Tropes vs Women in Video Games - Damsel in Distress - General

[QUOTE=Dah-thla;39836199]when has there ever been a female knight. (Those who know history well may be able to prove me wrong on this one) If the hero is supposed to be a knight, wouldn't it make sense for the person to be male?[/QUOTE] Female knights have existed along with knight like females. For example Joan of Arc. Also it's a work of fantasy so they could work female knights in anyway because they created the universe. Game of Thrones has a female knight.

Maybe instead of whining about it on youtube, you start a femino-centric game franchise that switches the roles of guys and gals? Make a point, rather than whine about it.

[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39836338]You're making her out to be some sort of ingenius manipulator. Nope, just another person, not a sociopath. to be honest I'm surprised she went through with making these videos at all after all of that bullshit[/QUOTE] Sure, but it's not hard to make the connections. Why not be transparent and let people know? Can't blame me for raising an eyebrow at the direction she's taken.

[QUOTE=Key_in_skillee;39836347][img]http://fronttowardsgamer.com/wp-content/uploads/ZeldaOOT_personnagePrincipal_impaHaut1.jpg[/img] Not exactly a knight, but still.[/QUOTE] Nah bro, she has jagged edges, it's obviously oppressive to the female bodies gentle curves.. Those goddamned Japs!!

[QUOTE=Shadaez;39836290]reread that lol prolonged cruel or unjust treatment or exercise of authority you can't just pick the parts you like, the path you took was "prolonged cruel excercise of authority" you can't just remove the cruel part do you really think rapists are being mistreated?[/QUOTE] I think that in THEIR minds they're being mistreated, and therefore are oppressed. They want something, and we don't allow them to do so, thus oppress them. If I'm not using the right word, then please tell me what I should use.

[QUOTE=Shadaez;39836270]since when is Link a knight? [/QUOTE] Link and his uncle in Link to the past were the last remaining bloodline in the knights of hyrule, Theres also a legend that the hero of time would appear within the ranks of knights. :eng101:

[QUOTE=kanesenpai~;39836367]Sure, but it's not hard to make the connections. Why not be transparent and let people know? Can't blame me for raising an eyebrow at the direction she's taken.[/QUOTE] idk chances it's because people are attacking her at every opportunity. You can see here in the thread there are people who went as far as to say they didn't even watch the video before judging it. While I don't agree with her methods I can't blame her either.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;39836268]This is the strangest hypothesis I've ever heard in my life, it seriously eclipses most of the conspiracy theories on AVfM [b]Hall of Fame[/b] 1. Spermjacking 2. mobrockers' video game thing 3. Circumcision as a feminist conspiracy 4. Sound of high heels as male mind control[/QUOTE] What is spermjacking.

[QUOTE=mobrockers2;39836343]If that's not the correct way to do this then I apologize.[/QUOTE] it isn't, otherwise the first part would be read as just "prolonged cruel," which obviously doesn't make any sense. there is no disconnect between the three given examples

[QUOTE=mobrockers2;39836343]Depends entirely on how you divide that sentence. I split it up as: prolonged cruel or unjust treatment or prolonged exercise of authority If that's not the correct way to do this then I apologize.[/QUOTE] can i do the same thing to ur posts? [QUOTE=mobrockers2;39836343]Depends entirely on how you divide that sentence. [b]I[/b] split it up as: [b]p[/b]r[b]o[/b]l[b]o[/b]nged cruel or unjust treatment or [b]p[/b]rolonged exercise of authority If that's not the correct way to do this then I apologize.[/QUOTE] "I poop" wow real mature

[QUOTE=Shadaez;39836355]So what? The video series is "TROPES VS WOMEN" not "THESE FEW TIMES WOMEN WERE SHOWN POSITIVELY"[/QUOTE] My point is that there's plenty of positive female characters in games. There's many negative ones, of course, but you should never just show the negative. If she's going to analyze this topic, it's important to acknowledge both sides. Only presenting one side of an issue is lazy and not in-depth. Though I cringe when I saw her whiteboard where she notes Femshep as a "positive" female character.

