JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: You can't escape now! You super retard!
5,002 replies, posted
Joeseph
Speedwagon
Polnareff
Stroheim
Wammu
Vague choices that were hard to make and I need a top 10 even though I haven't even gotten to part 4 yet..
[QUOTE=Hakita;47792812]diavolo really?
king crimson is the best stand in the whole series but diavolo is such an uninteresting villain, he has barely any motivation or character outside "evil guy"[/QUOTE]
haha oh god, my off the cuff opinions are being questioned
[IMG]http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/510/160/d63.jpg[/IMG]
Ok, I'll try and justify - I reread a bit of the manga to formulate this. I guess i'm judging characters based on how they are portrayed in the story as well as their motivations and stand ability. [sp]Diavolo's motivations and character aren't as clear-cut as some people make out - his main trait is that he's aggressively paranoid to such an extent that he'll ruthlessly dispatch anyone that sees his face, and I really like a mystery buildup which is why Dio is high on my list as well (except only his stand is a mystery, while the boss as a character is entirely one) - I love the scene with Bucellatti in the room with the pillars when he first meets the anonymous boss, yet still cannot discover his identity and the way the characters outside start experiencing time anomalies, gives an incredibly intimidating impression of the boss' power. The fact the stand is hard to understand at first adds to the mystery and appeals to me as well. All of this is caused by Diavolo's tendency to want to live in the shadows, but also how he wants to erase the past - King Crimson allows him to see and invincibly manipulate the future, but he cannot foresee what has already happened, which is why he views Polnareff as a 'challenge from the past that I must overcome'. He's not perfect though - unstable under stress, most of part 5 is about his carefully laid plans falling to shit (e.g. kidnapping Trish from Buccellati instead of just allowing him to willingly deliver her)
The way Diavolo works his way towards and reveals himself only meters away from Polnareff I think is one of the best villain reveals in the series, a real "oh shit" moment
King crimson is one of if not my favourite stand both in look and power, and Doppio is a character favourite as well so I sort of bunched both of them together. The split personality transformation thing I like as well, really unique.
It all adds up to be honest, he's ranked mainly because of King, doppio and his overall portrayal though[/sp]
If I was going by pure character and motivations (no stands, no portrayal) then it would probably be
Joseph
Johnny
Dio
Pucci
Josuke
I'm shit at rankings anyway, I'd have to reread the series to be completely sure. It's hard, as I love most of the parts
[QUOTE=The Rizzler;47793126]haha oh god, my off the cuff opinions are being questioned
[IMG]http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/510/160/d63.jpg[/IMG]
Ok, I'll try and justify - I reread a bit of the manga to formulate this. I guess i'm judging characters based on how they are portrayed in the story as well as their motivations and stand ability. [sp]Diavolo's motivations and character aren't as clear-cut as some people make out - his main trait is that he's aggressively paranoid to such an extent that he'll ruthlessly dispatch anyone that sees his face, and I really like a mystery buildup which is why Dio is high on my list as well (except only his stand is a mystery, while the boss as a character is entirely one) - I love the scene with Bucellatti in the room with the pillars when he first meets the anonymous boss, yet still cannot discover his identity and the way the characters outside start experiencing time anomalies, gives an incredibly intimidating impression of the boss' power. The fact the stand is hard to understand at first adds to the mystery and appeals to me as well. All of this is caused by Diavolo's tendency to want to live in the shadows, but also how he wants to erase the past - King Crimson allows him to see and invincibly manipulate the future, but he cannot foresee what has already happened, which is why he views Polnareff as a 'challenge from the past that I must overcome'. He's not perfect though - unstable under stress, most of part 5 is about his carefully laid plans falling to shit (e.g. kidnapping Trish from Buccellati instead of just allowing him to willingly deliver her)
The way Diavolo works his way towards and reveals himself only meters away from Polnareff I think is one of the best villain reveals in the series, a real "oh shit" moment
King crimson is one of if not my favourite stand both in look and power, and Doppio is a character favourite as well so I sort of bunched both of them together. The split personality transformation thing I like as well, really unique.
