[QUOTE=dai;44501871]it's amazing what a little cherrypicking can do to present opinions, isn't it
I'm not banning anything or anybody right now but I want you to seriously slow down on posting these videos; it's clear that the frequency of the topic and lack of self information is painting a rather blatant image and it's becoming a point of contention
I think he meant thunderfoot, not you.[/QUOTE]
If I wont post the videos, someone else will, you might as well ban it.
Just because I post a video doesn't mean that I agree with it, I don't have to take responsibility for people's assumptions about me.
I hope you planned that "cherry picking" thing the entire time, it's pretty funny that hex agreed went along with you anyway despite the fact that your logic was clearly flawed. I don't really think it's the same thing here because thunderf00t is just showing poisonous attitudes, he has no obligation to represent feminism as a whole, unlike you would (or should) if you're attempting to show what kind of person someone is.
[editline]9th April 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;44501893]If anything thunderf00t is more "poisonous" because regardless of what he thinks, the message people are receiving is that feminism is inherently bad. With a video title like that, what do you expect?[/QUOTE]
I don't think anyone actually thinks feminism is bad as a whole based on thunderf00t's videos, almost everyone knows that feminism at its core is a good equality movement. This is similar to the creationist videos that he has made, you could claim that he's saying that religion is inherently bad but that is not the case, both in his creationist videos and here he is simply showing what he perceives to be outrageously poisonous/invalid beliefs.
[editline]9th April 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=hexpunK;44501897]Could have meant both. That's like, a possibility.[/QUOTE]
Irrelevant to my point
[editline]9th April 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=dai;44501871]it's amazing what a little cherrypicking can do to present opinions, isn't it
I'm not banning anything or anybody right now but I want you to seriously slow down on posting these videos; it's clear that the frequency of the topic and lack of self information is painting a rather blatant image and it's becoming a point of contention
[/QUOTE]
He's posting them with the frequency that they get made, not his fault there's a lot of videos to post (thunderf00t has been on a streak recently, with more than a dozen videos so far this year)
[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;44501893]If anything thunderf00t is more "poisonous" because regardless of what he thinks, the message people are receiving is that feminism is inherently bad. With a video title like that, what do you expect?[/QUOTE]
He's simply pointing out the crazies. With a movement as huge as feminism you can't really say that criticizing any element of it is criticizing the movement as a whole.
Feminists hold different beliefs and even disagree about what feminism really is. The most obvious disagreements include trans issues, sexual freedom and the patriarchy.
[QUOTE=Wii60;44501404]dumb feminism/mra/etc. bullshit festival[/QUOTE]
That's pretty much how I feel about all of this. I'm tired of these tumblr-ish things getting posted around everywhere. Something about them just gives me a nasty taste in my mouth.
You can only hear about feminism, MRA, privilege, and other memes get thrown around, combined with all the harsh, egotistical attitudes arguing against each other so much before you get absolutely sick of it.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44502025]He's simply pointing out the crazies. With a movement as huge as feminism you can't really say that criticizing any element of it is criticizing the movement as a whole.
Feminists hold different beliefs and even disagree about what feminism really is. The most obvious disagreements include trans issues, sexual freedom and the patriarchy.[/QUOTE]
He is doing more than simply pointing out the crazies. He turns just about all of the 'points' he makes into exceedingly sensationalist generalizations.
I mean for example, the title of this video series is "why 'feminism' poisons EVERYTHING".
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44502025]He's simply pointing out the crazies. With a movement as huge as feminism you can't really say that criticizing any element of it is criticizing the movement as a whole.
Feminists hold different beliefs and even disagree about what feminism really is. The most obvious disagreements include trans issues, sexual freedom and the patriarchy.[/QUOTE]
I pretty much said all of that on the first page, so yes, I know.
Watching the video though, I don't get the feeling he's pro-feminist. He says stuff like "Let's see how feminists deal with an opposing viewpoint", shows a clip of an anti-feminist speech, then goes on to chastise "feminists" over how they react. I don't recall him saying it's just down to a minority or that feminism is largely a good thing in the video (I listened to it in the background mainly), I just caught some sweeping generalisations.
