I dont think you're understanding right now grunt
no one gives a fuck about the counters and shit like that right now, stop going into mad autistic paragraphs about balance.
The point is that YOU are an active detriment to other people's experience by being a prick about how they should play the game they spent their hard earned money on. In fact, people like you are exactly the reason why competitive multiplayer games are so hard for newcomers to break into nowadays.
Its like you're a kid at the daycare who's constantly getting mad that kids aren't playing with the toys YOU want them to WHEN you want them to. Like I feel genuinely embarassed for you reading your posts because this seems like mad... obsessive? I don't really know the word for it but you seriously need to cool the fuck down.
I hate playing with random people online who wont compromise and I hate shitty team compositions but I know this is never going to change so instead of throwing a tantrum about it I exclusively play with my friends.
Getting angry at your team is just counterproductive. Getting pissed doesn't make them play better, it doesn't make you play better, and it doesn't make the game more fun. Give suggestions, trust they'll make the right decision, if they don't work out move on to someone else.
If you aren't capable of dealing with pubs, make a team or take a break.
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;51178164]The point is that YOU are an active detriment to other people's experience by being a prick about how they should play the game they spent their hard earned money on. In fact, people like you are exactly the reason why competitive multiplayer games are so hard for newcomers to break into nowadays. [/QUOTE]
So [B]five other people [/B]should make compromises and have a lesser, far more frustrating experience only because [B][I]you [/I][/B]can't be arsed to go play Normal games or budge and make compromises of your own? Suuuuuuuuuure.
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;51178164]I dont think you're understanding right now grunt
[B]no one gives a fuck about the counters and shit like that right now, stop going into mad autistic paragraphs about balance. [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;51178164]Its like you're a kid at the daycare who's constantly getting mad that kids aren't playing with the toys YOU want them to WHEN you want them to. Like I feel genuinely embarassed for you reading your posts because this seems like mad... obsessive? I don't really know the word for it but you seriously need to cool the fuck down.[/QUOTE]
If this is the level of discussion we're going to have forwards I'm getting the hell outta this thread, I'm sorry that you're all offended by people when they tell you that crayons are for drawing and not sticking it up your nose til' it pokes your brain.
Also stop using "perceived disabilities" in order to make people seem lesser to you, that's rude.
[QUOTE=JohnnyOnFlame;51178250]So [B]five other people [/B]should make compromises and have a lesser, far more frustrating experience only because [B][I]you [/I][/B]can't be arsed to go play Normal games or budge and make compromises of your own? Suuuuuuuuuure.
If this is the level of discussion we're going to have forwards I'm getting the hell outta this thread, I'm sorry that you're all offended by people when they tell you that crayons are for drawing and not sticking it up your nose til' it pokes your brain.
Also stop using "perceived disabilities" in order to make people seem lesser to you, that's rude.[/QUOTE]
Other people not being optimal is the reality you accept when you don't or can't make a team. Don't get mad at everyone else and ruin the game for them just because you aren't willing or aren't capable of putting the effort in to get the experience you want.
If you really cared about being successful and winning you wouldn't be so quick to shift the burden onto other people.
Problem with competitive games like this is that the majority of people who suck up to the meta like babies to their mother's teat don't fucking understand why the meta exists to begin with.
It's why I avoid ranked play like the god damn plague in those types of games. Morons and tryhards who don't understand what the fuck they're doing and just parrot more successful players.
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;51178164]I dont think you're understanding right now grunt
no one gives a fuck about the counters and shit like that right now, stop going into mad [B]autistic[/B] paragraphs about balance.[/quote]
Now that's just offensive.
[quote]The point is that YOU are an active detriment to other people's experience by being a prick about how they should play the game they spent their hard earned money on. In fact, people like you are exactly the reason why competitive multiplayer games are so hard for newcomers to break into nowadays.[/quote]
Except I am not? I don't play with newcomers. The system doesn't allow newcomers to play with me.
I'm a strong proponent of the design philosophy where a multiplayer videogame should cater to a) all skills levels and b) all mentalities.
If you wanna goof around, the game should let you. If you wanna play serious, the game should let you. Right now, Quick Play lets you play without responsibility, while I expect competitive players to at least care enough not to pick clearly underpowered heroes. If they wanna do, fine, I have no power over them other than asking them to switch.
