Why the fuck is everyone shitting about how "morality" is horrible?
I mean Jesus, get laid.
[editline]12:32PM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;18079389]Why the fuck is everyone shitting about how "morality" is horrible?
I mean Jesus, get laid.[/QUOTE]
Just these two dudes.
I also don't think that the other dude meant the word instincts as much as he did question free will.
[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;18079328]Then that's a moral code that creates a stable society. It doesn't make it correct. sin(90) is the maximum value for the sine function. That doesn't make it better than sin(36.4). "Better" is not a word that applies to anything really if you're being objective.
Clearly moral codes exist and they all serve different purposes, but one is not better than any other.[/QUOTE]
That's what I said. There is a "best morality" for every given situation, providing the purpose is always the same.
The problem is that you can only have a somewhat objective set of rules when the purpose of everything you do is rigidly decided, which it usually isn't. And even then there's no guarantee what you want is a good thing.
[editline]04:34PM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;18079389]Why the fuck is everyone shitting about how "morality" is horrible?
I mean Jesus, get laid.[/QUOTE]
Why the fuck are you always bitching on the internet?
I mean Dawkins, get laid.
[editline]04:36PM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Death0nWings;18079405]The need to stay alive is an instinct. If you try to hang yourself your arms will try to prop yourself up so you don't strangle.
I think you need to stop spitting around words.
[editline]12:32PM[/editline]
Just these two dudes.
I also don't think that the other dude meant the word instincts as much as he did question free will.[/QUOTE]
I was referring to decisions that aren't of the split second reflex variety. When you can't think about something of course you aren't going to think about it.
[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18079421]That's what I said. There is a "best morality" for every given situation, providing the purpose is always the same.
The problem is that you can only have a somewhat objective set of rules when the purpose of everything you do is rigidly decided, which it usually isn't. And even then there's no guarantee what you want is a good thing.
[editline]04:34PM[/editline]
Why the fuck are you always bitching on the internet?
I mean Dawkins, get laid.
[editline]04:36PM[/editline]
I was referring to decisions that aren't of the split second reflex variety. When you can't think about something of course you aren't going to think about it.[/QUOTE]
Right. I actually misread what he said and read your reply and got the wrong impression. I deleted my post.
[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18079352]It doesn't "ruffle my feathers" any more than my insults seem to ruffle yours.[/QUOTE]
Good. Then we can both save some keystrokes by moving on.
[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18079352]Instincts are useless for discussion, decision, or conversation. Instincts are nothing more than the embodiment of stone age fears and lusts, with all the attached irrationality. While your choices will always be made with the tinge of instinct evident, you should never make choices because of instinct. As a human you have to ability to challenge your own conceptions and choose what is most logical based on the known evidence.[/QUOTE]
Our modern morality DERIVES from instincts. An instinct to help your neighbor put out the fire while his house burns. An instinct to help an old lady with her flat tire. An instinct to donate food and clothes to the needy. These social instincts we developed over the last 200,000 years are what allowed modern society to arise. We built onto them with things like logic and understanding and now call them morality. You can't understand a house without examining the foundation.
Hey, there's this great author called Richard Dawkins! You should check him out some time!
[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18079421]That's what I said. There is a "[B]best[/B] morality" for every given situation, providing the purpose is always the same.
The problem is that you can only have a somewhat objective set of rules when the purpose of everything you do is rigidly decided, which it usually isn't. And even then there's no guarantee what you want is a [B]good[/B] thing.[/QUOTE]
I don't think you know what objective means.
[editline]10:53AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18079584]Good. Then we can both save some keystrokes by moving on.
[B]Our modern morality DERIVES from instincts.[/B] An instinct to help your neighbor put out the fire while his house burns. An instinct to help an old lady with her flat tire. An instinct to donate food and clothes to the needy. These social instincts we developed over the last 200,000 years are what allowed modern society to arise. We built onto them with things like logic and understanding and now call them morality. You can't understand a house without examining the foundation.
