The Finns use the TKIV 85, a modified Finnush Mosin, which is chambered for 53r but can apparently fire 54r in a pinch, so I guess the 53r Mosin bolt will go into battery with a 54r cartridge. Not sure of the long term effects of doing this though. They could range from nil to severe. I would play it safe and load 53r cases. You can buy factory 53r but it is not cheap.
e: I am reading that the Finns designed the M39 to run captured Soviet ammo but didn't want their ammo to work for the Soviets if captured, so the Finnish guns will chamber both and the Russian guns will suffer if fed 53r (because the cartridge is just a bit too short, it will trigger sticky bolt syndrome). Don't shoot steel jacketed 54r through it and you [I]shouldn't[/I] have a problem.
Yeah no question there if he has the tools or the money to get the tools he should absolutely play it safe with that old gun. I wouldn't want to take any risks and the information on this is spotty at best.
I'm kinda in the same spot, need to either start loading for my M95 or sell it. There is a Mossberg Cruiser at my LGS for $200 and I've always wanted one so I might just ditch the M95 for 300 or 400 and pick up the Cruiser. If I had a Krag though you'd have to pry it out of my cold dead hands.
Mine's actually Dutch - so it's 6.5x53mmR which is even harder to find than 8x56r. It's a nightmare. I love the gun, it's super handy and really well put together, but there's just no ammo for it period and I don't have the equipment or the money or the room to put said equipment if I had the money to reshape .303 cases like you're supposed to. I just impulse bought it because I fell in love with it when I picked it up and did literally no research on ammo availability.
I might also try to get another Lithy SMLE instead of picking up the Cruiser since I miss mine something fierce and none of the BSA SMLEs I've looked at have felt the same.
Yeah, .303 goes right into the clip, the bolt strips them off and ejects them perfectly. Supposedly you can reshape the shoulder and trim the result but I just don't have the equipment and the only person who does this charges $50ish for 20 rounds and only accepts mail in money orders and takes a month to fill an order, so I've never shot this rifle.
Still the KNIL rifles are rarish in the US so I'm hoping I can get 3-400 dollars for it even though bubba swapped the rear sight. Hopefully it will end up with someone who can load for it.
LGSs around here seem to all be "gunshy" of carrying russian steel case .223/5.56, not sure if it's out of their ignorance or the ignorance of their customers.
However, one of the stores who said they didn't carry any steel cased .223/5.56 had a box of Hornady Steel Match...
I really like that store, but this is one of the reasons I shop online...
[QUOTE=PrusseLusken;50907359]i still have to buy a single station press to reload for my krag, i can't and won't shoot modern ammo in it since it's bound to make the receiver crack at the weirdly angled front receiver bridge. i could buy some US made hunting ammo but paying like 3 bucks a round for plinking/target shooting at at most 100m is just a waste.
really love my krag but i am considering selling it and buying my friend's old 10/22 and doing something fun with that instead[/QUOTE]
Fun with a 10/22? Not possible
[QUOTE=PrusseLusken;50906946]
however fireblade, you can always just run 54r casings through a 53r full size die. that would solve the problem, and you could use whatever .308 bullets which are literally everywhere. then just necksize the casings after.[/QUOTE]
Ah, it all makes sense now. Thank you for the good advice. I have reloading equipment, I just need to get appropriate tooling for this caliber.
In other news I've been in milsurp heaven for the past couple of days. over the past 3 days I've been helping a friend clean out his office at his house and then clean his extensive collection of rifles and handguns from every theater of both world wars, veitnam, korea, etc. 1.5 of the 3 days was spent field stripping, inspecting, removing surface rust, cleaning and recording 56 rifles and 23 handguns. Watching all those forgotten weapons videos finally payed off, didn't have to look up any disassembly info.
My fingers are tired now.
