[QUOTE=_Axel;50737591]It's the fields of France, but where are the French?
Also, is it just me or do the British and German pilots look exactly the same?[/QUOTE]
[IMG]https://i.gyazo.com/4d0a9a2d7b885b0be90ad94eb7bb9b6c.png[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;50739020]It's a sign of laziness and cash grabbing, it's a carrot at the end of the proverbial stick for the European market.[/QUOTE]
Of the four maps with factions described on the BF1 website two of them involve the Italians and the Austrians. Its quite clear at least some of the maps will involve Palestinians and Ottamans. But no, apparently not including France and Russia on release is a tactical move to sell more copies even though most people don't even have a clue about Italian or Austrian involvement (outside of maybe the Archdukes assassination) and the combined populations of those countries, and correspondingly the target demographics are barely bigger than that of France. Let's just ignore the fact that Russia is one of the world's biggest gaming markets.
You're trying to find offence in a place where there is none.
[QUOTE=Hauptmann;50739039]Excuse me but not having France in the base version of a WW1 game (you know, the war during when France lost [B]1 400 000[/B] soldiers ) but still having the Americans who almost didn't do anything compared to France is an enormous insult.
The yanks should have been the ones getting a DLC, not France.
Also I'm pretty sure they decided to make a DLC for France after seing how many people were pissed for not having seen it in the reveal trailer.[/QUOTE]
The game is a medium of entertainment, not a memorial. Casualties and proportion of involvement are only relevant up to the point where there is respect for the events depicted, such that there is no offence in the way events have been depicted. The game isn't trying to be an interactive pie chart to illustrate who deserves the most commemoration. You can play a German tanker driving a French tank and get out to shoot your British pistol. Representation is meaningless, and the end of the day it is all pixels, there is no secret loaded malicious intent. We're not even dealing with a case of zero representation for France.
There is nothing to suggest DICE is trying to insult anyone. Fact of the matter is you will get France in the game, and by the time that DLC does roll along, you'll probably find they get one of the greatest proportions of the representation from getting like 3 or 4 new maps.
[QUOTE=bdd458;50739078]
the us only joined the war in 1917 and didn't actually start fighting in earnest until 1918[/QUOTE]
US involvement was a major factor in ending the war. The UK officially only entered the war because of the invasion of Belgium, is it insulting they're not in the game?
Is this game an insult to Canada, Brazil, China, Japan etc because they haven't been included? At what point do we say that DICE not going out of their way despite the constraints of AAA game development to represent everyone isn't an insult?
[QUOTE=Dr.Critic;50739237]
US involvement was a major factor in ending the war.[/quote]
No lol. While US troops fought valiantly in the battles they did, all US involvement did was speed up the end. the Spring Offensive would have happened with or without US involvement in the war, and when it was clear that had failed by mid April 1918, the Germans could not recover. The US's first real battle of the war didn't start until May 28th, 1918.
The Germans were starting to get behind in new technologies such as tanks, and German supplies were dwindling both at the front and at home (one of the reasons they were starting to lag behind tech wise). They had one last offensive in them by that time, and it failed.
[QUOTE=Dr.Critic;50739237]The UK officially only entered the war because of the invasion of Belgium, is it insulting they're not in the game?[/quote]
While having Belgium would be interesting, they were overall a minor player in the grand scheme of the war, and much more suited for a DLC than France. [I]Hint, Germany only went through Belgium as a way to get to France[/I]. As a result of the war, between 1.67%-1.95% of Belgium's population perished (about 123,870-144,337 deaths, included in that is the 38,170 Combat Deaths (which includes MIA)).
France on the other hand lost 1,697,000 to 1,737,800 people, with 1,150,000 being combat deaths (with MIA). They lost a total of 4.29%-4.39% of their population. Only 3 nations lost a greater percentage of their population than France - Serbia (anywhere from 16%-27%), the Ottomans (13%-15%) and Romania (7%-8%) (as a side note, the high estimates for the % of German losses put them at equal % with France). I like how you bring up japan when they had a total of 300 combat deaths, essentially 0% of their population was lost as a result of the war.