It all adds up to be honest, he's ranked mainly because of King, doppio and his overall portrayal though[/sp]
If I was going by pure character and motivations (no stands, no portrayal) then it would probably be
Joseph
Johnny
Dio
Pucci
Josuke
I'm shit at rankings anyway, I'd have to reread the series to be completely sure. It's hard, as I love most of the parts[/QUOTE]
the thing about diavolo is [sp]he's mostly disappointing exactly because of how amazing his build-up is, the meeting with buccelatti is amazing and probably my favorite scene from part 5, but once he's finally revealed in the end he just kinda has a short fight and then dies.
he's kind of like a combination of vanilla ice's personality with extra paranoia and dio's portrayal, which is a great combination, but he isn't given nearly enough screentime or presence to really make a huge enough impact.
unlike dio and vanilla ice, his dangerousness isn't established well enough to really make him feel scary, which is especially disappointing because of how awesome and mysterious his stand is.
it would've been better if the stuff after his proper reveal were done more like Dio's in part 3, where he starts taking out members of the group to really show that he can really tear shit down (though i'm a bit biased since i wish they'd show off King Crimson being a badass stand both because of his immense strength and incredible stand power, i love that "i only need one punch" shit).
also, a huge problem with him is why didn't he just send every assassin simultaneously? Dio has the explanation that he just wants the crusaders to be delayed instead of actually be killed by his minions, but Diavolo has no explanation other than "because of reasons".
a personal dislike is that i don't feel his visual design is threatening enough, the second you see Dio's face you can tell he's one evil, cruel and powerful motherfucker and kira's sleek look shows how cold, calculating and diabolical he is (note how his character design explicitly changes during different parts of the story to show how his character changes, when he first steals another body his hairy is messy and spikey to show how he's constantly on the edge and very jagged because he's trying to learn what the person he's posing as is, but as soon as he gains the power of Bites the Dust, his hair is sleek and perfectly combed to show that he feels in power again).
Diavolo's design is just kinda ehh... his face does have that unmistakable evilness but i feel the rest of his design doesn't compliment that very well, especially not the weird dotted hair and web clothes he has[/sp]
that's my opinion on him at least, he's a huge amount of wasted potential and could've easily been my favorite jojo villain if handled a bit better
[QUOTE=MyBumBum;47790681]Let's list our top 5 favorite Jojo Characters![/QUOTE]
1. GZ (Steel Ball Run) - I think this is more sensible than spoiler tagging honestly.
2. Joseph Joestar (Multiple)
3. Yoshikage Kira (Diamond is Unbreakable)
4. Josuke Higashikata (Diamond is Unbreakable)
5. Funny Valentine (Steel Ball Run)
Honestly 5 was close between Valentine and Dio. Also who can guess my two favourite parts
[editline]24th May 2015[/editline]
To add onto this, let's list our 5 favorite stand powers.
1. Tusk ([sp]This is also primarily due to the use of The Spin, because killing people with the Golden Section is hardcore and I will fight you if you disagree[/sp])
2. King Crimson
3. THE WORLD
4. Killer Queen ([sp]Especially with Bites the Dust[/sp])
5. D4C
Honestly this would be a lot harder if you weren't allowed to include villain stands. They're just so cool though...
crazy diamond is easily the best hero stand, it's a simple power but it's used in such a variety of ways it's amazing
[QUOTE=Hakita;47793343]crazy diamond is easily the best hero stand, it's a simple power but it's used in such a variety of ways it's amazing[/QUOTE]
This is also why Star Platinum is probably my least favourite. Jotaro doesn't need to think on his feet when literally every problem can be solved with punching.
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793357]This is also why Star Platinum is probably my least favourite. Jotaro doesn't need to think on his feet when literally every problem can be solved with punching.[/QUOTE]
personally my least favorite hero stands are probably soft & wet and gold experience, they're both just too vague so it feels like they can just beat every fight with a bullshit deus ex machina
star platinum is a bit boring but (end of part 3 spoilers) [sp]once he learns Star Platinum The World he basically just become hero Dio, which is made even better by the fact that he's not the main character in part 4
i love the fact that the main character in part 4 is not the strongest hero, it makes for a really interesting dynamic[/sp]
[QUOTE=Hakita;47793382]personally my least favorite hero stands are probably soft & wet and gold experience, they're both just too vague so it feels like they can just beat every fight with a bullshit deus ex machina
star platinum is a bit boring but (end of part 3 spoilers) [sp]once he learns Star Platinum The World he basically just become hero Dio, which is made even better by the fact that he's not the main character in part 4
i love the fact that the main character in part 4 is not the strongest hero, it makes for a really interesting dynamic[/sp][/QUOTE]
Yeah, however Star Platinum also has plenty of ass-pull bullshit. [sp]Extending fingers and super breath beating Justice for example) and that's before we even get close to Star Platinum: The World[/sp]
However Star Platinum did invent the Jojo beatdown and so far is still the best for it.
