• I want your opinion: on what you think about no child left behind.
    101 replies, posted
I've had some great teachers that have gone on rants about the Education System in general. About how we are just handed grades now, to increase the school average. Basically we're spoiled now And I tottally agree with that it punishes smarter kids. Not to sound egotistical, but I like to think I'm pretty smart. I used to get 90's on everything, when I gave a fuck. Now I'm just so bored of most my classes because it's the same shit we've been learning since elementary. I coast through the work without giving much thought, which in math etc leads to me making some simple mistakes, that I would have caught if I was paying attention. Yet I still have a 80% average. That reflects on the education system that I can go my highschool career without trying at all, or even doing homework, and maintain that average.
There were and are people in my honors classes who do not deserve to be there, they don't do jack shit. I'm a damn smart person but I'm not motivated anymore. I want be challenged but noooo, we have to let the dumbasses graduate with us. NCLB is one of the reasons I quit wanting to be a teacher.
Before the No Child Left Behind shit every smart person had the opportunity to do well, but then you add the fucking idiots in an advanced class with you, and you just changed how the class works. The idiots ended up with an A in the 90-100 area, while the actual smart people who belonged in there ended up with B's and C's because of them being forced to do more while doing less. The idiots that got forced in there got retakes and free A's on nearly everything, while we're all left with having to do their work for them pretty much.
[QUOTE=tittles650;32158006]made most of the truly smart kids not do so well in school.[/QUOTE] Holy shit do I recognize this. My teacher said to me in first grade that I was not going to pass math because I didn't draw straight lines. Here I am, 9 years later reading college math in high school. [editline]7th September 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=GoldenGnome;32158049]it's retarded. kids who don't belong in advanced classes get shoved in there because otherwise they'd be "left behind." there are kids in my calculus class this year who should be talking trigonometry courses and such. not trying to sound elitist but some kids simply don't have the capacity to follow that track, but its the only track available in many cases. (note: the calculus class is not really an "advanced" one, it's the only mathematics my high school offers for seniors. that or statistics.)[/QUOTE] I took calculus before trigonometry and had no problem with it.
Australian education is better than American though. Or so it seems. [editline]7th September 2011[/editline] If you actually put more effort into it, you're rewarded.
[QUOTE=CoolKingKaso;32158051]They aren't idiots, it's just that they don't really care about doing work.[/QUOTE] Well even if they didn't want to do their work they could at least still get the correct answer. I mean I'm that way. I'd never turn in my homework in highschool but if I was asked a question I can still pull the correct answer out of my ass. They could just be completely stupid. I have a choc full of idiotic friends. I have a friend who has dropped low level college math because its too hard for her which i can understand as she doesnt even know how to isolate a variable yet she claims she got into college calc but it taking a lower level math class to "refresh her math skills" I'm with everyone else. I mean my girlfriend still uses the wrong their, there, and they're as well as your and you're. To her their = they're and their and your = your + you're. In her dictionary "worse" doesnt exists. you have no idea how many times ive wanted to just wanted to weep for our generation. Facebook is a great example for the failure of No Child Left Behind. Just...just kill me now...:suicide:
Well it's showcasing why a multi tiered system of schools, with a well established net of vocational, business and similar schools is needed. Essentially you have a set of "high schools" for the better performing who have the biggest chances of succeeding in university and then you have a secondary and tertiary net of vocational, engineering and similar schools for decently performing students who would probably have issues with university level education, but standard high school ed is too generic for them to make a living out of it and lastly craft schools.
It doesn't get much better in uni, my friend had a classmate in his geoscience practical who had a little speech why diamonds and gold were worthless and only fuelling cosmetics, so we should stop mining them. If I were there I'd honestly tell her "Bitch sit back down"
Im in a US school right now, and your Algebra1 is something I learned when I was in 7th grade in Slovakia. And yet I saw people that were Seniors taking that class, trying to figure out how to solve x^2+4x+4=5 Fucking terrible system you have.
