Civil war an overrated war? - General

every nation overhypes its own wars for itself and demonizes the opposing force

Some of the later years of the Civil War started to look pretty ominous about future conflicts, large scale trench warfare comes to mind.

Yes it is indeed a very overrated war, America is too proud of itself in my opinion. Britain should be proud of what it is and has done but we just move on unlike America the "Hero's of WW2" [i]bullshit[/i] I hate it when people call America the hero's. Great Britain were the hero's but we don't boast about it because that is when people start hating you because of your big headedness. Wonder why so many countries hate America? It is because they boast about the smallest achievements, twist it to make it look massive and then teach all the children of their country about their "bravery" and "patriotism". But in Britain we move on, we started the Industrial Era, we don't boast about it. We also stopped Napoleon and we don't boast about it and we also succeeded in making the largest empire the world has known but hey, we don't boast about it. Anyway that is my view on the civil war, [b]FAR FAR[/b] too overrated and boasted about.

[QUOTE=meepugh;25283010]First of all, America's slaves were immediately set free. Secondly, the cotton farmers of New England were required to pay a twelve percent duty on all exported cotton balls, swabs, and dungarees. For these minor changes, [b]902 million Americans gave their lives[/b] and countless others were left maimed[/QUOTE] I'm not even American, but that number can't be right.

[QUOTE=Doozle;25289790]I'm not even American, but that number can't be right.[/QUOTE] I think he was being sarcastic, showing how overrated the civil war was. :v:

[QUOTE=vizard38;25288671]Only because it was American versus American.[/QUOTE] Or maybe it's so important to Americans because when you are in the South it's kinda hard to not be standing on a piece of land where someone died in the Civil War. For example I am currently sitting right in the middle of where the Battle Of Chantilly (Ox Hill) occured. It's just a matter of paying attention to where you came from. Where would America be now if the Civil War hadn't happened? [QUOTE=joshdasmif;25289680]Yes it is indeed a very overrated war, America is too proud of itself in my opinion. Britain should be proud of what it is and has done but we just move on unlike America the "Hero's of WW2" [i]bullshit[/i] I hate it when people call America the hero's. Great Britain were the hero's but we don't boast about it because that is when people start hating you because of your big headedness. Wonder why so many countries hate America? It is because they boast about the smallest achievements, twist it to make it look massive and then teach all the children of their country about their "bravery" and "patriotism". But in Britain we move on, we started the Industrial Era, we don't boast about it. We also stopped Napoleon and we don't boast about it and we also succeeded in making the largest empire the world has known but hey, we don't boast about it.[/quote] You are kind of doing the same thing you are criticising. Living in America you would notice we really don't boast about that shit all to much. We respect the people who fought and died, that's about it. [i]Boasting about how America is great is so 2001.[/i]

No matter what the americans did my people would always be a bad people, no africa no bloodshed no worries. You cant look onward to other people to solve your problems with fancy coats and long guns - you need to think for yourself. The same goes for the french revolution. In my opinion.

[QUOTE=The Vman;25283334]That's because the North won :downs: [img]http://www.erichufschmid.net/ThreeSheeple.JPG[/img] WAKE UP SHEEPLE! Also, that's an awful analogy.[/QUOTE] Stop being a ignorant smartass, the media is also controlled by the goverment. Hiraldo and Glen Beck are just small pawns that help group together nutcases that think the FBI is sending Subway(C) trucks to bug their trucks. The goverment does things that you will never hear about, thats not the point in this thread. The point is, the whole united states in 1860 fought in a very uneccsary and very bigoted war, both sides wanted the same thing, control. The North just used moral tricks such as citing slavery as the souths main industry to engage in battles. The South had to defend against an attack, and eventually they would want to also take over the country, as of now no one really won. [editline]03:01PM[/editline] [QUOTE=CabooseRvB;25283362]And you're just as stupid as my Pre-Cal teacher that thinks the Illuminati is out to get him. Your posts are digging you a deeper hole so study these cases before you bury yourself. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Lopez[/url] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Printz_v._United_States[/url] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Morrison[/url] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seminole_Tribe_v._Florida[/url] You tell me that these did not keep the National Government from going overboard.[/QUOTE] The Government owns the cia, fbi, the army, the airforce, they have all the manpower to do anything and everything. The fuel? Lies. [editline]03:03PM[/editline] [QUOTE=imarawrus;25288434]The Civil War was America's most bloody war fought so far. 680,000 people died on American soil. That's kinda a big deal.[/QUOTE] So it matters where people die? Not for the idiotic reasons why they die? War is as uneccessary as raisin and shrek egg oatmeal. "War is the drug and fuel that every politician and hungry citizen clings to" - Eisenhower.

