[QUOTE=Thrilled;38161530]1 so far, Okinawa.[/QUOTE]
I like how that is considered a deployment for the Marines. That is kind of like the Air Force deploying to Manas. I can now see how you are still not more jaded, deployments to actual combat zones kind of mellow out your attitude. Anyways, let me introduce myself. I am a PFC (E-3), a 15S (OH-58D Helicopter Crew Chief), and have 1.5 years in the Army, currently deployed in support of OEF XII-XIII in FOB Salerno, Afghanistan. Welcome.
[QUOTE=SKEEA;38161562]I like how that is considered a deployment for the Marines. That is kind of like the Air Force deploying to Manas. I can now see how you are still not more jaded, deployments to actual combat zones kind of mellow out your attitude. Anyways, let me introduce myself. I am a PFC (E-3), a 15S (OH-58D Helicopter Crew Chief), and have 1.5 years in the Army, currently deployed in support of OEF XII-XIII in FOB Salerno, Afghanistan. Welcome.[/QUOTE]
It's not really a deployment, I thought you were a civilian so I called it that to keep things simple. I was stationed there for around 6 months.
I've been thinking more seriously about the military recently, and I had a few questions for y'all. Hope you guys don't mind.
First things first, my family has no experience with the military. I have no experience with the military. We don't have a lot of money, and furthering my education means certain debt. Both as a means of compensation and a path for direction in my life, the military certainly seems attractive. I've also felt like something is missing in my life. Like I'm not doing anything important with the time I have. I want to "do my part". Are these good reasons to join the military?
I want to know if the military is well suited for me. I'm not one to advocate violence, and from what I've gathered, there's no such thing as a "safe" MOS. I understand that. However, for me personally, I'd like to avoid an occupation whose direct focus is combat. It's not because I'm afraid of getting hurt. I have no personal interest in combat. To me, the other half is more important - protecting people who need it, and documenting what's going on around me. So yeah, I'm not looking at Infantry, Artillery, Armor, etc. It's just not what I'm about. Yet, I would still like to serve, and there are some MOSs that appeal to me. Is the military still right for me? Are "non-combat" roles asked to perform the same duties as say, Infantry, on a frequent basis?
Two MOSs I'm really interested in are:
[url=http://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/browse-career-and-job-categories/arts-and-media/public-affairs-specialist.html]Public Affairs Specialist (46Q)[/url] and
[url=http://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/browse-career-and-job-categories/arts-and-media/combat-documentation-production-specialist.html]Combat Documentation / Production Specialist (25V)[/url]
I've always thought about being a Journalist of some sorts. Being in the Army would give me the unique opportunity of traveling the world. I think I would enjoy meeting the people and documenting what goes on. Plus they would train me, pay for equipment, etc. They would also pay for my college education, and I would have years of experience to help me out. What are my chances of landing MOSs like these? Could I tell them my preference, only to be assigned somewhere else? Would they be involved in combat frequently, or even at all? (obviously the second MOS would put me on the front lines, but my focus still wouldn't be combat)
Thanks for the help. I'm still nowhere near 100% set on the Army, but it certainly seems like a good option.
[QUOTE=rilez;38161636]I've been thinking more seriously about the military recently, and I had a few questions for y'all. Hope you guys don't mind.
First things first, my family has no experience with the military. I have no experience with the military. We don't have a lot of money, and furthering my education means certain debt. Both as a means of compensation and a path for direction in my life, the military certainly seems attractive. I've also felt like something is missing in my life. Like I'm not doing anything important with the time I have. I want to "do my part". Are these good reasons to join the military?
