• Should every police officer be armed?
    134 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Bad)-(and;37746693]He was shot dead in a taxi in Tottenham, London. He pulled a gun from his waistband (Accoring to the most recent report) when pulled over by armed officers who were trying to detain him and was subsequently shot and killed. The shooting then sparked a riot in parts of London, which then spread across England[/QUOTE] From what I remember it all started as a peaceful protest sort of thing and then some ass-hats started taking it too far and a riot started. I'm pretty sure most of the rioters didn't give a shit about the shooting, they were just trashing shit because everyone else was.
[QUOTE=squids_eye;37748102]From what I remember it all started as a peaceful protest sort of thing and then some ass-hats started taking it too far and a riot started. I'm pretty sure most of the rioters didn't give a shit about the shooting, they were just trashing shit because everyone else was.[/QUOTE] Mark Duggan was to the 2011 riots, what Franz Fredinand was to WWI. Just replace huge international political tension across Europe, with a bunch of shitty people who were dying to go set things on fire and nick stuff.
Train them in martial arts and teach them to completely utilize their batons. Kung-Fu the fuck out of people.
imo not every police officer should get a gun off the bat. I think they should do a shit-ton of tests that would evaluate their mental and physical readiness for a gun. Honestly, we see too much douchebag cop news reports where they flatout shoot somebody because they don't like them or something.
Even as a Brit, living in the United States has helped me realize that every officer needs to be armed with at least a sidearm. "Expect the Unexpected," and always Be Prepared.
[QUOTE=areolop;37742668]I was saying that it is easy for everyone to buy/own a gun in the US. Not just criminals but everyone.[/QUOTE] It's not much harder to do so in most European nations, as long as you know at least remotely were to get one. Even legally. The main difference is the amount, or lack of, a gun culture.
Britain has ARUnits but they're only called out when it's already too late, arming police with tasers/non-lethal weaponry is the best way to approach this. They might have a short range but in the case of those 2 policewomen most houses aren't big enough to push it past the non-effective range.
They should be armed in relation of the gravity of the situation: the graver the better they have to be harmed. If it's a pacifical protest, well, just some very well hidden batoons in case that there is REALLY somebody dangerous among the normal people that is going to damage. During riots? Famas and Glocks 9mm armed with plastic capsules aimed to non-lethal spots to go.
[QUOTE=mario92;37774918]They should be armed in relation of the gravity of the situation: the graver the better they have to be harmed. If it's a pacifical protest, well, just some very well hidden batoons in case that there is REALLY somebody dangerous among the normal people that is going to damage. During riots? Famas and Glocks 9mm armed with plastic capsules aimed to non-lethal spots to go.[/QUOTE] That's how it is at the moment in a way. In a riot, if there is danger to life, the police are allowed to kill. It was revealed that during the 2011 riots they could have brought the armed police in and killed anyone who was a threat, but it wouldn't exactly look good, especially as we were in Libya at the time.
The problem is (in Britain, atleast) that since even though we already have strict gun laws, people still get guns illegally. If we give the police a pistol, the criminals will just get rifle illegally. It happens, we try to stop it but nothing is impossible. If we give every police officer a firearm in the UK, then the criminals will know to be armed equally if the police come for them. There'd be bigger problems with it than without in my opinion.
Of course they should be fucking armed. Officers often have to arrest violent and sometimes ARMED criminals. Why would you have them do that with nothing but a nightstick? You can trust a man to detain another human being but you cant trust him to carry a firearm?
[QUOTE=mario92;37774918]They should be armed in relation of the gravity of the situation: the graver the better they have to be harmed. If it's a pacifical protest, well, just some very well hidden batoons in case that there is REALLY somebody dangerous among the normal people that is going to damage. During riots? Famas and Glocks 9mm armed with plastic capsules aimed to non-lethal spots to go.[/QUOTE] You just cant decide "oh, today I'm not going to be armed" its your either armed every shift or your not. The problem is that an officer has to face the unknown threats all day so they have to be prepared for them at all times. That riot analogy is terrible. Police are trained to shoot center mass. Less-lethal or not.