Hey, there's this great author called Richard Dawkins! You should check him out some time![/QUOTE]
Well good job, you've just figured out why morality is backwards.
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;18079389]Why the fuck is everyone shitting about how "morality" is horrible?
I mean Jesus, get laid.[/QUOTE]
It's part of growing up and being a teenager to question everything. Morality is one of the most common things to reject. Don't worry, they get over it.
[QUOTE=Gutted;18079641]It's part of growing up and being a teenager to question everything. Morality is one of the most common things to reject. Don't worry, they get over it.[/QUOTE]
You and him are both being idiots. Try making a logical argument before accusing people of being immature teenagers because they say something you don't agree with.
(Sorry canuhearme, but that was a really stupid post, I normally agree with you though)
[QUOTE=ryandaniels;18079667]You and him are both being idiots. Try making a logical argument before accusing people of being immature teenagers because they say something you don't agree with.
(Sorry canuhearme, but that was a really stupid post, I normally agree with you though)[/QUOTE]
I'm not disagreeing with him, because I didn't read the first post or anything else he wrote.
LULUL
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18079584]Good. Then we can both save some keystrokes by moving on.
Our modern morality DERIVES from instincts. An instinct to help your neighbor put out the fire while his house burns. An instinct to help an old lady with her flat tire. An instinct to donate food and clothes to the needy. These social instincts we developed over the last 200,000 years are what allowed modern society to arise. We built onto them with things like logic and understanding and now call them morality. You can't understand a house without examining the foundation.
[/QUOTE]
Those aren't instincts, they're values that our society treasures. They also differ from person to person, so you're wrong.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;18076039]Morality is stupid[/QUOTE]
You're stupid :colbert:
[QUOTE=Death0nWings;18079718]Those aren't instincts, they're values that our society treasures. They also differ from person to person, so you're wrong.[/QUOTE]
If they're not instincts, why does it feel good to help other people? Abstract thoughts like 'values' would be purely frontal lobe constructs. Doing 'good deeds' gives an endorphin release from the basal brain which suggests that morality runs much deeper than that. Also instincts vary widely between individuals so we would expect to see the same with morality if it were ultimately instinct based, and we do.
Religious nuts and their egocentric "we would all be mindless animals without our babble" bullshit are the only folks that really believe that morality is some kind of divine-inspired invention. It's evolutionary adaptation to more societal life. Plain and simple.
edit:
Cmon Mr. Mcguffin, surely that deserves an agree check..
So I read the first post. OP states the obvious and presents a dream that could never come true, because humans cast aside what they don't agree with and what's different from themselves by nature. The day the world unites is the day the world is destroyed.
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18079780]If they're not instincts, why does it feel good to help other people? Abstract thoughts like 'values' would be purely frontal lobe constructs. Doing 'good deeds' gives an endorphin release from the basal brain which suggests that morality runs much deeper than that. Also instincts vary widely between individuals so we would expect the same with morality if it were ultimately instinct based, and we do.
Religious nuts and their egocentric "we would all be mindless animals without our babble" bullshit are the only folks that really believe that morality is some kind of divine-inspired invention. It's evolutionary adaptation to more societal life. Plain and simple.[/QUOTE]
So what's you're point? We realize that feeling good is a chemical release. I had the impression you were defending morality, but it would now seem you arguing against it.
Which is it?
It's a little of both! I'm arguing against this whole idea of uniform morality bullshit. We're all too different for that to ever work. We should set some simple rules like basic human rights and freedoms, then call whatever infringes on those rights 'bad' and whatever expands those rights or improves the quality of someone elses life 'good'. There's your morality!
People should be free to do whatever the hell they want as long as they don't hurt anyone by doing it. People doing good deeds is hardwired and will happen naturally, without artificial incentives like fucking tax breaks for philanthropists. Let the gays have marrige, legalize pot (since there's no fatal dose anyway and violent crimes just don't seem to happen on cannibis), get rid of all these 'sin taxes' on things like booze and smokes. Essentially get back to the good old basics that instinct provides. 'You leave me alone and I won't fuck with you. I'll probably even help you out if you need it.'
