[QUOTE=rampageturke 2;49891246]To me, ever since Bungie did Marathon, Bungie have been the only developer I know to really nail AI and make it work really well. Up until and including Halo 3, I loved how they included concepts from their earlier games into Halo and made it work, creating some sort of connection of the two.
Looking at Marathon and Halo, things like Hunters appearing in both, the easter egg terminals, the whole idea of the main characters background being a mystery. Theres so many well thought out references. Bungie is my favourite developer for what they did with Marathon (one of my favourite games series) and Halo (another)[/QUOTE]
According to the Dev Audio Commentary that came with the Reach special edition, they went back and looked at the Halo 1 AI for the Elites.
[QUOTE=Tuskin;49891808]According to the Dev Audio Commentary that came with the Reach special edition, they went back and looked at the Halo 1 AI for the Elites.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=DOG-GY;49891792]This is so true which is why it hurt me so much that Destiny's AI was fuckin garbo.
How they managed to release a game with AI that failed in all the ways that their previous games excelled is beyond me. Like being able to go outside the radius an enemy can walk from its spawn and cheesing it as it the AI strokes out trying to decide between running towards you and running back to its original position. Halo AI would flank and hunt you down in 3.
I bought a PS4 for that game all excited to explore a new universe by Bungie and realized only the multiplayer was passable. The story was barely there, it was all based on grind reward economy (and even worse random reward), etc. They made it anti-fun. And that initial exposure soured my impression so much that I don't want to come back to buy DLC that supposedly makes it better, let alone even consider Destiny 2 whenever it comes out unless it gets incredible critical acclaim.
Speaking as someone who literally got into making games because of Halo 1 and it being my favorite franchise until they handed the baton to 343i. I remember being like 13-14 and fucking around with the Halo CE engine, making custom skins and models. Basically learning how to make a game 101 by reverse engineering a masterclass in game design. It's so sad to say that vision seems completely dead on both ends, Bungie and 343.[/QUOTE]
Sorry for the confusion, I didn't mean coded AI you experience in the game, but an AI as a character and the behaviour concepts that revolve around an AI. For example, from the Marathon series some predominant AI characters that exist are Leela, Durandal, and Tycho. Durandal gets bored being a door opener for hundreds of years and eventually spirals into [URL="http://marathongame.wikia.com/wiki/Rampancy"]rampancy[/URL] which I think is a cool concept and you experience it in the games. Rampancy is also present in Halo.
Looking back on it now that really wasn't clear. But I agree, with Halo 3 the AI as you experience in game play was quite well done and outshines some much newer games.
Halo Reach is honestly my favorite, I loved the approach it took and the fact it told an entirely different story arc, and if you'd read the books, you knew where it was all going so getting to see it for yourself and experience it was fantastic.
I couldn't handle Halo 4 enough to go beyond the third story mission, although the multiplayer didn't bother me much.
But something interesting to me is ODST. It was a weird, wonky game that nobody asked for, but it actually was fantastic conceptually and I liked the idea of an open world Halo game, at least semi-open world. And I really would love to see a Halo game that did more with the ODST. Having gotten in to Warhammer 40k recently I have to liken it to how I see many fans like to see stuff dealing with more than just the Space Marines or Ultramarines. The Imperial Guard is fascinating because they're not unstoppable badasses, but basically normal guys fighting immensely more powerful and horifying forces. They're under far more threat and more vulnerable. The ODST is very similar, (though more special forces than the Imperial Guard's general infantry nature), they're squishy, normal humans fighting things far bigger than them (figuratively and literally). Seeing more of that is actually a great idea for my taste, and the idea of making it more like Rainbow Six of Ghost Recon would work well to me.
Similarly the idea of making the Spartans feel heavier is a great idea too. They're not Space Marine heavy and bulky, but still damn weighty. And the idea of using that weight in the environment is great (charging through a wall as someone said). Basically, save the speedy, agile parkour stuff for the ODST.
[QUOTE=rampageturke 2;49891246]To me, ever since Bungie did Marathon, Bungie have been the only developer I know to really nail AI and make it work really well. Up until and including Halo 3, I loved how they included concepts from their earlier games into Halo and made it work, creating some sort of connection of the two.
