[QUOTE=LuaChobo;48250887]i did, i just got the post he made on the steam forums mixed up with the video
[url]http://steamcommunity.com/groups/frameratepolice#announcements/detail/83665085958261853[/url]
pretty honest mistake i own up for, but you have pretty much just been reactionary to everything thats against your views on him because you like his stuff, and again power to you
[editline]20th July 2015[/editline]
grasping straws here (fuck is that the term i dont actually remember)[/QUOTE]
Power to me? Really? You've been suggesting this entire time through broad, clear generalizations that no one could have possibly misinterpreted that his fans are harrasing shit heads?
It's hard to take you seriously even if you desire to call me a reactionary for being heavily confused about your horrible, and unsubstantiated and fairly unreasonable views on personal responsibility, and guilt.
Maybe it is grasping at straws, but you have been creating wild strawman analogies all over the place to make yourself seem correct, but those weren't grasping at straws right? Because you say so? Right?
[QUOTE=LuaChobo;48232827]
If your fanbase is hoards of mouth breathing idiots you should know how to deal with them without them trying to fuck up other people.[/QUOTE]
[editline]20th July 2015[/editline]
Yeah, sorry, what was that you called pretty much all of his fans?
Oh, that's right
and here you are telling me I need to read your posts carefully because you've not said things like this, or implied anything about personal responsibility a logical person could debate? No, that's right of course not!
clearly total biscuit should have engaged his tractor beam and sucked every annoying person on the steam forums into space
honestly it's like he doesn't even care
[QUOTE=LuaChobo;48250972]if you guys really didnt want to have a discussion that bad why the hell were you baiting me[/QUOTE]
Holy shit.
I can't.
I'm being bamboozled right now, aren't I?
This thread is beautiful, thank all of you for de-stressing my night.
[QUOTE=LuaChobo;48250620]as i have stated before and i will again, but il break it down for you
A = TotalBiscuit
B = Ravenous Fans
C = Developer
If A does something and through lack of foresight and inaction influences B to personally attack C because of what A did, inside something that A created that specifically marks C.
Is A completely free from criticism and scold?
Apparently it comes down to opinion, I still don't see how but it apparently does.[/QUOTE]
Yes it does come down to opinion because the situation you just described is really damn vague. No, A is never completely free from criticism and scold, ever, even if they do something right - but if A mentions several times that they do not condone harassment then no A is not responsible for any harassment that goes on. What B does is not automatically the responsibility of A just because they're A's fans.
TB created an OBJECTIVE list for consumers to use to easily identify games that have ANY kind of 30 fps lock on them, and a quick summary on how to remove it if possible.
Literally NOBODY loses in this situation. The people who care get the information they need. The people who don't are COMPLETELY unaffected. Its an opt in/opt out service.
And no, TotalBiscuit is not 100% responsible for his fanbase and he shouldn't have to be. Plus, he's made it VERY obvious for what purpose this list exists. If you think hes "encouraging" harassment I think you need to rewatch the video and listen to the part where he explains WHY THE LIST WAS MADE!
Like what the fuck, I come into this thread and the first posts I see mention the KKK and the US government. What even happened in this thread?
[QUOTE=A Noobcake;48252617]Like what the fuck, I come into this thread and the first posts I see mention the KKK and the US government. What even happened in this thread?[/QUOTE]Apparently "TotalBiscuit" is all some people need to see before they start swinging their hate boners everywhere.
[QUOTE=LuaChobo;48250963]and? did you read any posts after that? like you know the ones saying that its ok to like a youtuber but you should still be wary of their mistakes? or how you should be careful not to incite witch hunts.
i mean right now with how you have responded to basically everything you are fitting in the same groups that im talking about, you are pretty much just attacking full force trying to dogpile someone with a different view of the situation because it doesnt fit ~your~ view
of course you arent gonna get good reactions if you shitpost, chances are you are gonna get negative posts back
[editline]20th July 2015[/editline]
breathe and calm down then try to discuss instead of doing kneejerk reactions and getting mad
then youl get replies back that dont make you kneejerk even more[/QUOTE]
Every thing you've said has been knee jerk.
Take your own advice child
I don't really see how 30fps is unplayable.
I do prefer 60fps for most games, but some others work well with 30.
Then we have have shit like The Evil Within which can't even hit that, but whatever.
For a lot of PC games, you really don't need a 30fps cap. Performance usually depends on your PC. For PC, there really is no excuse, but saying it's unplayable is quite the stretch.
[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;48252821]I don't really see how 30fps is unplayable.
I do prefer 60fps for most games, but some others work well with 30.
Then we have have shit like The Evil Within which can't even hit that, but whatever.
For a lot of PC games, you really don't need a 30fps cap. Performance usually depends on your PC. For PC, there really is no excuse, but saying it's unplayable is quite the stretch.[/QUOTE]
Its not that 30 fps is unplayable, its just that 60 fps is objectively better in every regard. I hate how graphics are more important than fucking gameplay. The whole reason games are as big as they are. I mean, I love a good looking game, but I'd rather it play excellent than look good.
[QUOTE=Solo Wing;48252949]Its not that 30 fps is unplayable, its just that 60 fps is objectively better in every regard. I hate how graphics are more important than fucking gameplay. The whole reason games are as big as they are. I mean, I love a good looking game, but I'd rather it play excellent than look good.[/QUOTE]
For consoles, at least, do something like The Last of Us Remastered did. If you can't have 1080p 60fps, give the option between 1080p 30 and 720p 60.