[QUOTE=Novangel;32163373]It doesn't get much better in uni, my friend had a classmate in his geoscience practical who had a little speech why diamonds and gold were worthless and only fuelling cosmetics, so we should stop mining them. If I were there I'd honestly tell her "Bitch sit back down"[/QUOTE] Why? I could see that being a fair thing to say if examples were provided.
I dropped out because of how fucking pointless highschool was, look at me now. Just work on something you can do best and work at it until you can make a job out of it. (i'm still going to get my GED and go to college, but highschool is BULLSHIT)
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;32163800]Why? I could see that being a fair thing to say if examples were provided.[/QUOTE] Sure a lot of bad things might be happening because of diamond mining, etc, but you know, we totally don't use gold/diamonds for other stuff, you know, circuitry, drilling, conducting, etc.
This is bullshit. You can't say these things about people just because they don't know something. Someone never told them most likely and it's just immature to laugh about it. Explain it to them and then mock them for not listening if they don't. Deal with schools being shit and you being young, and move on to better education when the time comes. As for schools dumbing down good students: One of the big problems of the education system trying to turn us into sheep. And about the title: I think students should be left behind. Not in knowledge but in years. If they fuck up, let them redo the year. Seems too uncommon to me. I've done it, and it's worked out great (no sarcasm).
If the lessons aren't interesting enough, try to make them more interesting. When a subject interests and appeals to someone, they pay more attention to it, and thus they are easier to educate concerning that subject. And if that still doesn't work, and the kid just mucks around like the whole thing's a fuckin' joke, then you start working out their problems; be a learning disability like ADD or ADHD (attention deficit hyperactivity disorder), or troubles of a domestic/social nature. (like if Mommy beats Little Timmy when she's on the Tullamore Dew, having a not-so safe priest, falling out with a close padre, losing a relative to cancer, etc) It's certainly a more appealing solution than educating the uninterested kids in less sophisticated subjects like how to flip a burger, how to stack shelves, or how to clean a toilet. Not that those jobs are bad; they're vital for supporting our infrastructure, with the BurgerMen feeding the flock, the shelf-stackers arranging the merchandise in the marketplaces, and without the janitors we'd be knee-deep in spilt saline solutions (IV juice, the stuff they pump into you at the hospital) and empty vending machines. Kind of a dilemma here; on one hand those jobs need doing and there need to be people to do them, since they're vital for society to function. But on the other hand, morality dictates that everyone should at least have a chance (or two) to achieve whatever heights they aspire to. I sure as hell don't want to live my life stacking shelves and flipping burgers; I want to be a games developer, and thus my aspirations led to a fine course at a college near Epsom. I'm putting in a lot of effort to get good grades and acquire the skills I need, and by Summer next year hopefully i'll have enough know-how and experience to make something great and become a good developer. (if I still don't have enough skill by then, i'll have to consider uni, even if it's bloody expensive now the plutocrats are in Parliment again) My aspirations and skills led me here, and i'm hoping it leads somewhere great; though hopefully not towards life as a minor cog in an otherwise soulless machine. If I were a lazy slob (even moreso than my minor sloth) who didn't care about learning, then i'd be stuck in some boring dead-end job, or worse i'd be some backwards-capped hoodie-wearing chav living off of benefits on some scummy council estate. That ain't the life I wanna lead, but we all gotta work to make our dreams and aspirations come true. If they're out of your reach, then you're either not trying hard enough, don't have enough experience, or don't have enough power to change the world to such a degree that you achieve your goals. The latter two usually go hand in hand in this day and age, since knowledge is power after all, and knowledge powers the higher functions of the machine of civilisation. But without the lower functions to maintain it, everything above falls apart. It's the tragic curse of the social pyramid, where those less fortunate and unable to reach such great heights end up with the privelidge and burden or maintaining the lower functions that makes civilisation possible. So what do you do; do you chase your aspirations of greatness, or do you work down below to keep the dream of society alive? Whatever you do, don't fall down so far that you end up dragging everyone down by being a big ol' mooch that moulders away on benefits before your time. That's what pensions and social security are for; they're keeping you alive and well for when you've worked enough and are unable to work anymore. You have to earn your rest and leisure by working hard and building the foundations of the future, both yours and everyone else's, as well as maintaining the present. It's very important to make it all strong and sturdy, since if there's a rickety past beneath and behind us it's easier to fall off the rusty scaffolding and into a dumpster full of many metal pipes facing upwards despite health and safety regulations. I wonder if class comes into this at any point?
