is about exploiting all avenues of funding and always be aware of how much you're borrowing. People tend to forget that they need to pay everything back once they're done. [editline]12th April 2017[/editline] Do remember though, loan payments can be around 100-300 a month, dependent on the lender. So it's better than paying a few thousand dollars per semester up front.[/QUOTE] I was just doing some thinking you know. I've been out of high school for 4 years and have done almost nothing. I got an A+ certification (entry level IT cert) and got promoted to team leader at my cleaning job and that's about it, no skills, no talents. If I wanted to do just community college I don't know if that would be possible without my parents helping at all (minus living conditions). I'm just a worryer because like I said my dad payed 40k over 4 years for my sister and my other sister wants to go to college too and we just can not afford this shit. and besides from leeching from them for 4 nearly 5 years now i've gotten nowhere. the funny thing is when my dad told me this last night he said that he wasn't actually worried about me, he was worried about my sister who is graduating soon (she's a year younger than me by the way).

Loans aren't so scary, honestly, as long as you only borrow what you need and have a plan to start making payments ASAP after graduation. If you really want to go back to school, find a community college which are obviously cheaper than universities, fill out your FAFSA, and see what sort of federal assistance you can get. Hard to determine whether or not its feasible to pay for until you know what sort of help you can get. My parents helped me through community college but after that, they cut me off from school help. I live at home under the stipulation that I get my degree and go to school, but I have to pay for it myself. Two years of University thus far has only cost me about 11k. I expect it to be around 15k or so when I actually graduate. Which, comparatively, isn't [I]awful.[/I] But I keep track of my loans, pay interest when I can, and never borrow any more money than I absolutely need. Unless your parents make an absurd amount of money, FAFSA will likely offer you [I]something.[/I]

[QUOTE=Pascall;52103097]Loans aren't so scary, honestly, as long as you only borrow what you need and have a plan to start making payments ASAP after graduation. If you really want to go back to school, find a community college which are obviously cheaper than universities, fill out your FAFSA, and see what sort of federal assistance you can get. Hard to determine whether or not its feasible to pay for until you know what sort of help you can get. My parents helped me through community college but after that, they cut me off from school help. I live at home under the stipulation that I get my degree and go to school, but I have to pay for it myself. Two years of University thus far has only cost me about 11k. I expect it to be around 15k or so when I actually graduate. Which, comparatively, isn't [I]awful.[/I] But I keep track of my loans, pay interest when I can, and never borrow any more money than I absolutely need. Unless your parents make an absurd amount of money, FAFSA will likely offer you [I]something.[/I][/QUOTE] I used to be scared of loans and debt but I realized (not on my own of course) that debt should be leveraged to earn you more money. so if I get loans to go to college it's presumably to get more money than I could have before.

I used to be scared of my student loan until it tanked my credit by almost 200 points just by virtue of it existing and ruining my credit to debt ratio. 100% repayment rate on my cards for 3 years, always low utilisation, etc, doesn't mean shit apparently. I was nearing the 800's with my credit score before I took out student loans. Now I'm down in the very low 600's. Now I just look at it with the knowledge that it's either going to literally be the death of me, or I'll spend decades recovering from it.

credit scores a fucking massive scam anyways it isn't about how trust worthy you are for debt. it is how likely you are to make lenders money. your score goes up slower the less interest you pay. also they're very liquid so don't worry about it. they can go down quickly but can also go up quickly.

After moving to another country and living alone for six months, I realize now that the hardest part of life is knowing what you are going to eat tonight. Will it be the same bread and ham you keep eating since last week or the canned soup you got at a discount ?