Nihilists like you are what ruin my day, stop saying how shit life is, just have some fucking fun
Morals are just a fancy word for instinct e.g. you don't kill your friends wife or rape them, but you will defend your family.
So if I kill your entire extended family and all your friends and blame it on my opinions and rights (self-defense anyone?) you would be perfectly fine with it and respect that? Cool.
[QUOTE=Earthen;18079963]Nihilists like you are what ruin my day, stop saying how shit life is, just have some fucking fun
Morals are just a fancy word for instinct e.g. you don't kill your friends wife or rape them, but you will defend your family.
So if I kill your entire extended family and all your friends and blame it on my opinions and rights (self-defense anyone?) you would be perfectly fine with it and respect that? Cool.[/QUOTE]
Who said we were miserable?
Also, it's all well and good to say that you don't kill people because you'd feel bad about it, but that's not what you are saying, now is it? You are trying to argue in favor of being a judgmental bigoted prick.
This thread is full of stupid.
Notice how it's always idiots who have lived their entire life in sheltered western societies, in great conditions and no daily threat of danger that complain about shit like morality on FP.
Go fuck off to a warzone in africa OP and get ass raped and beaten by someone who didn't like you just because of the way you looked, then tell us how "stupid" you think morality is.
[QUOTE=ryandaniels;18080070]Who said we were miserable?
Also, it's all well and good to say that you don't kill people because you'd feel bad about it, but that's not what you are saying, now is it? You are trying to argue in favor of being a judgmental bigoted prick.[/QUOTE]
wait judgemental bigotral prick?
please, you are miserable, even if you don't want to admit. Or you are just annoying, cynical, pretentious, arrogant cuntheads who can't seem to grow up, instead what you people do is always annoy everyone about how the world is pointless and humans are horrible and everythings wrong with corporations and there are no morals because humans are decrepit, myah... grow up. We might not be fucking perfect, but at least we do what we can and have some fucking fun. Instead of being annoying, cynical, pretentious, arrogant cuntheads who ruin people's days because you think you know everything.
Fuck, i'm glad I grew out fast of that stage
[editline]08:25PM[/editline]
[QUOTE=professional;18081191]Notice how it's always idiots who have lived their entire life in sheltered western societies, in great conditions and no daily threat of danger that complain about shit like morality on FP.
Go fuck off to a warzone in africa OP and get ass raped and beaten by someone who didn't like you just because of the way you looked, then tell us how "stupid" you think morality is.[/QUOTE]
and maybe they will appreciate something in life instead of crying about every single fucking thing.
Morality holds society together, and nearly everybody is happier with a society than they would be running around throwing rocks at each other. It's not stupid.
[QUOTE=Earthen;18081633]wait judgemental bigotral prick?
please, you are miserable, even if you don't want to admit. Or you are just annoying, cynical, pretentious, arrogant cuntheads who can't seem to grow up, instead what you people do is always annoy everyone about how the world is pointless and humans are horrible and everythings wrong with corporations and there are no morals because humans are decrepit, myah... grow up. We might not be fucking perfect, but at least we do what we can and have some fucking fun. Instead of being annoying, cynical, pretentious, arrogant cuntheads who ruin people's days because you think you know everything.
Fuck, i'm glad I grew out fast of that stage[/QUOTE]
You are being rather childish for someone who fancies himself as "grown up".
Disregarding your douchebaggery, ... Uhhhh...
...Actually, I'm finding it hard to find anything in your post that worth addressing. You just make a bunch of unfounded assumptions about me and claim I'm immature.
Care to make a real point?
[editline]01:42PM[/editline]
[quote=fenwick;18081826]morality holds society together, and nearly everybody is happier with a society than they would be running around throwing rocks at each other. It's not stupid.[/quote]
:sigh: government....