I want to know if the military is well suited for me. I'm not one to advocate violence, and from what I've gathered, there's no such thing as a "safe" MOS. I understand that. However, for me personally, I'd like to avoid an occupation whose direct focus is combat. It's not because I'm afraid of getting hurt. I have no personal interest in combat. To me, the other half is more important - protecting people who need it, and documenting what's going on around me. So yeah, I'm not looking at Infantry, Artillery, Armor, etc. It's just not what I'm about. Yet, I would still like to serve, and there are some MOSs that appeal to me. Is the military still right for me? Are "non-combat" roles asked to perform the same duties as say, Infantry, on a frequent basis?
Two MOSs I'm really interested in are:
[url=http://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/browse-career-and-job-categories/arts-and-media/public-affairs-specialist.html]Public Affairs Specialist (46Q)[/url] and
[url=http://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/browse-career-and-job-categories/arts-and-media/combat-documentation-production-specialist.html]Combat Documentation / Production Specialist (25V)[/url]
I've always thought about being a Journalist of some sorts. Being in the Army would give me the unique opportunity of traveling the world. I think I would enjoy meeting the people and documenting what goes on. Plus they would train me, pay for equipment, etc. They would also pay for my college education, and I would have years of experience to help me out. What are my chances of landing MOSs like these? Could I tell them my preference, only to be assigned somewhere else? Would they be involved in combat frequently, or even at all? (obviously the second MOS would put me on the front lines, but my focus still wouldn't be combat)
Thanks for the help. I'm still nowhere near 100% set on the Army, but it certainly seems like a good option.[/QUOTE]
The odds of those MOS's coming available are like finding a live unicorn. Also, on deployment, you will find yourself doing guard duty a fair bit. Everyone does it really. Now, that no interest in combat thing may be a problem. The primary task for the Army is to destroy the enemy. Everyone is trained how to do so in BCT, and you will be required to kill the enemy with prejudice should you find yourself in that sort of situation. If you hesitate, you or someone else will die. If you make peace with the fact that you may need to kill someone, and will not hesitate to do so, it will make things easier. To address your latter concerns, once you have booked your MOS with the Army, that WILL be your MOS, unless you fail your MOS training. If you are not Combat Arms (Infantry, Scout, Pathfinder, Mech. Infantry, Artillery, Armor) then you will not see much, if ANY combat. You will be a fobbit with a non-combat arms MOS, rarely leaving the FOB, just doing your job or performing guard duty or whatnot. Now, I joined the Army for a few of those reasons you listed, and it seems like you are feeling the call, which is a good attitude for the military. Do you have any further questions?
[QUOTE=Thrilled;38161601]It's not really a deployment, I thought you were a civilian so I called it that to keep things simple. I was stationed there for around 6 months.[/QUOTE]
you know
there's a word for people like you
boot
[QUOTE=SKEEA;38161768]The odds of those MOS's coming available are like finding a live unicorn. Also, on deployment, you will find yourself doing guard duty a fair bit. Everyone does it really. Now, that no interest in combat thing may be a problem. The primary task for the Army is to destroy the enemy. Everyone is trained how to do so in BCT, and you will be required to kill the enemy with prejudice should you find yourself in that sort of situation. If you hesitate, you or someone else will die. If you make peace with the fact that you may need to kill someone, and will not hesitate to do so, it will make things easier. To address your latter concerns, once you have booked your MOS with the Army, that WILL be your MOS, unless you fail your MOS training. If you are not Combat Arms (Infantry, Scout, Pathfinder, Mech. Infantry, Artillery, Armor) then you will not see much, if ANY combat. You will be a fobbit with a non-combat arms MOS, rarely leaving the FOB, just doing your job or performing guard duty or whatnot. Now, I joined the Army for a few of those reasons you listed, and it seems like you are feeling the call, which is a good attitude for the military. Do you have any further questions?[/QUOTE]
Protecting myself or others isn't really the issue. I would shoot if I had to. I just don't want to actively pursue combat, if you know what I mean. I don't want to make a career with my gun, but I understand I might have to use it.
Is my chance of landing a MOS of that nature really that low? I've looked at some of the practice ASVAB material, and I think I could do pretty well. Can you "wait" for a MOS deployment if they're not available when you complete BCT?
