I'm thinking about joining Christianity, should I? - General

[QUOTE=Tippmann357;19167135]It's called copy pasting [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot[/url] Also [img]http://godlesspaladin.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/logic.jpg[/img] Fuck this is so true[/QUOTE] this

[QUOTE=Aaronn;19167085] 3 - There is no black and white line of Theism - Agnosticism - Atheism. People who believe so are usually idiots who think it's "hip" to be atheist.[/QUOTE] So you have no problem with religion seeing things as black or white?

[QUOTE=Tippmann357;19167135]It's called copy pasting [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot[/url] Also [img]http://godlesspaladin.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/logic.jpg[/img] Fuck this is so true[/QUOTE] This is what I was trying to say though.

[QUOTE=NoShogun;19167059]Then I can choose whether or not to believe in it. And you said that it was a fact. I don't state my beliefs as fact, I state them as beliefs.[/QUOTE] Yes, but you're not going to treat it as something that could actually be true, are you? To you it's just some silly proposal that has no logical bearing, but to him it's the absolute truth and there is nothing you can say to sway him from it.

I'd like to believe in something to have some closure but I just don't, that's how I am, and that's how I always will be, regardless of whether or not I say I believe.

I'd rather go to hell anyway. Bon Scott could be waiting

[QUOTE=Faren;19167223][QUOTE=Aaronn;19167085]I'll clear some things up 1 - The Bible is excerpts from different people and sometimes they do stumble over each other and commit hypocrisies. The bible is a teaching tool and a moral code. Yes you can in fact choose what parts to believe in because the bible is left to [b]YOUR[/b] interpretation of it. 2 - Christians and other members of certain religions sometimes think of women as lower class. This is complete bullshit and isn't backed up by the Bible at all. It was the [b]TREND[/b] during the time the bible took place that women were lower class. All the way up into the present where they are still somewhat second class. (The women basketball league?) So don't think just because the cavemen in the bible did it means that God wants you to. 3 - There is no black and white line of Theism - Agnosticism - Atheism. People who believe so are usually idiots who think it's "hip" to be atheist. I can't classify exactly what I believe. I believe in the moral code of the bible while I don't believe in or take stock in certain parts of it. I think that there is a power out there that isn't understood that influences us and is divine. Do I think he's/it's watching me while I take a shit? No. He's probably got better things to do like arguing with physicists. You can call me agnostic because I don't truly take part in any religion but I do think there is "something" divine out there. Which places an element of theism. 4 - whatever you become, please don't come on this forum and try to argue it's better than everyone elses beliefs. Like Faren here, don't be him. He's just as bad as the dumbass christians who think that they alone have any real basis of belief. Don't be a super cool atheist hero trying to save us from spending our lives believing in something. Because your wasting time I could be spending believing in something. That is all for now.[/QUOTE][B]1)[/B] Then the Bible is not truly the word of god, is it? [B]2)[/B] If it's written in the Bible, then it should be followed. If you don't follow one part of the Bible, why should you follow any other part? [B]3)[/B] Of course there is a gradient of beliefs. By the way, I think that anyone who thinks that there could not possibly be a god is completely ignorant. The only logical option when it comes to the existence of god is doubt. I'm not sure there is no god, but I think that the chances are pretty slim so I might as well get on with my life. [B]4)[/B] I'm not really sure how to respond to a personal attack on myself. Do you see me calling anyone an idiot or swearing at anyone? I'm not trying to be a "super cool atheist hero", I'm just trying to correct people in their posts where they've made some mistakes in the hope that they might start to look at things logically instead of faithfully. I'd rather teach people how to think than what to think.[/QUOTE] This was my longest post in the thread and I'd rather not have it overlooked by accident because it is at the bottom of a page (sorry if this is just annoying and you all saw it anyway).

[QUOTE=Zeke129;19167103]No, it is the word of a perfect god. And somehow, a perfect god let out some imperfect words. Funny thing that[/QUOTE] This children, is a good example of an uninformed atheist. Before we start this, I want to make it clear I'm not the white knight of theism. I just want to clear up some things. If you check the bible, you will see names for some chapters. We'll be taking Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John for example today. If you read each chapter under them, you will notice the story is different in each one. This is because, these men who wrote the bible aren't god. They are men who make mistakes and are righting their account of what happened as best they could. I'm sorry but God wasn't standing over their shoulder proofreading.

