• DOOM - Campaign Trailer
    311 replies, posted
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;49682651]And this is another big thing too, for whatever reason they're very heavily focusing on the kill moves in all of the promotional material. While I totally think that it deserves to be shown off before the game launches, people like myself are already starting to get worn out when it comes to the system purely because they're pushing it so hard.[/QUOTE] At this point it's starting to be Terminator: Genisys. I seriously think the game would have been better if they had let the player discover the glory kill system on his/her own.
[QUOTE=RikohZX;49682646]Honestly, my big problem so far isn't with the game itself. From the Game Informer articles and the snippets of real gameplay we get, it looks and sounds fine to me. It's that the marketing team, whether in Id or at Bethesda as the publishers, can't get their heads out of their asses and keep trying to do this cinematic "look at how RIP AND TEAR we are guys!" horseshit. You'd get a lot more people over the fence if you showed some actual goddamn gameplay instead of the constant pacebreaker brutalities, and they have a bloody Snapmap system they could use to showcase fights just as well without spoiling Campaign content.[/QUOTE] I said this on another forum but I think the marketing comes down to the fact that they want this game to sell a lot. Doom 4's story seems behind the scenes so they aren't probably gonna push that in marketing (I'm guessing its D3-type audio logs and stuff probably). A level editor doesn't sell to mass market, exploration/puzzles/keycards don't sell to mass market, but [I]violence[/I] does. So they are probably doing this to play it safe with the marketing and draw a wide crowd in to nail down some sales that might not even be the target audience. I mean hell, look at Wolfenstein's marketing campaign too. Until we got the livestreams, 90% of the trailers we got were [I]story[/I] trailers. Rewatching them the amount of gameplay you see literally amounts to maybe a minute or two. Like Doom, we got most of our gameplay from e3, and then towards release for Wolf we got the livestreams - which they will hopefully do with Doom as well.
[QUOTE=27X;49682554]And you're completely absolutely wrong.[/QUOTE] Why do people even say this when it comes to subjective topics? How to be an uncool dude Step 1. Proclaim someones wrong before you even present the rest of your post.
[QUOTE]primary gripe with DOOM's handling of gore is that it's not to -any- effect[/QUOTE] Because it is. "I believe so strongly in my opinion it has to a be a fact" Except it's not, as the audience demonstrated during the first reveal with with half speed animation, which is why the time, money and manpower was spent in the first place. "Why is Rocky all beat up, all that blood is so tacky and they didn't need it." Yeah it's not there cause Sylvester Stalloone has a blood fetish, it's there to very clearly demonstrate in absolutely stark terms he just got the ungodly shit kicked out of him and still persevered, form and function alike.
[QUOTE=27X;49682973]Because it is. "I believe so strongly in my opinion it has to a be a fact" Except it's not, as the audience demonstrated during the first reveal with with half speed animation, which is why the time, money and manpower was spent in the first place. "Why is Rocky all beat up, all that blood is so tacky and they didn't need it." Yeah it's not there cause Sylvester Stalloone has a blood fetish, it's there to very clearly demonstrate in absolutely stark terms he just got the ungodly shit kicked out of him and still persevered, form and function alike.[/QUOTE] yeesh this again [editline]6th February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=J!NX;49682957]Why do people even say this when it comes to subjective topics? How to be an uncool dude Step 1. Proclaim someones wrong before you even present the rest of your post.[/QUOTE] 'i do this as a hobby so i am an authority on such matters' im pretty much ignoring his posts at this point cause that totally invalidated him in my eyes
[QUOTE=TornadoAP;49682638]In short, gore does have it's place in games, but the idea that throwing extreme amounts of it or making it the focus of a game is just stupid.[/QUOTE] You see, this is what I had a problem with in the first place. This is why I came out swinging so causticly with no filter, and will continue to do so whenever someone says shit like this in the future. This is a hell of an assertion you make here. Like, a fucking doozy. And as an opinion, it's just [I]lazy.