License to Vote? - General - Facepunch Forum

[QUOTE=CabooseRvB;27205188]some countries stick fines on you if you didn't vote in the elections.[/QUOTE] That is what we were discussing. [editline]4th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=CabooseRvB;27205188]Yeah exactly, which dashed a bunch of those projects. The busing sucked also, they were just kindling the flame.[/QUOTE] Now you're making no sense. So were white people back then racist or not to you?

[QUOTE=Funcoot;27205214] Now you're making no sense. So were white people back then racist or not to you?[/QUOTE] They were, they hated them all the way to the point they just wanted them out of their lives and practically having a wall separating the towns.

[QUOTE=evilking1;27205099]Well you are required to go to school / possibly drafted to war too. And you could always vote donald duck or blank though. I feel that the liberty to make a blank vote (aiming for the lesser evil is better imho) wouldn't make the forced-voting system all that bad.[/QUOTE] Aren't truancy laws just on the state level though? Since federal government mostly has its hands out of schooling affairs.

[QUOTE=Mr Dinosaur;27205154]So people have to go through a test to vote nothing? Brilliant.[/QUOTE] No, i'm saying without an option to test, then voting for nothing wouldn't be a bad idea. At least people wouldn't feel pressured to vote for something, and a large number of "Nothing" votes would show the media that maybe they didn't cover certain issues enough.

I remember they did stuff like this back when I was kid to stop black people from voting. Wait no. I'm not that old.

[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;27205352]No, i'm saying without an option to test, then voting for nothing wouldn't be a bad idea. At least people wouldn't feel pressured to vote for something, and a large number of "Nothing" votes would show the media that maybe they didn't cover certain issues enough.[/QUOTE] 3rd party candidates say hi.

[QUOTE=Mr Dinosaur;27205523]3rd party candidates say hi.[/QUOTE] What do you mean by that?

[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;27205820]What do you mean by that?[/QUOTE] 3rd party candidates also have stands on things. Or is that too complicated for you to understand?

Know what? Whatever. It was my idea, that made logical sense to me. I offered it. I even said up-front that I was convinced I was forgetting something, because otherwise why didn't we ALREADY operate like this? I don't think "dumb" ratings and "worst threads of the new year" nominations were ever exactly called for. Someone earlier asked me why I thought things were getting worse. That's easy. Most people in the country have the luxury of not having to think. They listen to the news, they hear election commercials, they hear "prop#____" in whatever their state is. And all those things are directly praised and refuted by opponents. When you hear them on TV, one after the other, you couldn't tell if a person or a proposition was a new progressive decision for everyone's betterment, a misguided idealist one with terrible repurcussions, or a full-on wolf in sheep's clothing. You can't tell who's lying and who's telling the truth. How can there be any order in this chaos? The only way is if people actually look into the matters first hand. How many people do this? How many people can reasonably be EXPECTED to do this? People across the nation vote in the midst of a gigantic smokescreen. How can we expect the right decisions to be upheld by the majority under these conditions? We can't. People will say "fuck it", and vote for their party, through ignorance or for petty reasons. And why wouldn't they? This is what I mean when I say the Democratic system isn't working. We're reaching a point that will determine much of the rest of this century at least. We have to solve the rapid depletion of oil, turn to alternative fuels. We have to counteract pollution and the potential effects of hypothetical climate change. So many hurdles, all of them critical if we are to make it through this without first degrading into famine-wars. If we can't figure this out and start causing some actual progress, we are in for some dark years as a species.

Isn't this pretty much what the electoral college was for (Tyranny of the majority)?

[QUOTE=J-Dude;27206039]Know what? Whatever. It was my idea, that made logical sense to me. I offered it. I even said up-front that I was convinced I was forgetting something, because otherwise why didn't we ALREADY operate like this? I don't think "dumb" ratings and "worst threads of the new year" nominations were ever exactly called for. Someone earlier asked me why I thought things were getting worse. That's easy. Most people in the country have the luxury of not having to think. They listen to the news, they hear election commercials, they hear "prop#____" in whatever their state is. And all those things are directly praised and refuted by opponents. When you hear them on TV, one after the other, you couldn't tell if a person or a proposition was a new progressive decision for everyone's betterment, a misguided idealist one with terrible repurcussions, or a full-on wolf in sheep's clothing. You can't tell who's lying and who's telling the truth. How can there be any order in this chaos? The only way is if people actually look into the matters first hand. How many people do this? How many people can reasonably be EXPECTED to do this? People across the nation vote in the midst of a gigantic smokescreen. How can we expect the [b]right decisions[/b] to be upheld by the majority under these conditions? We can't. People will say "fuck it", and vote for their party, through ignorance or for petty reasons. And why wouldn't they? This is what I mean when I say the Democratic system isn't working. We're reaching a point that will determine much of the rest of this century at least. We have to solve the rapid depletion of oil, turn to alternative fuels. We have to counteract pollution and the potential effects of hypothetical climate change. So many hurdles, all of them critical if we are to make it through this without first degrading into famine-wars. If we can't figure this out and start causing some actual progress, we are in for some dark years as a species.[/QUOTE] Stop assuming there is a right and wrong to vote for.