[editline]24th May 2015[/editline]
But I'll agree with you that Josuke is probably one of the smartest Jojos (second maybe only to Joseph, who has pretty much superhuman levels of perception, cunning and deduction) and it really shows in his fights, which is why I enjoy them so much more.
Well, I've only followed the anime thus far (Plan on reading the rest once Stardust Crusaders finishes), but so far my favorites are
1. Dio
2. Joseph (Mainly Part 2 Joseph)
3. Stroheim
4. Polnareff
5. Kakyoin
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793387]Yeah, however Star Platinum also has plenty of ass-pull bullshit. [sp]Extending fingers and super breath beating Justice for example) and that's before we even get close to Star Platinum: The World[/sp]
However Star Platinum did invent the Jojo beatdown and so far is still the best for it.
[editline]24th May 2015[/editline]
But I'll agree with you that Josuke is probably one of the smartest Jojos (second maybe only to Joseph, who has pretty much superhuman levels of perception and deduction) and it really shows in his fights, which is why I enjoy them so much more.[/QUOTE]
those star platinum traits can kinda be excused because araki hadn't really completely figured out what he wanted to do with stands yet
also (mid-part 3 spoilers) [sp]super breath can be explained by the fact that star platinum is immensely powerful in every aspect, so his lungs are also incredibly powerful, meaning it's not really a new stand power as much as it is just an alternate use of his strength[/sp]
Let's not forget that Araki forgets his own rules for how Stands work pretty regularly.
Also shit I really want to put Pucci in my top 5 but I don't know where I'd fit him.
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793429]Let's not forget that Araki forgets his own rules for how Stands work pretty regularly.
Also shit I really want to put Pucci in my top 5 but I don't know where I'd fit him.[/QUOTE]
pucci is just [sp]an extension of dio's penis so putting dio in counts[/sp]
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793429]Let's not forget that Araki forgets his own rules for how Stands work pretty regularly.[/QUOTE]
When did he do that after part 3?
Oh damn top 5 stand powers now, uh lessee
1.Crazy Diamond
2.King Crimson
3.Heaven's Door
4.Scary Monsters
5.Harvest
I mainly ranked them on coolness factor and how cool it'd be to actually have it.
[QUOTE=gokiyono;47793442]When did he do that after part 3?[/QUOTE]
Shit man you're gonna make me look dumb while I look for examples.
[editline]24th May 2015[/editline]
If I can even find any. There's a few exceptions to the rules that I can think of but it's clear those are intended to be just that: exceptions.
I don't know I guess the point I meant to make was Stand Rules aren't set in stone, there's a considerable number of Stands that don't adhere to them fully.
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793518]Shit man you're gonna make me look dumb while I look for examples.[/QUOTE]
I'm just curious because I can't really remember anything other than [sp]someone in part 7 saw a stand before gaining one[/sp]
[QUOTE=gokiyono;47793542]I'm just curious because I can't really remember anything other than [sp]someone in part 7 saw a stand before gaining one[/sp][/QUOTE]
Bohemian Rhapsody is one, as it's incredibly powerful and has an incredibly long (if infinite) range [sp]considering it affects sites all across the world, although it does so without discriminating[/sp]
[sp]Silver Chariot Reqiuem[/sp] doesn't follow its users orders, [sp]D4C[/sp] sort of bends the rules a little in regards to the 'can't trade Stands' rule as does [sp]Scary Monsters[/sp], although this is because of [sp]the Saint's left eye.[/sp].
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793557][sp]Silver Chariot Reqiuem[/sp] doesn't follow its users orders[/QUOTE]
[sp]normal stand rules don't apply to Requiem stands[/sp]
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793557]Bohemian Rhapsody is one, as it's incredibly powerful and has an incredibly long (if infinite) range [sp]considering it affects sites all across the world, although it does so without discriminating[/sp][/QUOTE]
the more distance = less power rule only applies to physical power as far as i know and autonomous stands don't seem to have any need of connection to their owners ([sp]Anubis, Sheer Heart Attack, Notorious B.I.G.[/sp])
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793557][sp]D4C[/sp] sort of bends the rules a little in regards to the 'can't trade Stands' rule as does [sp]Scary Monsters[/sp], although this is because of [sp]the Saint's left eye.[/sp].[/QUOTE]
both are explained by [sp]the stands being born from possessing Saint parts, Valentine could've easily just given the Saint's Heart to his alternate universe versions to pass the stand on to them[/sp]
[QUOTE=Hakita;47793566][sp]normal stand rules don't apply to Requiem stands[/sp][/QUOTE]
True. Honestly I'm glad that entire mechanic didn't remain a thing past the part it was introduced in.