Seriously, it would be sweet to see Belgium in there. But it's a mind-boggling decision to not include France, the nation which a majority of the Western Front went through. It would have made far more sense for the US to be DLC, rather than France who had been there for 4 god damn years fighting to preserve themselves.
[QUOTE=Dr.Critic;50739237]Is this game an insult to Canada, Brazil, China, Japan etc because they haven't been included? At what point do we say that DICE not going out of their way despite the constraints of AAA game development to represent everyone isn't an insult?[/QUOTE]
There's a difference between not representing one of the major players of the war, in both its cause and action, and minor nations who played a fairly minimal role in the war. It's like making a game about the war in the Pacific, and not including the US but rather including a bunch of other Allied powers such as the UK and the Netherlands and then putting them at places such as Iwo Jima all while portraying it as historically authentic.
Not including France in a game about WW1 while including the US would be like doing the opposite in a WW2 game. If it were focused on specific events it would make sense, but in a game which aims to depict the conflict globally it's a really weird choice.
[quote]No lol. While US troops fought valiantly in the battles they did, all US involvement [B]did was speed up the end.[/B][/quote]
Nice strawman. I would have thought that I wouldn't have had to elaborate on the fact that the US involvement was a major factor in ending the war when it did, and not just period.
[quote]While having Belgium would be interesting, they were overall a minor player[/quote]
I'm going to summarise my response to everything along this line here- I explained this to the point of being tiresome in my post. Minor, major, percentage of involvement, etc, it doesn't matter a toss. As I said, the game is not an interactive pie chart. There is no obligation for them to do things in order of importance.
Its not supposed to be insulting, it shouldn't be insulting, its not difficult to understand why they haven't gone for trying to feature every single major power in the initial release, and why it isn't important that they have to appease impatient people making a big deal out of nothing about the order in which content for different nations is released.
As for your comparison to the Pacific, you're ignoring the fact that the US had the vast, overwhelming majority of involvement whereas on the western front of WW1 the proportion of UK to French involvement was far more balanced by comparison.
[QUOTE=_Axel;50738274]...What? The US only joined the war in its last year.
The fuck is that?[/QUOTE]
You actually expecting a nation other than the US to be the main nation in a modern game?
lmao
It's not a simple question of order in which content is released, it's the fact you have to [I]shell out extra[/I] to be able to play as or against the nation that was one of its major players, the soil of which is a substantial amount of the game's battlefields, all the while including a faction the involvement of which was more anecdotal in comparison.
That's like having a game about the Napoleonic wars feature the French, the Portugueses and the Swedish, but only include the British in paid DLC.
[QUOTE=Jund;50737403]holy shit 4:18 is beautiful
how the hell is that not pre-rendered? that water reflection is insane[/QUOTE]
Screen space reflections, it looks nice but the reflection clips when they pass your screen borders.
Or it's planar reflections, but those are computationally expensive and only work on level objects.
[QUOTE=Dr.Critic;50739719]Nice strawman. I would have thought that I wouldn't have had to elaborate on the fact that the US involvement was a major factor in ending the war when it did, and not just period.
I'm going to summarise my response to everything along this line here- I explained this to the point of being tiresome in my post. Minor, major, percentage of involvement, etc, it doesn't matter a toss. As I said, the game is not an interactive pie chart. There is no obligation for them to do things in order of importance.
Its not supposed to be insulting, it shouldn't be insulting, its not difficult to understand why they haven't gone for trying to feature every single major power in the initial release, and why it isn't important that they have to appease impatient people making a big deal out of nothing about the order in which content for different nations is released.
As for your comparison to the Pacific, you're ignoring the fact that the US had the vast, overwhelming majority of involvement whereas on the western front of WW1 the proportion of UK to French involvement was far more balanced by comparison.[/QUOTE]
I'm going to break this down for you. The Western Front composed about 400 miles between Nieuport in Belgium and the Swiss border. [I]270 miles of that was occupied by the French[/I]. 40 miles were Belgian, and 90 were British. Just by the amount of men alone the French had the overwhelming majority of involvement on the Western Front, [I]in part because it was their own soil they were fighting on[/I].