Looking at Marathon and Halo, things like Hunters appearing in both, the easter egg terminals, the whole idea of the main characters background being a mystery. Theres so many well thought out references. Bungie is my favourite developer for what they did with Marathon (one of my favourite games series) and Halo (another)[/QUOTE]
Well Halo was originally going to be the same universe as Marathon, possibly being a prequel. That changed when Microsoft came into play though.
Bungie was really good at the whole mysterious universe thing. Their writers really know what they're doing.
[QUOTE=rampageturke 2;49891872]Sorry for the confusion, I didn't mean coded AI you experience in the game, but an AI as a character and the behaviour concepts that revolve around an AI. For example, from the Marathon series some predominant AI characters that exist are Leela, Durandal, and Tycho. Durandal gets bored being a door opener for hundreds of years and eventually spirals into [URL="http://marathongame.wikia.com/wiki/Rampancy"]rampancy[/URL] which I think is a cool concept and you experience it in the games. Rampancy is also present in Halo.
Looking back on it now that really wasn't clear. But I agree, with Halo 3 the AI as you experience in game play was quite well done and outshines some much newer games.[/QUOTE]
Oops lol
Also can we just mention how orgasmic ODST's soundtrack is? The part at 3:00 still gets me and always will.
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQRH6kLMa1k[/media]
[QUOTE=Janus Vesta;49889684]Yeah man, what kind of shitty Halo game has metal in it?
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2O9K7E3lDRU[/media]
For fuck's sake, the assault on High Charity ends with an instrumental version of Blow Me Away. Halo has always had varied music, and it has had metal and rock music in it since 2.[/QUOTE]
Fun fact, Heavy rock music has been in the Halo series from the start, Mjolnir Mix has it's roots in a short song called saving the world from the silent cartographer mission.
[url]http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/halo/images/7/7b/16_Rock_Anthem_for_Saving_the_World.ogg/revision/latest?cb=20140529174742[/url]
[QUOTE=Skyward;49893669]Also can we just mention how orgasmic ODST's soundtrack is? The part at 3:00 still gets me and always will.
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQRH6kLMa1k[/media][/QUOTE]
Marty O'Donnell is a god-tier composer.
[QUOTE=Fr3ddi3;49894065]Fun fact, Heavy rock music has been in the Halo series from the start, Mjolnir Mix has it's roots in a short song called saving the world from the silent cartographer mission.
[url]http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/halo/images/7/7b/16_Rock_Anthem_for_Saving_the_World.ogg/revision/latest?cb=20140529174742[/url][/QUOTE]
God I forgot about that song. It's part of the reason Silent Cartographer is my favourite mission.
I need to replay the Halo games now.
[QUOTE=Naught;49891675]this just makes me want halo reach on pc again[/QUOTE]
Man, I have Xbox 360 and Reach and it's right there in my closet but... Damn I would've love to play Halo 3/Reach games on PC. Using M&K is a lot more comfortable to use than a controller.
[QUOTE=Pappi_man;49894784]Man, I have Xbox 360 and Reach and it's right there in my closet but... Damn I would've love to play Halo 3/Reach games on PC. Using M&K is a lot more comfortable to use than a controller.[/QUOTE]
Halo 3 had some really nice control layouts some other games could do with adopting, such as bumper jumper
[QUOTE=RikohZX;49889835]This was like one or two fights, but you must not pay any damn attention to the music in this series.
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSgQGKZocDA[/media]
[editline]7th March 2016[/editline]
shit, page-surprised[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Janus Vesta;49889684]Yeah man, what kind of shitty Halo game has metal in it?
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2O9K7E3lDRU[/media]
For fuck's sake, the assault on High Charity ends with an instrumental version of Blow Me Away. Halo has always had varied music, and it has had metal and rock music in it since 2.[/QUOTE]
That's not what I was talking about when I was talking about reach having a more metal soundtrack. I was talking about the fact that some of the Halo Reach soundtracks are just straight up metal (namely the end of the Winter Contingency suite), whereas with the rest of the series it was more of a mix of traditional classical music and metal which was fucking amazing. In reality though I'm more starting to realize I just don't like the music of Reach in general, probably because as someone else mentioned, Reach does have a much darker grittier tone. I didn't like that at all because to me Halo was all about having hope that fighting your way through the covenant hordes you can stop them, whereas Reach was more just about hopelessness and how you're helpless to stop the destruction of Reach.
I forgot how Halo just has like... the COOLEST fucking names for things. No other series comes close.