[editline]10th April 2014[/editline]
If he started with a disclaimer saying "Actually I do support feminism but these are a few individuals that poison it", I'd be a little more accepting of the video. Instead, he gives it a sensationalist title and jumps straight into why 'feminism' posions EVERYTHING. If that title isn't a sweeping statement then I don't know what is.
[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;44502193]I pretty much said all of that on the first page, so yes, I know.
Watching the video though, I don't get the feeling he's pro-feminist. He says stuff like "Let's see how feminists deal with an opposing viewpoint", shows a clip of an anti-feminist speech, then goes on to chastise "feminists" over how they react. I don't recall him saying it's just down to a minority or that feminism is largely a good thing in the video (I listened to it in the background mainly), I just caught some sweeping generalisations.
[editline]10th April 2014[/editline]
If he started with a disclaimer saying "Actually I do support feminism but these are a few individuals that poison it", I'd be a little more accepting of the video. Instead, he gives it a sensationalist title and jumps straight into why 'feminism' posions EVERYTHING. If that title isn't a sweeping statement then I don't know what is.[/QUOTE]
There is almost no way he doesn't support feminism, it would be unfair to assume that he's an absolute and complete bigot, which you would have to be to dissupport the pursuit of equality which is feminism.
[QUOTE=dai;44501484]
anything to do with my little pony[/QUOTE]
Hmm, really? I remember I made like 3 MLP-related threads and none of them ended up badly, neither was I banned for making them. The only one that got closed was due to my request and in fact I remember the last one I made ended on a very positive note.
Besides dai, you visit the DAA, so I hope you see the irony in you saying that MLP-related topics are forbidden.
(I'll stop now I swear, I don't mean to cause shitstorms)
[QUOTE=Manibogi;44502458]Hmm, really? I remember I made like 3 MLP-related threads and none of them ended up badly, neither was I banned for making them. The only one that got closed was due to my request and in fact I remember the last one I made ended on a very positive note.
Besides [B]dai, you visit the DAA, so I hope you see the irony in you saying that MLP-related topics are forbidden.[/B]
(I'll stop now I swear, I don't mean to cause shitstorms)[/QUOTE]
ok? is this supposed to be a callout? let's not divert the thread any further with needless fluff, please.
[QUOTE=Manibogi;44502458]
Besides dai, you visit the DAA, so I hope you see the irony in you saying that MLP-related topics are forbidden.[/QUOTE]
This is really irrelevant. That's a thread meant for laughing at MLP-related topics, not having a discussion over them.
[QUOTE=Viper202;44501380]TAA hasn't been posted in months, I'm pretty sure people are going to stop posting Thunderfoots crap after a while too.
Literally censoring it because you don't like it is retarded though, but maybe we should ban russian viral videos too because I really hate those!
[editline]9th April 2014[/editline]
Seriously just ignore the thread if you know it's a thunderfoot/amazingatheist thread lmao[/QUOTE]
its less that i want it "censored" and more that it just leads to a big argument every time. it's just an eyesore and bothersome in general. I could care less what you or anyone else feels about thunderf00t because that's your opinion but if its obviously going to cause a big thread with nothing but arguing then its better to just not have it at all
atleast, in my opinion.
[QUOTE=Viper202;44502629]This is really irrelevant. That's a thread meant for laughing at MLP-related topics, not having a discussion over them.[/QUOTE]
I didn't know you were talking about topics to discuss and not just topics in general but, ignoring that last sentence, my point still stands. I remember the last big MLP-related video thread I saw prior to the ones I made was about SWAG.MOV and that one didn't turn into a shitstorm either. Neither did any of the ones I saw in SH for that matter.
But whatever I'm derailing hard right now, I think it's best to stop.
[QUOTE=be;44502341]There is almost no way he doesn't support feminism, it would be unfair to assume that he's an absolute and complete bigot, which you would have to be to dissupport the pursuit of equality which is feminism.[/QUOTE]
I really do not see how you think he supports feminism.