[QUOTE=Tippmann357;19167135] [img]http://godlesspaladin.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/logic.jpg[/img] Fuck this is so true[/QUOTE] Not really. A baseball is a solid object that we have seen before and can observe with the five senses. We have not yet observed God with our five senses and so when we try to disprove a diety's existence, we may not be observing correctly. Basically, we know how to find a physical form of a baseball, but we have not done that with any god yet.

[QUOTE=FlowXobDans;19166389]Yes. Even if it Isn't real, then you don't know you died like what they say, but if it is and you don't believe, then you go to hell. Which one is more logical.[/QUOTE] Don't try and use Pascal's wager on us. The repercussions for believing in a 'false' god would be just as bad (if not worse) than rejecting the idea entirely if it turned out there WAS a god and an afterlife. Most religions make that quite clear (that there's is the only one, true, real god, and that believing in another is blasphemy, etc, etc).

[QUOTE=NoShogun;19167327]Not really. A baseball is a solid object that we have seen before and can observe with the five senses. We have not yet observed God with our five senses and so when we try to disprove a diety's existence, we may not be observing correctly. Basically, we know how to find a physical form of a baseball, but we have not done that with any god yet.[/QUOTE] Way to miss the entire point.

You seem to have already decided, and just want validation of your choice.

[QUOTE=NoShogun;19167327]Not really. A baseball is a solid object that we have seen before and can observe with the five senses. We have not yet observed God with our five senses and so when we try to disprove a diety's existence, we may not be observing correctly. Basically, we know how to find a physical form of a baseball, but we have not done that with any god yet.[/QUOTE] The problem with this argument is that everything that exists can be percieved with the five senses or machines that can collect data. It doesn't need to be a baseball. Replace it with light or air and it still works. Your argument also doesn't address the main point that in order to confirm something as fact you need to provide evidence to what you propose. Providing lack of disproof does not prove your argument.

I am quite happy with my [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism]Deism[/url]. You should read up on it.

[QUOTE=Revo;19166864]"Suppose we grant that there is indeed some small chance that God exists. Nevertheless, it could be said that you will lead a better, fuller life if you bet on his not existing, than if you bet on his existing and therefore squander your precious time on worshipping him, sacrificing to him, fighting and dying for him." [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_Wager[/url] There is absolutely no [i]evidence anywhere[/i] for gods existence. The only thing you can do is argue the probability of god existing. The bible is a collection of stories and poems. It's a piece of literature, how exactly have you come to believe that this is "evidence" in any way shape or form? Bible class is just a really flimsy front for indoctrination into a belief system that nobody can prove. So good luck in deciding if you want to waste your life devoting yourself to blind ignorance and faith on the word of godbotherers whos only job it is to prey on indecisive teenagers like yourself in the name of their "god" The rest of us will be enjoying life for what it is, not wasting it hoping that something exists afterwards :v:[/QUOTE] Pascal was a stupid person. He came up with a dumb wager.

[QUOTE=Aaronn;19167322]This children, is a good example of an uninformed atheist. Before we start this, I want to make it clear I'm not the white knight of theism. I just want to clear up some things. If you check the bible, you will see names for some chapters. We'll be taking Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John for example today. If you read each chapter under them, you will notice the story is different in each one. This is because, these men who wrote the bible aren't god. They are men who make mistakes and are righting their account of what happened as best they could. I'm sorry but God wasn't standing over their shoulder proofreading.[/QUOTE] Then why do so many people love to call it the word of god? Why is it followed unless god personally made sure that there were no mistakes in it? You can have one of two things: [B]1)[/B] God is a cruel, immoral (I was really hesitant to use that word... I'll probably be misinterpreted) being OR [B]2)[/B] It is not really the word of god (at least not all of it) and any part could be something added/changed by the people writing it and therefore there is no grounds to adhere to it.