"The Pillar of Autumn"
"The Silent Cartographer"
"High Charity"
"Truth and Reconciliation"
Like I could be here all day, everything in Halo just oozed cool
[QUOTE=TornadoAP;49895182]That's not what I was talking about when I was talking about reach having a more metal soundtrack. I was talking about the fact that some of the Halo Reach soundtracks are just straight up metal (namely the end of the Winter Contingency suite), whereas with the rest of the series it was more of a mix of traditional classical music and metal which was fucking amazing. In reality though I'm more starting to realize I just don't like the music of Reach in general, probably because as someone else mentioned, Reach does have a much darker grittier tone. I didn't like that at all because to me Halo was all about having hope that fighting your way through the covenant hordes you can stop them, whereas Reach was more just about hopelessness and how you're helpless to stop the destruction of Reach.[/QUOTE]
All of Reach's differences is because it's a spinoff. It doesn't have to constrain itself to the conventions and all that of the first three games. ODST did the same thing with a more jazzy slow soundtrack. Reach still had the classic Halo sounds you love so much, but Reach was also able to get away with any differences because of the huge tonal shift it took. It wasn't a story about a team of Spartans saving the day, it was a story about a group of soldiers just trying to survive the final days of an all out assault.
Reach is supposed to be different, it didn't have to be the usual Halo shtick, and Reach is well beloved because of that.
And again, ODST did the same thing, it's an incredibly different story with very different tones from the main trilogy and you seem to like that game perfectly fine.
Not to mention the moment Halo Reach was announced everyone already knew about The Fall of Reach, so we all had a strong idea of what was going to happen - just not the how. You're not Master Chief, who's out saving the universe from the threat of the Flood and the Halos. You're Noble Six, a disposable SPARTAN-III stuck by sheer bad circumstance in the front of the planet-glassing Covenant juggernaut's path with no choice but to fight.
I get that some may not like the grittier, darker and more brutal tone of Reach, but the game intentionally ends on a hopeful note for the planet and leading straight into Halo 1 for a reason. It pretty much serves as a good indicator of what humanity was going through with the insurgency on one side and the Covenant trying to genocide them all on the other and just why Master Chief's role in the war is so important in comparison.
[QUOTE=Katatonic717;49895236]All of Reach's differences is because it's a spinoff. It doesn't have to constrain itself to the conventions and all that of the first three games. ODST did the same thing with a more jazzy slow soundtrack. Reach still had the classic Halo sounds you love so much, but Reach was also able to get away with any differences because of the huge tonal shift it took. It wasn't a story about a team of Spartans saving the day, it was a story about a group of soldiers just trying to survive the final days of an all out assault.
Reach is supposed to be different, it didn't have to be the usual Halo shtick, and Reach is well beloved because of that.
And again, ODST did the same thing, it's an incredibly different story with very different tones from the main trilogy and you seem to like that game perfectly fine.[/QUOTE]
Which is why I don't like it and thus I think it's the worst game of the series. I get what they were trying to do with it, I just don't like where it went.
I've never even had an Xbox to play the Halo games on and I still adore what the series used to be - their art design is one of my favourites in any form of media and it makes me sad to see what it's become.
My fondest memory of Halo was playing Attack on the Control Room splitscreen with my brother, with this (my fav Halo track alongside Another Walk) playing in the background:
[video=youtube;7Ga380Wd85s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ga380Wd85s[/video]
Like, sheesh. That level is one of my favorites in any video game. None of the recent Halo games have been able to recreate that same feeling. Vivid memories of crossing that damn bridge. It's honestly a shame other kids won't be able to play these new Halo games splitscreen with their siblings.
What made Halo successful wasn't just it's gameplay, it was the experience as a whole. The writing, music, sound direction, art direction, were some of the greatest works of all time in the gaming industry. Just about every single part of Halo 1-3 is iconic and memorable. THATS the making of an instant classic.
[QUOTE=ace13;49884483]In related news; [url]http://halome.nu/[/url] is a beautiful page.
Also, the work the CMT have been doing on SPv3 is enough to keep me happy for now, though I'd love a PC release of the MCC or just a proper Halo 3 PC version.
One can always dream.[/QUOTE]
I hit the Reach button, holy fuck that one hit just as much as the others.
[QUOTE=Butthurter;49907793]and now we have was a literal gundam warmachine in halo 5, cleverly named
"the mantle of responsibility"[/QUOTE]
That's not a machine, the Mantle of Responsibility isn't even a physical object or anything.
