[QUOTE=JurajIsNotPirat;44150329]She follows this up by stating that science has discovered that both men and women see other women as a "mish-mash of sexual body parts". This is a baseless claim, as she doesn't refer to any actual scientific study. Honestly, this doesn't only smell of generalisation but I also find it quite ridiculous. I'd like to see the study itself.[/QUOTE]
You don't need a fucking scientific study to prove this, lol. Look, I googled "men lips" and "women lips." Both these images were in the [I]first row[/I] on the [I]first page.[/I]
[t]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-RCrrMRZ3HTk/UZ5kJe669wI/AAAAAAAAmSo/gvxsCbqDGuk/s1600/lips.jpg[/t]
[t]http://www.xanthicbeauty.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/men-lips-care.jpg[/t]
[t]http://www.mendaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Lip-Bite.jpeg[/t]
[t]http://images3.alphacoders.com/245/245105.jpg[/t]
Try this for [I]any[/I] body part that's on the human body, seriously. There are some that are [U]usually[/U] sexualized for both sexes like the ass, thighs, and genitals, sure, but those are a given.
You even have some fucking [I]bullshit[/I] like stupid fucks saying that women can't breastfeed in public because it's ~indecent~. I mean, what the fuck, they're using their breasts for their biological fucking purpose. There's also a bunch of other bullshit like people being okay with a fat hairy dude walking around topless on the beach but a woman isn't allowed to because "hurp durp i can't control my dick because i'm a fucking perverted asshole!!! cover them or else i'll be [I]forced[/I] to stare at you and think about ramming you," or how lots of women get stared at when they wear certian clothes, like, ew. It's disgusting, and if you're seriously out of your goddamn mind if you deny it.
In short, [I]YOU'RE THE PROBLEM IF YOU GET A BONER LOOKING AT SOMEBODY IN A COMPLETELY NON-SEXUAL SITUATION[/I]
Your entire post is filled with horribly sexist and misinformed points, seriously, did you even [I]think[/I] before you smashed this wall of text together? Most of your points are just you [I]not understanding her words[/I], by the way lol.
[editline]6th March 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Jeep-Eep;44154415]Good lord, drop that strawman. A notation of it being suspiciously low doesn't mean every charge against someone is real, FFS.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, those kind of posts are just gross.
Immediately jumping on the side of the possible rapist is damaging to [I]all[/I] victims, not just the one who made the accusation.
Considering how many [I]legitimate rapes[/I] are never reported due to stress/anxiety/trauma/etc, and how many are just fucking dropped because "hurr durr its a popular sports player!" or some other bullshit, fake accusations are basically a non-issue. I'll change my stance on this once society is unanimously against rape, which isn't the case at all right now.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;44156262]You don't need a fucking scientific study to prove this, lol. Look, I googled "men lips" and "women lips." Both these images were in the [I]first row[/I] on the [I]first page.[/I]
[t]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-RCrrMRZ3HTk/UZ5kJe669wI/AAAAAAAAmSo/gvxsCbqDGuk/s1600/lips.jpg[/t]
[t]http://www.xanthicbeauty.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/men-lips-care.jpg[/t]
[t]http://www.mendaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Lip-Bite.jpeg[/t]
[t]http://images3.alphacoders.com/245/245105.jpg[/t]
Try this for [I]any[/I] body part that's on the human body, seriously. There are some that are [U]usually[/U] sexualized for both sexes like the ass, thighs, and genitals, sure, but those are a given.
You even have some fucking [I]bullshit[/I] like stupid fucks saying that women can't breastfeed in public because it's ~indecent~. I mean, what the fuck, they're using their breasts for their biological fucking purpose. There's also a bunch of other bullshit like people being okay with a fat hairy dude walking around topless on the beach but a woman isn't allowed to because "hurp durp i can't control my dick because i'm a fucking perverted asshole!!! cover them or else i'll be [I]forced[/I] to stare at you and think about ramming you," or how lots of women get stared at when they wear certian clothes, like, ew. It's disgusting, and if you're seriously out of your goddamn mind if you deny it.