Do you know what happened on August 22nd, 1914? 27,000 French soldiers were killed in one day. That's a death toll to even surpass the British dead on July 1st, 1916. 73% of French forces ended up being a casualty (dead, wounded, missing), while only 35% of British forces were. I'm not really sure how much more simple to make this for you, the French are far too important to leave out of a game that takes place across seemingly the whole Western Front and then charge after release to get them.
And again, the US was not a driving force in the end of the war, that was coming either way. Germany was exhausted, supplies and materials and manpower starting to truly run low. The German strategy had rested upon beating Russia and then putting everything they had against the West since the start of the war. And when they did, it failed. That was the end of the war, and it was not because of the US.
[QUOTE=_Axel;50739788]It's not a simple question of order in which content is released, it's the fact you have to [I]shell out extra[/I] to be able to play as or against the nation that was one of its major players, the soil of which is a substantial amount of the game's battlefields, all the while including a faction the involvement of which was more anecdotal in comparison.
That's like having a game about the Napoleonic wars feature the French, the Portugueses and the Swedish, but only include the British in paid DLC.[/QUOTE]
this essentially
[QUOTE=FalconKrunch;50739868]Screen space reflections, it looks nice but the reflection clips when they pass your screen borders.
Or it's planar reflections, but those are computationally expensive and only work on level objects.[/QUOTE]
reflection techniques aren't new but these are the most realistic water reflections i've ever seen in a game
their method is a bit more complex than simply mirroring what's on the screen
[url]http://www.frostbite.com/2015/08/stochastic-screen-space-reflections/[/url]
Can we have marketing like this and not dumbass dubstep please EA.
[QUOTE=RainbowStalin;50740037]Can we have marketing like this and not dumbass dubstep please EA.[/QUOTE]
I like both.
Glitch Mob is also not dubstep.
Anyone know which country the British scout might be from?
Like, did the UK have any countries in Africa under its control back then? Because I've honestly forgotten.
[QUOTE=Scorpo;50740320]Anyone know which country the British scout might be from?
Like, did the UK have any countries in Africa under its control back then? Because I've honestly forgotten.[/QUOTE]
[t]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/de/Colonial_Africa_1913_map.svg/1280px-Colonial_Africa_1913_map.svg.png[/t]
Red is UK holdings in 1913
[QUOTE=Jund;50740036]reflection techniques aren't new but these are the most realistic water reflections i've ever seen in a game
their meathod is a bit more complex than simply mirroring what's on the screen
[url]http://www.frostbite.com/2015/08/stochastic-screen-space-reflections/[/url][/QUOTE]
Screen space reflections also raytrace what is infront of you to get correct normal mapped reflections, that new method is a way of doing really good looking glossy screenspace reflections, which aren't possible with naive Screen space reflections.
It's really cool though, thanks for sharing.
[QUOTE=bdd458;50740394][t]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/de/Colonial_Africa_1913_map.svg/1280px-Colonial_Africa_1913_map.svg.png[/t]
Red is UK holdings in 1913[/QUOTE]
I wonder if they are going to give Germany (turquoise) black colonial soldiers too
[IMG]http://www.wwvets.com/Images/BUFFisher2.jpg[/IMG][IMG]https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/6e/d3/08/6ed30858e789cf935df3bfb476f69a8e.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Daniel Smith;50740501]I wonder if they are going to give Germany (turquoise) black colonial soldiers too
[/QUOTE]
Sadly the german scout is black. Tbh black german soldiers have no place in the Western Front. They never was any german colonial troop in Europe.
[url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schutztruppe[/url]
holy shit i thought this was a real EA thing too, had me totally fooled. that's really really good for in-game footage
[QUOTE=Dr.Critic;50739237]
Is this game an insult to Canada, Brazil, China, Japan etc because they haven't been included?[/QUOTE]
How does that make any goddamn sense when the game takes place in fucking [b]FRANCE[/b] and focuses on the [b]WESTERN FRONT[/B]
I'm not surprised the thread turned into a "where is France" thing.
[QUOTE=Adarrek;50740575]How does that make any goddamn sense when the game takes place in fucking [b]FRANCE[/b] and focuses on the [b]WESTERN FRONT[/B][/QUOTE]
And no French troops.