Thanks for the response.
[QUOTE=rilez;38161959]Protecting myself or others isn't really the issue. I would shoot if I had to. I just don't want to actively pursue combat, if you know what I mean. I don't want to make a career with my gun, but I understand I might have to use it.
Is my chance of landing a MOS of that nature really that low? I've looked at some of the practice ASVAB material, and I think I could do pretty well. Can you "wait" for a MOS deployment if they're not available when you complete BCT?
Thanks for the response.[/QUOTE]
With the Army, you can choose your MOS before even going to BCT, right in the recruiting station. If you make your recruiter pull the MOS codes, you can see what is available at any given moment. Keep in mind that those are the codes available across the entire Army, and they can go quickly. Thing is with 25V that would fall under AFN, the Armed Forces Network, and such an MOS code would be extraordinarily rare to ever come up. Public Affairs would be more common, and would have more of a chance to come up. You can wait as long as it takes for those codes to come up, if you want to. Your recruiter might get rather annoyed though if you keep having him pull codes for weeks. You are assigned an MOS before getting your BCT ship date, at MEPS. The Army is the only service where you are guaranteed your MOS that you reserve for yourself. You can reserve your MOS before going to MEPS even. First things first, go to your recruiter and take the ASVAB. After that, start talking about job codes and whatnot.
[QUOTE=SKEEA;38162102]With the Army, you can choose your MOS before even going to BCT, right in the recruiting station. If you make your recruiter pull the MOS codes, you can see what is available at any given moment. Keep in mind that those are the codes available across the entire Army, and they can go quickly. Thing is with 25V that would fall under AFN, the Armed Forces Network, and such an MOS code would be extraordinarily rare to ever come up. Public Affairs would be more common, and would have more of a chance to come up. You can wait as long as it takes for those codes to come up, if you want to. Your recruiter might get rather annoyed though if you keep having him pull codes for weeks. You are assigned an MOS before getting your BCT ship date, at MEPS. The Army is the only service where you are guaranteed your MOS that you reserve for yourself. You can reserve your MOS before going to MEPS even. First things first, go to your recruiter and take the ASVAB. After that, start talking about job codes and whatnot.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for all the info. Seems like my best bet is to talk to a recruiter. I should also have a chat with my parents, but I'm not sure what I should tell them yet
snerp
If I wanted to be a flight engineer, would I get to choose my airframe, or is that chosen for you?
[QUOTE=Coppermoss;38166402]If I wanted to be a flight engineer, would I get to choose my airframe, or is that chosen for you?[/QUOTE]
Air Force or Army? Well with my knowledge on how MOS's work, your MOS that you get will contain the airframe that you will be working on. Take, for example, my MOS, 15S (OH-58D Helicopter Repairer). There are different MOS's for different airframes, such as 15T (UH-60 Helicopter Repairer), 15U (CH-47 Helicopter Repairer), and 15R (AH-64 Helicopter Repairer). I would imagine that flight engineers would have a system that is exactly the same in regards to the MOS, in which the airframe is listed in the MOS's title.
I was thinking Air Force. Army PT and such it too hardcore for me, hehe, although the AH-6 does have a special place in my heart. My second(?) cousin is in the Army Reserves in intelligence, and her mother is a nurse. Both enlisted on the same day. A lot of my family was/is AF, so its traditional, I guess.