[QUOTE=mobrockers2;39836343]Depends entirely on how you divide that sentence. I split it up as: prolonged cruel or unjust treatment or prolonged exercise of authority If that's not the correct way to do this then I apologize.[/QUOTE] the problem being you really shouldn't be splitting up definitions at all

[QUOTE=Key_in_skillee;39836248]David Wong, part time complete fucking genius and by far the best article writer at Cracked.com, has an article that sheds a good amount of light on the "woman hating" that goes on a lot in society and why it exists. [url]http://www.cracked.com/article_19785_5-ways-modern-men-are-trained-to-hate-women.html[/url] SatansSin is a prime example of this sort of thing. It's OK to hate a woman for reasons, but if you default to attacking her sexually (calling her a slut or a "whale encrusted vagina" or something like that when she hasn't done anything besides put on makeup) or attacking her appearance, it's pretty clear you're being a sexist twat. The video game industry isn't the only one that is lacking in good woman role models. When was the last time you saw a good superhero movie starring a woman? Video games aren't any worse off than any other medium; we have plenty of empowering female characters, like Samus Aran (barring Other M), Jade, Alyx Vance, Big Boss, etc. The problem is that most of the people in the game industry are men, and don't know how to write female characters, or write from a woman's perspective. If you're going to go on about the "damsel in distress" trope, there's really nothing to say about video games that can't be said about any other medium. Like video games, movies also have their share of empowering female characters (Ripley for example). If you're going to talk about a problem that's mostly unique to video games, talk about the obscene oversexualization of female characters with ridiculous proportions. Comic books had this problem as well, and it stems from the perceived audience of young "nerdy" males that the developers want to cater to.[/QUOTE] Well that pretty much sums up my thoughts. This video is just terrible at representing and debating the issue, which only provides fodder for idiots to yell at.

[QUOTE=Shadaez;39836396]can i do the same thing to ur posts? "I poop" wow real mature[/QUOTE] The sentence has three or's, it is not clear to me which or breaks up which part of the sentence. I chose apparently the wrong one, which changes the definition of oppression. You're the one being immature here.

The way femshep is depicted in Mass Effect, which is almost the exact same way the male shep is, is very positive relatively speaking lol

[quote]just because it occurs in other mediums doesn't make it okay. Also you have to make a distinction between "oversexualization" and "empowerment."[/quote] I never said it was okay, I was saying there's not a whole lot that's new to say about it that's specific to video games. Also, there is a clear distinction between oversexualization and empowerment. That's why I said there are no good female superhero movies despite the existence of Tank Girl, Barbed Wire, Catwoman, etc. [quote]also, you name all of those characters, but one never says a word,[/quote] You talking about Samus? She speaks in the first person as early as Super Metroid, and she has a LOT of dialogue in Fusion. In the Prime games she doesn't say much, but then again neither does anyone until the third one.

and no, there really aren't that many positive female characters, or more importantly female leads, in gaming. sorry to break it to you. I personally think we are headed in that direction and that as of late there have been more, but on the whole, no.

[QUOTE=Dr. Gestapo;39836193]Then perhaps we should stop being offensive to women in the games we play? [editline]well[/editline] Disabling comments and ratings was a terrible move on her part.[/QUOTE] Disabling comments/ratings on any video is pretty much damage control

[QUOTE=Amiga OS;39836053]I really don't see what the hate is for, she kinda has a point and if I were a woman I would find it hard to relate to most games. Instead of rating me dumb, explain why you feel like I'm wrong, because otherwise there is just no point to this thread.[/QUOTE] [b]Okay[/b] You want us to tell you how your personal idea about if you were a female that you would feel uncomfortable. How about you explain why that is and show some games and what not. This video is dumb, she is dumb.