[QUOTE=sa2fan;50740846]I'm not surprised the thread turned into a "where is France" thing.[/QUOTE]
EA wants us to pay for the Marne taxis' fare.
[QUOTE=bdd458;50739966] the French are far too important to leave out of a game that takes place across seemingly the whole Western Front and then charge after release to get them.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Adarrek;50740575]How does that make any goddamn sense when the game takes place in fucking [b]FRANCE[/b] and focuses on the [b]WESTERN FRONT[/B][/QUOTE]
Except you're both completely wrong
The game has maps set in the Western Front in France, the Italian Front, Arabia and reputedly Gallipoli. From what we've seen so far they're not even trying to depict culture stereotype absolute trench warfare where everything is dirt and trenches. There is absolutely nothing to suggest they are focusing on the Western Front.
DICE has never said the game focuses on the Western Front. Its been clear from the beginning they have opted to make a game with varied theatres because that makes for an interesting game with different environments.
[QUOTE=Dr.Critic;50741060]Except you're both completely wrong
The game has maps set in the Western Front in France, the Italian Front, Arabia and reputedly Gallipoli. From what we've seen so far they're not even trying to depict culture stereotype absolute trench warfare where everything is dirt and trenches. There is absolutely nothing to suggest they are focusing on the Western Front.
DICE has never said the game focuses on the Western Front. Its been clear from the beginning they have opted to make a game with varied theatres because that makes for an interesting game with different environments.[/QUOTE]
Yes there are maps that take place in other parts of the world, which is great to see - and the factions for those places are accurately represented.
But there are maps which seemingly take place along the entire Western Front - not just St. Quentin which was in the British sector. Argonne, which I'm guessing is a US vs German map. Bold is mine
[quote]
MP_Amiens [B]Western Front: France, English battle late in war[/B]
MP_Chateau [B]Western Front: France?[/B]
MP_Desert [B]Middle East[/B]
MP_FaoFortress [B]Middle East[/B]
MP_Forest [B]Western Front: France or Belgium[/B]
MP_Argonne [B] Western Front: France (US map probably tho)[/B]
MP_ItalianCoast [B]Italian Front[/b]
MP_MountainFort [B]Italian Front[/B]
MP_Scar [B]Western Front: France, late war British battle[/B]
MP_Suez [B]Middle East[/B]
[/quote]
Half of the maps, which will most likely be all of the vanilla maps (BF3 had like 10 on release, BF4 9 on release iirc from doing some reading), take place on the Western Front. 1/5th take place in Italy, and 1/3rd take place in the Middle East.
Out of the Western Front maps, they pretty much all take place in France with only 2 of them being a British battle, and 1 being an American battle. The other two easily could be French battles.
[QUOTE=Hauptmann;50740537]Sadly the german scout is black. Tbh black german soldiers have no place in the Western Front. They never was any german colonial troop in Europe.
[url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schutztruppe[/url][/QUOTE]
DICE's approach to MP is to have every part of each nation represented, it seems. I'm sure the campaign will be more authentic.
Isn't the Suez Africa, not middle east?
[QUOTE=Tuskin;50741306]Isn't the Suez Africa, not middle east?[/QUOTE]
Depends on one's definition of "Middle East"
[editline]19th July 2016[/editline]
Egypt could be considered "African" in culture/origin up until the Ottoman period. Also people consider Sinai to be Asia and whatnot
tl;dr fuck continents
I classify that all under the Middle Eastern/Mesopotamian front
[QUOTE=Oblivion Knight;50741297]DICE's approach to MP is to have every part of each nation represented, it seems. I'm sure the campaign will be more authentic.[/QUOTE]
Allright but why isn't he wearing the Askari uniform then ? The british scout and medic both have uniforms telling the place they're from, while the german scout has a simple german uniform
[QUOTE=Hauptmann;50741354]Allright but why isn't he wearing the Askari uniform then ? The british scout and medic both have uniforms telling the place they're from, while the german scout has a simple german uniform[/QUOTE]
That's a good point. No clue.
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