I'm thinking about joining Christianity, should I? - General

[QUOTE=Zeke129;19168060]If that's true you're going to have to explain it again so I can continue to ignore it on account of it being wrong. But seriously, humour me.[/QUOTE] you're a really bad atheist fyi you're one of those stupid as fucking rocks ones who gets so ingrained into their own belief that they won't even engage in an intelligent discussion. I'm atheist too, but I'm actually not a close-minded prick or a bad poster (you should look into fixing that). Really, once you say "I'm right you're wrong" without hearing the argument you're being [I]just as bad as a religious zealot.[/I] You're not the answer. You're the fucking problem. You're the kind of person that all of the christians associate us all with. I'm about as godless and as bitter as you can get, but I don't fucking deny history, and I don't deny the positive effects that religion had during the course of human evolution. Get off your fucking high horse and stop being a stubborn jackass and listen to what I'm telling you I'm not going to take the time to explain it all, so I'll just some fairly key ideas: many scientific discoveries in the early dawn of civilization were actually for religious purposes (such as Egyptians developing batteries and concepts of basic electricity in order to instill fear of gods by hooking effigies up and shocking those who touched them to "feel the touch of the gods") - Let's also say the development of astronomy / astrology - the stars were associated with the gods, so people began cataloging them. That's a foundation of science - an organized collection which people routinely study and evaluate (and they were, they studied the phases of the moon, the placements of the stars, found the north celestial pole, etc). there's also the fact that the father of modern physics, Isaac Newton, was a religious scholar, and quite a big one at that then there's how religion created the basis for modern civilization (creating a natural order as opposed to an alpha-male dominated society), founding the basis for fucking democracy (which ties quite heavily into science, look into modernization theory ;D) the earliest group of intellectuals were Monks, they were the ones who studied how the world works. Their hypothesis may have been wrong, but they collected empirical data, cataloged it, shared it, and constantly changed it. They transcribed scrolls into different languages allowing the greater sharing of knowledge throughout cultures if you fight this post, you're seriously a moron. Science and Religion aren't pals now, but Religion gave birth to science. It created the sense of mystery that people explored. Those who attempted to prove god's existence and ground their beliefs in their respective religions ended up finding conclusions that paved the way for modern science to evolve to a manageable concept with concrete ideas. guess what know that guy Darwin? Y'know, the one who conviced us about natural selection and shit? He studied Anglican Theory at university. He went around the world looking for key spots where life started to explain the distribution of life, but found out that ~GUESS WHAT~ he was wrong! don't be fucking stubborn and listen to someone who knows more about this shit than you I'm not one of those stupid fuckers who just reads directly into what he hears, I'm one of the atheists that everyone is supposed to be in order to be taken seriously. Try to be a skeptic, listen to the evidence given to you. don't be a zealot, a radical, whatever the fuck you want to call it. Because while you may be progressive, you're being a fucking dick about it and you're not going to get shit done plus it's just stupid stop that

Actually science has not disputed it. I can play that game too anime fag.

[QUOTE=Kybalt;19168323]Belief in something without evidence is completely irrational and stupid. They had a theory explaining that. It did have it's flaws ,however, that were easier solved by the earth going around the sun. They had telescopes and stuff, and built models and crap. Don't act like they hadn't the slightest clue. It is if you have no evidence pointing toward it. Yes it is irrational because you have NO evidence suggesting that fact.[/QUOTE] And you have no evidence suggesting the fact that the universe always was. We don't know what happened before the events of big bang. If you are going to use this argument, both theism and atheism are irrational.

Protip for people who think believing in a god or the bible is the opposite of a fun enjoyable life: Some people enjoy the camaraderie of a youth group or the people they met in their religious organizations. I believe in parts of the bible. This, however, will not stop me from having premarital sex with my girlfriend. It's instinct right? Yo God you gave me instincts right? Brb rutting on my female.

Its your decision OP, most of the people here are stanch atheists. You have noting to lose in investing in a religion. Ive been born and raised a christian, but my family isnt the hardcore "REPENT FOR YOUR SINS" kind. You cant let us decide. Ive seen strange things which have assured me there is an afterlife. And even with other things ive found myself believing in god. Granted the road to faith isnt easy. But, it is worth it when you die and go to heaven. Science and religion arent against eachother. They are 2 methods in which they try to understand where the heck we came from.