In short, [I]YOU'RE THE PROBLEM IF YOU GET A BONER LOOKING AT SOMEBODY IN A COMPLETELY NON-SEXUAL SITUATION[/I]
Your entire post is filled with horribly sexist and misinformed points, seriously, did you even [I]think[/I] before you smashed this wall of text together? Most of your points are just you [I]not understanding her words[/I], by the way lol.
[editline]6th March 2014[/editline]
Yeah, those kind of posts are just gross.
Immediately jumping on the side of the possible rapist is damaging to [I]all[/I] victims, not just the one who made the accusation.
Considering how many [I]legitimate rapes[/I] are never reported due to stress/anxiety/trauma/etc, and how many are just fucking dropped because "hurr durr its a popular sports player!" or some other bullshit, fake accusations are basically a non-issue. I'll change my stance on this once society is unanimously against rape, which isn't the case at all right now.[/QUOTE]
I really fucking hate this shit
[t]http://images3.alphacoders.com/245/245105.jpg[/t]
The other one with the red lipstick also bothers me.
I zoned out in the first 3 minutes at the amount of words she was spewing at me[sp](im tired sorry :<)[/sp]. However I have to agree with Johnny with the posing of genders.
[QUOTE=Elspin;44153305]Uh actually the off-topic started when I said that it was really sad how few rapists go to prison and instead of the "yeah, it's fucked up" agreement I expected a massive misogynist said "It's heart crushingly sad that everyone who's accused of rape isn't thrown in jail?" despite the fact that nobody on the planet was saying we should do that. I'm no psychologist but I think you people need to deal with some internal issues you're facing over this[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;44151936]
[QUOTE=Elspin;44151520][URL="http://www.ncadv.org/files/DomesticViolenceFactSheet(National).pdf"]
[/URL][QUOTE=Canuhearme?;44147585][QUOTE=BLOODGA$M;44146698][URL]http://www.ncadv.org/files/DomesticViolenceFactSheet(National).pdf[/URL][/QUOTE][URL="http://www.ncadv.org/files/DomesticViolenceFactSheet(National).pdf"]
[/URL]I find it odd how that graph implies every single accusation of rape is genuine, and the fact many don't lead to prosecutions or arrests is some horrific affront to the legal system.[/QUOTE]can we all just agree that no matter your opinion on how this relates to the topic at hand, or if it's a bit old, these statistics are heart crushingly sad[/QUOTE]It's heart crushingly sad that everyone who's accused of rape isn't thrown in jail?[/QUOTE]
I like how you people twist those arguments. Like what the fuck? Someone points out that a graph assumes guilty until proven innocent, then you blow it out of proportions, and we are the ones who need to deal with some internal issues we're facing over this? Can you stop with those stupid projections? You overreacted and started arguing with someone who's only point was that it's wrong to assume that everyone who's accused is automatically guilty, and then you tell people they have some psychological problems.
I'll say this again, if you agree that we shouldn't put in jail everyone who's accused, then there is nothing to disagree with as no other argument was made.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;44157838]I like how you people twist those arguments. Like what the fuck? Someone points out that a graph assumes guilty until proven innocent, then you blow it out of proportions, and we are the ones who need to deal with some internal issues we're facing over this? Can you stop with those stupid projections? You overreacted and started arguing with someone who's only point was that it's wrong to assume that everyone who's accused is automatically guilty, and then you tell people they have some psychological problems.
I'll say this again, if you agree that we shouldn't put in jail everyone who's accused, then there is nothing to disagree with as no other argument was made.[/QUOTE]
That post was made before I posted and I was not replying to them so that's not where the conversation started for me. It's not like their first post was any less misogynistic though. No not every case is genuine but the vast majority are, barely any lead to conviction, and most aren't even reported. How is that NOT a horrific affront to the legal system?
I want to sex object her face.
[QUOTE=Elspin;44157993]That post was made before I posted and I was not replying to them so that's not where the conversation started for me.[/QUOTE]
That conversation started before you joined it, how egocentric are you?