[QUOTE=Unsmart;32163758]Im in a US school right now, and your Algebra1 is something I learned when I was in 7th grade in Slovakia. And yet I saw people that were Seniors taking that class, trying to figure out how to solve x^2+4x+4=5 Fucking terrible system you have.[/QUOTE] Quadratic equations at 7th grade? Wow, you learn that 3 years later here...
Sounds like his school's a bit more advanced than yours...
The whole 'teaching to the lowest common denominator' thing at school was bullshit. It got me really frustrated. Thankfully in the later years of school they split classes up into groups of students based on how good they were doing. I was usually in the highest classes which was good. And of course when we got to choose our subjects in the last few years of high school I chose to do all of the science and maths subjects which meant that there was almost nobody left in any of my classes who was particularly slow (that or EVERYONE was slow at the same time because they introduced a wildly new concept that people had a hard time to adjust to).
I've just started college (16-18 years old) and there are people who still cannot get their 'their, they're and there' in the right place. Alot of people get 'no' and 'know' mixed up too. People don't know simple things, it's almost as if the entire world is getting dumber.
[QUOTE=sltungle;32164608]The whole 'teaching to the lowest common denominator' thing at school was bullshit. It got me really frustrated. Thankfully in the later years of school they split classes up into groups of students based on how good they were doing. I was usually in the highest classes which was good. And of course when we got to choose our subjects in the last few years of high school I chose to do all of the science and maths subjects which meant that there was almost nobody left in any of my classes who was particularly slow (that or EVERYONE was slow at the same time because they introduced a wildly new concept that people had a hard time to adjust to).[/QUOTE] Indeed, the lowest common denominator doesn't seem too much of a good thing. Even though it intends to cater for those lower down, it drags down the potential smart kids to such basic levels and can potentially hamper their ability to achieve greatness. It's like if we were bird-people (not necessarily "furry" or anything, just an example i'm using here), and the Wise Owls simply taught the young chicks to walk, just so the less-able ones could learn some vestiges of mobility, when all the other bird-children were MORE than capable of learning how to fly. Why walk when you can easily fly? Why remain on the ground when the sky is your world? Why let those lower down and less capable weigh you down, like a busted leg impeding the mobility of a centipede? (and yes, I got that last bit from Family Guy) Sometimes we need to discard that which weighs us down in an effort to reach great heights, but also keep in mind not to soar too close to the Sun. Like Icarus learned so long ago, at such great heights there lies the dangerous solar fires of risk and expectations; fly too close to the Sun and you will get burned, or in the case of Icarus the wax that holds your wings together will melt, and you'll plummet towards the ground, reaching an untimely conclusion to your story as your bones break and your limbs go flying in many gruesome directions, with a resounding "SPRACK!" echoing across the seas and mountains. (sounds like a messy splattering of meat and blood, combined with the cracking and smashing of bones breaking, with an additional whirling whistling sound that accompanies your severed limbs twirling away from the site of the carnage)
Sounds like a noble idea that didn't quite work. [editline]7th September 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=sltungle;32164608]The whole 'teaching to the lowest common denominator' thing at school was bullshit. It got me really frustrated. Thankfully in the later years of school they split classes up into groups of students based on how good they were doing. I was usually in the highest classes which was good. And of course when we got to choose our subjects in the last few years of high school I chose to do all of the science and maths subjects which meant that there was almost nobody left in any of my classes who was particularly slow (that or EVERYONE was slow at the same time because they introduced a wildly new concept that people had a hard time to adjust to).[/QUOTE] I'm admittedly not on good terms with subjects that have classes based on ability. I got shoved down from top set english to 3rd set english which almost jeopardised my english GCSE's
[QUOTE=thf;32164506]Quadratic equations at 7th grade? Wow, you learn that 3 years later here...[/QUOTE] I don't recall the exact grade, but I am quite certain that they did appear in primary school. Same for germans and austrians as far as I know.
