[QUOTE=SuperDuperScoot;45240181]I could listen to Markiplier read the phone book.[/QUOTE]
If youtube ever stops being profitable for him, he could make a killing as an audiobook narrator.
[QUOTE=Pvt. Martin;45240852]I never liked that idea on story in games. "Story in games is like Story in porn, don't matter fuck et".[/QUOTE]
Games like Rise of the Triad, Doom, and Quake dont really need a story.
[QUOTE=Pvt. Martin;45240852]I never liked that idea on story in games. "Story in games is like Story in porn, don't matter fuck et".[/QUOTE]
I think it's an apt description. The porn comparison really is important to understanding it.
A good game with crap story is like good porn with a bad story. Focusing on the plot will confuse and/or disappoint you, but the meat of the experience that you came for is still good.
However, also like porn, while a good story isn't vital, it can really elevate the experience from "pretty good" to "holy shit, take all my money". Just like how the rare well-written dialogue and a believable yet fresh setting can make porn much more engaging, so too can story refinement make games truly immersive and more fun.
The core appeal of gameplay is always there, and the quality of the story won't hurt the pre-existing core workings of a game in any way if bad. But when they can work together to make something beautiful and seemingly-real, that's when you get an amazing game or porno.
Story's never vital, but when it really gets used properly and even well, it's just as much of a draw as the mechanics.
[QUOTE=Pvt. Martin;45240852]I never liked that idea on story in games. "Story in games is like Story in porn, don't matter fuck et".[/QUOTE]
Then again, he said that at a time where putting story in a video game was actually pretty fucking hard due to technical limitations.
Up until Half Life, First Person Shooters had absolutely no focus on the story. Hell, Half Life was also supposed to be like that until at some point they figured it was interesting to have characters around that don't want to kill you.
Goddamn the DooM 3 theme still kicks ass
Shame I never found a high quality version of it
[QUOTE=Pvt. Martin;45240852]I never liked that idea on story in games. "Story in games is like Story in porn, don't matter fuck et".[/QUOTE]
This I think it's the length of time ago now, games have evolved to be capable of story far beyond what they were back in the 90s.
The music in doom is like the only stuff that puts me on edge. So eerie.
[QUOTE=xianlee;45245059]The music in doom is like the only stuff that puts me on edge. So eerie.[/QUOTE]
This song used to scare the shit out of me as a kid.
[video=youtube;FMex4f8cwEY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMex4f8cwEY[/video]
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;45244023]Then again, he said that at a time where putting story in a video game was actually pretty fucking hard due to technical limitations.
Up until Half Life, First Person Shooters had absolutely no focus on the story. Hell, Half Life was also supposed to be like that until at some point they figured it was interesting to have characters around that don't want to kill you.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Rossy167;45244969]This I think it's the length of time ago now, games have evolved to be capable of story far beyond what they were back in the 90s.[/QUOTE]
He said that in 2003, not the 90s
[QUOTE=i-am-teh-sex;45245428]He said that in 2003, not the 90s[/QUOTE]
Oh. Well still, 10 years ago.
[QUOTE=TurboSax;45243711]I think it's an apt description. The porn comparison really is important to understanding it.
A good game with crap story is like good porn with a bad story. Focusing on the plot will confuse and/or disappoint you, but the meat of the experience that you came for is still good.
However, also like porn, while a good story isn't vital, it can really elevate the experience from "pretty good" to "holy shit, take all my money". Just like how the rare well-written dialogue and a believable yet fresh setting can make porn much more engaging, so too can story refinement make games truly immersive and more fun.
The core appeal of gameplay is always there, and the quality of the story won't hurt the pre-existing core workings of a game in any way if bad. But when they can work together to make something beautiful and seemingly-real, that's when you get an amazing game or porno.
Story's never vital, but when it really gets used properly and even well, it's just as much of a draw as the mechanics.[/QUOTE]
The way John Carmack describes it is that the mechanics are MUCH more important than the story
I just don't think this holds any truth anymore. With RPGs, the draw is just as much about the story as it is the gameplay, moreso even. Then you get games with mediocre gameplay that are great games because of the story, like Bioshock Infinite and Spec Ops: The Line. And then you have games that have very little "gameplay" that are great purely because of the story, like the Walking Dead and The Wolf Among Us.