It's literally a title, a belief by the Precursors that the most technologically and mentally advanced species around must tend to, care for, and help the other lesser species around it, control the galaxy to maintain the ecosystem and prevent the pointless destruction of life. Encourage biodiversity, allow life to flourish and expand and so forth.
Except when the Precursors gave the mantle to Humanity rather than the Forerunners, both races being their creation among many others, the Forerunners flipped their shit completely and utterly, like a bratty child being told their younger sibling was the favorite. They believed they held the right to the title of the mantle even though they basically used its belief to impose harsh and draconian rule of subjugation. Thus they wiped out the Precursors, even if begrudgingly, and when ancient humanity's war with the Flood got out of control and collateral damages got involved (they basically glassed a planet under the Forerunners and the runners didn't believe their claims of the Flood infection), the Forerunners promptly blasted them into the stone age (literally, degrading minds and destroying non-Forerunner technology) - only to realize the Flood that they'd been trying to deal with on the side were a far greater threat than they imagined and thus had to resort to the Halos to destroy all potential food for the Flood so they don't spread further. Even more ironic because as I said before, the Flood actually were testing humanity in the original series for whether they could handle the Mantle as well since the Flood are corrupted Precursors born from infectious dust.
The only reason there's even Reclaimers in Humanity by the time the series begins (which started the whole conflict with the Covenant when they realized all of humanity were 'forerunner artifacts' in a sense) is because a few Forerunners realized just how bad they fucked up and helped engineer them to reclaim the Mantle.
Literally, 343's introduction of the Mantle of Responsibility as a concept and belief, little else, became the catalyst for [i]the entire conflict of the franchise[/i] and turned the mysterious Forerunners into huge assholes who basically ruined everything and decided they were the righteous force that should decide what happens to the universe at large. The 'last resort' weapons of the Halos were a desperate last bid when Bungie was around and that doesn't change much for 343, but the added context that they basically had to fall back to that because their stupidity and selfish, destructive tendencies [i]caused the very thing the Halos were meant to counter[/i] essentially changes the whole damn intent into something overly ridiculous.
Halo has been one of the best game series in my life. From Halo as a young kid to Reach, except 2, though I did play that with a friend; they all hold a special place in my heart. From the singleplayer, playing with friends, messing around with other people online (like roleplaying), and even making some of my own maps for the custom edition, there are so many fond memories through out the years.
I can't say anything about the new Halo games by 343, I haven't played them, and I probably never will. To me Chief's story ended with 3, it was the perfect ending.
[QUOTE=TornadoAP;49895182]That's not what I was talking about when I was talking about reach having a more metal soundtrack. I was talking about the fact that some of the Halo Reach soundtracks are just straight up metal (namely the end of the Winter Contingency suite), whereas with the rest of the series it was more of a mix of traditional classical music and metal which was fucking amazing. In reality though I'm more starting to realize I just don't like the music of Reach in general, probably because as someone else mentioned, Reach does have a much darker grittier tone. I didn't like that at all because to me Halo was all about having hope that fighting your way through the covenant hordes you can stop them, whereas Reach was more just about hopelessness and how you're helpless to stop the destruction of Reach.[/QUOTE]
Sgt Johnson listens to "Flip" music, which is actually metal.
Your complaints don't seem that grounded
Halo 1 has metal in it.
I think the best part of Halo for me is that combination of unique sci-fi military (Spartan program and the ODSTs) and that biblical tone (the Covenant, forerunners, and the god-tier soundtrack).
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49908991]Sgt Johnson listens to "Flip" music, which is actually metal.
Your complaints don't seem that grounded
Halo 1 has metal in it.[/QUOTE]
Who cares if it has metal in it?
Metal is fucking awesome.
[editline]11th March 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Duck M.;49897132]What made Halo successful wasn't just it's gameplay, it was the experience as a whole. The writing, music, sound direction, art direction, were some of the greatest works of all time in the gaming industry. Just about every single part of Halo 1-3 is iconic and memorable. THATS the making of an instant classic.[/QUOTE]
A combination of Halo, Battletech, Mass Effect and Killzone were my biggest inspirations for a lore I'm currently working on for shits and giggles.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49908991]Sgt Johnson listens to "Flip" music, which is actually metal.
Your complaints don't seem that grounded
Halo 1 has metal in it.[/QUOTE]
Did you not read any of my other posts?
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