I myself and Swedish and we didn't even look at the Civil War but it seems very interesting and I'd love to learn more about it.

[QUOTE=JLea;25286426]He's saying the Civil War is overrated, and I'm agreeing with him. Because it doesn't effect the world in any way. American wasn't a world power afterwards, and it didn't effect anything else outside of your country.[/QUOTE] I just thought you were posting just to say that you didn't care about the topic. My apologies.

[QUOTE=Babs;25290036] Hiraldo and Glen Beck are just small pawns that help group together nutcases that think the FBI is sending Subway(C) trucks to bug their trucks. The goverment does things that you will never hear about, thats not the point in this thread.[/quote] Fox News is not controlled by the Government. And I need more evidence on your baseless claims. [QUOTE=Babs;25290036]The point is, the whole united states in 1860 fought in a very uneccsary and very bigoted war[/quote] The Union of the United States was split in half by rebelling Southern states that defied the National Government over the issues of the admissions of the new states and failed compromises. The Southern rebels bombed a U.S. Army fort when Lincoln sends in a ship of provisions to aid the stranded troops. [QUOTE=Babs;25290036] both sides wanted the same thing, control. [/quote] The United States wanted to bring the Union back together. The Confederate States wanted to be out and away from the Northern States and adopt their own form of government. Where is the part of Imperialism and Colonization again during the Civil War again? [QUOTE=Babs;25290036]The North just used moral tricks such as citing slavery as the souths main industry to engage in battles.[/quote] The Southern States' Economy was mostly Agriculture from White Farmers and Large Plantation owners that possessed a huge amount of African slaves to work the fields. The North [b]did not go to war with the South on the issue of Slavery until later in the war. They initially engaged in order to save the Union from further crumbling.[/b] [QUOTE=Babs;25290036]The South had to defend against an attack.[/quote] The South did not defend all the time, they did advance into Pennsylvannia (Gettysburg) and launched attacks on Allied Borderstates and landed themselves very close to D.C. [QUOTE=Babs;25290036] and eventually they would want to also take over the country, as of now no one really won.[/quote] The United States won. The Confederate States of America was broken up into Military Districts controlled by the Union Army Generals after Lee's surrender at Appomattox House in 1865. How is it that nobody won the war? [editline]03:01PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Babs;25290036]The Government owns the cia, fbi, the army, the airforce, they have all the manpower to do anything and everything. The fuel? Lies.[/quote] The Central Intelligence Agency works on operations [b]outside the U.S.[/b]. States control their own National Guards, but they are ultimately subordinate to the Federal Government. There is a very, [b]very[/b] good reason as to why the President, not the individual State Governors that control the Military. You obviously did not acknowledge the fact that the National Government has been checked by the Court Cases I have already presented. [QUOTE=Babs;25290036]War is as uneccessary as raisin and shrek egg oatmeal.[/quote] I guess the Revolutionary War, and World War II were extremely unnecessary in your eyes.

[QUOTE=meepugh;25283010]First of all, America's slaves were immediately set free. Secondly, the cotton farmers of New England were required to pay a twelve percent duty on all exported cotton balls, swabs, and dungarees. For these minor changes, 902 million Americans gave their lives and countless others were left maimed; many with serious rope burns, others with severed thumbs, swamp rot, turf toe, or a variety of other ailments related to the consumption of Johnny Cake. The price tag for these small social changes was enormous. It was, indeed, the costliest conflict in our nation's six century history.[/QUOTE] yeah the end of slavery was totally a minor change that didn't affect modern day america in the slightest

[QUOTE=joshdasmif;25289680]Great Britain were the hero's[/QUOTE] No they weren't. By saying any one country was the main contributor you're being a massive hypocrite, and even though you might say otherwise you are boasting about Britain's achievements.