[QUOTE=SKEEA;38166646]Air Force or Army? Well with my knowledge on how MOS's work, your MOS that you get will contain the airframe that you will be working on. Take, for example, my MOS, 15S (OH-58D Helicopter Repairer). There are different MOS's for different airframes, such as 15T (UH-60 Helicopter Repairer), 15U (CH-47 Helicopter Repairer), and 15R (AH-64 Helicopter Repairer). I would imagine that flight engineers would have a system that is exactly the same in regards to the MOS, in which the airframe is listed in the MOS's title.[/QUOTE]
OH-58 is a cool bird. I actually like it more than all others excepting the sexy Super Cobra :D
I am still not sure if I want to go AF or not. A big decision that I am always thinking about
[QUOTE=rilez;38161636]I've gathered, there's no such thing as a "safe" MOS. I understand that. However, for me personally, I'd like to avoid an occupation whose direct focus is combat. It's not because I'm afraid of getting hurt.[/QUOTE]
Then I really don't see why you're even remotely interested in the Army. They have a lot of good jobs for you to go into, but a lot are combat related, and nothing is "FOR SURE" in the military, you could easily be put into a totally different MOS that you never wanted in the first place that IS combat related, it doesnt happen a lot, but it DOES happen.
You'd be better off joining the Airforce. Chances are you're on your ass a lot browsing the web, so computers/electronics must be of some interest to you, hence; Join the AF, nothing else.
[QUOTE=Coppermoss;38173190]I was thinking Air Force. Army PT and such it too hardcore for me, hehe, although the AH-6 does have a special place in my heart. My second(?) cousin is in the Army Reserves in intelligence, and her mother is a nurse. Both enlisted on the same day. A lot of my family was/is AF, so its traditional, I guess.[/QUOTE]
Dude, you gotta be physically fit no matter what service you join. The Air Force does PT just like all of the other services. PT in the morning, report to work, get off, do stuff, sleep, PT next morning. It is a big cycle. I can guarantee you that you will be doing PT in the Air Force, especially if you want to be a flight engineer. Also, the AH-6 is indeed cool, but unfortunately in order for me to work on them and fly with them I must be a part of the 160th SOAR.
[QUOTE=SKEEA;38175154]Dude, you gotta be physically fit no matter what service you join. The Air Force does PT just like all of the other services. PT in the morning, report to work, get off, do stuff, sleep, PT next morning. It is a big cycle. I can guarantee you that you will be doing PT in the Air Force, especially if you want to be a flight engineer. Also, the AH-6 is indeed cool, but unfortunately in order for me to work on them and fly with them I must be a part of the [B]160th SOAR.[/B][/QUOTE]
Which results in a lot more PT.
Just man up, go to the gym, and start running.
[QUOTE=Thrilled;38161530]1 so far, Okinawa.[/QUOTE]
Lol..
[QUOTE=Coppermoss;38173190]I was thinking Air Force. Army PT and such it too hardcore for me, hehe, although the AH-6 does have a special place in my heart. My second(?) cousin is in the Army Reserves in intelligence, and her mother is a nurse. Both enlisted on the same day. A lot of my family was/is AF, so its traditional, I guess.[/QUOTE]
A big reason people join a branch is to become something better than they are now.
You sound like you have no motivation/ambition or any sense of self-development with this "waaah I cant push myself to be in decent shape" nonsense. From what I've heard so far, Army PT is a fucking joke (I could be wrong, but I'm going off what my [I]few[/I] Army friends have told me). Intelligence is something thats hard to get into; your cousin must be of "high moral charter" - You should strive to be like him.
PT isn't shit anyway. When you start you may think you can't do it, but you do it. Then you do it again, and again, and again. Then it becomes routine and you don't care.
[QUOTE=WubWubWompWomp;38175505]Which results in a lot more PT.
Just man up, go to the gym, and start running.[/QUOTE]
What the fuck? I already DO go to the gym religiously every day and run a ton. Not much else to do here in Afghanistan. Due to my goals in the Army, I am not going to join the SOAR, even though I would do great at it. I want to be a warrant officer, not a nightstalker. That is what I was talking about when I said "unfortunately" because the littlebird is a wonderful helicopter, and I will not have a chance to work on them, not that I am a lazy fuck that doesn't PT. Don't make fucking assumptions like that.
