[QUOTE]He's spreading the cancer to every game he plays.
The community he build around him knows they can do that.
He built his community around people donating to play terrible songs and racist text-to-speech whilst spamming nonsense in chat. So it makes sense this would happen to him in a game with voice chat.
Welp, kinda his own fault for never limiting his community. I'm actually impressed he is able to handle that so well
Not limiting? He actively fostered that kind of community. He has no one to blame but himself.
Forsen is doing gods work keeping the cancer in his channel.
This is Forsen's shtick.[/QUOTE]
Here's some of the comments on r/livestreamfail
This isn't about streamsniping problem in PUBG, this is how Forsen's channel is like ALL THE TIME, no matter what games he's playing.
Meanwhile, when the Star Citizen devs released Alpha 2.0 to public testing, they sat there waiting for the players to download the big patch and connect, and when [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_qAtqm4XUI"]a popular community streamer connected, QA devs connected to his instance, followed him to the space station that's a dedicated fps combat area, and stalked him via stream sniping.[/URL] :v:
Of course, it's one thing to stream-snipe people who will be able to take the joke in a consequence-free alpha test in literally the first 20 minutes of the test, and quite another to stream-snipe in normal matches of a released game.
[QUOTE=Gwoodman;52648390]Here's some of the comments on r/livestreamfail
This isn't about streamsniping problem in PUBG, this is how Forsen's channel is like ALL THE TIME, no matter what games he's playing.[/QUOTE]
This is a complete non-sequiter. Yes, forsen's stream is garbage.
But he's not the only one that gets sniped. Hell, the bans that set the PUBG community ablaze had nothing to do with forsen, but were mostly about a couple other dudes like summit.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;52648379]I'm unsure if I remember any game banning for it before PUBG, could you let me know if I'm wrong? The last time it was significant to me was when it was rampart in the DayZ streaming community and no one really cared then, when the stakes were much higher.[/QUOTE]
streamers bitched about it a lot. The devs didn't really care though because. well. they were the DayZ devs.
[quote]It's hard to define it as griefing, you'd have to define the experience of streaming a game to thousands of people as the baseline, average gaming experience. Is it really your standard form of griefing when it's not to a player, but to an entertainer?
Isn't that more like heckling? I can understand banning people for impacting the average player experience, as that [I]is[/I] the literal experience the game is intended to give. Streamers though? Eh...[/quote]
[quote]A griefer is a player in a multiplayer video game who deliberately irritates and angers other players within the game, using aspects of the game in unintended ways.[/quote]
Pretty much is like that. Accessing information you aren't supposed to have, along with specifically targeting and fucking with specific people.
And as the bans show, they do intend streaming to be an officially supported medium.
tbh I think a major point of disagreement in this debate is whether or not you can truly call streamers 'average players', and if going out if your way to account for 1% of your playerbase is really a good idea.
i mean think about it, you're playing your game, minding your own business, someone starts fucking with you to irritate you. fuck yeah, ban them, they're intruding in on how you're meant to play the game.
stream snipers though? you're playing your game, broadcasting to thousands, one of those thousands starts fucking with you to irritate you? they're intruding on the [I]streaming[/I] experience. i feel that's the fundamental difference and it's why i'll never be able to take the 'issue' of stream sniping seriously.
it's one side being dicks and the other side not knowing when to laugh, add a delay and move on.
[editline]5th September 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;52648414]
And as the bans show, they do intend streaming to be an officially supported medium.[/QUOTE]
and the playerbase is disagreeing with that notion, loudly. guess we'll just have to see which one pays out over the long run - the people who pay money to play your game, or the people who make money playing your game.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;52648419]tbh I think a major point of disagreement in this debate is whether or not you can truly call streamers 'average players', and if going out if your way to account for 1% of your playerbase is really a good idea.
i mean think about it, you're playing your game, minding your own business, someone starts fucking with you to irritate you. fuck yeah, ban them, they're intruding in on how you're meant to play the game.
stream snipers though? you're playing your game, broadcasting to thousands, one of those thousands starts fucking with you to irritate you? they're intruding on the [I]streaming[/I] experience. i feel that's the fundamental difference and it's why i'll never be able to take the 'issue' of stream sniping seriously.
it's one side being dicks and the other side not knowing when to laugh, add a delay and move on.
[/QUOTE] But as other examples like live poker, competitive gaming, etc. show. Livestreaming isn't an excuse to access information you aren't supposed to have.
In this case, they ARE making streaming an officially supported and protected thing.
Also adding a delay doesn't work, unless it's a delay so long that there is no longer a point to the "live" part.