[QUOTE=Elspin;44157993]It's not like their first post was any less misogynistic though.[/QUOTE]
It's misogynistic not to adopt the "guilty until proven innocent" mindset when it comes to rape accusations. Okay.
[QUOTE=Elspin;44157993]No not every case is genuine but the vast majority are[/QUOTE]
That argument again that it happens so rarely that it can be neglected altogether.
[QUOTE=Elspin;44157993]barely any lead to conviction, and most aren't even reported. How is that NOT a horrific affront to the legal system?[/QUOTE]
The fact that many rapists go free is not a reason to assume that everyone who's accused of rape should go to jail as the graph in question suggested. You are replying to arguments that no one has made.
I remember awhile ago in school there was a girl that liked me. We kissed after a movie for a few minutes and nothing else, then I friend-zoned her because I didn't really feel a connection.
She accused me of rape/sexual assault, brought it to the attention of others.
That was a hard year....
things like this happen to people, since usually it's behind closed doors it's a matter of he-said she-said
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;44158546]That conversation started before you joined it, how egocentric are you?[/QUOTE]
lmao ok
[QUOTE]It's misogynistic not to adopt the "guilty until proven innocent" mindset when it comes to rape accusations. Okay. [/QUOTE]
Uh no it's misogynistic to be so unconcerned with the fact that less than 2% of rapists are convicted that you care more about the minuscule amount by comparison that are falsely accused of it
[QUOTE]That argument again that it happens so rarely that it can be neglected altogether.[/QUOTE]
Nobody is saying that, it's just way less of a problem and yet it seems to be 100% of your focus
[QUOTE]The fact that many rapists go free is not a reason to assume that everyone who's accused of rape should go to jail as the graph in question suggested. You are replying to arguments that no one has made.[/QUOTE]
NOBODY IS SAYING THAT EVERYONE ACCUSED OF RAPE SHOULD GO TO JAIL DO YOU HAVE READING COMPREHENSION PROBLEMS LET ME HELP YOU UNDERSTAND
[b]NOBODY IS SAYING THAT EVERYONE ACCUSED OF RAPE SHOULD GO TO JAIL[/b]
is that clear enough for you or would you like to make some more shit up
[QUOTE=Elspin;44159280]
NOBODY IS SAYING THAT EVERYONE ACCUSED OF RAPE SHOULD GO TO JAIL DO YOU HAVE READING COMPREHENSION PROBLEMS LET ME HELP YOU UNDERSTAND
[B]NOBODY IS SAYING THAT EVERYONE ACCUSED OF RAPE SHOULD GO TO JAIL[/B]
[/QUOTE]
"Out of every 100 rapes" and "the other 97 will walk FREE" paints a really different image than "out of every 100 suspected cases of rape" and "97 of the cases do not result in conviction and imprisonment."
Her body language is kinda disturbing. I litterally could not keep an eye contact with her for more then two seconds before freaking out and scrolling down
However, the speech itself was pretty good. Exept that I listened to it while keeping the page scrolled down below her level of sight.
[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;44152133]
I don't get this sentiment, it's tantamount to "guilty until proven innocent... and sometimes even if you're proven innocent." You seem to be implying that those ~1,000 prosecuted cases found not guilty are actually all obviously rapists who now get to walk free, and that's a very dangerous assumption because society then vilifies people who have not been proven to have done anything wrong.
I'm not saying we should call all the women who made accusations toward men found not guilty should be branded as liars without any solid proof, but it's pretty awful to assume that anyone charged with rape is a rapist even if they're found not guilty.[/QUOTE]
It also doesn't help because rape is very often really really difficult to prove and devolves into a he said/she said case which would fail in court.
ITT Facepunch working on another PHD thesis.
Sexual objectification, yeah not touching this one >.<
I watched the video and it was a good speech, then when it was over, the "Man" part in me couldn't help but to notice the other videos in the channel (also known as Collage of Cleavage) then I kinda felt trolled.
For someone who advocates against objectification, that's a peculiar height, you know, where your head doesn't fully fit the screen but your puppies are always framed?