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793557]Bohemian Rhapsody is one, as it's incredibly powerful and has an incredibly long (if infinite) range [sp]considering it affects sites all across the world, although it does so without discriminating[/sp]
[sp]Silver Chariot Requiem[/sp] doesn't follow its users orders, [sp]D4C[/sp] sort of bends the rules a little in regards to the 'can't trade Stands' rule.[/QUOTE]
[sp]I think the things made by Bohemian Rhapsody was made of paper.[/sp]
[sp]There is only one D4C, and it's not that stands can't be traded (Pucchi can do that)[/sp]
1. King Crimson
2. Tusk ([sp]mainly because of it's multiple forms but also how it's combined with the concept of spin[/sp])
3. The World
4. Highway Star
5. C-MOON
Man, this ranking is hard.[sp]Cream is cool because it's intimidating, but has a really small area of influence. Whitesnake is cool because of it's disc ability but not cool in and of itself. Crazy Diamond's ability is utilised well, but too simple to make the list. Mandom is neat but is too limited. Made in Heaven is just way OP that it becomes uninteresting[/sp]
[QUOTE=Hakita;47793252]that's my opinion on him at least, he's a huge amount of wasted potential and could've easily been my favorite jojo villain if handled a bit better[/QUOTE]
yeah, i'll give you that.[sp]He does kill Abbacchio in one hit, then perfectly blends with Doppio into the crowd of football playing children, I feel like rather than spectacularly killing his foes like Dio he dispatches them in a surprising and confusing way, much like how Narancia dies (both deaths come as a sudden shock rather than at the end of an obvious fight). I think the idea behind assassins is a discreet kill, and the last thing a paranoid boss would do is send a stand user army against his enemies, it's not subtle enough
The imprint of his face[/sp]([URL="http://i.gyazo.com/61b7f3db47dbd34b3c199d57bfee9a25.png"]image[/URL])[sp]that Abbachio leaves behind is pretty damn unsettling, and his silhouette in the basement fight and the flashbacks paint him as a short haired, suit wearing man which I think would have suited his character more than the almost flamboyant final reveal yeah. Still though his appearance is very odd, I think again that contributes to his air of mystery. I still like him because of the build up[/sp]
[QUOTE=Hakita;47793343]crazy diamond is easily the best hero stand, it's a simple power but it's used in such a variety of ways it's amazing[/QUOTE]
[sp]The mid-air deconstruction and reconstruction of the motorcycle is one of the most amazing utilisations of a stand ability in the series[/sp]
[editline]24th May 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793518]I don't know I guess the point I meant to make was Stand Rules aren't set in stone, there's a considerable number of Stands that don't adhere to them fully.[/QUOTE]
Whitesnake's digestive fog is completely forgotten about, that's not a general rule though
[QUOTE=gokiyono;47793578][sp]I think the things made by Bohemian Rhapsody was made of paper.[/sp]
[sp]There is only one D4C, and it's not that stands can't be traded (Pucchi can do that)[/sp][/QUOTE]
Supposedly [sp]the charaters from Bohemian Rhapsody are made up of the medium they were recorded on. It's still reported that Bohemian Rhapsody was responsible for 'thousands of deaths' before it was stopped, meaning that it might just have the highest bodycount out of any individual stand so far unless you count Made in Heaven.[/sp]
[editline]24th May 2015[/editline]
You've got some good taste, Rizzler
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793574]True. Honestly I'm glad that entire mechanic didn't remain a thing past the part it was introduced in.[/QUOTE]
it was clearly meant as a one-off thing, and i'm glad it stayed that way, but i would've liked to hear more about what kind of other stands we could've gotten
does this thread consider the light novels canon or not
especially jorge joestar
this is important
[QUOTE=Maruhai;47793603]does this thread consider the light novels canon or not
especially jorge joestar
this is important[/QUOTE]
Considering that would mean that [sp]Cars comes back from Mars and convinces Killer Queen to become his stand[/sp] I'm inclined to say no. But 'canon' is a very loose term in JJBA especially given how the whole [sp]universal reset[/sp] thing works so I guess the answer is actually yes?