[quote]Its like you're a kid at the daycare who's constantly getting mad that kids aren't playing with the toys YOU want them to WHEN you want them to. Like I feel genuinely embarassed for you reading your posts because this seems like mad... obsessive? I don't really know the word for it but you seriously need to cool the fuck down.[/QUOTE]
Except competitive mode is not a daycare? Also I'm chill right now, and i've been chill since the start of the discussion. I've been doing nothing other than trying to explain my point of view. I've admitted I can be a prick in-game, [I]occasionally[/I], but I'm extremely calm while speaking on this forum. Or is this one of those HumanAbyss situations where he is perfectly calm yet people still think he's mad for some reason?
At this point you are just reading posts in order to respond to them instead of digesting the point they are making, and you're going in circles..
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51178278]Other people not being optimal is the reality you accept when you don't or can't make a team. Don't get mad at everyone else and ruin the game for them just because you aren't willing or aren't capable of putting the effort in to get the experience you want.
If you really cared about being successful and winning you wouldn't be so quick to shift the burden onto other people.[/QUOTE]
Also, isn't this a bit hypocritical?
I have to accept less-than-serious players exist, and I have to try and not hurt their feelings.
Yet when a single player decides to throw the games (knowingly or not) and five other people start asking him to change (remember I'm not the only guy in the entire game who can recognize a bad pick, I'm average, not Overwatch Jesus) he's without sin?
I can accept that bad players exist, and bad players are going to have to accept that I'm going to write strongly worded insults to them in my private overwatch diary!
[editline]aa[/editline]
muh merge
do you also keep records of your overwatch performance in Excel?
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;51178372]do you also keep records of your overwatch performance in Excel?[/QUOTE]
Ye, I took the idea from one of the guys from the overwatch thread.
[QUOTE=Annoyed Grunt;51178359]Also, isn't this a bit hypocritical?
I have to accept less-than-serious players exist, and I have to try and not hurt their feelings.
Yet when a single player decides to throw the games (knowingly or not) and five other people start asking him to change (remember I'm not the only guy in the entire game who can recognize a bad pick, I'm average, not Overwatch Jesus) he's without sin?
I can accept that bad players exist, and bad players are going to have to accept that I'm going to write strongly worded insults to them in my private overwatch diary![/QUOTE]
It isn't about fault. It's about being constructive.
It is entirely within your power to get the experience you want out of the game. But instead of taking the time to actually do what you'd have to to get it, you'd rather just whine about things outside your control.
You complain about the game not being fun, and instead of doing something to fix it you blame others. And not only are you harming your own experience, you're harming the experience of other people.
It's a selfish, hypocritical waste of time.
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51178394]It isn't about fault. It's about being constructive.
It is entirely within your power to get the experience you want out of the game. But instead of taking the time to actually do what you'd have to to get it, you'd rather just whine about things outside your control.
You complain about the game not being fun, and instead of doing something to fix it you blame others. And not only are you harming your own experience, you're harming the experience of other people.
It's a selfish, hypocritical waste of time.[/QUOTE]
I know I should get a team, and that that would fix every single problem I have.
But I don't think it's selfish or hypocritical. Just a waste of time.
[editline]9th October 2016[/editline]
Which just makes it dumb.
[QUOTE=Annoyed Grunt;51178408]I know I should get a team, and that that would fix every single problem I have.
But I don't think it's selfish or hypocritical. Just a waste of time.
[editline]9th October 2016[/editline]
Which just makes it dumb.[/QUOTE]
i mean I've gone on way too many pointless, hypocritical tirades at this point to criticize anyone for being an asshole
but it is worth recognizing how pointless it is. I just think if you pay for a game to have fun your primary concern should always be fun maximization. And that always starts with "how can I make my experience more fun".
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51178439]i mean I've gone on way too many pointless, hypocritical tirades at this point to criticize anyone for being an asshole
but it is worth recognizing how pointless it is. I just think if you pay for a game to have fun your primary concern should always be fun maximization. And that always starts with "how can I make my experience more fun".[/QUOTE]
I understand that, that's why I started that spreadsheet thingy (find it oddly cathartic). I'm never going to stop asking people to switch if they think they could be doing better with another hero, it may not work but it is always worth a shot.
