Jon Tron vs Destiny / 4:21 AM - Zukriuchen: I Stand by JonTron, unironically - General

Hey, I recognize this music. It has been a long time I have heard this music, I think it was when I was a little toddler and my parents played this music to make me fall asleep in peace. Good times. Thank you Jontron for making me remember.

[QUOTE=Skanic;51959668]Who said that it should be restricted due to race? We can agree that Trump didn't properly roll it out so that people who are from countries that are not banned can easily enter the USA. But its not a race ban when over 80% of said "race" can still enter. Why are people still pushing race? We are all the same biological just a different skin hue . But there is different cultures. Or do you think the Culture in Japan is the same as in Europe?[/QUOTE] Did you watch the debate at all because I'm not talking about Trump, dude. Pay attention

[QUOTE=Gwoodman;51959487]It's pretty sad how you probably agree with Jon given your post history and posted this to try and deflect the conversation. Typical Internet Political Troll 101. This isn't about what Destiny has said before, it's about Jon boy[/QUOTE] Actually those clips are from this debate [editline]14th March 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=KillRay;51959595]Keemstar is even condeming Jon lmao [Media]https://twitter.com/KEEMSTAR/status/841495812777598977[/media][/QUOTE] Everyone type jontron is a stupid friend/homie in the chat

[QUOTE=rndgenerator;51959495]I'm confused because people say destiny is a good debater but after watching a few of his videos that's hardly true? Or what am I missing really?[/QUOTE] I can count the amount of sentences Jon got out without being interrupted on 1 hand.

[QUOTE=BanthaFodder;51959649]It honestly sounds like both of them had pretty understandable views that were just relayed incredibly poorly and blown way out of proportion by the internet outrage machine after being reduced to soundbites that make either side sound like a lunatic in order to appeal to a specific audience. So business as usual.[/QUOTE] Actually watch the video if you want to have an opinion.

[QUOTE=Lobstuzz;51959707]I can count the amount of sentences Jon got out without being interrupted on 1 hand.[/QUOTE]Kinda reminds me of Stefan who also interrupts the other person a lot during arguments.

[QUOTE=BanthaFodder;51959649]It honestly sounds like both of them had pretty understandable views that were just relayed incredibly poorly and blown way out of proportion by the internet outrage machine after being reduced to soundbites that make either side sound like a lunatic in order to appeal to a specific audience. So business as usual.[/QUOTE] fear of race-mixing is an understandable view?

[QUOTE=Lobstuzz;51959707]I can count the amount of sentences Jon got out without being interrupted on 1 hand.[/QUOTE] That even happens in presidental debates, with a moderator. What's your point? Its not like Jon never interrupted either to throw out his zingers

[QUOTE=Gwoodman;51959671]People aren't hating, they are extremely disappointed at these poorly misinformed statements by someone they liked a lot and feel bad that the enjoyment of him has gone away.[/QUOTE] There are some serious haters in this thread, you can't deny that. It's a loud minority.

[QUOTE=KillRay;51959722]That even happens in presidental debates, with a moderator. What's your point? Its not like Jon never interrupted either to throw out his zingers[/QUOTE] But it's consistent throughout the whole conversation. Destiny got to fully articulate many of his points, whereas Jon only got to put out a handful.

[QUOTE=Lobstuzz;51959723]There are some serious haters in this thread, you can't deny that. It's a loud minority.[/QUOTE] Its almost like expressing hateful ideology might make people feel some strong distaste toward the speaker :thinking:

[QUOTE=KillRay;51959722]That even happens in presidental debates, with a moderator. What's your point? Its not like Jon never interrupted either to throw out his zingers[/QUOTE] Presidential debates are an awful shitshow tbh. It is not a good example of how a debate should be. And I don't see why you mention Jon, no one's arguing that Jon is the better debater, just that destiny seems rather overrated on his debating skills.

[QUOTE=KillRay;51959729]Its almost like expressing hateful ideology might make people feel some strong distaste toward the speaker :thinking:[/QUOTE] I'm replying to someone saying that people aren't hating. Or are you too horny to get some zings to read the post I'm replying to?

