Depression, anxiety, suicidalism and similar disorders, issues and troubles V4 - Discussion, help an - General

I channeled all of my anxiety and bad vibes recently into mashing up Big Data and Moskau. [url=https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/965202/WIP%20Music/BitBlasted4%20WIP.mp3]I'm not even joking[/url]. I've been taking a break from life today by working on music and stuff, and sometimes I take a break from making music by making stupid music.

So because some incompetent fuck in my house decided to remove my fishing rods from my room and throw them into a pile, I just found out my favorite fly rod is broken. YAY. Oh and before anyone says, "It's just a flyrod" yes. It is just a fly rod.... A fly rod which costed me $200 and I used to switch out between spinner reel and fly reels for different types of fishing.

what do people think about the right to die? to receive professional help to commit suicide? there's a somewhat big thing in the news here in Norway about a woman in her early 30s who has spent the last 2 years in belts with 24/7 surveillance. she has been in the forced psychiatric system for even longer, 10 years I believe? the people working there even say themselves that the goal to begin with was to, obviously, help her to the point where she could go back home. now the goal is to ensure she has as many good days as possible in the hospital. it seems like she has gone so far down the hole that it's not possible to get back up, her only wish is to die. I found it pretty difficult to read the article. tears tried to push on several times, sounds like such a horrible life to live. imagine being strapped and immobilized 24/7 to ensure you don't kill yourself. can't even shower on your own, can't even sleep alone, no privacy at all. the hospital, from what I could gather, has pretty much given up on helping her. the only goal is to keep her alive. when it gets to this point, I think the person should be given the right to die. whats the point of living a life like this? it sounds like torture.

[QUOTE=PredGD;49925539]what do people think about the right to die? to receive professional help to commit suicide? there's a somewhat big thing in the news here in Norway about a woman in her early 30s who has spent the last 2 years in belts with 24/7 surveillance. she has been in the forced psychiatric system for even longer, 10 years I believe? the people working there even say themselves that the goal to begin with was to, obviously, help her to the point where she could go back home. now the goal is to ensure she has as many good days as possible in the hospital. it seems like she has gone so far down the hole that it's not possible to get back up, her only wish is to die. I found it pretty difficult to read the article. tears tried to push on several times, sounds like such a horrible life to live. imagine being strapped and immobilized 24/7 to ensure you don't kill yourself. can't even shower on your own, can't even sleep alone, no privacy at all. the hospital, from what I could gather, has pretty much given up on helping her. the only goal is to keep her alive. when it gets to this point, I think the person should be given the right to die. whats the point of living a life like this? it sounds like torture.[/QUOTE] There is no inherent value to life from the get-go. That's something I wish more people would understand. No one has the right to force you to do anything outside of what's provided in law, and then even that in itself is debatable with laywers and courts. Really, what matters and doesn't is up to each one of us individually, and each other's opinions matter as much as we let it. The right to take away our own life if we determine it to be meaningless and full of pain is something that we should be allowed to do. It's a dark corner of the room that no one likes to look at, but it's there. And it's an immense power to have and something that should be exercised in only the worst of situations. If I was locked in someone's basement with no foreseeable way out and immense amounts of torture, I would take my life. If you remove the basement out of the equation but leave the torture in the forum of some debilitating disease, I see no difference. And, in the fear that I could 100% never get better with some mentally destroying disease i.e. a severe case of Alzheimer's, I'd want to be gone. I don't see anything wrong with that. The problem is when the problems [I]are[/I] fixable. If things can be fixed, you should try to fix them instead of run away from them. But it's not fair to expect someone to "fix" the last stages of cancer even if it's technically possible.

