video of Civilians killed in Baghdad. - General

the journalists didn't have a fucking gun.

[QUOTE=Dclone2;21190547]They never said where the girl was[/QUOTE] Thats because the video doesn't want you to know, so it looks as bad as possible for the US, you can see her at around 9:52. She wasn't in the group at the beginning, and the video would have defiantly shown if a US soldier shot the little girl, he just found her [QUOTE=Flaming Neko;21190608]the journalists didn't have a fucking gun.[/QUOTE] At 3:40ish of the 17min long one you can clearly see on of the guys in their party is infact carrying an AK, and possibly the guy beside him, there is no way thats a camera.

Are you blind? In the first part they are civilians. Two of them are journalists who have cameras which look like RPGs. @darkheadcrab

You guys are all collectively *picking and finding* things you don't like about the video. You're all saying different things, but actually none of you are even on the same page. The fact of the matter is that the Iraqi people are more than aware that the Army will fire on anyone seen walking about with weapons, especially in Baghdad. This is the rule there, so anyone breaking that rule is reasonably designated a terrorist threat. Also, no one in their right mind is going to help out someone they see randomly wounded in the streets... unless, of course, they're also terrorists. So, please tell me again, what they actually did that was unlawful? BTW, if they actually did anything unlawful, it would all be recorded there on film and they would positively get caught. Personally, I'm moved that they actually had the patience to request permission to engage before engaging. [editline]11:29AM[/editline] [QUOTE=LeonS;21190617]Are you blind? In the first part they are civilians. Two of them are journalists who have cameras which look like RPGs. @darkheadcrab[/QUOTE] guns [editline]11:30AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Dclone2;21190601]1 little girl 1 or more pedestrians walking by the building near the end[/QUOTE] Children have been used by terrorists for decades. Who, in their right mind, is just going to casually stroll by a military engagement? Again, they had probable cause to engage these "civillians".

[QUOTE=Beardy;21189915]a few seconds before he lit up the first 8 civ's, about 4 or 5 were holding a dark object with a strap on it, which i assume were either guns, or just sticks with straps on them.[/QUOTE] i have no problem with that but what about the van

[QUOTE=darkheadcrab;21190663] So, please tell me again, what they actually did that was unlawful? [/QUOTE] Nothing, they had gotten permission, and rather quickly too, like previously said they must have had prior intel on the location, since the mechanized unit was about to roll in. [QUOTE=Corporal Yippie;21190703]i have no problem with that but what about the van[/QUOTE] 'They also shot the van because it was aiding the enemy, if they were taliban you wouldnt let the van come in and pick up all the wounded guys in an unmarked vehicle just so they can fight again tomorrow and ambush the mechanized unit that was entering the town'

Not to mention the fact that the heli is probably on guard there because its an off-limit section of the city, by the way they were reporting every vehicle and person group they spotted. [editline]11:35AM[/editline] I think all the negative critics of this vid... a) don't understand the concept of "probable cause" or the fundamentals of combat, for that matter b) are critics of the war in the first place c) just throw out random shit like "they're enjoying it! bad!" and pretend that they're all on the same page, when they're actually all saying different things

I took the time to watch about half of it, and I don't see a problem. A group of men were engaging in very suspicious behavior (loitering, checking corners) while carrying objects that indeed looked like weapons, and we taken down appropriately. A van later drives into the zone of fire, is mistaken for insurgents, and is fired upon. I would say that it's neither the civilian's fault, or the pilots' fault. The pilot just engaged enemies, and someone came in and started carting off the bodies. The civilians saw the bodies, and tried to help. It's just matter of bad communication and war. If the civilians had been waving a white flag or similiar, then the pilots would have been totally unjustified, but the video as is, the pilots were following procedure.

[QUOTE=darkheadcrab;21190736]Not to mention the fact that the heli is probably on guard there because its an off-limit section of the city, by the way they were reporting every vehicle and person group they spotted. [editline]11:35AM[/editline] I think all the negative critics of this vid... a) don't understand the concept of "probable cause" or the fundamentals of combat, for that matter b) are critics of the war in the first place c) just throw out random shit like "they're enjoying it! bad!" and pretend that they're all on the same page, when they're actually all saying different things[/QUOTE] This.

I don't see anything wrong with this. They were suspicious, they had weapons, the rest is just war.

I'm surprised they didn't notice the helicopter

[QUOTE=scout1;21190856]I took the time to watch about half of it, and I don't see a problem. A group of men were engaging in very suspicious behavior (loitering, checking corners) while carrying objects that indeed looked like weapons, and we taken down appropriately. A van later drives into the zone of fire, is mistaken for insurgents, and is fired upon. I would say that it's neither the civilian's fault, or the pilots' fault. The pilot just engaged enemies, and someone came in and started carting off the bodies. The civilians saw the bodies, and tried to help. It's just matter of bad communication and war. If the civilians had been waving a white flag or similiar, then the pilots would have been totally unjustified, but the video as is, the pilots were following procedure.[/QUOTE] You mean gunner, the pilot doesn't shoot, the gunner does.