[QUOTE=Funcoot;19168352]No not at all. What benefit do I have in believing for the sake of believing when I don't believe in an after life.[/QUOTE] In all instances it was shown that the belief was malformed and illigitimate, causing a stall in scientific progress. There is no use for faith unless your willing to try and prove it through science.

Too bad your really not, Aaronn, and i highly doubt you even have a girlfriend.

[QUOTE=BrickInHead;19168370]:words:[/QUOTE] I sense anger in your post. Relax.

[QUOTE=BrickInHead;19168370]you're a really bad atheist fyi you're one of those stupid as fucking rocks ones who gets so ingrained into their own belief that they won't even engage in an intelligent discussion. I'm atheist too, but I'm actually not a close-minded prick or a bad poster (you should look into fixing that). Really, once you say "I'm right you're wrong" without hearing the argument you're being [I]just as bad as a religious zealot.[/I] You're not the answer. You're the fucking problem. You're the kind of person that all of the christians associate us all with. I'm about as godless and as bitter as you can get, but I don't fucking deny history, and I don't deny the positive effects that religion had during the course of human evolution. Get off your fucking high horse and stop being a stubborn jackass and listen to what I'm telling you I'm not going to take the time to explain it all, so I'll just some fairly key ideas: many scientific discoveries in the early dawn of civilization were actually for religious purposes (such as Egyptians developing batteries and concepts of basic electricity in order to instill fear of gods by hooking effigies up and shocking those who touched them to "feel the touch of the gods") - Let's also say the development of astronomy / astrology - the stars were associated with the gods, so people began cataloging them. That's a foundation of science - an organized collection which people routinely study and evaluate (and they were, they studied the phases of the moon, the placements of the stars, found the north celestial pole, etc). there's also the fact that the father of modern physics, Isaac Newton, was a religious scholar, and quite a big one at that then there's how religion created the basis for modern civilization (creating a natural order as opposed to an alpha-male dominated society), founding the basis for fucking democracy (which ties quite heavily into science, look into modernization theory ;D) the earliest group of intellectuals were Monks, they were the ones who studied how the world works. Their hypothesis may have been wrong, but they collected empirical data, cataloged it, shared it, and constantly changed it. if you fight this post, you're seriously a moron. Science and Religion aren't pals now, but Religion gave birth to science. It created the sense of mystery that people explored. Those who attempted to prove god's existence and ground their beliefs in their respective religions ended up finding conclusions that paved the way for modern science to evolve to a manageable concept with concrete ideas. guess what know that guy Darwin? Y'know, the one who conviced us about natural selection and shit? He studied Anglican Theory at university. He went around the world looking for key spots where life started to explain the distribution of life, but found out that ~GUESS WHAT~ he was wrong! don't be fucking stubborn and listen to someone who knows more about this shit than you I'm not one of those stupid fuckers who just reads directly into what he hears, I'm one of the atheists that everyone is supposed to be in order to be taken seriously. Try to be a skeptic, listen to the evidence given to you. don't be a zealot, a radical, whatever the fuck you want to call it. Because while you may be progressive, you're being a fucking dick about it and you're not going to get shit done plus it's just stupid stop that[/QUOTE] So, from reading this, religion provided a hypothesis, when people went to test it, and found that it was wrong, they formed their own conclusions and theories that led to scientific discovery based on evidence and such. It's true, and I wouldn't be one to argue that religion was completely useless through all of history, but now, in the 21st century, it is useless, can we agree on that?

[QUOTE=Carbon Knight;19168260]Your point? Imagine if this was two thirds of the worlds population. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c6HsiixFS8[/media] Would that make it more right?[/QUOTE] It's not about being right. We don't really know if we're right until we die. When we die, we'll finally see if there is a heaven, a hell, or even a god. But when we do, we won't be able to tell anyone. We won't be able to spread the good news to one side or another. We'll be rotting six feet under. That's why nobody (who is alive) knows. I see religion as sticking to your beliefs until the end, no matter the circumstances. Basically, strongly believing in something. That's faith, a large part of religion.