[QUOTE=PredGD;49925539]what do people think about the right to die? to receive professional help to commit suicide? there's a somewhat big thing in the news here in Norway about a woman in her early 30s who has spent the last 2 years in belts with 24/7 surveillance. she has been in the forced psychiatric system for even longer, 10 years I believe? the people working there even say themselves that the goal to begin with was to, obviously, help her to the point where she could go back home. now the goal is to ensure she has as many good days as possible in the hospital. it seems like she has gone so far down the hole that it's not possible to get back up, her only wish is to die. I found it pretty difficult to read the article. tears tried to push on several times, sounds like such a horrible life to live. imagine being strapped and immobilized 24/7 to ensure you don't kill yourself. can't even shower on your own, can't even sleep alone, no privacy at all. the hospital, from what I could gather, has pretty much given up on helping her. the only goal is to keep her alive. when it gets to this point, I think the person should be given the right to die. whats the point of living a life like this? it sounds like torture.[/QUOTE] It's a question I ask myself daily with my current mental health problems. If you come to a point in life where the burden of life is a burden on all of those around you, why bother living? Some people may ask that question before hurting themselves, but I'm unsure if life would be worth living if you were a psychological mess, and you feel no point in going on as nothing more then a doctor's favorite shoebox rat.

Well, are your psychological problems inescapable? Is there no getting better? Is it terminal? Note: I'm asking literally, and not emotionally. I understand when it [I]feels[/I] like there's no hope, but feeling is different from knowledge. Have you tried everything in the book? How many times? How much effort did you put into it? Have you asked around? Have you asked for help? Depression often provides the delusion of doing something, when in reality the depressed haven't done anything. They feel like they've tried to be better, but they haven't done anything. Or maybe they have - maybe they tried some pills that didn't work, and because it takes an effort to do something like that, they feel like they've tried everything. There's so much more. Even with therapy alone, there's so many different kinds of therapy. There's so many different ways that people have gotten better, and there's no way someone has done it all. The problem really is motivation. Not having motivation =/= tried everything. Not having motivation = fixable. The cold, hard truth is that suicide and depression is quite often the escape from having to do something. It's better to stay victim to your own inertia because change, even for the better, is hard. Eating better and quitting smoking is hard. We're more willing to sit in the water starting to boil. I've honestly yet to see someone who is so depressed that a doctor is willing to give up on them and say "you're permanently depressed". Even if one doctor can't help, they might refer you to someone else, or at worst say, "I don't know what's wrong." But they're not going to say, "You're fucked!" Psychology is such a weird thing to delve into that it's hard to really provide a one-size-fits-all cure for everyone, so a doctor would have to be incredibly stupid to suggest such a thing. On the other hand, it's fair for a doctor to say that the chances are slim to ever recover from brain tumors. With that said, I'm not accusing anyone in here of being lazy, or at least not purposefully lazy. Depression eats away at your will power. It's kind of like its own cancer of thoughts. It slowly consumes you. It is escapable, though. It requires wit, exploration, and some self-comfort to outsmart the shittiness, and you only get better with practice and making a stronger effort to think nicer and not freak out if you're feeling things.

I've been stuck in this shitty state for a few days now, anything that happens to me and every thought I have fucks me up hard and anybody's reassurance just makes me angry and lash out at them I don't know what I can fucking do, there's no way up from this [editline]13th March 2016[/editline] I feel a very strong need to get drunk but I ran out of alcohol, I don't know any other way to escape [editline]13th March 2016[/editline] I don't see any fucking point in remaining alive

