It's easy to say I want constitutional carry because I know I'm responsible and experienced and don't want to go through the hassle of a training course but the reality is the majority of Americans are stupid as fuck and unfortunately guns have a wide appeal to some of the knuckle-draggingest mouth-breathingest sister-fuckingest retards in the country, who I definitely am not comfortable with being armed in public.
Requiring training for CC/OC is therefore acceptable to me and also calms down some anti-gun sorts, which makes it a reasonable thing to compromise on.
[QUOTE=evilweazel;51864710]A law-abiding, able citizen shouldn't have to "gain their rights" to do anything recognized by the constitution.[/QUOTE]
Can you point out to me in the second amendment, constitution, or bill of rights, where it says that concealed carry is a right to every citizen, unless you're a felon or mentally gimped? You're doing some serious mental gymnastics to try and say that CC is a right.
The way I see it, a strict interpretation of the 2A would allow [i]everyone[/i] access to all firearms and weaponry, no matter if they're a vegetable, retarded, or a felon. You can't just point to the 2A anytime you want to get new gun legislation.
Well, regardless of weather people should have some training before carrying (they should), the way i see it, its just like laws on wearing a helmet on a motorcycle. You should wear one, but it shouldnt be the governments responsibility to make sure you do, it should be your own responsibility.
[QUOTE=evilweazel;51864519]Used the NFA as an example, I assumed you would get the idea from most of my posts.
I don't mind background checks like what is on a 4473 (which I think is about perfect as far as that goes), like I said before, it keeps away people from (legally) getting weapons when they shouldn't have them, IE when they have showed a willingness to deny others of their rights.
Anything involving regulations on Concealed Carry is gone. Things involving FFLS and most other commerce laws could get slashed and I wouldn't really mind, so long as regs. like the FFA has involving barring felons aren't touched. Granted, I don't know a lot of behind-the-counter stuff and the business side of things, so I'd have to read up more on what those entail. Things involving waiting periods and the like are done. The F in ATF is removed because fuck those guys.
Basically, anything that disallows or puts under penalty or otherwise impedes a law abiding and sane citizen, from owning or carrying in any way, covering basically anything they want to would be put in to the shredder. Things like magazine size, features, accessories, etc. would also be completely unregulated as well![/QUOTE]
There isn't a whole lot more that goes on behind the counter. You hand me a 4473, I plug it into NICS, and I get a proceed/deny/delay. If it's a proceed or the delay goes through I log the sale in my books then tuck the 4473 safely away in a filing cabinet until the business closes permanently. The only time there's something different is if you buy multiple handguns at once, to which then I have to fill out what's called a multiform with all the info from the 4473 and then fax (yes fax) it to the ATF and local law enforcement.
What I find kind of surprising is if I get a deny I don't do anything beyond cancel the sale. We blacklist the person ( to prevent them or relatives of theirs from trying to buy one for them) but we're not legally required to, nor are we required to report any of it. The only time I actually called someone was because a guy who I knew from the paper was charged and convicted of trying to aid/join ISIS came in and tried to buy a gun, though I'd consider that a much different circumstance. A good number of the denials I get are false, whether it be mistaken identity or even a local government fuck up like accidentally putting some completely unrelated dudes felony I to their background file. Alas NICS doesn't tell us what the denials are for, and what I've learned came from the customers who came back after clearing things up.
[QUOTE=Birdman101;51865006]Well, regardless of weather people should have some training before carrying (they should), the way i see it, its just like laws on wearing a helmet on a motorcycle. You should wear one, but it shouldnt be the governments responsibility to make sure you do, it should be your own responsibility.[/QUOTE]
Except if you don't wear a helmet, you're the one that gets hurt. If you don't know how to use your gun and don't know your states laws, its someone else who gets hurt.
For years the process to get a cc permit in sd was to go down to the cop shop, fill out a form, drop a fiver, and wait a week. Litteraly the only requirements are that youre not a felon and you give them five bucks. No training, no quiz, nothing. You know how often you hear about someone shooting someone with their cc? Never. Practically all gun crime here is drug related, gun used in a robbery, or occasionally a crazy man with an sks shooting at cops.
A lot of gun safety is preventative, though. Just because nothing bad happens when you sweep someone at the range doesn't mean it's OK to sweep people as long as you're reasonably certain the gun is empty.
Lack of CC crime doesn't mean there are no accidents or that people aren't reckless and create accident conditions. I think if the fed standardized and subsidized CC training, that would both respect the right to carry and the need for training and safety -- since if they're providing the courses at no charge to you, you can't really argue that they're denying you the right to carry.
Yeah I'm not worried with the dude shooting somewhere up with his CC, someone like that won't bother with one. I'm talking about what Grenadiac is.
[QUOTE=Birdman101;51865076]For years the process to get a cc permit in sd was to go down to the cop shop, fill out a form, drop a fiver, and wait a week. Litteraly the only requirements are that youre not a felon and you give them five bucks. No training, no quiz, nothing. You know how often you hear about someone shooting someone with their cc? Never. Practically all gun crime here is drug related, gun used in a robbery, or occasionally a crazy man with an sks shooting at cops.[/QUOTE]
No, but what does happen is accidents and people getting charged for murder because they don't know the laws.