[QUOTE=mastermaul;25298956]No they weren't. By saying any one country was the main contributor you're being a massive hypocrite, and even though you might say otherwise you are boasting about Britain's achievements.[/QUOTE] He sounds like his country is the most upright. All in all, Britain has it's own, good share of blood on it's hands throughout history.

I know right? I think that the Viet nam war was way under rated and the civil war was way too mainstream, but I liked it back in 1950's before it got popular with you tools.

[QUOTE=Atchell;25283268]Except that the holocaust led to World War II, and all, but let's overlook that and speak our minds[/QUOTE] um what [editline]11:10PM[/editline] [QUOTE=meepugh;25283010]First of all, America's slaves were immediately set free. Secondly, the cotton farmers of New England were required to pay a twelve percent duty on all exported cotton balls, swabs, and dungarees. For these minor changes, 902 million Americans gave their lives and countless others were left maimed; many with serious rope burns, others with severed thumbs, swamp rot, turf toe, or a variety of other ailments related to the consumption of Johnny Cake. The price tag for these small social changes was enormous. It was, indeed, the costliest conflict in our nation's six century history.[/QUOTE] apparently in 1865 there were 3 times as many Americans as there are today you learn something every day huh

Although this may be a tad off topic, I highly recommend Harry Turtledove's series "The Great War" and "In at the Death". It provides an interesting alternative history of the south and a divided America.

[QUOTE=Derubermensch;25300480]Although this may be a tad off topic, I highly recommend Harry Turtledove's series "The Great War" and "In at the Death". It provides an interesting alternative history of the south and a divided America.[/QUOTE] [img]http://mailer.fsu.edu/~akirk/tanks/UnitedStates/lighttanks/uslt-ford3ton-PattonMuseum-2.jpg[/img] IT'S A BARREL.

[QUOTE=mastermaul;25300544][img]http://mailer.fsu.edu/~akirk/tanks/UnitedStates/lighttanks/uslt-ford3ton-PattonMuseum-2.jpg[/img] IT'S A BARREL.[/QUOTE] <inside joke giggle> ......they don't know what we are talking about

[QUOTE=JLea;25286426]The French revolution was important because it was the overthrowing of a powerful European monarchy, which hadn't reallly happened before.[/QUOTE] The American revolution inspired the French revolution....

[QUOTE=CabooseRvB;25298818]Fox News is not controlled by the Government. And I need more evidence on your baseless claims. The Union of the United States was split in half by rebelling Southern states that defied the National Government over the issues of the admissions of the new states and failed compromises. The Southern rebels bombed a U.S. Army fort when Lincoln sends in a ship of provisions to aid the stranded troops. The United States wanted to bring the Union back together. The Confederate States wanted to be out and away from the Northern States and adopt their own form of government. Where is the part of Imperialism and Colonization again during the Civil War again? The Southern States' Economy was mostly Agriculture from White Farmers and Large Plantation owners that possessed a huge amount of African slaves to work the fields. The North [b]did not go to war with the South on the issue of Slavery until later in the war. They initially engaged in order to save the Union from further crumbling.[/b] The South did not defend all the time, they did advance into Pennsylvannia (Gettysburg) and launched attacks on Allied Borderstates and landed themselves very close to D.C. The United States won. The Confederate States of America was broken up into Military Districts controlled by the Union Army Generals after Lee's surrender at Appomattox House in 1865. How is it that nobody won the war? [editline]03:01PM[/editline] The Central Intelligence Agency works on operations [b]outside the U.S.[/b]. States control their own National Guards, but they are ultimately subordinate to the Federal Government. There is a very, [b]very[/b] good reason as to why the President, not the individual State Governors that control the Military. You obviously did not acknowledge the fact that the National Government has been checked by the Court Cases I have already presented. I guess the Revolutionary War, and World War II were extremely unnecessary in your eyes.[/QUOTE] I'm getting frustrated here. You keep throwing you're own opinion on how the United States government works, you do not work within the system, watching CNN and reading books written by people that frankly were fuck ups doesn't help you. If I read up on how all the laws were pushed through the senate or whatever, that doesn't make the government anymore credible. Also the justice system is basically shakespeare, except you just don't deliver lines of dialog, you also yell out stupid rules and get turds and hairs to prove someone guilty. I'd rather flush my shit down the toilet rather than having some jagoff named Dean put my shit in bags and I get arrested. If our government is so spotless and not to blame for anything, how is the United States economic system so boned in the ass? Why are we fighting in a war that we should've never declared? How is this dessert war still going? We have satellites that can track the golden girls corpses through north America and into the gulf. How have we not found every cave or school that builds young fertile boys into super machines? If the government is so great why aren't all facepunchers millionaires? I mean, you seem super intelligent and knowledgeable about the government, you seem to know all your shit and you seem proud about it. Why haven't you utilized the great tool box this country has given you? The truth is though, not everyone gets a toolbox, sometimes you just get a tv and basic cable and you watch everyone loves raymond until you play with your phone and then you come here, and spread your over patriotic bile all over. I'm not proud to be an american, because too many Americans love to jerk off on history books and war documentary DVD's. All these rules in the country won't protect you or save you, saying that we can put the government into check is like saying I can tell my grandpa what record he can dance too, he just laughs and dances to violins or some shit.