[QUOTE=AtomicSans;49926217]I've been stuck in this shitty state for a few days now, anything that happens to me and every thought I have fucks me up hard and anybody's reassurance just makes me angry and lash out at them I don't know what I can fucking do, there's no way up from this [editline]13th March 2016[/editline] I feel a very strong need to get drunk but I ran out of alcohol, I don't know any other way to escape[/QUOTE] I've been wondering about whether or not some people end up depressed in a way that allows them to blindly ignore the fact that things could get better, because it ends up meaning that there's that uncertain possibility that they can put in some work in fixing themselves. The uncertainty of whether or not things will pay off creates anxiety that they don't want and requires energy - two things they don't want, so they just opt into believing that nothing could ever be better. Since you don't want reassurance, I'll just tell you that you will forever fail at life until you realize that you don't have to. You should become comfortable enough with failure to accept that you [I]can[/I] fail but won't necessarily fail. Failure and success are your decision, anyway. You can define your own personal barometer of success and failure. By many people's barometers, I'm a failure, but by my own I'm doing alright. Nothing's stopping you from being forgettable, awful, intolerable, miserable, offensive, and a moronic miscreant. And that's the best part about life: you have a lot of freedom, and everything is subjective. There's no objectively best way to live life and there is no "good". If you just want to stay home and play video games all day, you totally can. If you want to chase after girls as a chick magnet named Mr. Fucking, you can do that. If you want to research and fight against AIDS, you can do that. No one is stopping you. There might be people who try, but you can persevere and live your life however you want to, and only your opinion matters. And that's why it is important to change how you think, because right now you think of yourself as a loser, and that means you are. But you don't have to be a loser, friend. I'm not reassuring you that you will get better. That's ultimately up to you.

You're 17, you're drinking yourself to sleep most nights. Stop that. You're 17. You have your whole life ahead of you and honestly, not getting into a college isn't the end of the world. You have so many chances and opportunities that will come up. There's so many other ways to go about things at that age because things can still work out. When you get closer to being 30, it's a lot different but at 17 you have so many chances to figure it out.

[QUOTE=wauterboi;49926723]I've been wondering about whether or not some people end up depressed in a way that allows them to blindly ignore the fact that things could get better, because it ends up meaning that there's that uncertain possibility that they can put in some work in fixing themselves. The uncertainty of whether or not things will pay off creates anxiety that they don't want and requires energy - two things they don't want, so they just opt into believing that nothing could ever be better.[/QUOTE]You're very right, this describes me well. I feel like depression has killed my ability to get better, and I'm not sure if it's true but it doesn't feel good. It feeds into itself. [editline]13th March 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49926797]You're 17, you're drinking yourself to sleep most nights. Stop that.[/QUOTE]Don't know any other way to go to sleep in a tolerable mood. I wake up in the same mood I go to sleep in. So drinking really does help. I just hope I won't need to for too much longer, I don't want it to become a real problem.

Being dependent on alcohol makes you an alcoholic.

it's not like it's every night, just the really bad ones

[QUOTE=AtomicSans;49926958]You're very right, this describes me well. I feel like depression has killed my ability to get better, and I'm not sure if it's true but it doesn't feel good. It feeds into itself.[/QUOTE] A cycle like that is common with this kind of thing, but it's a cycle you can break out of if you recognise the problem - and the foresight to act on it, however small, is invaluable and the sooner the better. And echoing the two above me, drinking yourself to sleep, even irregularly, isn't something you should be doing, especially at 17.

[QUOTE=AtomicSans;49927002]it's not like it's every night, just the really bad ones[/QUOTE] I had an opposite reaction to booze. I've only been buzzed, but only in that buzz is my brain silent. It might inspire some to stay buzzed or get drunk but I have found myself bothered by being buzzed. I don't want that. I don't need it either. It's like choosing whether or not I want to feel pain, or whether or not I'd want to go back and change the past: I don't want or need to do so. All of these things make me who I am.

I ask my buddy if she wants to hang out one of these days I got off work and she says yea. I go to ask her about it today since I had today off and it turns out she either blocked me or deactivated her account. Bummer. I keep bugging people and it drives them away. I did it once before with another chick and that shit sucks.

[QUOTE=Pascall;49926981]Being dependent on alcohol makes you an alcoholic.[/QUOTE]my life isn't being affected in any adverse way, I think I'm fine

Sans, take it from the guy who has been addicted to just about everything in the book. The fact you are taking it to deal with the bad days, usually means you are already addicted to the vice.

Shit... I don't know how else I can deal with the bad days though, I have to deal with them somehow...