[QUOTE=Valnar;44502902]I really do not see how you think he supports feminism.[/QUOTE]
If the views he expresses are anything to go by then it's plain that he supports gender equality. He's criticising intellectual dishonesty, not feminism. He's put the 'feminism' bit in quotation marks for that very reason, although it's pretty blatant clickbait as well.
[QUOTE=idiot;44503014]If the views he expresses are anything to go by then it's plain that he supports gender equality. He's criticising intellectual dishonesty, not feminism. He's put the 'feminism' bit in quotation marks for that very reason, although it's pretty blatant clickbait as well.[/QUOTE]
Wow I never even noticed the quotation marks, that completely decimates the claim that thunderf00t is saying all feminism is this way.
[QUOTE=Valnar;44502902]I really do not see how you think he supports feminism.[/QUOTE]
Being a feminist doesn't necessarily mean you support gender equality. It does mean however that you do support womens rights and interests.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44503391]Being a feminist doesn't necessarily mean you support gender equality. It does mean however that you do support womens rights and interests.[/QUOTE]
Feminism [I]is [/I]gender equality, though the 'rights' side of it is specifically women oriented. It evolved over time, realizing many problems in the social-side of things can affect men negatively as well, all from under the same umbrella that's causing issues for them- the "patriarchy". This isn't a term for 'men' as most see it, it's a term for how society treats things with the overall belief in males being superior; That's why the name is based on a patriarch, the authority-holding male of an extended family.
It is not a concept people actively created, nor follow intentionally, rather how we and generations before were simply raised, evolving as a social norm for these kind of factors-
• Men are superior, deserving
• Women are a trophy and accessory to serve the men
• Men who show what are thought to be feminine traits or interests in the unusual are weak
• Women who show masculine traits and interest in 'manly' responsibilities and hobbies are broken or delusional
Those who claim to be feminists but hate men are radicals; The group Femen is akin to the Westborough Baptist Church or PETA activists. Yes, you [I]can [/I]be a good feminist and focus on specific issues related only to women's rights, but to actively proclaim you don't support the other concepts is missing the point and leading back into radical territory.
I'm not sure there's a proper term one could rename feminism with, which accurately explains who's side the whole thing is actually on. For a side-example, the situation with 'global warming' would be a lot harder for deniers to hyuck it up about had they started out with [i]the current term[/i], "climate change". You could just go full humanist if you want to skip the political specifics, but that is a much broader, longer push to be had.
[QUOTE=Viper202;44501583]Thanks for not dancing around the question. I mean that.[/QUOTE]
the list was a jab at what else evokes this exact kind of discussion (and gets itself locked down), not an actual checklist of what's bannable.
[QUOTE=Manibogi;44502458]Hmm, really? I remember I made like 3 MLP-related threads and none of them ended up badly, neither was I banned for making them. The only one that got closed was due to my request and in fact I remember the last one I made ended on a very positive note.
Besides dai, you visit the DAA, so I hope you see the irony in you saying that MLP-related topics are forbidden.
(I'll stop now I swear, I don't mean to cause shitstorms)[/QUOTE]
for a brony on this forum you seem to have zero understanding of [i]why[/i] the subject often warrants a threadlock, let alone how the subject relates to my history here in particular. The DAAS is entirely irrelevant due to the nature of the discussion. It's there to laugh at weird art and bad mentalities, people who post decent mlp work to laugh at 'wasted talent' or whatever actually get shunned for it; oddly enough, the regulars of that thread tend to appreciate talent and dedication over subject matter, gross-factors withstanding
[QUOTE=idiot;44503014]If the views he expresses are anything to go by then it's plain that he supports gender equality. He's criticising intellectual dishonesty, not feminism. He's put the 'feminism' bit in quotation marks for that very reason, although it's pretty blatant clickbait as well.[/QUOTE]
Thats a pretty flimsy excuse for yellow journalism.
He is still framing feminism in a negative light.
It is a sensationalized title that puts frames an idea for the audience. One of the negative things about Thunderfoot is that he is highly sensationalized when it comes to these feminist video.