[QUOTE=SKEEA;38175544]What the fuck? I already DO go to the gym religiously every day and run a ton. Not much else to do here in Afghanistan. Due to my goals in the Army, I am not going to join the SOAR, even though I would do great at it. I want to be a warrant officer, not a nightstalker. That is what I was talking about when I said "unfortunately" because the littlebird is a wonderful helicopter, and I will not have a chance to work on them, not that I am a lazy fuck that doesn't PT. Don't make fucking assumptions like that.[/QUOTE]
Wasn't talking to you, was directed at the other guy.
EDIT: Was it really that difficult to work out?
[QUOTE=Thrilled;38174630]Then I really don't see why you're even remotely interested in the Army. They have a lot of good jobs for you to go into, but a lot are combat related, and nothing is "FOR SURE" in the military, you could easily be put into a totally different MOS that you never wanted in the first place that IS combat related, it doesnt happen a lot, but it DOES happen.
You'd be better off joining the Airforce. Chances are you're on your ass a lot browsing the web, so computers/electronics must be of some interest to you, hence; Join the AF, nothing else.[/QUOTE]
I'm not afraid of combat, I just didn't want my career to be 100% combat oriented. If I wanted to sit on my ass all day, I wouldn't be thinking of joining the military.
If landing the MOS I want is so difficult in the Army, why would it be any different in the AF? I have looked at the AF before, but what makes them so different?
[QUOTE=rilez;38176283]I'm not afraid of combat, I just didn't want my career to be 100% combat oriented. If I wanted to sit on my ass all day, I wouldn't be thinking of joining the military.
If landing the MOS I want is so difficult in the Army, why would it be any different in the AF? I have looked at the AF before, but what makes them so different?[/QUOTE]
You could try being a Combat Controller/JTAC, not sure what the MOS is, though.
Pararescue 1T2X1
Combat Controller 1C2X1
Tactical Air Control Party (TACP) 1C4X1
Combat Weather 1W0X2
[QUOTE=rilez;38176283]
If landing the MOS I want is so difficult in the Army, why would it be any different in the AF? I have looked at the AF before, but what makes them so different?[/QUOTE]
Just fyi I didnt really mean that in a mean way.
Anyways; Each branch has their own way of doing things - Chances are, the jobs that the Army and Air Force have in common (such as intelligence), are likely to be the same, but since I haven't been in either service, I cant say in what ways they are different from eachother (this goes for the other MOS's they have in common).
But as far as how they're different in the bigger picture is that the Army has a lot of combat related jobs, where as the airforce has like 3 lol (MP's, security forces, pararescue).
With the Army they have a lot. Like.. a lot a lot:
You have your basic infantry man, combat engineers, artillery, special forces, combat support, etc etc. [URL="http://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/browse-career-and-job-categories/combat.html"]Just look at this list.[/URL]
Wondering why this is even remotely important to you? Because the army has these combat related jobs that you arent interested in, and they NEED to have a certain amount of people to fill the positions for each combat MOS (yes, they literally have 'slots'!). So if you enlist, sign a job contract for lets say; Medical. Yes, you sign a contract that states what MOS you're going to have, but you sign an [URL="http://bit.ly/VHO0E1"]SOU[/URL], that your recruiter may or may not make clear, that the Army can legally switch your MOS for whatever reason (you don't make the cut for that MOS, don't fully qualify, or if you're needed elsewhere).
They can do this in ANY branch. Which is why I think you'd be safest just going with the Airforce, since most of their jobs are intellectual and they encourage people to go to college. If they did the 'switcheroo' on you, theres a very very high probability that you would end up in an MOS that doesnt have much to do with direct combat.
tl;dr - My short answer is that the Army has dozens of combat jobs that they can LEGALLY put you in against your will. It doesnt happen [I]that[/I] often, but it does happen, and you WILL meet people that it has happened to. The Airforce has less than 5, so your safest route would be to join the Airforce.