I like how everyone in this thread keeps saying how heartless they are. Yet they try and help the little girl even tho they could easily kill her

[QUOTE=Jmir 54;21191156]I'm surprised they didn't notice the helicopter[/QUOTE] I think they did, the guy even tried to take a picture, thats when he said 'they're shooting at us' There was also two helicopters for anyone who didnt know.

The forces did nothing wrong they were clearly armed and acting suspicious and if the black van was simply picking up wounded they wouldn't need to look around and be careful about it and they tried to get the wounded out. I really don't see what they've done wrong

About what distance was that? [editline]08:06PM[/editline] Also, if it was me, I would just go round the corner when I saw the helicopter.

This is fucking sick

Shit like this has happened in every war. There's no such thing as humane war, or clean war. Difference is that we don't have video footage of Roman soldiers killing 'barbarian' villagers and such.

[QUOTE=gbtygfvyg;21190127]No they're right, it is their fault for bringing a child into a war zone.[/QUOTE] Half there country is a fucking war zone, most people are too poor to leave what the hell do you expect them to do. I doubt they thought they would get shot down for carrying camaras.

[QUOTE=gbtygfvyg;21190127]No they're right, it is their fault for bringing a child into a war zone.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Dclone2;21190134] They fucking live there, goddamn.[/QUOTE] Would you brings kids with you where your friends got killed? Of course not. Anyways. Sick war video, but it's nothing compared to Medieval Battles. It's better dying quickly rather than getting stabbed.

[QUOTE=madmanmad;21191469]Half there country is a fucking war zone, most people are too poor to leave what the hell do you expect them to do. I doubt they thought they would get shot down for carrying camaras.[/QUOTE] They brought the kid in the van, it's not like the kid was in her house when it was bombed or something

Bongo Truck, what the hell?

From what I saw in the video they did everything by the book. I couldn't tell weather the group of people was armed or not but I did see a guy who looked like he was gonna stir up some shit on a corner. But hell accidents happen. Oh by the way while posting this I was half way through.

[QUOTE=don818;21191665]From what I saw in the video they did everything by the book. I couldn't tell weather the group of people was armed or not but I did see a guy who looked like he was gonna stir up some shit on a corner. But hell accidents happen. Oh by the way while posting this I was half way through.[/QUOTE] Exactly, journalists are always subjected to war if they're a part of it. This video is a pefect example, shoulder mounted cameras often get mistaken for an anti-tank weapon. A journalist was filming a tank, and the tank mistook it for a weapon and shot. (small bits of blood) [b]NSFW[/b] [url]http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=27d_1218682570&c=1[/url]

[QUOTE=Pappi_man;21191512]Would you brings kids with you where your friends got killed? Of course not. Anyways. Sick war video, but it's nothing compared to Medieval Battles. It's better dying quickly rather than getting stabbed.[/QUOTE] It was just some guy taking his kids to a tutor who happened to pass by and decided to help a man who had been shot.

The point of the video is not the fact they were enjoying killing them, even though it is disgusting, it was the fact that THEY WERE JOURNALISTS. They didn't have a single weapon on them and were killed for no reason. The US government tried to cover this video up and it now has resurfaced. :tinfoil:

[QUOTE=Toshinden;21192824]The point of the video is not the fact they were enjoying killing them, even though it is disgusting, it was the fact that THEY WERE JOURNALISTS. They didn't have a single weapon on them and were killed for no reason. The US government tried to cover this video up and it now has resurfaced. :tinfoil:[/QUOTE] If you were in Iraq and know that nearly every "civilian" that looks at you could be an insurgent you would be paranoid as hell. They saw these Journalists with their cameras and thought they were weapons so they took action.

This is why they hate us

[QUOTE=Toshinden;21192824]The point of the video is not the fact they were enjoying killing them, even though it is disgusting, it was the fact that THEY WERE JOURNALISTS. They didn't have a single weapon on them and were killed for no reason. The US government tried to cover this video up and it now has resurfaced. :tinfoil:[/QUOTE] They had weapons and cameras, it was clearly a hostile area, it was a mistake that they were killed.

[QUOTE=KillerCarrot;21190526]They had firearms, one of the guys clearly has an AK, yes there were journalists, but they should have known how to react in a situation of multiple people with at least one caring a gun. It would look bad, to anyone, like something was happening, and then could clearly see the helicopter, one of the guys tried to take the picture which looked to the gunner than he was aiming an RPG, it's a mistake yes. [/QUOTE] No, they were completely unarmed. I understand how they could have though it was a weapon, but the journalists couldn't have known what they would look like to some helicopter, especially if they didn't even know it was thereand there clearly isn't any rule that says "don't bring long, thin stuff here, because a copter might shoot you" . I think the problem here was bad imaging software/hardware. They should have had way higher resolution screens since they were in a civilian area, if you're about to be looking through a blurry piece of shit you should kill everyone holding a stick while you're at it. One thing that is strange to me is how quickly they got authorization to fire. In other videos that I saw the helicopter made several passes to be absolutely sure that the targets were insurgents and the sticks were actually weapons. Go look at [url]http://www.wikileaks.org/[/url], since it has a better description, and a video explaining stuff.