[quote]
and the playerbase is disagreeing with that notion, loudly. guess we'll just have to see which one pays out over the long run - the people who pay money to play your game or the people who make money playing your game.[/quote]Most players don't seem to really care anymore based on the subreddit.
Also "people who make money playing your game."
Streamers bring a lot of revenue to games too by introducing people to them. Them being so good at doing that effectively killed gmod, and they'll even be paid tons of money directly by companies to stream their games.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;52648419]tbh I think a major point of disagreement in this debate is whether or not you can truly call streamers 'average players', and if going out if your way to account for 1% of your playerbase is really a good idea.
i mean think about it, you're playing your game, minding your own business, someone starts fucking with you to irritate you. fuck yeah, ban them, they're intruding in on how you're meant to play the game.
stream snipers though? you're playing your game, broadcasting to thousands, one of those thousands starts fucking with you to irritate you? they're intruding on the [I]streaming[/I] experience. i feel that's the fundamental difference and it's why i'll never be able to take the 'issue' of stream sniping seriously.
it's one side being dicks and the other side not knowing when to laugh, add a delay and move on.
[editline]5th September 2017[/editline]
and the playerbase is disagreeing with that notion, loudly. guess we'll just have to see which one pays out over the long one - the people who pay money to play your game or the people who make money playing your game.[/QUOTE]
Accounting for that 1% does not discount the other 99%, only the portion of that 99% that are stream snipers. And between the two, streamers are less a problem than stream snipers. Streaming is itself innocuous towards gameplay, where as stream sniping actively harms gameplay. Further, stream snipers are the ones explicitly using something not provided by the game to gain an unfair advantage, which is explicitly cheating.
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;52648414]This is a complete non-sequiter.[/QUOTE]
It's not. The video is about critikal talking about streamsnipers in Forsen's PUBG stream, not knowing that this is what it's supposed to be like for his channel every time.
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;52648431]But as other examples like live poker, competitive gaming, etc. show. Livestreaming isn't an excuse to access information you aren't supposed to have.
In this case, they ARE making streaming an officially supported and protected thing.
Also adding a delay doesn't work, unless it's a delay so long that there is no longer a point to the "live" part.[/QUOTE]
when people play live poker, they're not broadcasting their information to other potential players and opponents. if they were, it wouldn't be up to the other players to ignore that information, it'd be up to the poker player to stop broadcasting the information. same goes for competitive gaming/e-sports. players don't broadcast their screen to the enemy team and hope the enemy team doesn't look.
Again, we'll just have to see how much the playerbase is going support the idea of this game being made for streamers, there seems to be a vocal few who are against it from the get-go.
[editline]5th September 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;52648434] And between the two, streamers are less a problem than stream snipers. Streaming is itself innocuous towards gameplay, where as stream sniping actively harms gameplay. [/QUOTE]
Stream sniping actively harms streaming, not gameplay. The streamer can turn off the stream at any time and play the game 100% as intended, no stream sniping.
Again, I think this comes down to an idea we're both disagreeing with. I believe, inherently, streaming takes you away from the standard gameplay experience. When you're broadcasting live to thousands of potential opponents, it's silly to complain about someone taking advantage. When those streamers want to play the game normally, they can, any time.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;52648442]when people play live poker, they're not broadcasting their information to other potential players and opponents. if they were, it wouldn't be up to the other players to ignore that information, it'd be up to the poker player to stop broadcasting the information. same goes for competitive gaming/e-sports. players don't broadcast their screen to the enemy team and hope the enemy team doesn't look.
Again, we'll just have to see how much the playerbase is going support the idea of this game being made for streamers, there seems to be a vocal few who are against it from the get-go.[/QUOTE]
But they do?
People cheat in those things, you know. It's the exact same case here. You get punished if you attempt to access information you aren't supposed to have.
"This game being made for streamers" it's not some manichaen streamers vs. normal people. Games can support both.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;52648442]when people play live poker, they're not broadcasting their information to other potential players and opponents. if they were, it wouldn't be up to the other players to ignore that information, it'd be up to the poker player to stop broadcasting the information. same goes for competitive gaming/e-sports. players don't broadcast their screen to the enemy team and hope the enemy team doesn't look.
Again, we'll just have to see how much the playerbase is going support the idea of this game being made for streamers, there seems to be a vocal few who are against it from the get-go.[/QUOTE]
Except there can easily be people in the audience using that information to aid a player. Its just a little harder, but its still entirely the fault of the person cheating. You blame the person taking advantage of something they're not supposed to be doing, something not part of the game itself. It doesn't matter if the one who put that information up is the player, you don't get to break rules just because you can or because someone else gives you the opening to.
Also, this dumbshit "LOLMADEFORSTREAMERS!" trash meme needs to die. Taking streamers in to account is not making the game for streamers.