[QUOTE=thrawn2787;52109839]credit scores a fucking massive scam anyways it isn't about how trust worthy you are for debt. it is how likely you are to make lenders money. your score goes up slower the less interest you pay. also they're very liquid so don't worry about it. they can go down quickly but can also go up quickly.[/QUOTE] It doesn't really bother me so much anymore now that I'm pretty much 100% only temporarily in the US now, but it was one of those things I was taught was so important and worked so hard to get good credit. I knew it was a bullshit thing, but I worked hard to keep it good. It's just a really shitty feeling how I can seek to better my self, be a model of financial responsibility even, and be absolutely fucked at every turn for literally no logical reason. [editline]16th April 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Nanamil;52110012]After moving to another country and living alone for six months, I realize now that the hardest part of life is knowing what you are going to eat tonight. Will it be the same bread and ham you keep eating since last week or the canned soup you got at a discount ?[/QUOTE] Mate canned soup can be pretty great if you spice it up. Cooking is a chore yeah, but it's worth it to at least experiment with adding stuff to whatever you've got that's easy. I used to get loads of canned soups from Tesco because they were always on sale and mega cheap already. But eating the same bland soup sucks dick so I'd buy other stuff and add them to the soup to make it good. You don't gotta eat just bread and ham, get the ham warm in a pan, toast the bread, throw some lettuce, tomato, mayo and siracha on it, bam you've got a pretty good discount BLT. If you can afford bacon that's even better.

I'm thinking about investing some of my money into stocks. What are your thoughts on index funds? To me they seem like the best bet for someone who's saving for retirement and doesn't want to get too involved with economics and markets.

I don't know much about Sweden's system, but your country should have an equal or better thing to the IRA/Roth IRA we have in the US no? Your bank should also have some sort of private pension fund that allows you to invest into it and receive a tax rebate each year for that amount up to a certain cap. Idk what the cap is in Sweden. Index funds to me always looked like a too-good-to-be-true prospect, plus all the money lost in fees and such, gross. If you're going to play the market, you either have to have a very good initial capital and income source to afford the fees of an agent or you gotta actually double down and learn the market imo. I'm sure some people will disagree with me, and I'm sure a lot of people have had success with index funds and such, but by the same token I'm sure some people have had perfectly functional outcomes with timeshare rentals too.

[QUOTE=Nanamil;52110012]After moving to another country and living alone for six months, I realize now that the hardest part of life is knowing what you are going to eat tonight. Will it be the same bread and ham you keep eating since last week or the canned soup you got at a discount ?[/QUOTE] When I was in the UK, I made it a rule that I'd eat in a social setting atleast twice a week, no matter what. That way I was forced to vary things up and get a needed dose of social interaction - sometimes it was a date, sometimes it was having fun with friends. Another thing that helps is making cooking an activity, not a chore - one of my favorite weekend activities in college was looking up a list of "cheap as fuck" recipes from the frugal eating subreddit, drawing up a list of ingredients, going down to Tescos, picking up stuff, and then cooking all of them and carefully storing them in the fridge. So one day it was bread with x, another day I was having y, and the food in the fridge would last about a week easily - some of the meat-based dished even tasted better once the spices caught on properly by day 2. A little bit of prepwork can make all the difference and keep things fun. If you have a partner, make cooking with her an activity you can do together for funzies.

Index funds are fine. But you still have to do some independent research. They'll be safer than doing stocks on your own tho. But you speak of retirement, and those are most likely not going to be the best way to kick that off. Where you go next really depends on your country though. I'd just google "saving for retirement" in swedish and start there

[QUOTE=maeZtro;52112973]I'm thinking about investing some of my money into stocks. What are your thoughts on index funds? To me they seem like the best bet for someone who's saving for retirement and doesn't want to get too involved with economics and markets.[/QUOTE] I don't have any clue about index funds, I have pretty much all my savings in stocks. However, from what I've heard from funds there are quite high administrative fees. Though some funds do not have this like Avanza zero. But start saving money in stocks are quite easy, you get an ISK (investeringssparkonto) on a bank and just add money to it and start buying stocks. I'd honestly recommend getting an ISK at Avanza since their fees (courtage) are the lowest, especially if you don't have that much money saved. If you've got less than 50 k SEK you don't pay any courtage at all for buying and selling stocks on the Stockholm Stock exchange (Stockholmsbörsen). Also, if you have an ISK the tax you pay is based on the average amount on your account a year. I don't know at the top of my head how much it is, but it's not much at all, like a percentage of a percentage. If you have one at avanza they automatically forward info to the tax people (skatteverket) so that there's no hustle to declare your tax. You also don't have to declare tax every time you sell a stock. The main reason I use stocks instead of funds is that firstly you get the money that the companies decide to give to the shareholders, you don't if you save in funds. The other reason I only save in stocks are that you get the most money for it, no "förvaltningsavgift" to pay, you only pay courtage really and Avanza are really good with courtage. Regarding saving money to retirement without getting into economics you are probably right that funds are easier. So if you really don't want to get into it I guess they are ok. But if you would just read some analysis' of companies on redeye.se you can get very far. But of course, it's your money and do with it that you're comfortable with. I'm no expert but if you have any questions you can ask me and I'll see if I can answer.