[QUOTE=AtomicSans;49927483]Shit... I don't know how else I can deal with the bad days though, I have to deal with them somehow...[/QUOTE] I know religion isn't a lot of people's cup of tea on this forum, but have you considered going down to see the local priest every now and then? Some of them can be quite empathizing if you explain your situation, even if you don't believe. If you are patient with them they will be patient with you. Most of the time they don't charge for consultation like that. Basically just a person to listen to you and receive advice from.

[QUOTE=Zenreon117;49927824]I know religion isn't a lot of people's cup of tea on this forum, but have you considered going down to see the local priest every now and then? Some of them can be quite empathizing if you explain your situation, even if you don't believe. If you are patient with them they will be patient with you. Most of the time they don't charge for consultation like that. Basically just a person to listen to you and receive advice from.[/QUOTE]I already have a therapist that sort of fills that role. Where I live, religious types tend to be whackjobs, too. What I mean is that, in the moment when I'm feeling unbearably bad, I don't have any options other than ride it out or drink it away. And drinking is so much faster and more effective and pleasant. I don't know anything else.

I'm depressed because I don't have friends, I don't have any friends because I'm depressed... repeat for 8 years (and it's not because I have social anxiety, I'm extroverted as frick I hate being alone)

[QUOTE=AtomicSans;49927483]Shit... I don't know how else I can deal with the bad days though, I have to deal with them somehow...[/QUOTE] It depends on why they're shitty. Care to explain a little? Also, everyone already knows my stance on religion, but if you're gonna go through with that, just make sure you aren't somebody else's pawn. My cousin was almost convinced to go on a huge Mormon mission for no other reason other than the church convinced him to. Stuff like that can take advantage of the desperate while also teaching them nothing more than "put your faith in God". Some good can come from religion but there's so many tradeoffs to be wary about for the sake of self-preservation.

[QUOTE=wauterboi;49928931]It depends on why they're shitty. Care to explain a little? Also, everyone already knows my stance on religion, but if you're gonna go through with that, just make sure you aren't somebody else's pawn. My cousin was almost convinced to go on a huge Mormon mission for no other reason other than the church convinced him to. Stuff like that can take advantage of the desperate while also teaching them nothing more than "put your faith in God". Some good can come from religion but there's so many tradeoffs to be wary about for the sake of self-preservation.[/QUOTE]I just have days where I hate myself, I hate everything, I feel like shit, I can't get anything done, and I'm incredibly anxious. I'm just paralyzed and trapped.

[QUOTE=AtomicSans;49929017]I just have days where I hate myself, I hate everything, I feel like shit, I can't get anything done, and I'm incredibly anxious. I'm just paralyzed and trapped.[/QUOTE] I think you're at the point where you should definitely muster up the courage to ask anyone - even your school counselor - for help. You have a therapist so you could and should mention that you've been drinking. From there you can get referrals or further help.

I don't think that's really necessary to be honest

better to do it sooner rather than later when it becomes too much of a problem in your life

Dunno if this goes here but... why are we afraid of death, really? I don't understand what's so inherently scary about it. Like, yeah, you stop living, but there's no proof that there's an afterlife or something worse than just not existing anymore. We've all experienced not being alive before, namely before we were born. Is there a philosophy thread or something? :v:

[QUOTE=fear me;49930028]Dunno if this goes here but... why are we afraid of death, really? I don't understand what's so inherently scary about it. Like, yeah, you stop living, but there's no proof that there's an afterlife or something worse than just not existing anymore. We've all experienced not being alive before, namely before we were born. Is there a philosophy thread or something? :v:[/QUOTE] People are scared of nothingness. Like is there anything afterwards? Do you just not exist? Are we conscious for anything afterwards? Is there a ghostland? Limbo? Heaven? Hell? People are afraid of the unknown because they don't know what it is. People that aren't afraid of death. Are suicidal. Fear of death is what keeps us alive.

