[QUOTE=mugofdoom;24127936]Dude, I just want you to shut up. You have one point that you hold onto with your dear life despite how fucking stupid it is. It's so completely exaggerated and far fetched that it doesn't even apply anymore to what we're talking about.
Hell you still can't give us a good reason why anything you want banned should be banned, you're continuing to result to the WHAT IF ARGUMENT
WHAT IF COLUMBINE MASSACRE WAS DONE WITH TANKS???
Well what the fuck if? It wasn't, nothing of that caliber has ever happened, you have no evidence to say that it will despite tanks being as readily available as they ever will be, you can't argue that point any further.[/QUOTE]
Now you're just falling back to "IT HAS NEVER HAPPENED SO YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT WOULD HAPPEN". I think we both know what it would be like if they used artillery instead of a few guns.
You can't prove purple unicorns exist, because nobody has ever seen one. Doesn't mean you can't come up with a logical consensus that they DON'T.
We have never seen a school get hit with heavy artillery, doesn't mean we can't logically conclude the size of the death toll if it DID happen. And since we're talking HEAVY ARTILLERY, it would be the school and a shitload of other buildings as well.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24127945]A fucked up rich kid with inheritance money can. Risk is too high to take. And if you don't see that, take it up with the government. I want to see how far your logic will go with them.[/QUOTE]
Yeah man what if some prepped up rich kid got his father to buy him some artillery pieces because he got mad at all the kids at his private, sheltered school and his completely paid for life.
[editline]01:24AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128004]Now you're just falling back to "IT HAS NEVER HAPPENED SO YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT WOULD HAPPEN". I think we both know what it would be like if they used artillery instead of a few guns.[/QUOTE]
And you're falling back to "IT HAS NEVER HAPPENED SO IT PROBABLY WILL."
[QUOTE=mastermaul;24128005]Yeah man what if some prepped up rich kid got his father to buy him some artillery pieces because he got mad at all the kids at his private, sheltered school and his completely paid for life.
[editline]01:24AM[/editline]
And you're falling back to "IT HAS NEVER HAPPENED SO IT PROBABLY WILL."[/QUOTE]
I said inheritance money. And obviously you've never met a rich kid.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128004]Now you're just falling back to "IT HAS NEVER HAPPENED SO YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT WOULD HAPPEN". I think we both know what it would be like if they used artillery instead of a few guns.
You can't prove purple unicorns exist, because nobody has ever seen one. Doesn't mean you can't come up with a logical consensus that they DON'T.
We have never seen a school get hit with heavy artillery, doesn't mean we can't logically conclude the size of the death toll if it DID happen. And since we're talking HEAVY ARTILLERY, it would be the school and a shitload of other buildings as well.[/QUOTE]
I'll believe you when you tell me where these kids get both the equipment and the knowledge to accurately shell a fucking school.
I'm going off 100 years of these things being perfectly legal to own with an absence of any incident ever happening. The problem in criminals getting these is not legality, it's availability and of course the registration process (which I am fine with by the way, minus the 1986 ban on Automatics, that needs to be repealed). These aren't easy to get because they're rare, and that won't change.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128030]I said inheritance money. And obviously you've never met a rich kid.[/QUOTE]
Don't sell artillery to 16 year olds?
[QUOTE=And you're falling back to "IT HAS NEVER HAPPENED SO IT PROBABLY WILL."[/QUOTE]
That makes no sense. Of COURSE it probably will. You think if someone wants to kill as many people as they can and they have the choice between a pistol and heavy artillery, they would pick the pistol? The only reason we have never seen such incident is because it is illegal to buy artillery pieces.
[editline]03:29AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=mastermaul;24128084]Don't sell artillery to 16 year olds?[/QUOTE]
The Virginia Tech guy was over 18 years old I believe. Eh, I'd call him a kid.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128086]That makes no sense. Of COURSE it probably will. You think if someone wants to kill as many people as they can and they have the choice between a pistol and heavy artillery, they would pick the pistol? The only reason we have never seen such incident is because it is illegal to buy artillery pieces.[/QUOTE]
YES they would pick the pistol. Do you know how hard it is to use this artillery?
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;24128061]I'll believe you when you tell me where these kids get both the equipment and the knowledge to accurately shell a fucking school.
I'm going off 100 years of these things being perfectly legal to own with an absence of any incident ever happening. The problem in criminals getting these is not legality, it's availability and of course the registration process (which I am fine with by the way, minus the 1986 ban on Automatics, that needs to be repealed). These aren't easy to get because they're rare, and that won't change.[/QUOTE]
Where do uneducated Terrorist learn the ability to make bombs and fly planes?
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128086]The only reason we have never seen such incident is because it is illegal to buy artillery pieces.[/QUOTE]
No it isn't. Have you been listening to anything?