[QUOTE=Savyetski79;37777901]Of course they should be fucking armed. Officers often have to arrest violent and sometimes ARMED criminals. Why would you have them do that with nothing but a nightstick? You can trust a man to detain another human being but you cant trust him to carry a firearm?[/QUOTE] Have you even read the OP, or any of the other posts in the thread? First of, we're talking about the UK here. Second, yes, I would trust a cop with detaining me, but not with carrying a firearm especially when they don't fucking want to carry. It is by choice that they don't carry.
Sure, a person can obtain a firearm in the UK. But it is very difficult. If officers all have guns it will be like a call to arms for criminals. Forget the 50 year gap between the Manchester killings and the last time this sort of incident occurred. It will happen a lot more frequently. Those officers that don't carry firearms are very well trained. The response times of armed officers needs to be addressed. It's not like they're not trained to attack either. There was a call to introduce the side handle baton, but they went instead with the extendable Asp baton because it's more offensive than defensive.
[QUOTE=MalwareOhMy!;37738701]Since I live in the us all officers are armed usually. But in other industrialized countries like the us, there is still violence, but not as much as the us in most cases. I think there are plenty of NON LETHAL options to choose from. Tear gas, batons, rubber bullets, etc[/QUOTE] You are not going to respond to a mugging and just peg tear gas at them, and you are not going to see a guy with a gun and try hitting him with a baton. Rubber bullets also do not do much to a target. [editline]24th September 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=mario92;37774918]They should be armed in relation of the gravity of the situation: the graver the better they have to be harmed. If it's a pacifical protest, well, just some very well hidden batoons in case that there is REALLY somebody dangerous among the normal people that is going to damage. During riots? Famas and Glocks 9mm armed with plastic capsules aimed to non-lethal spots to go.[/QUOTE] Tell me what a non lethal spot is. And why would they shoot them with plastic shots.
[QUOTE=ThePinkPanzer;37785028]You are not going to respond to a mugging and just peg tear gas at them, and you are not going to see a guy with a gun and try hitting him with a baton. Rubber bullets also do not do much to a target.[/quote] I agree with your point completely. The rubber rounds are lethal at short range though and even if their out of the lethal range, they still sting like a motherfucker
Bullets hurt too but there are plenty of instances of people continuing on after being shot, I doubt rubber bullets will put down dangerous targets.
[QUOTE=ThePinkPanzer;37787892]Bullets hurt too but there are plenty of instances of people continuing on after being shot, I doubt rubber bullets will put down dangerous targets.[/QUOTE] There are not "plenty of instances". If so, show us.
"The officer has the right to arrest And if you fight back they put a hole in your chest! The police them have a little gun So when I'm on the streets, I walk around with a bigger one" Here's a gun and a right to arrest. I feel totally safe. If they had no guns, that would be cool. Then some people wouldn't need them in self defense anymore. We don't need police officers with guns. We shouldn't resolve "crimes" with weapons. What kind of person are you then?
[QUOTE=MCCCXXXIII;37789140]Then some people wouldn't need them in self defense anymore.?[/QUOTE] If you need a gun for "self defence" against the police, move the fuck out of whatever shithole country you are in, or stop doing shady shit that gets you shot. The armed police are meant to be trained enough to not shoot you unless they have to. At least in the UK they tend to be quite good at not fucking everything up when they start shooting. Average patrols and disturbance checks shouldn't need any form of firearm in the UK, we don't have a gun culture, the most a police officer usually has to deal with is some nut with a knife. The moment dispatchers get wind of a firearm offence they don't just send unarmed units in, that's silly. The police don't need guns for day to day patrols. Especially if there is no gun culture. We very rarely get instances like the recent Manchester attack, let alone gun robberies. The people who currently have illegal guns tend to either be idiot "gangsters" who will probably shoot themselves anyway, or organised crime groups/ relatively organised thieves who get armed units to deal with. Arming the police would probably just lead to them wanting bigger, stronger weapons and causing more havoc, our police forces would be reluctant to up the ante and arm patrols because of how our society views guns.