[QUOTE=Fireblade RX7;50906662]Thank you, great info. I gauged the bore myself and it looks like it's .308, I will have a gunsmith confirm but it is most likely x53r. Are the casings the same between x53 and x54? I am a machinist by trade and I may be able to come up with a reloading solution for the primer issue with these things and reload the old x54 cases with proper bullets IF they are the same. Otherwise this will remain a display gun. :frown: I may have to buy this nice Russian M44 from the same friend to supplement my short Mosin needs.
I also picked up another gun yesterday in trade for work (like the m28/30). It's a Tokarev, and probably the nicest looking one I've ever seen anywhere. The finish is polished blue, really pretty. It also has an unusual frame mounted safety just behind the left grip that I can't find any other examples of. I will take some pictures of it when I get home, as I am getting ready to leave for work now.[/QUOTE]
Read this in regards to getting it to shoot commercial 7.62x54r and 7.62x53r:
[url]http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?113282-M28-76-Practical-distinction-revealed-between-7-62x53R-and-7-62x54R[/url]
Ouch, $2 a shot for Lapua!:
[url]http://ammoseek.com/ammo/7.62x53r[/url]
Ouch, $1.15 just for brass!
[url]http://www.brownells.com/reloading/brass/rifle-brass/lapua-brass-7-62x53r-54r-100-ct--sku749101231-36933-75256.aspx[/url]
[QUOTE=PrusseLusken;50909819]swap out the trigger, use decent mags (shimmed BX25s), put on a nice scope and a suppressor and boom. loadsafun
my cz452 is still much more fun to shoot since the trigger pull doesn't give you a cramp, but idk magdumping a suppressed 10/22 is neat[/QUOTE]
Still sounds boring to me but maybe throwing a can on would be fun. Never found .22lr plinking fun or interesting. Bought a MP40 22lr repro and only ever shot it once and put it in the cabinet, along with every other 22 I own. Its just so boring.
Just dropped off the check with my LGS to order that Rock River AR for me.
The Tokarev I got in exchange for cleaning guns...
I haven't had a chance to disassemble and clean the gun/saddle soap the holster yet.
He definitely polished and re-blued it. I can't find any other examples of this safety though, all the other examples I see are different and/or really poorly placed. I like the placement of this one, it's not intrusive and is pretty easy to operate... Not that it matters, as I most likely won't be carrying this gun regularly.
Cross one off of the exceedingly long "own one of these at some point in my life" list.
[T]http://i.imgur.com/5m8rTtD.jpg[/T]
[T]http://i.imgur.com/eZFFtxp.jpg[/T]
[T]http://i.imgur.com/bbcwasx.jpg[/T]
[T]http://i.imgur.com/pAZhpxE.jpg[/T]
[T]http://i.imgur.com/5WRxtHC.jpg[/T]
The oddball safety...
[T]http://i.imgur.com/DSh2ktb.jpg[/T]
The buffer blend line really shows up with the flash, not very noticeable otherwise. The flash also illuminates my red computer chair and adds orange hue to it at certain angles.
[T]http://i.imgur.com/QzS2vve.jpg[/T]
[T]http://i.imgur.com/3TcslUq.jpg[/T]
It's just a century (CAI) tokarev, ATF required them to install safeties on them in order to import them. Could be an early import which would explain the nicer safety installation.
Congrats though. It's pretty, I'd love to own a TT-33 one day safety or otherwise.
Wow, an actual Russian TT-33 in the US. Shame about the stupid safety, glad we don't have those laws here.
I know it's not directly firearms related; but my stepfather's gotten me stuck on a show on Netflix from Channel 5 called Battlefield Recovery where an amateur team of of British archaeologists search Eastern European battlefield for war relics to donate to museums. The show's definitely gotten me more interested in studying WWII's eastern front and the general personal belongings of soldiers during the time frame. Figured some of you who haven't heard of it might like the history background behind the show.
[QUOTE=Fireblade RX7;50910902]The Tokarev I got in exchange for cleaning guns...