It's just hard to buy artillery because it's expensive.
So yeah, there's nothing from stopping that rich insane kid from shelling his school right now, is there?
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128117]Where do uneducated Terrorist learn the ability to make bombs and fly planes?[/QUOTE]
They go to flight school and a lot of them get blown up in the process of making said bombs.
You're talking about spoiled rich kids here, not trained terrorists.
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;24128098]YES they would pick the pistol. Do you know how hard it is to use this artillery?[/QUOTE]
Not so hard to learn. Especially if you have a big target such as a city.
Terrorists are trained, they aren't that stupid, spoiled rich kids aren't trained.
[editline]01:33AM[/editline]
Just letting you know that this thread is suddenly fucking hilarious.
I mean really, this is ridiculous. You're seriously saying some spoiled rich kid is going to buy heavy artillery and shell a city with no prior knowledge of how they work and where to get them? You can't mail order this shit. And he wont' get caught wheeling the artillery in? Who is going to sell him the artillery? Where will he know where to get it? Who will sell him the ammo? How does he know how to use it? Where does he practice to use it? How does he not get caught from that?
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128117]Where do uneducated Terrorist learn the ability to make bombs and fly planes?[/QUOTE]
The pilots of the planes on 9/11 took classes in the US. They only wanted to learn how to talk off and fly.
Bombs are relatively simple to make.
Terrorists aren't uneducated.
[QUOTE=mastermaul;24128134]No it isn't. Have you been listening to anything?
It's just hard to buy artillery because it's expensive.
So yeah, there's nothing from stopping that rich insane kid from shelling his school right now, is there?[/QUOTE]
No. Artillery is illegal in the states I believe. Tanks are legal, but they have to be gutted of their weapons (most of the time).
[editline]03:35AM[/editline]
It's hilarious because Mastermaul thinks its a good idea to make artillery easy to buy, whereas if you were to announce such idea to the public it would be met with ill concealed laughter.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128169]No. Artillery is illegal in the states I believe. Tanks are legal, but they have to be gutted of their weapons (most of the time).
[editline]03:35AM[/editline]
It's hilarious because Mastermaul thinks its a good idea to make artillery easy to buy, whereas if you were to announce such idea to the public it would be met with ill concealed laughter.[/QUOTE]
Artillery is legal in the US, it's a destructive device.
I'm actually studying up on the laws and procedures to reactivate an RPG-7 one of these days. Which is perfectly legal.
[QUOTE=Asswipe;24119512]Owning tanks and APCs is completely legal. You don't even need a license last I checked.[/QUOTE]
Defo, in the UK you can own them if you have an H licence (basically a heavy drivers licence). Insurance is dirt cheap. Ferrets are popular because they perform like a large car. Despite being huge armoured things. What's awesome about British military vehicles, is that the majority can go the same speed backward as forward (So in the case of the ferret, depending on type, 70 to 85mph, in reverse!)
I think in the US its slightly different, don't quote me on it because I'm not sure,I don't think you can own in service vehicles in the US. I was told a lot of Americans are buying FV432's from the UK and shipping them across to the US because they want a vehicle that looks like an M113 but they can't get those because they are in service? At this exhibition I went to last month, there was an HMMWV, and I was told that was the first time they had a HMMWV because the type is in the process of being phased out.
[QUOTE=Darkhorse01;24128215]Defo, in the UK you can own them if you have an H licence (basically a heavy drivers licence). Insurance is dirt cheap. Ferrets are popular because they perform like a large car. Despite being huge armoured things. What's awesome about British military vehicles, is that the majority can go the same speed backward as forward (So in the case of the ferret, depending on type, 70 to 85mph, in reverse!)
I think in the US its slightly different, don't quote me on it because I'm not sure,I don't think you can own in service vehicles in the US. I was told a lot of Americans are buying FV432's from the UK and shipping them across to the US because they want a vehicle that looks like an M113 but they can't get those because they are in service? At this exhibition I went to last month, there was an HMMWV, and I was told that their was a HMMWV there for the first time because the type is in the process of being phased out.[/QUOTE]
You can own in-service if you can find them.
Police organizations in the US own M113s, and they aren't part of the military.
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;24128205]Artillery is legal in the US, it's a destructive device.[/QUOTE]
Destructive devices are legal under federal law, but are restricted from civilian purchase in nearly all states.
Also, if learning how to fire artillery is so hard, what is the point of letting people buy it and its ammunition under the second amendment as you previously stated?
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;24128205]Artillery is legal in the US, it's a destructive device.
I'm actually studying up on the laws and procedures to reactivate an RPG-7 one of these days. Which is perfectly legal.[/QUOTE]
I don't think i'd want to own an RPG-7 under current laws.