I'm taking A-level classes in a College that is about an hour from my house, I'm doing Phys/Chem/Biol so you'd expect others on the course to be quite smart to want to do subjects like this. I sat by this guy yesterday (it was our first day of the course) and we got chatting he mentioned he wanted to get into medicine and I thought sweet someone else that wants to do what I want. About an hour later we had to write some notes on things and he turns to me, honestly now, and says "How do you spell the word SAND?" I hope to fuck this guy does not become a doctor and work on innocent people.
Maybe it was just a blip? People have those sometimes, where they lose the words. "Put more of... the stuff into... the thing that stuff goes into..." *sets off radiological alarms*
[QUOTE=ironman17;32165706]Maybe it was just a blip? People have those sometimes, where they lose the words. "Put more of... the stuff into... the thing that stuff goes into..." *sets off radiological alarms*[/QUOTE] I once forgot how to spell the word "is." Let me tell you, I felt like a fucking brain surgeon that day. And I don't really have the excuse of being young, since this happened in my second quarter of college.
I learn more in one hour on the internet than 7 hours at school.
[QUOTE=wraithcat;32165284]I don't recall the exact grade, but I am quite certain that they did appear in primary school. Same for germans and austrians as far as I know.[/QUOTE] We had quadratics about middle of 8th grade, but apart from that, we had ALL of Algebra 1 in 7th grade. Regardless, the fact a senior couldn't pass that class on first try is just sad. Back in SVK, only 1 girl failed her math class, but she was the type that would rather go outside and smoke/drink. All of my classmates are now in High School (its 1 year later there) Right now Im in a class with a kid that just wont shut the fuck up and I dont learn anything on the lesson. To clarify, Im in a US school, which follows exact curriculum and standards as in the US.
The worst part about it is the teacher's attitude. They all seem to want to believe that the degenerate kids have some kind of salvageable potential. Or at least they say that so that they can keep their job. I've only met two teachers in my school career that had the balls to admit some kids are just not worth the time or effort.
Its a fucking joke. Like seriously, half of the people in my Honors Chemistry class last year were barely passing the class, which meant we were behind all of the teachers other classes. To be more exact, by the end of the semester we were behind 2 weeks of work, because the teacher had to stop and explain what the hell was going on to several people who weren't paying attention and talking. What I don't understand is if a person has a hard time in the class, they should drop down and try something more on their level. Also, if the person doesn't give a fuck and only goes to class just to fuck around, let them drop out. If they want to flip burgers the rest of their life, its their decision. Also, standardize testing just sucks. In order to graduate at my school, you have to pass the PSSA (Its in Pennsylvania) in 11th grade to graduate. You waste 2 months just studying for this one test while you could learning about things that actually matter. In conclusion, standardized testing is useless, you should focus on the people who want to learn and are there to be apart of the class, and If the person can't handle that class, let them be the class below it, but don't drag down the people who can handle it with them. PS: If I made any type of grammar or spelling mistake, its because english isn't my thing.
I think it's dumb as shit, but it has probably saved my ass more than once. I'm not the biggest fan of doing homework.
I think education in the United States is a bit too "America-centric." For example, the only time I've ever been able to learn about another country in class is when I was taking an advanced course or part. There was one time when the general class was taught about WW2, but America was heavily involved in that. I also think our (for Americans, obviously, don't know about foreign tests) standardized tests need to be completely re-written. I don't remember ever having to actually know specific facts about Science or Social Studies to pass either of the tests. It's mainly "read this paragraph, answer these questions." I think if we fix standardized tests, we could fix American education.
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