[QUOTE=Mr Dinosaur;27205928]3rd party candidates also have stands on things. Or is that too complicated for you to understand?[/QUOTE] I'm sorry that your vague sentence wasn't understood. Maybe work on elaborating in the first place to save your cocky attitude having to pick up the slack later on. I didn't mention 3rd party candidates because they should have equal coverage on the ballots describing what they are representing.

[QUOTE=Mr Dinosaur;27206113]Stop assuming there is a right and wrong to vote for.[/QUOTE] Of COURSE there is. It's the decision that produces the most gain and the least harm. Yes, nothing is COMPLETELY right, or COMPLETELY wrong, but choosing the lesser of two evils tends to be the name of the game in politics. You tell me; was Prop 8 right, or wrong? If you tell me neither, I'll smack you and tell you to stop being a fucking nihilist and join Western Society already. In any case, we barely scraped by repealing DADT under OBAMA, for Dawkin's sake. Could you imagine it under McCain at all? Not with his attitude.

[QUOTE=J-Dude;27206291]Of COURSE there is. It's the decision that produces the most gain and the least harm. [/QUOTE] To you - or the others?

[QUOTE=J-Dude;27206291]Of COURSE there is. It's the decision that produces the most gain and the least harm. Yes, nothing is COMPLETELY right, or COMPLETELY wrong, but choosing the lesser of two evils tends to be the name of the game in politics. You tell me; was Prop 8 right, or wrong? If you tell me neither, I'll smack you and tell you to stop being a fucking nihilist and join Western Society already. In any case, we barely scraped by repealing DADT under OBAMA, for Dawkin's sake. Could you imagine it under McCain at all? Not with his attitude.[/QUOTE] I don't think there always is a right or wrong. It all depends too heavily on what you think, and care about. My mom doesn't want DADT to pass because she's firmly rooted in her Christian belief that a man and a woman is the only "right" thing. I on the other hand think the gay community should have every right to die for their country that everyone else does, without having to hide who they really are.

[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;27206245]I'm sorry that your vague sentence wasn't understood. Maybe work on elaborating in the first place to save your cocky attitude having to pick up the slack later on. I didn't mention 3rd party candidates because they should have equal coverage on the ballots describing what they are representing.[/QUOTE] Maybe work on elaborating in the first place to save your cocky attitude having to pick up on the slack later on. You never mentioned 3rd party candidates but now I am supposed to assume I knew you wanted them to have equal coverage? Ok, please forgive me for my cocky attitude, Sire. For I have sinned. It's funny because you're the one who didn't elaborate. [QUOTE=J-Dude;27206291]Of COURSE there is. It's the decision that produces the most gain and the least harm. Yes, nothing is COMPLETELY right, or COMPLETELY wrong, but choosing the lesser of two evils tends to be the name of the game in politics. You tell me; was Prop 8 right, or wrong? If you tell me neither, I'll smack you and tell you to stop being a fucking nihilist and join Western Society already. In any case, we barely scraped by repealing DADT under OBAMA, for Dawkin's sake. Could you imagine it under McCain at all? Not with his attitude.[/QUOTE] The problem with this is that "right" is your opinion. What is right is you is very well possibly wrong for me. [editline]5th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;27206427]I don't think there always is a right or wrong. It all depends too heavily on what you think, and care about. My mom doesn't want DADT to pass because she's firmly rooted in her Christian belief that a man and a woman is the only "right" thing. I on the other hand think the gay community should have every right to die for their country that everyone else does, without having to hide who they really are.[/QUOTE] Separation of Church and State. I agree with you.

[QUOTE=Mr Dinosaur;27206443]Separation of Church and State. I agree with you.[/QUOTE] Now i'm pretty sure the world is ending.

[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;27206537]Now i'm pretty sure the world is ending.[/QUOTE] I know, it's hard to believe that you said something that is agreeable to.

[QUOTE=Mr Dinosaur;27206558]I know, it's hard to believe that you said something that is agreeable to.[/QUOTE] Har Har Har. I can't help it you disagree. Doesn't make me wrong, just means we don't agree.

[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;27206576]Har Har Har. I can't help it you disagree. Doesn't make me wrong, just means we don't agree.[/QUOTE] Sure you aren't wrong. Too bad a test will never be implemented. :smugdog:

[QUOTE=J-Dude;27206291]Of COURSE there is.[/QUOTE] There isn't. The reason you're getting so many dumb ratings and negative responses is because you have a surprisingly poor grasp of the philosophy of democracy. You're basically advocating authoritarianism, which isn't very popular. [editline]5th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=J-Dude;27206291]for Dawkin's sake.[/QUOTE] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/ZCNOH.gif[/IMG]

I sorta agree with the OP, You should choose to vote, not be forced to vote. But the licence thing is a bit of a waste of money

[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;27207671]I sorta agree with the OP, You should choose to vote, not be forced to vote.[/QUOTE] You're not forced to vote

Now I must read all of TH89's post in Rex's voice again.