[editline]9th October 2016[/editline]
Also I want to understand where this thing about me being literal Overwatch Hitler came from, I [B]can[/B] be assholish at times but it's not like I purposefully enter every single match with the idea that people need to follow my every order, I just occasionally ask people to switch heroes
[QUOTE=Annoyed Grunt;51178458]I understand that, that's why I started that spreadsheet thingy (find it oddly cathartic). I'm never going to stop asking people to switch if they think they could be doing better with another hero, it may not work but it is always worth a shot.[/QUOTE]
There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving suggestions to your team. That's just a part of coordination and collaboration.
The meta doesn't mean shit, if you know how to play you characters and play them well, you can win. Simple as that.
As long as you're not actually like in the top 20 players worldwide. Which cmon guys, most of us will never be close to, so stop pretending like you need to play the meta just because the people who are better than you do.
[QUOTE=Annoyed Grunt;51178458]Also I want to understand where this thing about me being literal Overwatch Hitler came from, I [B]can[/B] be assholish at times but it's not like I purposefully enter every single match with the idea that people need to follow my every order, I just occasionally ask people to switch heroes[/QUOTE]
People don't like to be commanded. People want to feel free to make what they believe is the best decision. Even if it isn't your intent to dictate to other people how to play the game, certain approaches can give people that impression, and it just doesn't feel good.
I think the best way to give suggestions is in the context of problem solving. You give a suggestion at the beginning of the match, and if they don't follow it and that results in them performing poorly, explain how that suggestion could help them perform better. Instead of dictating how they play the game, you're providing them a way to fix a problem.
For example, instead of
"If you don't play the meta don't play comp"
I would say
"if you play the meta you'll do better"
To put it in context, Dunky is doing fine. He is clearly capable of making his own hero choices. There's nothing wrong with you suggesting he switch, and there's nothing wrong with him deciding not to. The game goes on, he does fine, there is no problem, there is no need for further frustration. By trusting in your team you've all avoided unnecessary frustration and had a better experience for it.
Meta of any game only applies to people who understand [I]why[/I] it's the meta and can take advantage of mechanics combined with their higher level skillcap.
If x is meta but you have no idea how to play it you're better sticking with y, which may not be meta but you're comfortable with.
Unless you're in the top 1% you shouldn't take the meta as gospel and throw hissy fits when people don't fit into your perfect little team comp image like lego bricks. Playing what you're comfortable with is much more efficient than playing fotm.
[QUOTE=RetaDepa;51178586]Meta of any game only applies to people who understand [I]why[/I] it's the meta and can take advantage of mechanics combined with their higher level skillcap.
If x is meta but you have no idea how to play it you're better sticking with y, which may not be meta but you're comfortable with.[/QUOTE]
The thing about giving people suggestions is that they know way more about themselves than you know about them. You have to give them the final say in what they do because they have more information about what's good for them than you do.
When I'm raiding in WoW I'm not going to tell some monk who's doing crazy healing that he needs to switch heal addons before the raid because it's mathematically more efficient or some shit. I'm going to provide him with the information I have and trust he'll make the best choice.
I play on the Asian server where, like, half of the people speak English. I almost exclusively play comp solo and I just trust my team no matter what they pick and it really makes for a better experience overall.
I've been humbled by ridiculous shit like winning with a Symmetra on King's Row offense in a diamond mmr game. :v:
Metas in Overwatch are developed as optimal team compositions and game plans that transcend human error and lack of consistency. That's it. It exists in every competitive game whether it's League or DOTA. It's not a guide for the most effective method of action in every game, and it's not an end all be all methodology to cover any flaws of a team. Metas are meant to display certain strategies that offer optimal performance to cover as much as possible with as few holes in the plan as possible.
Now as far as being a dick to your teammates in comp, like I said, I would never suggest anyone force someone into a role they're not comfortable with. If you said, "Waah, don't go Pharah you'll get killed by McCree!" you're talking "meta" which is fucking pointless. You're counter picking yourself sure, but counter picks don't ensure failure or success in any game. It simply provides benefits or detriments given to either player in specific matchups.
Just let people play what they want. People naturally don't like playing badly, so if they legitimately feel like they're doing horrible chances are they'll switch off anyways. Just don't tell them what to do, because I'm sure they know what they're good at better than you do regardless of what is "in meta".
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