*pew* *BOOM* Well that was fun, and now i'm broke.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128242]Destructive devices are legal under federal law, but are restricted from civilian purchase in nearly all states.
Also, if learning how to fire artillery is so hard, what is the point of letting people buy it and its ammunition under the second amendment as you previously stated?[/QUOTE]
They aren't restricted anymore than automatics, the procedure is roughly the same as owning a transferable machine gun. $200 tax stamp, registration, background check, done and its yours.
Also its hard for a spoiled teenager intent on blowing up his school. Stop turning it around. You're talking about spoiled teenagers here.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128242]Destructive devices are legal under federal law, but are restricted from civilian purchase in nearly all states.[/quote]
Uh, no.
[quote]Also, if learning how to fire artillery is so hard, what is the point of letting people buy it and its ammunition under the second amendment as you previously stated?[/QUOTE]
In my mind, i'd have the people need to qualify and pass background checks with them before purchase, but the extra "destructive device" costs wouldn't apply when they are able to.
And that's quite a bit of difference. A Kalashnikov should cost about $50 in the US, but they go for thousands.
[QUOTE=mastermaul;24128250]I don't think i'd want to own an RPG-7 under current laws.
*pew* *BOOM* Well that was fun, and now i'm broke.[/QUOTE]
Nah just sort of a wall hanger, plus you can get practice rounds. I have an obsession with keeping things in original condition, I [I]hate[/I] deactivated weapons.
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;24128281]They aren't restricted anymore than automatics, the procedure is roughly the same as owning a transferable machine gun. $200 tax stamp, registration, background check, done and its yours.
Also its hard for a spoiled teenager intent on blowing up his school. Stop turning it around. You're talking about spoiled teenagers here.[/QUOTE]
Automatics are VERY restricted in nearly all states. And if you're so sensitive about the spoiled rich kid metaphor, change it for a suicidal rich guy who hates the world. Simple.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128328]Automatics are VERY restricted in nearly all states. And if you're so sensitive about the spoiled rich kid metaphor, change it for a suicidal rich guy who hates the world. Simple.[/QUOTE]
Same thing applies dude. Also:
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;24116043]You just go on and on and on about things you don't understand, don't you?
Here let me break it down for you.
There are three types of "Machine gun" (legal term) in the US, they go as follows:
[U]Transferable[/U] - These are automatics made [I]and registered[/I] prier to May, 1986. Any United States citizen over 21 with a clean record can own one after they pay a $200 tax stamp and get the firearm registered under their name. This process takes around 4 months. No new transferable automatics can be built for civilian ownership. The $200 tax stamp is [B]NOT A LICENSE[/B], it is exactly as the name implies, a tax stamp, it's a tax on automatics and it must be paid every time the weapon changes hands and for every automatic you buy. The weapon must also go through a class 3 dealer before it gets to you and the local sheriff must sign off on it.
[U]Pre-86 Dealer Sample[/U] - These are weapons that were made before May, 1986 but were not registered until after the ban on newly made automatics. Only those with a Class 3 DEALER'S license or an FFL07 Builder's License may own these. The dealer may keep these weapons after his license has expired but if he were to sell them, they must go to another dealer.
[U]Post-86 Dealer Sample[/U] - These are weapons made and registered [I]after[/I] May, 1986. Only one of each weapon may be personally owned by the Dealer/Builder and they must be either destroyed (receiver deactivated and sold as parts or just flat out torn to pieces) or sold to another dealer before the dealer/builder's license expires.
There, as you can see, you don't need a license to own an automatic, it just depends on the type of firearm.
There are also Destructive Devices, this ranges from anti-tank cannons to M203s to functioning Bazookas and RPG-7s, these are just as easy (and sometimes cheaper) to get as Transferable automatics, however the ammunition is also classified as a destructive device and has its own $200 tax stamp.
These laws apply to all states that allow automatics, which is the majority of the states. I think roughly 38 but I'm not entirely sure.
And for the last time there is no such thing as a regular firearm's license, you don't need any form of license to get any form of Title 1 weapon.[/QUOTE]
I know more about US gun laws than you do, I spend a lot of my time studying them.
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128328]Automatics are VERY restricted in nearly all states.[/quote]
No, they aren't. Moreso than semi-automatics? Yes. They're nowhere near impossible or even difficult.
[quote]And if you're so sensitive about the spoiled rich kid metaphor, change it for a suicidal rich guy who hates the world. Simple.[/QUOTE]
I think we should be much more worried about the legion of doom and their rayguns.
:frogc00l:
B|
[QUOTE=Viephemeral;24128412]:frogc00l:[/QUOTE]
You haven't accomplished anything.
Well that was a fun argument. I just found out I'm the #2 poster in the thread too, awesome.
How much do C-96s go for at gun shows? I've seen them before but I can't much remember.
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