[/I] I don't think you've considered that extreme amounts of gore [I]is[/I] what people take away from the franchise, and that the focus on it might be too. I don't think you've considered the fact that a lot of people think excessive gore to the point of stupidity is really really good. Would slasher films of the 80s have any clout if you had your way? Would I have Nightmare on Elm Street? Would I still have Planet Terror(not from that era but still)? Would I still have Evil Dead? Don't do this to me. It all ties back into the "Doom is ___" argument that you've tried to make. It's one that I've seen on the earlier Doom threads when this was first announced. Before there was even any footage [I]at all[/I] and all we had was first hand descriptions. Not even blurry screenshots. The descriptions of the game being slightly Brutal Doom-esque caused a shitshow that makes this look like a tea party. I think Marphy Black still has rebar lodged in his anus from that fateful day. It was a bunch of people arguing about what Doom always was or never was about. A bunch of people realizing for the first time, that the image they projected onto the ancient title, and the narrative and thematic blanks they filled in for those vague 16 bit visuals and abstract puzzle-like level design didn't match up with other people's perceptions. When the argument in this thread first calmed down, you yourself admitted you never really payed any attention to the extremely gory death animations when others have clearly made that aspect the one they remember the most fondly when they think of the game. If that isn't a textbook demonstration of the dissonance in perception people have with Doom, I have no idea what is. If your argument for or against a feature in this new DooM starts with "Doom was never/always about..." you don't have a fucking leg to stand on. Most will agree that Doom is a platform upon which most of modern gaming sits. I can only speak for myself, but I see it as a near featureless canvas that only steers perceptions without explicitly creating them. That's how these types of arguments can even happen. The moment you try to firmly state what does and doesn't belong is the moment you directly step on the toes and perceptions of someone else who has invested just as much, if not more, of their livelihood into this game. The argument isn't winnable. There is no consensus. It all boils down to this: [QUOTE=sirdownloadsalot;49681478]Doom was never about [BLANK] It was actually all about [BLANK] You would know if you were actually a real fan sweetie :)[/QUOTE] That guy nailed it. Fuck, just look at DooM's past. There were like 2 iterations before this one, each one thematically completely removed from the last. There was one which I only heard rumors of from friends of friends of ex Id people which was like a direct continuation of Doom 3 which was scrapped for a COD inspired guided military drama which was scrapped for this. The people making the game couldn't even decide what perception of Doom they wanted to portray. And then there's Doom 3 itself, which is a far cry from being a direct link to the first two games, while being no less dark and moody when compared to its contemporaries as Doom was to its contemporaries. Doom 3's darkness and greyness and horror focus didn't spring out of nowhere. The seeds were sown in the original titles. That dark, moody, and suspenseful atmosphere was certainly present in those original titles, but was it the focus? Most would probably say no, but others would disagree, and they'd have backup. It depends wholly on who you ask, and that's that. The only thing about this Doom that kinda makes me sad is that Danny Trejo was gonna be in that old COD iteration and he isn't in this one.
I am not necessarily disappointed in the art style, it looks cool for what it is I guess. It's better than Doom 3. And I could always just mute the music and play some Metallica or Pantera or Iron Maiden or whatever. but the gameplay just looks like it gets repetitive and boring, it looks watered down despite it having more features. in FPS games you ride a fine line between having variability in your game and having it being addictive, or being the same every time and boring as shit. id games pre-doom 3 used to be the master of that. Having a FPS game be so replayable, smooth and skill based, despite the genre being so simple as it is. I don't know, be as optimistic as you want towards this game, it may even be fun for the first 5 hours or whatever. But I have played Doom 1 and 2 for I would say close to 1000 hours or something like that, I am just talking vanilla doom 1/2 on a sourceport with different usermade maps and stuff like that. When you are making a doom game you really need to live up to that legacy because I am one out of tons of other people who put the same amount of time into that game. The gameplay never gets old to me, there is always some new strategy to think about when approaching new maps. I was just really really hoping for a new baseline of a game again to put so many hours into. But the fact that theres no true SDK just weakens that by a lot. I don't care about snapmap.
aside from the gore, why does it even have to go back to doom 1/2 style as if it's somehow like the set design? it felt like doom 3 was pushing the series forward and it became a pretty different, intense game nothing wrong with doom 1/2 but im pretty dissappointed they didnt continue where 3 left off as it's one of my favorite games. don't we have enough straight up run and gun stuff already?