[QUOTE=Faren;19167275]Yes, but you're not going to treat it as something that could actually be true, are you? To you it's just some silly proposal that has no logical bearing, but to him it's the absolute truth and there is nothing you can say to sway him from it.[/QUOTE] And to him, my religion is surely some silly proposal, too. I see how it can be hard for atheists to understand religion, but that's what faith is. You believe. Also, I'd like to say thanks to you, Faren, for being so calm and educated in your arguments instead of trying to be Mr. Badass Super-Atheist trying to make an idiot out of any/all Christians. It's been a pleasure discussing this with you.

[QUOTE=Funcoot;19167377]I am quite happy with my [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism]Deism[/url]. You should read up on it.[/QUOTE] Isn't that kind of like atheism for pussies.

[QUOTE=Majache;19167400]Isn't that kind of like atheism for pussies.[/QUOTE] ...Deism is theistic. Atheism is not.

[QUOTE=Faren;19167303]This was my longest post in the thread and I'd rather not have it overlooked by accident because it is at the bottom of a page (sorry if this is just annoying and you all saw it anyway).[/QUOTE] You're right. It's not HIS words. This is why I don't hold with modern-day Christians. Because they believe certain things that don't even have a basis in their own bible. They are, to put it eloquently, "putting words in his mouth." He didn't say all this shit. Some of it is mortal men writing bullshit. Some of it is completely false account from the current Kings who used Gods name to rally troops and demoralize other armies. The bible isn't a perfect text. And God's word can be perfect but the medium in which it is delivered is garbled and quite imperfect. Excuse the attack on yourself. My bad.

They literally kicked my family out of their church because we had no money to donate to the church that week because they took it all. Fuck Christianity.

This is like going into a Mosque and saying "I'm Christian bitches!"

[QUOTE=NoShogun;19167397]And to him, my religion is surely some silly proposal, too. I see how it can be hard for atheists to understand religion, but that's what faith is. You believe. Also, I'd like to say thanks to you, Faren, for being so calm and educated in your arguments instead of trying to be Mr. Badass Super-Atheist trying to make an idiot out of any/all Christians. It's been a pleasure discussing this with you.[/QUOTE] That's kind of a stupid thing to do. Believing because it's believing. Sort of like eating because it's eating. I dunno. [editline]06:13AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Funcoot;19167413]...Deism is theistic. Atheism is not.[/QUOTE] So. All it is is tacking another sentence onto what we know about the world. Just put God created the universe, then. . ." and there you go. Not really a useful belief.

[QUOTE=Badunkadunk;19167422]They literally kicked my family out of their church because we had no money to donate to the church that week because they took it all. Fuck Christianity.[/QUOTE] That's the church/greedy people, don't generalize all Christians.

[QUOTE=Aaronn;19167322] This is because, these men who wrote the bible aren't god. They are men who make mistakes and are righting their account of what happened as best they could. I'm sorry but God wasn't standing over their shoulder proofreading.[/QUOTE] Tell that to the millions of Christians who call the bible the word of god then.

[QUOTE=Badunkadunk;19167422]They literally kicked my family out of their church because we had no money to donate to the church that week because they took it all. Fuck Christianity.[/QUOTE] Not much of a church, then, is it?

I believe anyone should have the choice to believe in anything they want. (with the exceptions of things that hurt others)

[QUOTE=sHaRkBiTe;19167455]I believe anyone should have the choice to believe in anything they want. (with the exceptions of things that hurt others)[/QUOTE] Beliefs don't hurt others. I can believe that you should die but it doesn't hurt you. (I don't believe this) Not sure what kind of idiot would disagree with this, unless we have a psychic on facepunch who can manifest their beliefs physically.

[QUOTE=NoShogun;19167327]Not really. A baseball is a solid object that we have seen before and can observe with the five senses. We have not yet observed God with our five senses and so when we try to disprove a diety's existence, we may not be observing correctly. Basically, we know how to find a physical form of a baseball, but we have not done that with any god yet.[/QUOTE] Wait so god is like a baseball that even the person who has doesn't know exists or not. What aside of the debate are you arguing again, this is confusing.

[QUOTE=Majache;19167425]That's kind of a stupid thing to do. Believing because it's believing. Sort of like eating because it's eating. I dunno. [editline]06:13AM[/editline] So. All it is is tacking another sentence onto what we know about the world. Just put God created the universe, then. . ." and there you go. Not really a useful belief.[/QUOTE] You are very dense. Deism is the complete opposite of Atheism.