This might've been true back in the 90s, but games today NEED a good story, otherwise they just blend into the crowd. It's like those cheesy spoof porns. People love them BECAUSE of the plot bits, and pretty much only for that reason.
[QUOTE=xianlee;45245059]The music in doom is like the only stuff that puts me on edge. So eerie.[/QUOTE]
Oh yeah, here's my favorite part of any of the Dooms' music ever
Skip to 3:05
[video=youtube;MCPJGt3m_v8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzTLjRUgbtM[/video]
The whole array of soundtracks (especially Final Doom) are so ambient and eerie, but satisfying to listen to somehow.
[QUOTE=Funktastic Dog;45248952]The way John Carmack describes it is that the mechanics are MUCH more important than the story
I just don't think this holds any truth anymore. With RPGs, the draw is just as much about the story as it is the gameplay, moreso even. Then you get games with mediocre gameplay that are great games because of the story, like Bioshock Infinite and Spec Ops: The Line. And then you have games that have very little "gameplay" that are great purely because of the story, like the Walking Dead and The Wolf Among Us.
This might've been true back in the 90s, but games today NEED a good story, otherwise they just blend into the crowd. It's like those cheesy spoof porns. People love them BECAUSE of the plot bits, and pretty much only for that reason.[/QUOTE]
I mostly agree but I don't think games today NEED a great story. A great story can make a game stand out but there are still plenty of games that stand out for other reasons.
I would agree with him about video games that came out around Doom.
I find it odd he said that in 2003 - video game stories were getting better around then.
[QUOTE=Krinkels;45249128]I would agree with him about video games that came out around Doom.
I find it odd he said that in 2003 - video game stories were getting better around then.[/QUOTE]
Well thing is, even around doom the second most popular kind of PC game was adventure games, like Monkey Island and Kings Quest.
Perhaps in the 80s that would be true though.
I notice he's also a bit sloppy on the audio editing, like how he says "John RoJohn Carmack" early on, and some sudden jumps in tone of voice mid-sentence.
[QUOTE=i-am-teh-sex;45245428]He said that in 2003, not the 90s[/QUOTE]Carmack did not make the "story in a porn movie" quote in 2003. This is another example of the video being wrong, and anyone using a bit of common sense would tell you this would have been an odd time for Carmack to make that statement when id Software was in the middle of developing Doom 3 which was touting its deeper plot and involvement of Hollywood-experienced writers. The quote is actually cited from the book Masters of Doom which was [i]published[/i] in 2003. The quote itself was made in late 1992 when id began development of Doom which is what the video was discussing at that point. No idea how the video creators managed to screw that up, but it's not surprising given they've already demonstrated some exceptional ineptitude at reading simple wiki articles.
Anyhow, since this video is total garbage, here's some actual Doom trivia for youse guys: [i]Did you know[/i] that the shotgun and plasma rifle weapons were based on toys?
[t]http://i.imgur.com/Jv3EJdc.jpg[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/3Fz67aM.jpg[/t]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/MjFGLql.jpg[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/QcFcfUI.jpg[/t]
And [i]did you know[/i] that the chainsaw was based on a real chainsw, the McCulloch Eager Beaver, which belonged to Tom Hall's girlfriend?
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRqJ9OhHPhQ[/media]
[QUOTE=Shugo;45243466]Those are all neat facts, but there's really no criteria for what "should" be in these videos. The only thing that should matter is how accurate their information is and so far, the only error you've pointed out is that there were four planned playable characters instead of five.
I don't know a lot about Doom since I don't crawl wikis about it, so this was all neat stuff to see from my perspective. They've covered other games that I did have a lot of wiki-smarts about, and I've always been impressed at how accurate and obscure their trivia selection is. If they make mistakes, they're once-in-a-while deals. As a whole, though, their series is really interesting and I applaud them for presenting actual facts when [B]most other ~gaming trivia~ shows make up a whole bunch of bullshit speculation narrated by obnoxious, self-important hosts.[/B] DYKG is the only channel in this vein that I watch.
So far, your beef with them just boils down to "I already knew all that, this part is wrong, and they could've said a lot more stuff (which I already knew and everyone else should already know)." Being such a Doom trivia buff, I'm not sure what you expected walking into a video about Doom trivia.[/QUOTE]
You're referring to Game Theory right?