[QUOTE=fear me;49930028]Dunno if this goes here but... why are we afraid of death, really? I don't understand what's so inherently scary about it. Like, yeah, you stop living, but there's no proof that there's an afterlife or something worse than just not existing anymore. We've all experienced not being alive before, namely before we were born. Is there a philosophy thread or something? :v:[/QUOTE] we're afraid of death because in terms of what we know, life is all that is, we're afraid of losing all that we hold dear; our loved ones, our reputations, our knowledge, our memories, our possessions, our identies most importantly, what we believe to be 'our selves', what we fear is that the experience which we identify with might completely disappear, and that we'd be left with 'nothing', which is ironic, because nothing is an impossibility, there must be something for there to be any form of experience, for there to be truly 'nothing', there'd be no experience, and in that sense, death doesn't matter because it cannot be experienced I'm afraid of dying in the sense that I can't comprehend 'nothingness', but that only gives me more reason to live it up while I can, and at the same time... in the end, it won't matter, only the next conscious experience, whatever the hell that is, will be what matters after I, or you, or whatever, dies. but because I fear dying, I fear living it up, I fear that pushing the boundaries, or whatever, will lead to losing all that I hold onto the ultimate irony, no?

[QUOTE=elasticity;49929516]better to do it sooner rather than later when it becomes too much of a problem in your life[/QUOTE] It already seems to be a problem. He's trying to justify it like an addicted person would. "I only drink it when I'm depressed. I'm more fun and happy when I drink anyway, so what's the problem? Also, I've been drinking a ton as of late." The fact of the matter is drinking, let alone repeatedly drinking, to escape problems in real life is never a good sign. [editline]14th March 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=elasticity;49930173]we're afraid of death because in terms of what we know, life is all that is, we're afraid of losing all that we hold dear; our loved ones, our reputations, our knowledge, our memories, our possessions, our identies most importantly, what we believe to be 'our selves', what we fear is that the experience which we identify with might completely disappear, and that we'd be left with 'nothing', which is ironic, because nothing is an impossibility, there must be something for there to be any form of experience, for there to be truly 'nothing', there'd be no experience, and in that sense, death doesn't matter because it cannot be experienced I'm afraid of dying in the sense that I can't comprehend 'nothingness', but that only gives me more reason to live it up while I can, and at the same time... in the end, it won't matter, only the next conscious experience, whatever the hell that is, will be what matters after I, or you, or whatever, dies. but because I fear dying, I fear living it up, I fear that pushing the boundaries, or whatever, will lead to losing all that I hold onto the ultimate irony, no?[/QUOTE] Why do you have to understand the semantics of death and nothingness to live your life? It's because there is nothing after I die and the looming time limit that I've learned to be happy and appreciate my experiences. It also makes life more precious and energy worth too much to waste on awful people. Whenever I think of death I think of the time I was put under for surgery to treat my appendicitis. The anesthesiologist told me, "I'm going to count back from 10, now." I never heard the numbers. When I woke up, it felt like no time ever passed, and I was severely confused as the ceiling was moving - I was being moved back to my room. I didn't feel like I was operated on. I seriously asked the nurse if they were joking with me, and the nurse smiled and said, "We don't have time to joke with you." That senselessness where you can't even feel time is probably what I would associate the most with death. And it's awesome. It's like someone booting me, the metaphorical computer, down, and putting it away into storage. Except they put me into storage, never to be turned on again. But I wouldn't be able to care. I wouldn't be able to feel. I would neither feel happy or hurt. I wouldn't even feel indifferent. I just feel nothing. And that's not the worst thing I could imagine for death. Some people cope with death by imagining heaven or hell, which depresses me far more than the concept of nothingness. While there's a beauty I can see with every man and woman, good or bad, all throughout history facing the same fate, heaven and hell teaches me that no matter what I do, I will always be without some of the people I love in my life. Heaven is a purgatory where you find your friends burning in hell, probably for Atheism, or being good but sinners nonetheless. It's where you find the people who were addicted. The ultimate judgement is the ultimate rejection, and I'd rather reject God and burn in hell for God is an awful being to subject me to separation.