[QUOTE=Gwoodman;52648436]It's not. The video is about critikal talking about streamsnipers in Forsen's PUBG stream, not knowing that this is what it's supposed to be like for his channel every time.[/QUOTE]
I mean it seemed like you were attempting to say that sniping isn't really much of a problem with your comparisons to Lirik.
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;52648452]But they do?
People cheat in these things, you know. It's the exact same case here. You get punished if you attempt to access information you aren't supposed to have.
"This game being made for streamers" it's not some manichaen streamers vs. normal people.[/QUOTE]
In order to cheat, poker players need to go out of their way to peak over and look at their opponents hands. It's not as easy as bringing up their phone and accessing a live feed footage of another's hand, and again, if it [I]was,[/I] it wouldn't be up to the tournament host to prevent the idiot from streaming that information.
Comparing poker tournaments to casual-play video games is silly anyway. Apples to oranges, and all that. Comparing any sort of tournament to any sort of casual play is silly. The streamers are streaming their moves to the entirety of their potential opponents. It's in no way comparable to a tournament, and in any context other than a tournament, it'd be absolutely up to the individual to not broadcast their moves and strategies.
I never said there's some normal people vs streamers drama going on, but since PUBG has started banning for stream sniping there [I]has[/I] been a vocal outrage from people who don't care about streaming, and will not want to see the game officially support it as viable as regular play. All I'm saying is that as time goes on, we're going to see which side wins out.
[editline]5th September 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;52648461]
Also, this dumbshit "LOLMADEFORSTREAMERS!" trash meme needs to die. Taking streamers in to account is not making the game for streamers.[/QUOTE]
No one is saying that - calm down. I'm not literally proposing that the game's intended market is streamers. As you said, taking streamers into account is not the same as making the game for streamers. Some people don't think it's worthwhile to do either, and I would generally agree. Leave stream maintenance to the streamer.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;52648472]In order to cheat, poker players need to go out of their way to peak over and look at their opponents hands. It's not as easy as bringing up their phone and accessing a live feed footage of another's hand, and again, if it [I]was,[/I] it wouldn't be up to the tournament host to prevent the idiot from streaming that information.
Comparing poker tournaments to casual-play video games is silly anyway. Apples to oranges, and all that. Comparing any sort of tournament to any sort of casual play is silly. The streamers are streaming their moves to the entirety of their potential opponents. It's in no way comparable to a tournament, and in any context other than a tournament, it'd be absolutely up to the individual to not broadcast their moves and strategies.
I never said there's some normal people vs streamers drama going on, but since PUBG has started banning for stream sniping there [I]has[/I] been a vocal outrage from people who don't care about streaming, and will not want to see the game officially support it as viable as regular play. Because it never will be, no matter how much streamers want it to be.[/QUOTE]
Or they communicate or collude with the audience, and people otherwise outside of the game.
Likewise in many games this is a big problem with ghosting. Both in tournament, and out of tournament.
Tournaments are harder to cheat in and the severity is much higher, but something doesn't necessarily become okay outside of that setting.
I've said it before, but somebody should make an open world multiplayer game like this with a bounty hunting mechanic. There's actually an interesting gameplay idea in stream sniping, it's just that it's y'know, basically cheating here.
You can tell just how many people (including critikal) are new to forsen in their response to this, this is literally the draw to his stream. He's been doing crazy songrequest stuff, not inhibiting his chat whatsoever, etc. for years. This is nothing new and he actively encourages it.
[QUOTE=Simplemac3;52648670]I've said it before, but somebody should make an open world multiplayer game like this with a bounty hunting mechanic. There's actually an interesting gameplay idea in stream sniping, it's just that it's y'know, basically cheating here.[/QUOTE]
Star wars galaxies used to have a bounty hunting mechanic like that. Becoming a jedi was a massive pain in the ass, and if you used your force abilities in public you'd wind up on a list that bounty hunter players can use to try to kill you.
[QUOTE=Duck M.;52648724]You can tell just how many people (including critikal) are new to forsen in their response to this, this is literally the draw to his stream. He's been doing crazy songrequest stuff, not inhibiting his chat whatsoever, etc. for years. This is nothing new and he actively encourages it.[/QUOTE]
The fact it can happen on such a scale though is the problem. Not every streamer that has to deal with this is encouraging it.
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;52648216]Destiny, when playing rust, once made a new steam account with an anonymous and hidden name to try to avoid sniping in that game, and it took only 30 minutes for people to find the server he was playing on and identifying him, based off the fucking server weather, and this was when rust was super popular.
So nah, you can't really avoid it. For forsen it's also going to be a LOT of people trying it at once.