I think you guys should listen to this before commenting
[video]https://soundcloud.com/totalbiscuit/enough[/video]
ESPECIALLY LuaChobo
[QUOTE=LuaChobo;48250972]apparently im still getting mass reported so i guess il leave now
if you guys really didnt want to have a discussion that bad why the hell were you baiting me and then mass reporting me[/QUOTE]
mas reporting is pretty uncool but I'm pretty sure it's that tit using a mass rate script so I wouldn't bother worrying about it
[QUOTE=LuaChobo;48250972]apparently im still getting mass reported so i guess il leave now
if you guys really didnt want to have a discussion that bad why the hell were you baiting me and then mass reporting me[/QUOTE]
Gee, it's almost like if you say something dumb, people are going to rate you dumb, strange thought I know
[QUOTE=Lord of Boxes;48253478]I think you guys should listen to this before commenting
[video]https://soundcloud.com/totalbiscuit/enough[/video]
ESPECIALLY LuaChobo[/QUOTE]
I really feel bad for TB, he has to go through all this cancer shit while people are sending him personal attacks and death threats to him and his family over having an opinion on the internet
What is wrong with trying to objectively make games better?
There is currently a problematic practice in the gaming industry of tieing framerate to animations, which objectively creates problems for people who are trying to push higher frames to better enjoy their products, but cannot due to these artificial unnecessary limitations. There are objectively no reasons to really tie down the framerate unless you are trying to achieve an aesthetic effect. More often than not in recent years poor framerates are being locked down due to animation constraints, this problem simply boils down to sheer laziness from developers.
As a consumer, which I would like to think you are, why wouldn't you advocate for a system that simply informs consumers of the quality of a particular product? To object to such a system is down right masochism and stupidity.
If you are a developer, it would make sense to want to try to fight this system if are a lazy son of a bitch who never wants to have to go through the work of updating their standards. But for GOOD developers, who are trying to push the limits of what games can achieve, having higher standards can only be seen as a positive thing. Towards making better games and advancing the industry into new realms of entertainment.
So objectively, the only real sufferers of a system like this are lazy developers who don't want to update standards and unfortunately some atheistic games like that south park RPG for instance, where some customers might view that store page logo as a negative. But hopefully, we could have more faith in consumers to understand why certain games are locked to 30 fps in those instances, which TotalBiscuit takes the time to address multiple times in his videos.
It is illogical to fight this system of informing consumers. Tell me why it is not.
I think that about wraps this thread up.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;48215431]I wouldn't call it laziness but rather optimization for consoles.[/QUOTE]
From a programming point of view, it's essentially [code]// global or static
#if CONSOLE
const // This constant-folds into perfectly optimized code with the right compiler. Usually games have a central FPS constant anyway if the precise lock isn't decided on from the start.
#endif
float FrameTime = .0333333333f; // Default value also for PC so it doesn't become zero (but that shouldn't really matter with good programming).[/code]
That's it in terms of overhead for dynamic FPS support on PC with no disadvantage to consoles.
[editline]manual merge[/editline]
The only difference would be with animations that can be not-interpolated with a fixed framerate, but considering Titan Quest can do it with more actors simultaneously on screen than in a lot of newer titles I don't think performance considerations are an excuse on PC.
If you [I]really[/I] need to skip it on console you can always [I]#ifdef[/I] it centrally in the method that retrieves the current animation pose.
I play a lot of games at sub-60, it doesn't really matter to me, but it should be the standard for most games to not be capped at anything sub-60.
If there are japanese games that tie their engine's logic to the framerate, then they should tie it to 60.
[URL="http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1476218&p=48276634&viewfull=1#post48276634"]:snip: It's better if I merge this into the previous post.[/URL]
There are still games that don't use delta timing, or don't use it [I]consistently[/I] (e.g. quick bugfixes that happen to break delta time but the devs don't care as long as there's a constant framerate lock).
There are also games which, while not framerate locked, are only optimised until they run at 30 on reasonable equipment/settings.
In both of those cases, running them at 60 isn't all that easy or cheap, and thus not merely lazy.
A lot of developers also have quality assurance processes that make every change, even so little ones, somewhat more costly.
Personally, I still don't find that acceptable, and I'd hope that more people start caring about framerate so locking it on PC would fail every possible cost-benefit analysis, but it's not always a matter of "they didn't even take 10 seconds".
[QUOTE=BenJammin';48276677]I play a lot of games at sub-60, it doesn't really matter to me, but it should be the standard for most games to not be capped at anything sub-60.
If there are japanese games that tie their engine's logic to the framerate, then they should tie it to 60.[/QUOTE]
Games shouldn't be capped at all, but that's not the point, the point is that some are and consumers would like to be able to easily tell.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';48276677]I play a lot of games at sub-60, it doesn't really matter to me, but it should be the standard for most games to not be capped at anything sub-60.
If there are japanese games that tie their engine's logic to the framerate, then they should tie it to 60.[/QUOTE]
Games that are capped usually means it's tied to framerate, which means that if you go below the capped framerate you're also gonna have a problem, just not as big as going over.
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