Something everybody that is seriously considering joining the US military needs to fully understand, is: [B]Nothing in the military is EVER. GUARANTEED.. [I]EVER[/I].[/B]
*BOOM*
Just been issued my new gas mask (which is really really well designed by the way) so I'm back off in the chamber this afternoon to test it out. Been 3 years since I last went in :dance:
We're going to have a competition to see who can last the longest too :v:
[QUOTE=Thrilled;38176415]Just fyi I didnt really mean that in a mean way.
Anyways; Each branch has their own way of doing things - Chances are, the jobs that the Army and Air Force have in common (such as intelligence), are likely to be the same, but since I haven't been in either service, I cant say in what ways they are different from eachother (this goes for the other MOS's they have in common).
But as far as how they're different in the bigger picture is that the Army has a lot of combat related jobs, where as the airforce has like 3 lol (MP's, security forces, pararescue).
With the Army they have a lot. Like.. a lot a lot:
You have your basic infantry man, combat engineers, artillery, special forces, combat support, etc etc. [URL="http://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/browse-career-and-job-categories/combat.html"]Just look at this list.[/URL]
Wondering why this is even remotely important to you? Because the army has these combat related jobs that you arent interested in, and they NEED to have a certain amount of people to fill the positions for each combat MOS (yes, they literally have 'slots'!). So if you enlist, sign a job contract for lets say; Medical. Yes, you sign a contract that states what MOS you're going to have, but you sign an [URL="http://bit.ly/VHO0E1"]SOU[/URL], that your recruiter may or may not make clear, that the Army can legally switch your MOS for whatever reason (you don't make the cut for that MOS, don't fully qualify, or if you're needed elsewhere).
They can do this in ANY branch. Which is why I think you'd be safest just going with the Airforce, since most of their jobs are intellectual and they encourage people to go to college. If they did the 'switcheroo' on you, theres a very very high probability that you would end up in an MOS that doesnt have much to do with direct combat.
tl;dr - My short answer is that the Army has dozens of combat jobs that they can LEGALLY put you in against your will. It doesnt happen [I]that[/I] often, but it does happen, and you WILL meet people that it has happened to. The Airforce has less than 5, so your safest route would be to join the Airforce.
Something everybody that is seriously considering joining the US military needs to fully understand, is: [B]Nothing in the military is EVER. GUARANTEED.. [I]EVER[/I].[/B]
*BOOM*[/QUOTE]
I see where you're coming from. Thanks for the info. I was aware AF had more of a focus on that sort of stuff, but had no idea about the SOU.
The idea that they can switch your deployment at any time makes me a bit more uneasy about enlisting, but now I know.
[QUOTE=rilez;38176602]I see where you're coming from. Thanks for the info. I was aware AF had more of a focus on that sort of stuff, but had no idea about the SOU.
The idea that they can switch your deployment at any time makes me a bit more uneasy about enlisting, but now I know.[/QUOTE]
That SOU link I gave you was sorta vague.
Each SOU per MOS is different, but the consent that you give them, that they can move you to where you are needed the most never changes, no matter the MOS.
And you're very welcome, I wouldn't wish an MOS change to something you would hate to have upon anybody, since your contract starts at a minimum of 4 years, some MOS's require a 6+ year agreement of active duty service. An SOU is something you dont see till you visit MEPS, or afterwards (thats also different for each branch), so it's something that kinda creeps up on you when you least expect it.
My personal advice for you, is; If you have your heart set on something in the Army, I'd say go for it. The Army is still a great thing to enlist in, same with ALL other branches, but you sound like if you ended up with a combat MOS (because honestly man, at the end of the day, shit does happen), it would totally fuck your 4+ year enlistment. I'm not trying to scare you at all, remember I *did* say that it DOES happen, but it's not a total constant thing that happens to a high percentage of people that enlist, I just want you to be cautious and know that something like that does and [I]can[/I] happen, for your sake.
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