They can try sticking on a massive delay, or hide the game for a few minutes after it ends while queueing at an unknown time during that, but IIRC they don't really work and they make your stream much worse.[/QUOTE]
Forsen obviously takes no effort to prevent it despite all of his options. Put two and two together and it's fairly clear that he lets it happen intentionally for publicity. For example I would never have even heard of him without this video.
What's worse is that the developer goes straight to banning stream snipers before taking any action to prevent it. Implementing a streamer mode is fairly trivial but he chooses not to. Why?
[QUOTE=Talishmar;52649285]Forsen obviously takes no effort to prevent it despite all of his options. Put two and two together and it's fairly clear that he lets it happen intentionally for publicity. For example I would never have even heard of him without this video.
What's worse is that the developer goes straight to banning stream snipers before taking any action to prevent it. Implementing a streamer mode is fairly trivial but he chooses not to. Why?[/QUOTE]
Whether or not there is a streamer mode is irrelevant to banning people for cheating.
[QUOTE=Talishmar;52649285]Forsen obviously takes no effort to prevent it despite all of his options. Put two and two together and it's fairly clear that he lets it happen intentionally for publicity. For example I would never have even heard of him without this video.
What's worse is that the developer goes straight to banning stream snipers before taking any action to prevent it. Implementing a streamer mode is fairly trivial but he chooses not to. Why?[/QUOTE]
I mean yeah for forsen, that is true. The developers probably should ignore forsen because he actively encourages it. Forsen has been around for years, and even as a hearthstone streamer his fanbase pretty much was in a symbiotic relationship with him of fucking with him.
Streamer mode doesn't entirely work. It raises the difficulty a little bit without hurting the stream, but that's mostly what it accomplishes.
That in combination with the bans would be pretty effective though. Streamer mode helps keep otherwise decent people decent. That dedicated lot who constantly quit and requeue, use tools, etc. to get into the game will still exist, but that behavior will be relatively easy for the developer to log and use as evidence to ban them if they get reported.
Watching Forsen now, yeah it's pretty bad, but he managed to get chicken dinner one game after killing his snipers.
[QUOTE=TheTalon;52648217]I still think it's stupid to put the blame on the people spamming mic and stream sniping and not the people who broadcast their position in real time to everybody
Just delay your stream, You have 4500 people watching you, you're not going to read a damn thing anyway[/QUOTE]
I hate this argument because it just screams ignorance of Twitch as a platform. Please explain how to delay your stream for me.
[QUOTE=TreasoN.avi;52651339]I hate this argument because it just screams ignorance of Twitch as a platform. Please explain how to delay your stream for me.[/QUOTE]
OBS has options for it. You can add it per source (to keep a live chat or something) or I think there's a general broadcast option as well.
[t]https://my.mixtape.moe/dvckvj.PNG[/t]
Not really the topic but why do people spend hours typing into this ten posts per second non-human communication?
What does anyone get out of this?
[QUOTE=IliekBoxes;52648222]I know where the Pacman being waterboarded came from
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPRA0W1kECg[/media][/QUOTE]
FeelsGoodMan Clap
[QUOTE=Viper_;52659092][t]https://my.mixtape.moe/dvckvj.PNG[/t]
Not really the topic but why do people spend hours typing into this ten posts per second non-human communication?
What does anyone get out of this?[/QUOTE]
Its fun, being a part of the chaos and the oddly communal nature of these sorts of chats are pretty enjoyable experiences for me
Sucks but i mean, maybe if this guy put an overlay over the minimap or something?
I mean obviously he knows how to, he's got a goddamn G2A advertisment overlayed on the screen, and a face cam.
Also that is by far the worst stream chat i've ever seen, holy christ what a shit filled community he has.
[QUOTE=Viper_;52659092][t]https://my.mixtape.moe/dvckvj.PNG[/t]
Not really the topic but why do people spend hours typing into this ten posts per second non-human communication?
What does anyone get out of this?[/QUOTE]
It's screaming in a crowd. it's half the reason I love watching MoonMoon. 10k viewers spewing shit is great.
[QUOTE=Viper_;52659092][t]https://my.mixtape.moe/dvckvj.PNG[/t]
Not really the topic but why do people spend hours typing into this ten posts per second non-human communication?
What does anyone get out of this?[/QUOTE]
There's a chrome addon that changes those weird words to be emotes. FeelsGoodMan Clap would be the feelsgood Pepe next to an animated clapping hands.
I was confused too until I got better twitch tv. It makes the experience less confusing and overall more fun
(Not to sound like I'm advertising it lol)
BetterTwitchTV
When Moon Plays fanfavourite songs, you get shit like this nonstop. It's great.
[img]https://i.imgur.com/RFKyUcz.png[/img]
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