[quote]The reason you're getting so many dumb ratings and negative responses is because you have a surprisingly poor grasp of the philosophy of democracy. You're basically advocating authoritarianism, which isn't very popular.[/quote]The philosophy of Democracy? How exactly? Because I've lost my faith in the average man knowing what's best? About a month ago, a man with no qualifications in the realm of science and an anti-science background, was brought in to oversee the United States' science budget. An agonizing number of people are becoming increasingly ignorant despite widely available scientific information. Instead of subsiding at last, religion in the United States is running rampant. Mark my words, if you could find the most ignorant 20% of the voters on a graph, and eliminate them, you'd have just reduced the Republican numbers by a good 45%. And I'm being generous with that figure. But it's not so much an attitude towards the bedrock of the Republican identity, but what it has become in recent years as an ultra-conservative cesspool that gives nothing and instead wants everything for itself. It is THEIR wish that the poor suffer and the rich prosper, not mine. You still want right and wrong? Right is improving the standard of living of all people, foreign and domestic. Right is allowing all people to find happiness however they can, so long as they do not physically, psychologically or financially harm another's person or property. Right is seeing all humanity treated equally against the law. Right is freedom of speech, expression and thought. Right is constantly advancing our knowledge. Right is ensuring the life we coexist with is not ruined by our ambitions. Do you disagree? How COULD you disagree? Is this not the very basis of Western Civilization?

If you are restricting who can vote, it isn't democracy its authoritarianism plain and simple. Anybody can spew stuff about ideals and how thinking or voting a certain way is the only way but it is never that simple. You don't define what is Right you just list off ideals with no way to attain them, and what is Right to someone may not be Right to someone else. You are so deep seeded in your views that you automatically discount people who would not vote liberal as the voting for the ultra-conservative cesspool who only wish that the poor suffer and the rich prosper. The fact that there are ideas and ways of running government that differ from you do not make them wrong, and it sure as hell does not mean you are right. The beauty of democracy is that in some way it gives everyone a voice, because no one person is completely right and even if a side fails their voice is heard and not snuffed out. You seem to be sure that you are right that you want to restrict the rights of other people because they disagree with you, and I believe that is the most dumb and scary thing about your viewpoint.

[QUOTE=J-Dude;27209492]The philosophy of Democracy? How exactly? Because I've lost my faith in the average man knowing what's best?[/QUOTE] uh yeah that's like the definition dude

[QUOTE=J-Dude;27209492]The philosophy of Democracy? How exactly? Because I've lost my faith in the average man knowing what's best? About a month ago, a man with no qualifications in the realm of science and an anti-science background, was brought in to oversee the United States' science budget. An agonizing number of people are becoming increasingly ignorant despite widely available scientific information. Instead of subsiding at last, religion in the United States is running rampant. Mark my words, if you could find the most ignorant 20% of the voters on a graph, and eliminate them, you'd have just reduced the Republican numbers by a good 45%. And I'm being generous with that figure. But it's not so much an attitude towards the bedrock of the Republican identity, but what it has become in recent years as an ultra-conservative cesspool that gives nothing and instead wants everything for itself. It is THEIR wish that the poor suffer and the rich prosper, not mine. You still want right and wrong? Right is improving the standard of living of all people, foreign and domestic. Right is allowing all people to find happiness however they can, so long as they do not physically, psychologically or financially harm another's person or property. Right is seeing all humanity treated equally against the law. Right is freedom of speech, expression and thought. Right is constantly advancing our knowledge. Right is ensuring the life we coexist with is not ruined by our ambitions. Do you disagree? How COULD you disagree? Is this not the very basis of Western Civilization?[/QUOTE] I think you're getting a bit ridiculous with your "facts". The truth is, a person who's a republican and misinformed by some sensational story on Fox is no worse than some person who hates everything Republican simply because it is.

[QUOTE=J-Dude;27209492]The philosophy of Democracy? How exactly? Because I've lost my faith in the average man knowing what's best? About a month ago, a man with no qualifications in the realm of science and an anti-science background, was brought in to oversee the United States' science budget. An agonizing number of people are becoming increasingly ignorant despite widely available scientific information. Instead of subsiding at last, religion in the United States is running rampant. Mark my words, if you could find the most ignorant 20% of the voters on a graph, and eliminate them, you'd have just reduced the Republican numbers by a good 45%. And I'm being generous with that figure. But it's not so much an attitude towards the bedrock of the Republican identity, but what it has become in recent years as an ultra-conservative cesspool that gives nothing and instead wants everything for itself. It is THEIR wish that the poor suffer and the rich prosper, not mine. You still want right and wrong? Right is improving the standard of living of all people, foreign and domestic. Right is allowing all people to find happiness however they can, so long as they do not physically, psychologically or financially harm another's person or property. Right is seeing all humanity treated equally against the law. Right is freedom of speech, expression and thought. Right is constantly advancing our knowledge. Right is ensuring the life we coexist with is not ruined by our ambitions. Do you disagree? How COULD you disagree? Is this not the very basis of Western Civilization?[/QUOTE] bahahhahahahahaha oh my god you're so incorrect about republicans it's not even funny. Republicans want the best for everyone, they're not evil beings as what you think they are. Anyway, what defines "right" and "wrong"? To a Fascist oppressing the masses would be "right".