[QUOTE=Valnar;44504172]Thats a pretty flimsy excuse for yellow journalism.
He is still framing feminism in a negative light.
It is a sensationalized title that puts frames an idea for the audience. One of the negative things about Thunderfoot is that he is highly sensationalized when it comes to these feminist video.[/QUOTE]
He's highly sensationalized when it comes to all of his video titles, it isn't just the feminism ones.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44503391][B]Being a feminist doesn't necessarily mean you support gender equality.[/B] It does mean however that you do support womens rights and interests.[/QUOTE]
did you even read what you just posted
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;44504656]did you even read what you just posted[/QUOTE]
He's right you know, feminism doesn't concern the rights of men, it fights for the rights of women. The goal of feminism (to be equal to men) doesn't mean they advocate men's rights. This is not a new concept, many people neglect to refer to themselves as feminists because they would prefer to be more general (egalitarian is the word they use).
[QUOTE=be;44504703]He's right you know, feminism doesn't concern the rights of men, it fights for the rights of women. The goal of feminism (to be equal to men) doesn't mean they advocate men's rights. This is not a new concept, many people neglect to refer to themselves as feminists because they would prefer to be more general (egalitarian is the word they use).[/QUOTE]
Yes, feminism fights mostly for the rights of women, but it does so to archieve gender equality you numbnut.
[QUOTE=Manibogi;44504755]Yes, feminism fights mostly for the rights of women, but it does so to archieve gender equality you numbnut.[/QUOTE]
Yeah you're right, but that's pretty indirect and still doesn't mean that feminism really supports...men.
[QUOTE=be;44504703]He's right you know, feminism doesn't concern the rights of men, it fights for the rights of women. The goal of feminism (to be equal to men) doesn't mean they advocate men's rights. This is not a new concept, many people neglect to refer to themselves as feminists because they would prefer to be more general (egalitarian is the word they use).[/QUOTE]
it fights for gender equality. many people call themselves egalitarian because they're morons who can't handle feminism having 'fem' in it
[QUOTE=be;44504778]Yeah you're right, but that's pretty indirect and still doesn't mean that feminism really supports...men.[/QUOTE]
Make up your mind. First you agreed with the guy that said the feminism doesn't fight for gender equality and now you agree with me. Consistency, please?
[QUOTE=be;44504329]He's highly sensationalized when it comes to all of his video titles, it isn't just the feminism ones.[/QUOTE]
Why are you defending a person who you admit is highly sensationalized?
[QUOTE=be;44504778]Yeah you're right, but that's pretty indirect and still doesn't mean that feminism really supports...men.[/QUOTE]
It... does? Just because the word "feminism" is based off of the word "feminine" doesn't mean that it also strives for men's rights too. What do you think "gender equality" even means? Can't possible mean making MEN and WOMEN equal in every way, could it?
[QUOTE=be;44504778]Yeah you're right, but that's pretty indirect and still doesn't mean that feminism really supports...men.[/QUOTE]
honest question: what's your opinion of the MRA movement. do you support it because it 'addresses the other side' ?
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;44504792]it fights for gender equality. many people call themselves egalitarian because they're morons who can't handle feminism having 'fem' in it[/QUOTE]
I really don't understand why people say "i'm an egalitarian not a feminist." Like, why? They're both virtually the same thing, the only difference is the fucking word you use to define yourself.
I've heard lots of so called egalitarians saying that they call themselves that to stay away from the crazies that give feminism a bad name, which is hilarious because some of the most disgusting misogynistic MRAs brand themselves as egalitarians.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;44504867]I really don't understand why people say "i'm an egalitarian not a feminist." Like, why? They're both virtually the same thing, the only difference is the fucking word you use to define yourself.
I've heard lots of so called egalitarians saying that they call themselves that to stay away from the crazies that give feminism a bad name, which is hilarious because some of the most disgusting misogynistic MRAs brand themselves as egalitarians.[/QUOTE]
either they're morons that don't want to describe themselves with something that has the word 'fem' in it, or they're morons that don't understand what feminism is and assume because it has 'fem' in it it must just be about women
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