[quote]You clearly didn't take American History to understand that we did not even go to war on the issue on slavery in the first place.[/quote] Your argument has lost all credibility from what I said earlier. How can you place mistrust in a government system that you hardly ever learned of in the first place? You should first off learn how the government operates. How can you debate or question the historical events of the United States when you clearly did not take an actual class on it or read it from a tenured professor? Basing your claims off of Wikipedia sources or from Childrens' Books isn't really enough. But before you do any of that. Read on the Civil War. Preferably from the AMSCO Book of United States History.

[QUOTE=Atchell;25283227]The holocaust didn't happen :downs:[/QUOTE] It's overrated fan fiction :downs: [editline]12:15PM[/editline] Also, I honestly can't believe the OP is 29 years old. Please tell me you've faked your birth date.

In my opinion, you can't have an "overrated" war. Whether you support the reasons behind them or not, they were and continue to be huge events that change the course of history pretty substantially.

Not really an overrated war. It was a time-changing event for the United States, for sure. It was one of the most probably important times in our History, considering that it would eventually lead up to what our modern society is. Imagine if the South had gotten control of a powerful ally such as France or England at the time, and had gone against the North and we would've been defeated? State's would have most likely seceded from the Union all together in a power struggle, the Federal Government would've been abolished, and most importantly, the United States may have never existed, Nazi Germany would've never been defeated, and hell, we might be living in a Facism. People believe that the Civil War didn't affect the world, but altering one specific event in history, might change a whole ENTIRE Course of events.

Russian Civil War > Any civil war really The future of the entire world was decided in that war.

[QUOTE=CabooseRvB;25302364]Your argument has lost all credibility from what I said earlier. How can you place mistrust in a government system that you hardly ever learned of in the first place? You should first off learn how the government operates. How can you debate or question the historical events of the United States when you clearly did not take an actual class on it or read it from a tenured professor? Basing your claims off of Wikipedia sources or from Childrens' Books isn't really enough. But before you do any of that. Read on the Civil War. Preferably from the AMSCO Book of United States History.[/QUOTE] I've read up all I need to on it, I don't need to fill my brain with useless jargon and knowledge that I can't use unless I'm pursuing or I'm in a career within our great turd federal government. And stop trying to sell me books you merchant. Stay on topic please.

The Civil War marked the shift from Napoleonic line battle to modern skirmishing tactics. At the start of the war, the opposing armies lined up and fought in blocks just as they did two hundred years prior. By the end of the war, regiments of no more than a hundred men fought in loose skirmishing groups, using cover. Artillery bombardment, automatic weapons, balloon observation, long-range infantry rifles, repeating rifles, trench warfare, snipers, motorized military transport, and use of cover instead of standing in lines were all products of the American Civil War. The British didn't learn, and suffered greatly at the hands of the Zulus in 1879 as a result, as the big blocks of redcoats standing in the open got sniped at by skirmishing riflemen they couldn't see.

We Finns don't talk much about our civil war. There's no honour in shooting your neighbors. I don't think many people even know which side their ancestors fought for anymore.

Civil War is the most deadliest war in American history. worse than WWII Also, the Unions main objective in the civil war was to PRESERVE THE UNION not slavery, that came after the emancipation proclamation but did you know that it didn't free any slaves? It just said that slaves in southern states were free which encouraged slaves in the Confederacy to run away to the Union. Just studied the Civil War in US History class.