Should ask that in the Doom thread in GGD as well, probably get some more answers.
[QUOTE=Xubs;49684162]I mean, yknow, Doom 1/2 ARE filled with gore and you can't really beat around that. I guess you could argue it's not "about" it, but the graphics don't lie. You can blow enemies to an indiscernible pile of bits with a rocket launcher blast, levels are strewn all over with hanging disemboweled corpses, entire walls and floors are made of flesh and some feature visible bloodstains. And not to mention there are entire sections of levels FILLED with pools of blood so deep they make shallow lakes and rivers of nothing but human blood. Like, you can't really beat around the fact that that's pretty fucking hardcore. Technological limitations simply didn't let them go farther but it's still pretty extreme for 1993. I bet you they would've had things like Quake-style projectile gibs if the technology was there, but it wasn't.[/QUOTE] It was there in III, you just have to enable it, which is changing two Booleans and setting a variable. Then you've got permanent brains, ribcages, blood, meat chunks, burnt bits, arms, legs, and other sundry stuff. What appears in IV is pretty much a natural extension of that under a current engine.
[QUOTE=Rofl_copter;49685380]aside from the gore, why does it even have to go back to doom 1/2 style as if it's somehow like the set design? it felt like doom 3 was pushing the series forward and it became a pretty different, intense game nothing wrong with doom 1/2 but im pretty dissappointed they didnt continue where 3 left off as it's one of my favorite games. don't we have enough straight up run and gun stuff already?[/QUOTE] Most of the singleplayer first person shooters these days are more like "run to cover and shoot pop up targets" and really run and gun where as this seems to fit that bill more. I wouldn't have minded a continuation of Doom 3 (and I'm surprised to see so many people who liked it in this thread, I thought I was one of the few who did) but this looks cool too. I just hope it can deliver.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;49686516]Most of the singleplayer first person shooters these days are more like "run to cover and shoot pop up targets" and really run and gun where as this seems to fit that bill more. I wouldn't have minded a continuation of Doom 3 (and I'm surprised to see so many people who liked it in this thread, I thought I was one of the few who did) but this looks cool too. I just hope it can deliver.[/QUOTE] I honestly thought d3 was superb. I absolutely respect that its not close to the originals, but it had it's own charm and pretty convincing view of the universe
[QUOTE=BenJammin';49685258] but the gameplay just looks like it gets repetitive and boring, it looks watered down despite it having more features. in FPS games you ride a fine line between having variability in your game and having it being addictive, or being the same every time and boring as shit.[/QUOTE] I don't get it. All we've seen so far is a bunch of promotional material, and a few scenes from that Conan video, how can you at this point with confidence say that the gameplay looks repetitive and boring?
[QUOTE=Doom64hunter;49688911]I don't get it. All we've seen so far is a bunch of promotional material, and a few scenes from that Conan video, how can you at this point with confidence say that the gameplay looks repetitive and boring?[/QUOTE] Because they show near identical footage every time. You're right, its too early to tell, but initial impressions are -critical- and what they've shown of is starting to turn away quite a few people I know, ontop of quite a decent few people here and on the reddit. the marketing for this game is very poorly handled
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;49689075]Because they show near identical footage every time. You're right, its too early to tell, but initial impressions are -critical- and what they've shown of is starting to turn away quite a few people I know, ontop of quite a decent few people here and on the reddit. the marketing for this game is very poorly handled[/QUOTE] Did you know that marketing usually ramps up in the months immediately prior to release? Its releasing in May, i dont think this is the last trailer, that'd be dumb on their part. Even then, repetitive and Doom walk a thin line together. Classic Doom can easily get repetitive, it all depends on the level design and monster placement.
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;49687906]I honestly thought d3 was superb. I absolutely respect that its not close to the originals, but it had it's own charm and pretty convincing view of the universe[/QUOTE] The enemy designs were hit and miss and the flashlight system got annoying really damn fast.