[QUOTE=Lobstuzz;51959732]I'm replying to someone saying that people aren't hating. Or are you too horny to get some zings to read the post I'm replying to?[/QUOTE] And I'm explaining why there is haters.

the reason destiny kept butting in was because jon just kept throwing out shit like "sweden is collapsing" and "wealthy blacks are more criminal than poor whites" and bouncing between completely unrelated topics like do you really expect him to just let jontron vomit out wild and baseless accusations completely uninterrupted? [editline]14th March 2017[/editline] An hour and a half of discussion and not once did Jon answer why he thought the white majority in America needed to be preserved. An hour and a half of deflections and tangents about the criminality of blacks and the foreign tide destroying the west, and not [I]one[/I] straight fucking answer to the question. I think it's pretty fucking easy to understand why Destiny was cutting him off.

[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51959744] I think it's pretty fucking easy to understand why Destiny was cutting him off.[/QUOTE] Hardly. If you invite someone to debate with, least you can do is at least let them finish even if they're spouting nonsense. Interrupting just makes you look bad, especially in debates.

[QUOTE=rndgenerator;51959785]Hardly. If you invite someone to debate with, least you can do is at least let them finish even if they're spouting nonsense. Interrupting just makes you look bad, especially in debates.[/QUOTE] Don't you see how doing that punishes the person actually making points and justifying their conclusions and benefits the person quickly saying as much crazy shit as possible? If you're interested in a discussion that teaches you something about a topic or reveals new insight into a certain subject that's the absolute worst policy you could ever have.

[QUOTE=KillRay;51959595]Keemstar is even condeming Jon lmao [Media]https://twitter.com/KEEMSTAR/status/841495812777598977[/media][/QUOTE] is anyone even remotely surprised that sargon is defending jon, what an absolute worm destiny "won on the issues" the moment that jon opened his mouth

[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51959796]Don't you see how doing that punishes the person actually making points and justifying their conclusions and benefits the person quickly saying as much crazy shit as possible? If you're interested in a discussion that teaches you something about a topic or reveals new insight into a certain subject that's the absolute worst policy you could ever have.[/QUOTE] How is interrupting someone in the middle of a sentence a better policy? How is that better than waiting till the other side is done talking? It's fair enough if they talk for a long time, but in case of Jon that was not the thing. He was constantly getting interrupted in the middle of sentences. It's a debate, listening does not punish anyone, nor does it justify someone who talks a lot of anything.

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;51959806]is anyone even remotely surprised that sargon is defending jon, what an absolute worm destiny "won on the issues" the moment that jon opened his mouth[/QUOTE] "Only the left cares about race! We wouldn't talk about race if the left didn't bring it up so much!" *defends the person calling for the white american majority to be preserved* [editline]14th March 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=rndgenerator;51959808]How is interrupting someone in the middle of a sentence a better policy? How is that better than waiting till the other side is done talking? It's fair enough if they talk for a long time, but in case of Jon that was not the thing. He was constantly getting interrupted in the middle of sentences. It's a debate, listening does not punish anyone, nor does it justify someone who talks a lot of anything.[/QUOTE] he was constantly being interrupted because he was [I]constantly saying crazy shit and dodging the question[/I]

[QUOTE=rndgenerator;51959785]Hardly. If you invite someone to debate with, least you can do is at least let them finish even if they're spouting nonsense. Interrupting just makes you look bad, especially in debates.[/QUOTE] If you derail, you need to be interrupted and put on track before you go too far off course. There's a reason why mods will even ban here for off topic.

[QUOTE=KillRay;51959827]If you derail, you need to be interrupted and put on track before you go too far off course. There's a reason why mods will even ban here for off topic.[/QUOTE] It's known as "gish galloping". After a creationist who used it to win debates.