Should every police officer be armed? Yup.
People in Britain argue that criminals will arm if police arm, but in Japan there are fewer gun offences than Britain, yet the average Japanese police officer carries a sidearm. I do believe the police should carry a sidearm, to be prepared in case there is a scenario like the one in Manchester. It is better to have and not need than to need and not have.
[QUOTE=DaCommie1;37791840]People in Britain argue that criminals will arm if police arm, but in Japan there are fewer gun offences than Britain, yet the average Japanese police officer carries a sidearm. I do believe the police should carry a sidearm, to be prepared in case there is a scenario like the one in Manchester. It is better to have and not need than to need and not have.[/QUOTE] Different cultures bro. Handing guns to all UK police officers will not do any good.
[QUOTE=mobrockers2;37793706]Different cultures bro. Handing guns to all UK police officers will not do any good.[/QUOTE] Um, sure culture could have an effect, but could you please elaborate? He provided a pretty good argument, I would just like to see a better argument from your side. Otherwise, I just think that statistic would outweigh the claim of "different cultures".
Sometimes not even a firearm is enough to protect a police officer.
[QUOTE=mobrockers2;37793706]Different cultures bro. Handing guns to all UK police officers will not do any good.[/QUOTE] You wouldn't just give them a gun and go "Off ya go, lads!" You'd of course give them training in the proper use of a firearm, as well as accuracy training. IIRC, the Japanese police were trained by police from the US, and that didn't cause the Japanese criminals to become like American gang-bangers to counteract it.
[QUOTE=Zally13;37799976]Um, sure culture could have an effect, but could you please elaborate? He provided a pretty good argument, I would just like to see a better argument from your side. Otherwise, I just think that statistic would outweigh the claim of "different cultures".[/QUOTE] What statistics? And you can't apply statistics because of different cultures. If we were to apply statistics you'd see the US has far higher gun crime than the UK. [editline]26th September 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=DaCommie1;37802623]You wouldn't just give them a gun and go "Off ya go, lads!" You'd of course give them training in the proper use of a firearm, as well as accuracy training. IIRC, the Japanese police were trained by police from the US, and that didn't cause the Japanese criminals to become like American gang-bangers to counteract it.[/QUOTE] UK police don't want guns, UK citizens don't want guns, UK citizens don't want the police to have guns. Why give them guns? There is no valid reason to give the police guns when no party involved wants them to be armed. There already are teams whom carry, to handle crimes where a cop would need to be armed, there is no need at all for normal police to carry a gun as it's obviously working in the UK without.
[QUOTE=mobrockers2;37804157][B]What statistics? And you can't apply statistics because of different cultures. If we were to apply statistics you'd see the US has far higher gun crime than the UK. [/B] [editline]26th September 2012[/editline] UK police don't want guns, UK citizens don't want guns, UK citizens don't want the police to have guns. Why give them guns? There is no valid reason to give the police guns when no party involved wants them to be armed. There already are teams whom carry, to handle crimes where a cop would need to be armed, there is no need at all for normal police to carry a gun as it's obviously working in the UK without.[/QUOTE] What are you talking about? A statistic is just a presentation of data. I'm not asking you to apply statistics to compare cultures, I'm asking why Japan, the UK, and other countries are so different due to culture.
[QUOTE=Zally13;37817012]What are you talking about? A statistic is just a presentation of data. I'm not asking you to apply statistics to compare cultures, I'm asking why Japan, the UK, and other countries are so different due to culture.[/QUOTE] are you questioning whether culture has an effect on a population and why? i can't possibly answer that, I'm not a sociologist. [editline]27th September 2012[/editline] you can't compare the statistics because the test group isn't the same, and even if you do, you'll notice few firearm involved incidents in the uk and Japan, and many more in the us.
[QUOTE=Robbi;37789076]There are not "plenty of instances". If so, show us.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f32_1345329245&comments=1[/url] It really is not fucking hard to find, at all.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.