Well, at least the message on it's own is positive.
The implication of turning away sexual objectification in the media is ridiculous. Following the trend, if anything sexual objectification of both genders will get more severe.
Additionally the argument about [I]'this girl doing this pose looks ok but the man doing it is awkward'[/I] is stupid. The girl was on all fours, had an arched back - this is obviously a female pose! In the same way a girl would look stupid doing the hercules flex for a Calvin Klein advert. Fuck this girl man
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;44159669]"Out of every 100 rapes" and "the other 97 will walk FREE" paints a really different image than "out of every 100 suspected cases of rape" and "97 of the cases do not result in conviction and imprisonment."[/QUOTE]
Why does a statistic about how few rapists are caught need to state that some percentage could be false claims to be reasonable? If it was a statistic about how many murderers are never caught (and it was less than 2%, mind you) nobody would be up in arms raging about how "some of those could have been accidents" or "some of those caught could have been the wrong person", they'd be mortified how people are getting away with that. My point is it's really suspicious how none of you have even bothered to say "yeah it's really upsetting how few rapists are caught" but instead you just rail on about how the statistics that you might just be misunderstanding (maybe when it says out of 100 it's already taken into account how many are estimated to be false claims? not sure) aren't covering the base that some people accused are innocent.
When people (like me) complain about low conviction rates we're not saying a good solution would be to say guilty until proven innocent, the kind of change we're hoping for is a better attitude towards victims ([url=http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2013/03/19/two_girls_from_steubenville_are_arrested_for_threatening_the_victim_why.html]jesus christ why[/url]) and more support for those that are terrified to go to court due to the suffering it'll cause them
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;44156262]You don't need a fucking scientific study to prove this, lol. Look, I googled "men lips" and "women lips." Both these images were in the [I]first row[/I] on the [I]first page.[/I]
[t]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-RCrrMRZ3HTk/UZ5kJe669wI/AAAAAAAAmSo/gvxsCbqDGuk/s1600/lips.jpg[/t]
[t]http://www.xanthicbeauty.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/men-lips-care.jpg[/t]
[/QUOTE]
Arguably those lips are also sexualized, just that men lips aren't gona be sexy when biting/licking, they're sexualized in different way. Same thing that men look silly in feminine poses while they look sexualized and manly in poses characterized to men.
[QUOTE=itisjuly;44162211]Arguably those lips are also sexualized, just that men lips aren't gona be sexy when biting/licking, they're sexualized in different way. Same thing that men look silly in feminine poses while they look sexualized and manly in poses characterized to men.[/QUOTE]
ohshitohshit someone who understands something?
We're all fucking sexualized.
I think media portraying people in a counter-productive way stems from us through popular demand.
Better than trying to control the media would be to shape the people's mentalities towards confidence, consideration and a healthier body image. That way the bothersome media portrayals would be naturally phased out.
I can't think of any remotely reliable way to do that though.
thanks for all the dumbs guys, this will teach me not to talk on facepunch again
[QUOTE=Elspin;44159280]Uh no it's misogynistic to be so unconcerned with the fact that less than 2% of rapists are convicted that you care more about the minuscule amount by comparison that are falsely accused of it
Nobody is saying that, it's just way less of a problem and yet it seems to be 100% of your focus
NOBODY IS SAYING THAT EVERYONE ACCUSED OF RAPE SHOULD GO TO JAIL DO YOU HAVE READING COMPREHENSION PROBLEMS LET ME HELP YOU UNDERSTAND
[B]NOBODY IS SAYING THAT EVERYONE ACCUSED OF RAPE SHOULD GO TO JAIL[/B]
is that clear enough for you or would you like to make some more shit up[/QUOTE]
I'm the one having reading comprehension problems? For all this time you have been arguing against someone who only said it's odd that some graph assumed that every single rape accusation was genuine and it's wrong to assume that. That's the only argument that's been made yet you're talking about lots of other things and then you have the nerve to say that other people have reading comprehension and are making shit up. Nobody is saying that it's more of a problem than the low conviction rate. For like 20th time, the only argument was that it would be wrong to assume that everyone who has ever been accused of rape is a rapist,[B] AND YOU DISAGREED AND KEEP ARGUING[/B]. There has been no other argument made. Not one saying that it's more important than other things, not one that we should focus on it, not one that every claim that didn't end up in a conviction was a lie. But yeah sure keep projecting making shit up and bad reading comprehension onto other people.