I haven't had a chance to disassemble and clean the gun/saddle soap the holster yet.
He definitely polished and re-blued it. I can't find any other examples of this safety though, all the other examples I see are different and/or really poorly placed. I like the placement of this one, it's not intrusive and is pretty easy to operate... Not that it matters, as I most likely won't be carrying this gun regularly.
Cross one off of the exceedingly long "own one of these at some point in my life" list.
The oddball safety
The buffer blend line really shows up with the flash, not very noticeable otherwise. The flash also illuminates my red computer chair and adds orange hue to it at certain angles.[/QUOTE]
I wish my tokarev was that nice
[img]https://i.imgur.com/cxNLsei.jpg?2[/img]
Some guy tried to duracoat it like FDE or some other gay craptical color and fucked up the pigments or something and ended up making a budget 007 golden gun. Bought it for peanuts but the SN on it does start with BR0 so thats cool
[QUOTE=mastoner20;50911356]I know it's not directly firearms related; but my stepfather's gotten me stuck on a show on Netflix from Channel 5 called Battlefield Recovery where an amateur team of of British archaeologists search Eastern European battlefield for war relics to donate to museums. The show's definitely gotten me more interested in studying WWII's eastern front and the general personal belongings of soldiers during the time frame. Figured some of you who haven't heard of it might like the history background behind the show.[/QUOTE]
Someone told me the exact model of a Wehrmacht watch I own was found on that show. I'm tempted to try and find the episode.
Decided to buy an AR-15 complete lower, got a few mags, buy the upper next check.
[QUOTE=mastoner20;50892587]Gun shows, on the other hand, fucking suck. If you look remotely non-military or not 60 looking for a five-decade old hunting rifle, everyone assumes you are out to make an excuse as to why the shooting community is terrible and you're an awful, no good individual because you can't name the proper GI name of every individual screw and hole on a 1911 or M9. If you are slightly fat or completely lanky and look at an AR or handgun, the dealers will immediately try to run you off for not being 21 because you're looking at a tacticool gun and not a pellet shooter.[/QUOTE]
Have you gone to The Nation's Gun Show in Chantilly? There are a lot of fudds, tacticool rednecks, and overpriced WW2 bullshit but there's a lot of good and/or rare stuff and decent sellers mixed in among them. Plus with something like 1,300 tables I almost always find something worthwhile.
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;50910530]Still sounds boring to me but maybe throwing a can on would be fun. Never found .22lr plinking fun or interesting. Bought a MP40 22lr repro and only ever shot it once and put it in the cabinet, along with every other 22 I own. Its just so boring.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. I've always toyed with the idea of grabbing a .22 CZ bolt but I just find .22's so boring to plink around. Getting through a sizable box feels like a chore after 50 or so rounds whereas I can blow through 100 .45's with my 4506 and still want more.
My blemished lower showed up in the mail today. The blemish is on the inside of the thing in a place nobody will ever see, as my potatographs will show.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/J3InjUX.jpg[/t]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/ucDQGci.jpg[/t]
To add to the 7.62x53r debacle, the m28/30 will chamber silver bear 54r exactly the same as the m91, no undue resistance like the people in the m28/76 thread on that other site were describing. I still want to do an ink transfer test on both rifles and compare the results to make sure there isn't anything funky going on with the neck of the case. I did get some pictures of my ghetto bore check, one of a used but very well taken care of Russian m44 and one of my m28/30, both with the same Bulgarian ammo.
M44: (This was on the job the other day, my phone camera is shit...)
[T]http://i.imgur.com/DF4V5ok.jpg[/T]
m28/30:
[T]http://i.imgur.com/JBiyGcz.jpg[/T]
It sort of looks like it's sticking out more on mine, but I'm still going to have someone with a gauge pin set check the bore ID, as I don't own a gauge pin set myself. But could this mean that I possibly don't have to split hairs with the cases and at best, load .308 bullets into x54 cases after I verify that the OAL is within spec?