[QUOTE=mobrockers2;39836441]The sentence has three or's, it is not clear to me which or breaks up which part of the sentence. I chose apparently the wrong one, which changes the definition of oppression. You're the one being immature here.[/QUOTE] You cut it off before the first "or" though, whatever! This thread's actually turning out better than I imagined tbh. (also dictionarys are descriptive and not prescriptive)

[QUOTE=Key_in_skillee;39836449]I never said it was okay, I was saying there's not a whole lot that's new to say about it that's specific to video games. Also, there is a clear distinction between oversexualization and empowerment. That's why I said there are no good female superhero movies despite the existence of Tank Girl, Barbed Wire, Catwoman, etc. You talking about Samus? She speaks in the first person as early as Super Metroid, and she has a LOT of dialogue in Fusion. In the Prime games she doesn't say much, but then again neither does anyone until the third one.[/QUOTE] well she is purposely a whiteboard for the player to impose themselves on. the rare times she does speak it doesn't do her many favors, unfortunately.

[QUOTE=kanesenpai~;39836403]My point is that there's plenty of positive female characters in games. There's many negative ones, of course, but you should never just show the negative. If she's going to analyze this topic, it's important to acknowledge both sides. Only presenting one side of an issue is lazy and not in-depth. Though I cringe when I saw her whiteboard where she notes Femshep as a "positive" female character.[/QUOTE] A better way to go about this would be to give a positive example for every negative one as a contrast, one would think this would be one of the first ideas you'd have when making something like this. Oh well. Also, Femshep is sort of a good female character (at least on the writing side of things) it's just that she's incredibly sexualized just like every other female character in the series. The gender specific armor is hilarious.

[QUOTE=mobrockers2;39836441]The sentence has three or's, it is not clear to me which or breaks up which part of the sentence. I chose apparently the wrong one, which changes the definition of oppression. You're the one being immature here.[/QUOTE] I do believe it's prolonged (cruel or unjust) (treatment or exercise of authority)

[QUOTE=Shadaez;39836476]You cut it off before the first "or" though, whatever! This thread's actually turning out better than I imagined tbh.[/QUOTE] we did it :)

Goddamn, Sarkeesian's voice is so irritating. Even if she does make a valid point or two I can't stand the videos themselves

[QUOTE=Amiga OS;39836451]Femshep didn't really have a character though, with Mass Effect being a RPG she was more an extension of the player.[/QUOTE] Bioware's obvious pandering in how they made her curvier and ran a contest just to make her "prettier" is not indicative of a positive character. That'd be like saying making everyone gay in Dragon Age 2 was more positive than say, Arcade Gannon in New Vegas.

[quote]What is spermjacking. [/quote] I would assume it's when a woman gets a mans sperm through an illegitimate method (lying about being on the pill, getting it from a sperm bank illegitimately, poking a hole in the condom, etc), has a baby, and then forces the man to pay child support. This does happen but I'd say that many of the times it's been reported to happen it may have been the guy lying about it.

[QUOTE=Dr. Gestapo;39836488]A better way to go about this would be give a positive example for every negative one, one would think this would be one of the first ideas you'd have when making something like this. Oh well. Also, Femshep is sort of a good female character (at least on the writing side of things) it's just that she's incredibly sexualized just like every other female character in the series. The gender specific armor is hilarious.[/QUOTE] That's a stretch to me. I didn't find any of her armor to be particularly "bad" in that regard, in that aesthetically it really functions the same way that male shep's does [editline]7th March 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Amiga OS;39836509]I'd struggle to find games where you could play as a really good Female role model, with a fully fleshed out personality and not just a pair of tits on legs.[/QUOTE] mhm that's what I'm saying, it's very rare.

[QUOTE=Juniez;39836415]the problem being you really shouldn't be splitting up definitions at all[/QUOTE] In Dutch, oppression means suppressing, oppressing and controlling in a negative way, but not necessarily, the way the definition is formulated made me think it was the same in English.

[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39836485]well she is purposely a whiteboard for the player to impose themselves on. the rare times she does speak it doesn't do her many favors, unfortunately.[/QUOTE] No, she has clearly established character through her actions and monologues before Other M. She has a lot of introspective dialogue in Fusion and there's absolutely nothing wrong with her character at that point. It's solely Other M that fucks her up.