[QUOTE=IQ-Guldfisk;52116158]I don't have any clue about index funds, I have pretty much all my savings in stocks. However, from what I've heard from funds there are quite high administrative fees. Though some funds do not have this like Avanza zero. But start saving money in stocks are quite easy, you get an ISK (investeringssparkonto) on a bank and just add money to it and start buying stocks. I'd honestly recommend getting an ISK at Avanza since their fees (courtage) are the lowest, especially if you don't have that much money saved. If you've got less than 50 k SEK you don't pay any courtage at all for buying and selling stocks on the Stockholm Stock exchange (Stockholmsbörsen). Also, if you have an ISK the tax you pay is based on the average amount on your account a year. I don't know at the top of my head how much it is, but it's not much at all, like a percentage of a percentage. If you have one at avanza they automatically forward info to the tax people (skatteverket) so that there's no hustle to declare your tax. You also don't have to declare tax every time you sell a stock. The main reason I use stocks instead of funds is that firstly you get the money that the companies decide to give to the shareholders, you don't if you save in funds. The other reason I only save in stocks are that you get the most money for it, no "förvaltningsavgift" to pay, you only pay courtage really and Avanza are really good with courtage. Regarding saving money to retirement without getting into economics you are probably right that funds are easier. So if you really don't want to get into it I guess they are ok. But if you would just read some analysis' of companies on redeye.se you can get very far. But of course, it's your money and do with it that you're comfortable with. I'm no expert but if you have any questions you can ask me and I'll see if I can answer.[/QUOTE] When looking at Index funds, go with passive funds not actively managed funds. There are very few active funds who year upon year show they beat the market. 0.25% of Gross Value is the usual fee for the passively managed fund which quite literally means it has a set of principals and the computer will buy stocks automatically based upon these.

As I have yet another panic attack about finances, I'd like to drop my regular reminder to never lose financial vigilance. We made an irresponsible decision because we were feeling safe. We were making good money, way more than we needed to get by, and made the foolish choice to temporarily cut down our financial safety net to cover the costs of a vacation on the assumption that we would easily be able to hang it back up before we actually needed it again. We spent the money in our reserve account, six months of expenses set aside for emergencies, because we foolishly assumed that we would be alright without it for the two or three months it would take to fill it back up. The moment we got back home, we both lost our jobs for unrelated reasons, and found ourselves with no savings whatsoever. We had to fall onto our credit cards, racking up thousands of dollars in new debt, and months later we're still struggling just to keep our heads above water. I know I'm a broken record and ya'll have heard this before, but it's one of the hardest lessons I've ever had to learn, and it deserves some redundancy in coverage: never stop being cautious. I'm not saying you can never have fun with your money, but [I]never[/I] fail to maintain an "Oh Fuck" account with enough expenses to last you through a rough six months. If you don't have an "Oh Fuck" account, building one should be your highest priority.

Thanks for your opinion guys. I've been looking at avanza zero for a while now and I think it's what I'm going to go with for most of my money. It's cheap, more lucrative than interest funds and "safe". The thing is that saving for your pension "normally" is almost never worth it in Sweden because of taxes and if you have a low income, missed handouts. As for trading directly with stock as IQ-Guldfisk pointed out, I know I can make more money and I have actually read quite a lot about it but I just don't like the idea of it eating away hours from my day. I tend to get very involved, addicted even to things like that and I just stopped playing video games completely about a year ago.