I'm out of this argument because I'm getting fed up repeating that there has been no other argument than the one you fucking agreed with yourself. This discussion is going nowhere. You think we shouldn't put everyone who has been accused in jail, I think we shouldn't put everyone who has been accused in jail. You think the rape conviction rate is shit, I think the rape conviction rate is shit. Lets just agree to agree and end this please.
The only thing I really disagreed with her on was her point about men having more sexual freedom, and I consider that to be kind of a broad statement. Homosexual men are often looked down upon not only by males, but by females as well, yet there seems to be a very large acceptance of lesbian women. Lesbian women are often applauded and are not usually called out on their sexuality, but men face a lot more flak in those situations.
Also, I don't agree with her getting super dolled up and complaining about men objectifying women when she's pretty much making herself a perfect example of what society considers to be on point.
At any rate, she is extremely charismatic and presents her points in a concise, intelligent manner and I enjoyed the video.
[QUOTE=Aetna;44164927]The only thing I really disagreed with her on was her point about men having more sexual freedom, and I consider that to be kind of a broad statement. Homosexual men are often looked down upon not only by males, but by females as well, yet there seems to be a very large acceptance of lesbian women. Lesbian women are often applauded and are not usually called out on their sexuality, but men face a lot more flak in those situations.
Also, I don't agree with her getting super dolled up and complaining about men objectifying women when she's pretty much making herself a perfect example of what society considers to be on point.
At any rate, she is extremely charismatic and presents her points in a concise, intelligent manner and I enjoyed the video.[/QUOTE]
lesbian women aren't accepted more because women have more exual freedom, they're accepted because of men's creepy "hurhh hurr 2 girls" fantasies.
who do you think lesbian porn is the most popular with? lesbians???? no, it's straight dudes.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;44165012]lesbian women aren't accepted more because women have more exual freedom, they're accepted because of men's creepy "hurhh hurr 2 girls" fantasies.
who do you think lesbian porn is the most popular with? lesbians???? no, it's straight dudes.[/QUOTE]
Lesbian porn is pretty boring, tbh.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;44165012]lesbian women aren't accepted more because women have more exual freedom, they're accepted because of men's creepy "hurhh hurr 2 girls" fantasies.
who do you think lesbian porn is the most popular with? lesbians???? no, it's straight dudes.[/QUOTE]
Well I'd have no doubt straight numbers, yeah, but what if you compared the % of porn watching straight males that watch lesbian porn to the % of porn watching lesbians? That's me being a bit pedantic though, I would overall agree that lesbians are accepted more because people are more comfortable with it.
i'd say that lesbians are accepted more but only if they're improbably hot, otherwise they have it similarly to gay men
[QUOTE=Cone;44165582]i'd say that lesbians are accepted more but only if they're improbably hot, otherwise they have it similarly to gay men[/QUOTE]
It's interesting to note that, while inner-city gangs by and large treat women as inferior, and gays with violent revulsion, lesbians have carved themselves a neat little niche where they're more or less treated as "one of the guys."
she is an object get dicked
This whole discussion is way above my head but I don't mind. I'm glad this discussion isn't prominent in Austria because then I'd actually have to research and stuff.
Could somebody post a tl;dr version of this probably? Like, what it's about and what the real problems are? The discussion in this thread was way too indepth to follow. The only thing I know about it are the retarded Tumblr Users so I immediatly think everybody that uses these points is incredibly stupid and/or an attention whore :v:
[QUOTE=The Combine;44168465]The discussion in this thread was way too indepth to follow[/QUOTE]
If it was too indepth then I'm afraid there's no simpler way to explain it.
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