Because that's spot on.
[QUOTE=Tuskin;45240419]I've got a fact
The Track "Nobody Told Me About id" in Doom 1
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cixW6rogZ48#t=2573[/url]
Was also used by Bobby Prince in "Blake Stone: Planet Strike" as the track "Mourning"
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cc5Q2F_FCho#t=3058[/url][/QUOTE]
Blake Stone looks like when Michael Jackson was still black
Wow, I never knew the plasma gun was based on a toy.
This was honestly a surprise to find out.
[QUOTE=Larry_G;45244084]Goddamn the DooM 3 theme still kicks ass
Shame I never found a high quality version of it[/QUOTE]
I have a pretty good quality version on my computer, at least it sounds better than most versions on Youtube.
[url]https://www.mediafire.com/?8ey5plrzr6aj9vs[/url]
Then again the base game already had pretty bad sound quality, so I guess that's as good as it'll get.
Good old marphy black having to prove he knows more than everyone else
[QUOTE=Marphy Black;45252663]rant[/QUOTE]
Why are you so pissed about this video? Seriously, it's a short trivia video, not some super detailed history on every aspect of Doom. If you want anything more you can check a wiki.
[Editline] June 30 2014 [/editline]
Actually, not to be that douchey guy who is like "bluh why don't you do it", but why don't you do your own trivia thing? You seem to know a lot, so it'd be cool to hear your take and what you know past more people and several other FPers do reviews and such, so i'd support it and i'm sure others here would too.
[QUOTE=Darth_Kris;45241647]When talking about the music inspirations, they didn't mention that At Doom's Gate was inspired by the intro to Master of Puppets[/QUOTE]heretical levels of misinformation detected. anyone with a bit of musical ear knows that Master of Puppets doesn't sound like E1M1 at all
you're thinking of this
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbjMHisK9cg[/media]
E2M1 is the track clearly inspired by Master of Puppets (the riff before the verse, to be precise) and a certain AC/DC song
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;45252854]I have a pretty good quality version on my computer, at least it sounds better than most versions on Youtube.
[url]https://www.mediafire.com/?8ey5plrzr6aj9vs[/url]
Then again the base game already had pretty bad sound quality, so I guess that's as good as it'll get.[/QUOTE]
iD released the song as a 48K stereo ogg for free, the OST was 9 bucks for 44K cda, so no that's not as good as it got.
I actually have the kind of shotgun toy they used in DOOM
[QUOTE=DeVotchKa;45254663]Why are you so pissed about this video? Seriously, it's a short trivia video, not some super detailed history on every aspect of Doom. If you want anything more you can check a wiki.
[/QUOTE]
I know valid points is such a headache
keep drinking dat kool aid and you might catch that bad information virus
[QUOTE=Funktastic Dog;45248952]The way John Carmack describes it is that the mechanics are MUCH more important than the story
I just don't think this holds any truth anymore. With RPGs, the draw is just as much about the story as it is the gameplay, moreso even. Then you get games with mediocre gameplay that are great games because of the story, like Bioshock Infinite and Spec Ops: The Line. And then you have games that have very little "gameplay" that are great purely because of the story, like the Walking Dead and The Wolf Among Us.
This might've been true back in the 90s, but games today NEED a good story, otherwise they just blend into the crowd. It's like those cheesy spoof porns. People love them BECAUSE of the plot bits, and pretty much only for that reason.[/QUOTE]
I disagree with the idea that it's [I]necessary[/I] to have a good story. There are plenty of games even today that are able to stand out purely by merit of their game design despite having forgettable stories. In all honesty I actually find it pretty obnoxious how many people aren't willing to accept that sometimes games can just be games, not a [I]deep, immersive, cinematic storytelling [B]experience[/B][/I].
[QUOTE=DeVotchKa;45254663]Why are you so pissed about this video? Seriously, it's a short trivia video, not some super detailed history on every aspect of Doom. If you want anything more you can check a wiki.
[Editline] June 30 2014 [/editline]
Actually, not to be that douchey guy who is like "bluh why don't you do it", but why don't you do your own trivia thing? You seem to know a lot, so it'd be cool to hear your take and what you know past more people and several other FPers do reviews and such, so i'd support it and i'm sure others here would too.[/QUOTE]
because the facts are legitimately wrong, and arent that hard to know at all
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