[editline]23rd February 2017[/editline]
Honestly though, why take the risk? You're better informing people on the usage of their firearms and making sure they're aware of the laws when they take a CC course, and standardizing it for the whole nation is the smart thing to do. And the waiting time is 2-6 weeks. Is your time so precious or your life so dangerous that you can't wait that long? Forcing people to take this course completely mitigates the risk of accidents overall.
Or are we still going to try saying that CC'ing is a right?
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;51864797]Can you point out to me in the second amendment, constitution, or bill of rights, where it says that concealed carry is a right to every citizen, unless you're a felon or mentally gimped? You're doing some serious mental gymnastics to try and say that CC is a right.
The way I see it, a strict interpretation of the 2A would allow [i]everyone[/i] access to all firearms and weaponry, no matter if they're a vegetable, retarded, or a felon. You can't just point to the 2A anytime you want to get new gun legislation.[/QUOTE]
I mean, you're just going to paint me as some dribbling idiot for saying this but I guess I can go for it anyways:
[QUOTE]A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.[/QUOTE]
If I can be sent to jail for keeping and bearing my arms under my jacket because it's cold out, or I don't want it in sight of the public, or any other million reasons to not open carry, how is that right not being infringed, since like I said, I can be sent to jail for keeping and bearing arms if I don't have a permit?
It's not even a huge deal for me at the end of the day, but it doesn't seem logical to me claim your right is not being infringed, defined as:
[QUOTE]1. actively break the terms of (a law, agreement, etc.).
2. act so as to limit or undermine (something); encroach on.[/QUOTE]
Since the gov't is allowing you to only carry under their specific set of circumstances. (IE: Limiting when you can and can not carry your firearm on you.)
Like, claim it's for the public good and I guess I can wholly understand why you may want it that way and agree to an extent, but saying it's 100% constitutional to limit when someone can carry a firearm when the document states otherwise doesn't make much sense, to me. It'd be a completely different story in my eyes if it was shall-issue everywhere, in my eyes, but that isn't quite the case, and I'm glad that is seeing change. I'm willing to bend it around a little for felons and etc, but I don't think it's wise to go any further than that. Especially when it hasn't quite done any harm that I can notice so far.
Like, it didn't turn Wyoming into a dystopian wasteland plagued by constant NDs. It's stayed.... Well, Wyoming. Granted, if there are stats out there that show states that adopted permitless carry had a significant increase in NDs and accidental deaths, it'd be one thing, but I don't know of any stats that show that.
Call it whatever you want, crazy, dumb, retarded, whatever, claim it's for the public safety, that you're thinking of the children, but you probably shouldn't call it constitutional. :saxout:
[QUOTE=PrusseLusken;51864063]but bro it's my god given right through the second amendment and in that way you cannot legislate or regulate it because then you infringe and it [B] S H A L L N O T B E I N F R I N G E D !!!!!!!!!![/B]
[editline]23rd February 2017[/editline]
TL;DR "i should be able to carry my makarov loaded with +p+ fmj into church for service and if you disagree you are a godless commie without respect for the us constitution"[/QUOTE]
Hey guys whats going on in this thr-
Oh this again.
[QUOTE=ultra_bright;51865231]Hey guys whats going on in this thr-
Oh this again.[/QUOTE]
Here I was thinking something big had happened, like Trump single-handedly firing the whole ATF, or doing a 180 and telling everyone to turn in their guns.
Instead, we got drama :v:
[QUOTE=Grenadiac;51865108]A lot of gun safety is preventative, though. Just because nothing bad happens when you sweep someone at the range doesn't mean it's OK to sweep people as long as you're reasonably certain the gun is empty.
Lack of CC crime doesn't mean there are no accidents or that people aren't reckless and create accident conditions. I think if the fed standardized and subsidized CC training, that would both respect the right to carry and the need for training and safety -- since if they're providing the courses at no charge to you, you can't really argue that they're denying you the right to carry.[/QUOTE]
Yea, that would be sweet as hell, but we all know theres no way something like that would be free, and if it was, i fear the content would be pretty lacking.
I interrupt this episode of Nutn-Rights-Talk to ask a dumb question.
Anyone have any recommendations on good, reliable places to get Ariasaka ammo? Preferably locally if at all possible, obviously. But I don't think this is an ammo type I will get local.
[editline]23rd February 2017[/editline]
Also, anyone have any history identifying (or reading) Japanese Rifles? I know mine's an Ariasaka and I'm working on getting macro images of the markings and proofs to ID, but I know next to nothing beyond it being an inter-war period rifle.
Bought a Smith and Wesson M&P15 at my local gun shop, since the AK74 I wanted got sold out before I got my money.
[t]http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w229/Overwatch_Sniper/Mobile%20Uploads/KIMG0141.jpg[/t]
Here's a crappy pic.