[QUOTE=Carbon Knight;19168403]In all instances it was shown that the belief was malformed and illigitimate, causing a stall in scientific progress.[/QUOTE] What?

[QUOTE=waxrock;19168413]I sense anger in your post. Relax.[/QUOTE] I don't like idiots or zealots (the two are correlated quite strongly) chances are if you're a radical you don't know jack shit about what you're fighting about

[QUOTE=Funcoot;19168265]Belief in something without evidence isn't necessarily stupid. A long time ago it wasn't stupid to think the Sun revolved around the Earth. No one had proof that it did this, but they believed it to be that way. That was later solved with Science. Later humans questioned how Earth even came to be. Christians believe God created it. The theory of the Big Bang developed and has substantial evidence to support it and is now causing religion major trouble. Is it irrational or illogical to think something created or created the stuff that made the big bang? Is it illogical or irrational to think something created the universe with a set of laws that remained constant?[/QUOTE] Yeah, but what if they instead decided to believe the sun was hurtling towards us at lightning speed. That wouldn't be right or helpful. That's what I'm trying to tell you, just making things up only muddles stuff up. Yeah kind of, seeing as how all evidence point towards matter having always existed.

[QUOTE=Aaronn;19168378]Protip for people who think believing in a god or the bible is the opposite of a fun enjoyable life: Some people enjoy the camaraderie of a youth group or the people they met in their religious organizations. I believe in parts of the bible. This, however, will not stop me from having premarital sex with my girlfriend. It's instinct right? Yo God you gave me instincts right? Brb rutting on my female.[/QUOTE] Yes, oh those lovely youth groups. Oh the caring, fair youth groups. Announcer: "Who are you going to believe, God or the scientists?" Children: "God!"

[QUOTE=Kybalt;19168423]So, from reading this, religion provided a hypothesis, when people went to test it, and found that it was wrong, they formed their own conclusions and theories that led to scientific discovery based on evidence and such. It's true, and I wouldn't be one to argue that religion was completely useless through all of history, but now, in the 21st century, it is useless, can we agree on that?[/QUOTE] I'm not disputing that religion should've died off in the 19th century to pave the way for better communication among governments instead the pope fucked shit up

[QUOTE=waxrock;19168413]I sense anger in your post. Relax.[/QUOTE] You should have read it. Like, really.

[QUOTE=Archy;19168425]It's not about being right. We don't really know if we're right until we die. When we die, we'll finally see if there is a heaven, a hell, or even a god. But when we do, we won't be able to tell anyone. We won't be able to spread the good news to one side or another. We'll be rotting six feet under. I see religion as sticking to your beliefs until the end, no matter the circumstances. Basically, strongly believing in something. That's faith, a large part of religion.[/QUOTE] uh, what if by consequences of your belief I get screwed over after you die. Cause then you would just be kind of a prick.

[QUOTE=Archy;19168425]It's not about being right. We don't really know if we're right until we die. When we die, we'll finally see if there is a heaven, a hell, or even a god. But when we do, we won't be able to tell anyone. We won't be able to spread the good news to one side or another. We'll be rotting six feet under. I see religion as sticking to your beliefs until the end, no matter the circumstances. Basically, strongly believing in something. That's faith, a large part of religion.[/QUOTE] A main portion of your argument was that 2/3rds of the world belief in your religion.

Lol Internet drama. People need to realize that the supernatural is not quantifiable by any human's perception. That is why it's called, [b]super[/b]natural. Based on this, there is no way any religion on Earth has all their beliefs and theology perfectly in order. As many do, including I, dismiss a belief in a deity simply because it does not follow the laws of nature we have worked so hard to establish. Agnosticism seems like a very logical standpoint with that in mind,

[QUOTE=Carbon Knight;19167950]Well lets see what Science brings to the table and what religion brings to the table. [B]Science:[/B] Antibiotics Water Treatment Enhanced Farming Computers *Every technological advancement* [B]Religion:[/B] Holy Wars How do you plan to prove Religion without science. The fuzzy feeling in your heart can't be used to prove it as it can be proved with science to be unrelated to any super natural being.[/QUOTE] Cool! I can make a biased list too! [b]Science:[/b] Nuclear Weapons Chemical Weapons Biological Weapons Drugs [b]Religion:[/b] Charities Schools Hospitals Libraries/Records of the Past Orphanages

[QUOTE=Kybalt;19168450]You should have read it. Like, really.[/QUOTE] I did. I just felt like commenting on his gratuitous usage of vulgarities.