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;49689075]Because they show near identical footage every time. You're right, its too early to tell, but initial impressions are -critical- and what they've shown of is starting to turn away quite a few people I know, ontop of quite a decent few people here and on the reddit. the marketing for this game is very poorly handled[/QUOTE] They've showed us two trailers, and I don't know about you, but my biggest impression I've gotten from them is that they're willing to make changes based on critique. Notice how much more blatantly colorful everything is in this second trailer compared to the first. Notice how it looks a lot less meandering and slow (kill anims aside). I have my reservations about the game, but I think the devs are giving it an honest shot and I'd hate to be completely dismissive of it yet. I don't like the focus on glory kills in the trailer, but I can understand why they'd do that since it's a selling point and whatnot. Whether or not glory kills become a shitty addition all boils down to the implementation imo. They said melee killing dudes makes them drop hp+ammo, and if it's just a nice risk/reward bonus and you can go the entire game just gunning people down like classic doom than whatever, I don't think that's a problem at all and why not have it at that rate. If not killing enemies in melee is going to starve you of supplies and gimp your playthrough then I think it will be as bad as everyone fears.
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49689086]The enemy designs were hit and miss and the flashlight system got annoying really damn fast.[/QUOTE] see that's subjective. The Flashlight idea was obtuse, but aside from trites and the other little fuckers, I find all of the enemy designs to be pretty compelling. again, guys im not saying im giving up on this game but they've not shown any shift in focus from 'look at the kill moves' when they show off something else, I'll be more interested, but we've had a tonne of time where they've spat out a few different promotional materials (the original secret footage, a couple trailers, the conan gameplay [which was very small, but ID would have had plenty of say in what would be shown off and the only gameplay feature they -did- show off was ripping out the eye of a demon]) again, it's a problem with the marketing. First impressions are key, and there are plenty of people who are becoming disinterested purely because everything we're being shown is so samey. The old games did many things fantastically, but them being repetitive isn't a key feature. They need to stray from that hard. we just don't know a ton yet, but the shit they have shown off isn't really gripping people as much as some actual legitimate footage of something aside from 'look at the gore tho' [editline]7th February 2016[/editline] like again you guys don't need to talk down to me as if I don't know what Doom is about. we've all played a shitton of doom, its just that this new game is currently very hit or miss when it comes to its focus for some people. When we finally get some actual gameplay that isn't just an exhibition of melee kills with some staged/shit players (in reference to the conan skit) gunplay, i'm sure it'll start showing off its real chops.
Have you read everything Gameinformer released last month? Paints a different picture then what you see in the trailers.
Yeah ive been keeping up to date, but I care about -seeing- gameplay. Even a self isolated snapmap made exhibition would do wonders to sway people stuck on the fence
A good classic mode would be to center the viewmodels and cut the kill animations but i can only hope.
Would be neat if they remade e1m1. I doubt it though. Either way I am keeping tabs on this, seems like a good game so far.
[QUOTE=Zadrave;49690786]Would be neat if they remade e1m1. I doubt it though.[/QUOTE] Doesnt matter if they do or not, we'll be able to anyway. Imagine if thats the final level though. The 23 year long awaited return to E1M1. Original music and everything.
[QUOTE=Zadrave;49690786]Would be neat if they remade e1m1. I doubt it though. Either way I am keeping tabs on this, seems like a good game so far.[/QUOTE] If they did I doubt you would recognize it at this point. Going from basically blocks to extremely detailed hallways would be jarring. Unless you mean them actually taking e1m1 block for block as some kind of bonus easter egg.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;49690800]Doesnt matter if they do or not, we'll be able to anyway. Imagine if thats the final level though. The 23 year long awaited return to E1M1. Original music and everything.[/QUOTE] Honestly' it'd be cool but really short, E1M1 is a tiny map :v:
Im certain we'll get something ala the TNO dream sequences alongside some kind of remake, whether its in campaign or via SnapMap
E1M1 is too iconic to ignore. The theme itself is included in the games theme, you could hear it back at E3.
Maybe it will be like a small section of the first level
If it's not in the game, someone is going to remake it in snapmap. Guaranteed.
[QUOTE=The_J_Hat;49691097]If it's not in the game, someone is going to remake it in snapmap. Guaranteed.[/QUOTE] I fully expect an entire remake of doom in Snapmap
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.