[QUOTE=patq911;51959834]It's known as "gish galloping". After a creationist who used it to win debates.[/QUOTE] people do it a lot when talking to destiny if you throw out a bunch of sentences at once like "sweden is a disaster" and "blacks commit more crimes than whites" it's hard to address all of them at once even if it's pretty easy to point out why they're wrong

[QUOTE=Lobstuzz;51959728]But it's consistent throughout the whole conversation. Destiny got to fully articulate many of his points, whereas Jon only got to put out a handful.[/QUOTE] most of jons full uninterrupted sentences were i-i-i-i-i-i-ii-i t-t-think th--- AY YI YI DUDE YOU"RE IMPOSSIBLE HAHAHAHAHA

Interrupting others during a debate has its place. You do have to be careful obviously, but if your opponent is just spewing out statements with no expansion, or seemingly using terms in ways you're pretty sure are wrong or have never seen used that way before, then it's not exactly uncalled for to interrupt and try to get them to focus on one point like they should be doing, or to define a term. Its not like this was a formal setting anyway lmao. Holy shit you guys are reaching hard to make Destiny look like the bad guy here. Just go back to /pol/ or whichever subreddit makes you warm and fuzzy inside if you want to ignore reality.

[QUOTE=TheHydra;51959718]fear of race-mixing is an understandable view?[/QUOTE] I took it as more of a fear of culture-clash than a fear of race-mixing. I think tying race to culture is a tremendous fallacy, but I can also at least see where he's coming from in terms of placing value on national culture and heritage ([i]even if I don't necessarily agree with everything he said[/i]). That said, he articulated his points in a really irresponsible way. He went into a debate with questionable sources, no preparation, and shoddy numbers, so I feel like he's kinda made his bed on this one. If there's one thing he's proven time and time again it's that he's just not that good at expressing his ideas when he's not scripted. This might just be me reaching to see the best in everyone, but I don't think Jon is a racist. I think he's emotional and misinformed on a great many things, but I don't think people like H3H3, PsychicPebbles, SkyWilliams, Boogie, and the Grumps would associate/be friends with him if he was an actual bigot and not just a guy with firm opinions who says stupid shit sometimes. [editline]14th March 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51959715]Actually watch the video if you want to have an opinion.[/QUOTE] Fair enough.

[QUOTE=BanthaFodder;51959978]I took it as more of a fear of culture-clash than a fear of race-mixing. I think tying race to culture is a tremendous fallacy, but I can also at least see where he's coming from in terms of placing value on national culture and heritage ([i]even if I don't necessarily agree with everything he said[/i]). That said, he articulated his points in a really irresponsible way. He went into a debate with questionable sources, no preparation, and shoddy numbers, so I feel like he's kinda made his bed on this one. If there's one thing he's proven time and time again it's that he's just not that good at expressing his ideas when he's not scripted. This might just be me reaching to see the best in everyone, but I don't think Jon is a racist. I think he's emotional and misinformed on a great many things, but I don't think people like H3H3, PsychicPebbles, SkyWilliams, Boogie, and the Grumps would associate/be friends with him if he was an actual bigot and not just a guy with firm opinions who says stupid shit sometimes.[/QUOTE] this entire discussion is based on the idea that the white american majority must be preserved he specifically said that even if other races came in and integrated into the culture it would still be a problem because they would enter the gene pool he made several statements about the criminality of blacks and how culture is related TO RACE [quote]There is a clear divide in the way that people think. White people tend towards the Libertarian side and at least the first generation Mexicans vote heavily for government handouts. (Destiny mentions that red states take more govt handouts than blue states). These states (Southern red states (Alabama, Loiusiana)) have high non white populations.[/quote] please, tell me how is this not a racist statement [editline]14th March 2017[/editline] I know that a lot of my posts are coming across as "how dare you disagree with me shitlord", but that really isn't what I'm trying to say I honestly cannot understand how what he said couldn't be construed as racist. He repeatedly came back to the topic of race after Destiny tried to shift the conversation to something else, he made NUMEROUS claims about MULTIPLE racial groups, he SPECIFICALLY mentioned the WHITE majority like I don't understand how he could be more explicitly racist than he was without saying negroids are thieves and mongoloids are good at math

[QUOTE=KillRay;51959595]Keemstar is even condeming Jon lmao [Media]https://twitter.com/KEEMSTAR/status/841495812777598977[/media][/QUOTE] the irony is so thicc you could cut it with a knife

keemstar is a fucking airheaded cretin and he has nothing of value to add

Doesn't help that John acted like a baboon, outright denying facts with Destiny would bring them up. The concept of immigrants helping California's economy grow from the analysis of economists was dismissed on the concept of experts being wrong in pollsters for Hillary