[QUOTE=Majache;19168443]Yeah kind of, seeing as how all evidence point towards matter having always existed.[/QUOTE] For now. Science is ever changing and [b]nothing[/b] is solid. Anything before the big bang is up in the air. I am not trying to say atheism is irrational or illogical. It is very logical and rational. Not all theism is illogical or irrational, some of it is quite the opposite.

[QUOTE=Kymandu;19168404]Too bad your really not, Aaronn, and i highly doubt you even have a girlfriend.[/QUOTE] Are you bringing my personal life into question over what was an almost entirely sarcastic post? Go derail a thread somewhere else you poor excuse of a semi-sentient mammal. Go tell atheists to burn in hell or try to save the Christians from believing in something. Whatever it is you lucky individuals blessed with an IQ under national average enjoy doing these days.

Read, research and decide for yourself.

[QUOTE=Funcoot;19168374]And you have no evidence suggesting the fact that the universe always was. We don't know what happened before the events of big bang. If you are going to use this argument, both theism and atheism are irrational.[/QUOTE] Uh, so. We know that matter can't be destroyed. And we don't see matter ever not having existed. So why isn't it logical to assume it was always there.

[QUOTE=Kymandu;19168343]why ask these bigoted assholes? i know, i know, why post but really, they are just going to put down religion because thats all they know to do. No tolerance for anyone but the keyboard.[/QUOTE] Great post! This really helps your cause. How about you join in on the debate instead of just calling us all "bigoted assholes"? It's people like you who make my disliking of religion grow constantly stronger.

[QUOTE=lulzbocks;19168472]Cool! I can make a biased list too! [b]Science:[/b] Nuclear Weapons Chemical Weapons Biological Weapons Drugs Hospitals [b]Religion:[/b] Charities Schools Libraries/Records of the Past Orphanages[/QUOTE] Fixed part of the list.

[QUOTE=BrickInHead;19168370]you're a really bad atheist fyi [rant] stop that[/QUOTE] I read your entire post, and all I got from it is that 1) you're angry 2) you don't like me very much but most importantly 3) religion and science used to be more closely related than they are now but in no way did you prove that "science is a child of religion", as you said previously. The only thing remotely close to that in your post was about how many scientific discoveries were made for religious reasons, but this actually implies that religion is a child of science, not the other way around as you claim it. I get what you're trying to say, but you've hardly convinced me.

[QUOTE=waxrock;19168481]I did. I just felt like commenting on his gratuitous usage of vulgarities.[/QUOTE] that's just how I speak

[QUOTE=Archy;19168319]Ignorant probably wasn't the word I was looking for. What I mean is, this is just a whole "my opinion is right and yours is wrong" kind of thing; it's just being disrespectful to one another for being what one is. I could easily say that you're a retarded atheist who just rejected religion to look smart, but I know that's just blatantly rude and disrespectful, and probably wrong. It's just closed minded behavior that's being demonstrated through these insults, arguments and flame wars.[/QUOTE] Nope, it defiantly sounds like you hit it right on the nail. Ignorance is the term you are looking for. I'm not making personal insults, I'm judging the idea of theism as a whole. Believe what you like and keep it in the closet please. Nobody cares about the games someone plays to keep themselves a functional member of society. I have 16 years of religious history, I am as well versed in the Bible as any other Christian (My Grandpa is a pastor to this day). You see, I was raised SDA. It turns out the apple [I]really[/I] doesn't fall far from the tree. Theism/cults, God/Satan... There is very little to define between the two when the kettle boils it down to the rudimentary basics.