I want that m44 too, I have a problem. :ohno:
[QUOTE=catbarf;50914024]Have you gone to The Nation's Gun Show in Chantilly? There are a lot of fudds, tacticool rednecks, and overpriced WW2 bullshit but there's a lot of good and/or rare stuff and decent sellers mixed in among them. Plus with something like 1,300 tables I almost always find something worthwhile.[/QUOTE]
Chantilly's about 4 hours away from my dink town. Never been there. Wouldn't be opposed to it one day, but I just never have a reason to go there.
Yep, I was trying to get a super rough estimate of what the rifling inner diameter was. I just retrieved my Mitutoyo digimatic caliper from the garage and did a quick measurement, I'm getting 0.2995"-.300 on the bore and .308" in the groove measured at the muzzle. Unfortunately I can't compare it to the m91 since it's been counterbored, and I don't own that m44... yet. But at this point I don't think it's really necessary, the picture is pretty clear as to what it needs.
[QUOTE=PrusseLusken;50918598]I would assume that the Finn has a steeper and more intact crowning than the M44, thus the bullet hitting the bore earlier. I assume you already know that obviously the bullet will stop in the rifling since during shooting it will be swaged into it from the pressure and heat.[/QUOTE]
Ive shot bulgarian surplus 54r out of my M27 finn mosin and never had any issues.
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;50919375]Ive shot bulgarian surplus 54r out of my M27 finn mosin and never had any issues.[/QUOTE]
The barrel is probably "D" marked":
Groove diameter: .3095"
"This "D" stamping denotes that the rifles chamber has been altered to accept the Finnish D-166 heavy ball bullet. This change was done to accommodate a chamber size that would be able to use all types of 7.62x54R ammunition. The Finnish forces had captured vast quantities of Russian ammunition and it often was not useable in the m/27 due to the Finnish rifles tighter chamber tolerances. This alteration solved that problem and enabled the use of all captured ammunition as well as the new D-166 ball ammo and MG cartridges of the Finnish weapons of the day. It is very uncommon to find a Finnish rifle of any kind that has not been marked with this "D" stamping to indicate this modification. One of the most puzzling markings commonly found on the m/27 is the capitol letter "F" found over the date of the rifle on the barrel shank. This letter was erroneously thought by others to be the designation of Swedish Fägestra steel used in the fabrication of the barrel production. This is not the correct meaning of the "F" marking. In actuality the "F" marking is one of three that were used. The trial rifles of the m/27 series were marked with an "A" to denote the shape and contuor of the neck area of the chamber. The Finnish army had been experimenting with different bullet loads and shell casing measurements to determine the optimum cartridge to achieve the greatest accuracy out of the m/27. The first shell designation with a modified casing measurements in the neck area-that was made with a much steeper shoulder than the normal Finnish 7.62x53R cartridge, was the "A" cartridge designation. This shell was not adopted for wide spread use and the marking was dropped. No known m/27 that I am aware of are found with this "A" chamber shape marking. (The author would be glad to offer a great trade should one pop up!)
The other marking that was used on the barrel was the capitol letter "F" which identified the chamber measurements of the "F" designated cartridge. This cartridge used a shallower neck incline as found on early Finnish 7.62x53R ammunition. The final marking of "D" is as outlined above. The final letter code of "D" indicated an alteration of the chamber diameter and shape to accept the Finnish D-166 cartridge that differed very slightly from the "F" chamber. So in review the barrel markings of "A", "F" and "D" were marked on the barrel of the m/27 just above the date and between the serial number to indicate the barrels chamber characteristic and what type of ammunition was capable of being fired through the weapon."
Was not D marked
Guy pulled out of selling his revolver, said the wife wants to keep it. There was a dealer selling one I'm gonna call.
Tac USP 45 or new PTR 91, one with the paddle mag.
PTR91
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