[QUOTE=maeZtro;52121085]Thanks for your opinion guys. I've been looking at avanza zero for a while now and I think it's what I'm going to go with for most of my money. It's cheap, more lucrative than interest funds and "safe". The thing is that saving for your pension "normally" is almost never worth it in Sweden because of taxes and if you have a low income, missed handouts. As for trading directly with stock as IQ-Guldfisk pointed out, I know I can make more money and I have actually read quite a lot about it but I just don't like the idea of it eating away hours from my day. I tend to get very involved, addicted even to things like that and I just stopped playing video games completely about a year ago.[/QUOTE] Becoming addicted like that was how warren buffet became the richest person in the world just saying. But still, consider saving in more funds than one because it's good to do as BDA says and be cautious. Spreading the risk is something pretty much everyone recommends

Slightly less mopey status update: my business is actually doing pretty fucking great for where I'm at. I have been active for a month, and already have four clients -- one seller and three buyers. For my first month, that's pretty amazing! If I keep that momentum, I could measure my income in the hundreds of thousands of dollars instead of just the hundreds. Of course, it will be three or four months before those clients actually close on anything, so despite my stellar start I'm still fighting to keep my head above water lol. Still, though... Vigilance. Perserverence. Bootstraps. All that stuff. If I can just last through this year without any other major financial pitfalls, like a car breakdown, I'll hopefully never have to worry about money again. Despite my enormous level of stress right now, stress which is almost entirely my own fault, I remain optimistic about the long term.

I believe in you BDA. If I ever move back to the US in a permanent capacity, and to your part of the US to boot I suppose, I'll defo remember to pick you as a real estate agent.

I applied for a job with Khan Academy. It's remote and a great position with benefits, too, so I'm really hoping it turns out. I would absolutely put my education on slow-mode if it meant having this job. It actually fits my skill set for once lol. Here's hoping.

Would you be making tutor videos or something behind the scenes?

[QUOTE=OvB;52130135]Would you be making tutor videos or something behind the scenes?[/QUOTE] It's for a a Community Support Specialist position, working with teachers and making sure the help center is functioning + support on their community forums and stuff, I assume. There wasn't TOO much information about it, but it's behind the scenes stuff. [editline]20th April 2017[/editline] It's being a point of contact for educators specifically, I believe. Which I've done before at a different job so I'd be super excited to do it again. [editline]20th April 2017[/editline] I really want this position for the remote availability especially. But I'd totally be willing to relocate after being with them for some time too, in which case, I'd be moving to Mountain View, CA which sounds pretty fuckin' cool. But yeah I'm really just crossing my fingers for this one. It's pretty much perfect for what I'm looking for.

[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;52129770]Slightly less mopey status update: my business is actually doing pretty fucking great for where I'm at. I have been active for a month, and already have four clients -- one seller and three buyers. For my first month, that's pretty amazing! If I keep that momentum, I could measure my income in the hundreds of thousands of dollars instead of just the hundreds. Of course, it will be three or four months before those clients actually close on anything, so despite my stellar start I'm still fighting to keep my head above water lol. Still, though... Vigilance. Perserverence. Bootstraps. All that stuff. If I can just last through this year without any other major financial pitfalls, like a car breakdown, I'll hopefully never have to worry about money again. Despite my enormous level of stress right now, stress which is almost entirely my own fault, I remain optimistic about the long term.[/QUOTE] That's awesome, BDA! Good job, I'm really proud of you for doing so well! These clients are special, so save everything you can about them for later or when you need a bit of a pick-me-up. I keep a photocopy of my first ever paycheck in my wallet to remind me of how far I've come since then whenever I feel a bit down. Also, once you've closed, make sure to do as thorough a feedback process as you can with them, possibly setting up a calendar invitation to review their satisfaction after a few months. Also gives you a good excuse to see if they've built any word of mouth references for you to contact as well. It's easy to do now because the number is small, but it's definitely worth it because it can help polish up your approach in the future - success is in the iteration. :smile:

I got a response from KA! They're giving me an opportunity to answer some support scenarios to see how I'd help people in different situations. They're all fairly easy! They gave me a week to work on it but I likely won't even need more than today. I'm super excited aaaa. I really hope I can ace this.