[QUOTE=Craptasket;18076288]Are you serious, it's our humanly nature to kill each other.[/QUOTE]
And somehow you're so intelligent and smart and outstanding that you're one of the few who don't want to go on a fucking killing spree, amirite? And if "we" didn't have "rules" to keep all the insane muthafuckas (everyone besides you) in check, people would start raping and killing eachother (but not you, of course). And those rules are somehow upheld even though the majority are just cavemen who would rather go blow up the entire Earth because they can.
I hope you see where I'm getting at. People won't go insane just because there's no (ironically even more insane) religion to keep them in check. There's no "divine power", there's no magic glue. The world ALREADY depends on the same humans you accuse of being so volatile and insane, and by labeling few people "President" or "Senator", all you do is project legitimacy onto them and for example allow them to murder hundreds of thousands of civilians in countries like Iraq and Afghanistan and Hiroshima and Nagasaki and every other God damn place on Earth. Good job.
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18079780]If they're not instincts, why does it feel good to help other people? Abstract thoughts like 'values' would be purely frontal lobe constructs. Doing 'good deeds' gives an endorphin release from the basal brain which suggests that morality runs much deeper than that. Also instincts vary widely between individuals so we would expect to see the same with morality if it were ultimately instinct based, and we do.
Religious nuts and their egocentric "we would all be mindless animals without our babble" bullshit are the only folks that really believe that morality is some kind of divine-inspired invention. It's evolutionary adaptation to more societal life. Plain and simple.
edit:
Cmon Mr. Mcguffin, surely that deserves an agree check..[/QUOTE]
When you a good deed you are rewarded with praise. There's your "feel good" explanation.
I'm ducking out of this thread. I can't stand it anymore.
[quote]That's why I only present one universal moral, otherwise do whatever the fuck you want, smoke pot, fuck your car, snort koolaid. The one thing that is important no matter what is: Respect another person's right to do what they want. Don't harm another person, don't take their money, don't harass them for their beliefs even if they spit in the face of your own personal beliefs.[/quote]
I like how you say their is no morals, but then you offer one. Post #2 says it all.
Their will always be morals just they change and people who disagree say it's immoral.
in my experience, chicks don't dig immorality.
You seem to be the one who can't stand people's moral views hence you being the problem.
[QUOTE=ProboardslolV2;18082835]in my experience, chicks don't dig immorality.[/QUOTE]
Chicks can go fuck themselves.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;18076208]Yea because mass genocides are really good.[/QUOTE]
And what would happen if everyone could do whatever they want would be a thousand times worse.
Don't like the guy down the street? That's okay, you can do what you want now, just stick some hedge clippers through his face.
Don't like the Asian community in your city? Round up some like-minded fellows and burn them out.
Yeah, that sounds like the world I want to live in... where we can do whatever we want, no matter how cruel, senseless and evil
Morals are necessary, to prevent idiots like you who think it's so "edgy" to be able to do whatever they want.... to find out just what that ACTUALLY means.
Morality keeps in check the boundless human capacity for cruelty to your fellow man.
Seriously, what are you, 14?
To "TheAnarchist" - By imposing a system where one feels obligated to do things, either out of respect to a higher power (Divine or Human, See: The Law) or even fear of that self-same higher power, you stop the vast majority of people doing exactly those things. Sure, some people wouldn't go out and rape, murder and pillage in your exalted state of anarachy, but those would be the victims of the more vocal and violent group, which would probably be a slight majority, who would do just that. Hey, no accountability right? I can do whatever I want
[QUOTE=ryandaniels;18081903]You are being rather childish for someone who fancies himself as "grown up".
Disregarding your douchebaggery, ... Uhhhh...
...Actually, I'm finding it hard to find anything in your post that worth addressing. You just make a bunch of unfounded assumptions about me and claim I'm immature.
Care to make a real point?
[editline]01:42PM[/editline]
:sigh: government....[/QUOTE]
alright if I make such wild assumptions, then please by all means explain your views on morality, life, etc...
and how so am I being childish, because I don't whine about how the world is so fucked up
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