Can't wait to shoot it, I hope this turns out to be a good starter semi auto
[QUOTE=PaChIrA;51866680]Bought a Smith and Wesson M&P15[/QUOTE]
Sport II right? Yes it is a very good starter AR I have the same one!
Yeah I figured I should probably just get an AR-15 to start with anyways.
[QUOTE=PaChIrA;51866775]Yeah I figured I should probably just get an AR-15 to start with anyways.[/QUOTE]
Don't forget to pick up some spare magazines.
Magpul PMags are always a good choice, and I've heard good things about Lancer L5AWMs. Or, if you want something with a thinner profile, Brownells is a government supplier for GI mags.
[url]http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-30rd-magazine-cs-223-5-56-prod21225.aspx[/url]
[url]http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-30rd-pmag-gen-m3-magazine-223-5-56-prod75487.aspx[/url]
[url]http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-l5awm-translucent-smoke-magazine-30-rd-prod95203.aspx[/url]
If you're looking for an AR to build, go for a 6.5 Grendel and load up on the cheapest, most accurate cartridge you'll ever buy for 23 cents per round from SGAmmo:
[url]http://www.sgammo.com/product/65-grendel-ammo/1000-rounds-65-grendel-100-grain-fmj-lacquered-steel-case-wpa-wolf-ammo[/url]
I was against having a boutique cartridge, but after shooting one at 400+ yards, I really fell in love with it.
Then I bought a .300BLK AR after denouncing that cartridge as the dumbest money grabbing scam since Century made firearms. :V
[editline]23rd February 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Psychokitten;51866823]Don't forget to pick up some spare magazines.
Magpul PMags are always a good choice, and I've heard good things about Lancer L5AWMs. Or, if you want something with a thinner profile, Brownells is a government supplier for GI mags.
[url]http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-30rd-magazine-cs-223-5-56-prod21225.aspx[/url]
[url]http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-30rd-pmag-gen-m3-magazine-223-5-56-prod75487.aspx[/url]
[url]http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-l5awm-translucent-smoke-magazine-30-rd-prod95203.aspx[/url][/QUOTE]
Honestly, if you just want to stock up, you can find M2 windowless black PMags for $8-9 a piece.
Tried to buy a Kriss Vector today, apparently they're backordered super hard. At least the NJ compliant models.
[QUOTE=Binladen34;51867316]Tried to buy a Kriss Vector today, apparently they're backordered super hard. At least the NJ compliant models.[/QUOTE]
You'll get one when they've finished their run of anime figurines.
My pistol lower came in!
It matches my pitch black Del-Ton upper lol
[t]http://i.imgur.com/j119qnb.jpg[/t]
Finally got my rifles from my folks today. (I just have been busy and couldn't swing by with my cases to pick them up). Mauser is serial matching minus the bayonet lug and the safety selector which are matching to each other. sn: 250s
The ariasaka is 29550s sn (I don't know Japanese so know nothing beyond the Arabic Numerals for the SN).
And the m1 is fucking gorgeous. Never fired 1,000,000s Sky Box with original cardboard box.
Only two more rifles left to complete my WWII general issue part of my collection.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/1gux0BZ.jpg[/t]
And family keeps growing, dammit. I'm going to have to get another guest room at this rate.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/hvy5RTS.jpg[/t]
If you've been wanting an AR or another AR, you can't beat this deal:
$480 for
Radical Firearms - Forged MilSpec Rifle - 16” 5.56 SOCOM Contour (MID) – 12” FHR Handguard with Primary Arms Micro Dot With Removable Base and a Primary Arms Absolute Cowitness Micro Dot Riser
[url]http://www.primaryarms.com/Kit-RadRiflePAMicroDot[/url]
[t]http://www.primaryarms.com/SSP%20Applications/NetSuite%20Inc.%20-%20SCA%20Mont%20Blanc/Development/img/Kit-RadRiflePAMicroDot_00.JPG?fcts=20170224023028&resizeid=7&resizeh=0&resizew=2000[/t]
[QUOTE=MAC21500;51874410] stuff [/QUOTE] Wow, that's actually a really good deal
Local shop had an MSAR AUG E4, I was really excited. But then I saw it was 6.8
Getting a No.4 T soon bois
[QUOTE=Ridge;51874643]Local shop had an MSAR AUG E4, I was really excited. But then I saw it was 6.8[/QUOTE]
Wait, what? They made one in 6.8? Gimme gimme gimme! I got the mags and dies for that shit.
[QUOTE=AutismoPiggo;51874676]Getting a No.4 T soon bois[/QUOTE]
Nice! Surplus, or recent reproduction?
I'm thinking of getting something I can hunt with. Should I buy a bolt/hunting rifle or just get another upper for my AR15 that shoots something like .300BLK or something to that extent?
I was looking at some of the types of uppers and bullets you can stick in the AR15 platform (for science and fun) and I have to say the most entertaining ones from the looks of it has to be either 50 beowulf or 458 SOCOM, I mean both of those ammo types are stupidly expensive but whatever you shoot definitely isn't getting back up after you shoot it. Saw a video of a guy shooting a deer with 458 and the poor thing did 3 barrel rolls after he shot it.
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