[QUOTE=The Rizzler;47793586]yeah, i'll give you that.[sp]He does kill Abbacchio in one hit, then perfectly blends with Doppio into the crowd of football playing children, I feel like rather than spectacularly killing his foes like Dio he dispatches them in a surprising and confusing way, much like how Narancia dies (both deaths come as a sudden shock rather than at the end of an obvious fight). I think the idea behind assassins is a discreet kill, and the last thing a paranoid boss would do is send a stand user army against his enemies, it's not subtle enough
The imprint of his face[/sp]([URL="http://i.gyazo.com/61b7f3db47dbd34b3c199d57bfee9a25.png"]image[/URL])[sp]that Abbachio leaves behind is pretty damn unsettling, and his silhouette in the basement fight and the flashbacks paint him as a short haired, suit wearing man which I think would have suited his character more than the almost flamboyant final reveal yeah. Still though his appearance is very odd, I think again that contributes to his air of mystery. I still like him because of the build up[/sp][/QUOTE]
i feel a part of why he didn't really connect with me was because of how bored i started getting around part 5 with constant stand battles one after another (since i'd been marathoning the jojo mangas, read both part 4 and part 5 in a single week) so i just didn't get as involved with the story
that and also the biggest problem being the awful translation
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47793617]Considering that would mean that [sp]Cars comes back from Mars and convinces Killer Queen to become his stand[/sp] I'm inclined to say no. But 'canon' is a very loose term in JJBA especially given how the whole [sp]universal reset[/sp] thing works.[/QUOTE]
that's not even the weirdest part
althought I really dig [sp]kars w/ killer queen[/sp]
Just found a TV tropes page with some plot holes, here's a few
[url]http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Headscratchers/JoJosBizarreAdventure[/url]
[sp]> How did Iggy make a clone of Dio without ever having seen him
> How is Dio found in the same coffin that Erina used as a lifeboat years later
> Something I just thought of, what happened to Giorno's slowdown punch as well as his reflective damage ability (not really a plot hole but he never uses them again)
> Koichi's Act 2 had the power to create anything that made a noise by writing the sound effect on something (i.e. crackle for fire, whoosh for wind; presumably this could even extend to the boom of an atomic bomb or the crack of a spine being broken), so it basically had infinite uses; so in what way is Act 3's ability to make things heavier an improvement?
> In Phantom Blood, the man Dio tests the Stone Mask on "destroys his own bones and muscles" because the power unlocked within him is too strong to be contained by a human body. However, when Dio dons the Stone Mask, his body isn't damaged when he crushes bricks with his fingers and other superhuman feats. Why is he able to do so?
> Speaking of Stroheim, why does he have a sight on his machine gun on his abs, where it would do no good, and would be redundant when he has one as a monocle?
> Where did Joseph get a dress from in the middle of the desert?[/sp]
There's a few stretches in there but there are some good ones haha
the biggest one is how did avdol even understand the writing on the wall he can't read japanese he's egyptian
[QUOTE=Maruhai;47793736]the biggest one is how did avdol even understand the writing on the wall he can't read japanese he's egyptian[/QUOTE]
it's not impossible for an egyptian to learn japanese, maybe he's secretly a massive weeaboo
also it's possible the message was actually in arabic but was just translated to japanese for the audience
[QUOTE=The Rizzler;47793712][sp]> How did Iggy make a clone of Dio without ever having seen him[/sp][/QUOTE]
joseph's been throwing those spirit photos left and right, plus the joestars have always been a wealthy family, so it's very likely that portraits of dio were painted back around the time of Part 1
[QUOTE=The Rizzler;47793712][sp]> Speaking of Stroheim, why does he have a sight on his machine gun on his abs, where it would do no good, and would be redundant when he has one as a monocle?[/sp][/QUOTE]
it's jojo, style is always more important than actual usefulness
[QUOTE=The Rizzler;47793712][sp]> Where did Joseph get a dress from in the middle of the desert?[/sp][/QUOTE]
joseph [sp]always has a dress ready. always.[/sp]
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