• Corruption in Gaming Journalism Discussion V2 - Back from the dead!
    5,003 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Xonax;47268395]We wouldn't have games that has the same Graphics as the present, but we would have games that look like the SNES/Genesis. Atari had limit graphics, then the crash happened, and the NES had better Graphics. If a crash happens again, we will see the next step, the SNES/Genesis Graphics era till we come full circle.[/QUOTE] i'm not quite sure what you're trying to say here
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;47268401]i'm not quite sure what you're trying to say here[/QUOTE] It was a bad joke about how if the Industry crashes, we would end up with SNES/Genesis style Graphics. And that in the first crash, the graphics were upgraded from Atari graphics to NES graphics.
[QUOTE=Wii60;47268187]ill laugh hard if literal fights break out no one can be that stupid[/QUOTE] If blood does spill for whatever dumb reason, it'll most certainly be interesting to see how people respond to it.
for people who want the audience reaction to tim schafer [video=youtube;F9V4pB5Ablc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9V4pB5Ablc[/video]
[QUOTE=Wii60;47268443]for people who want the audience reaction to tim schafer [video=youtube;F9V4pB5Ablc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9V4pB5Ablc[/video][/QUOTE] This feels like it belongs in a cringe thread because wow that is some shitty stand up.
[QUOTE=Xonax;47267566][url]https://twitter.com/_icze4r/status/573656363835985921[/url] [url]http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/285774514/gdc-2015[/url] [img]http://puu.sh/gop9s/0e17e52c2f.png[/img] What do you guys think? I hope the Industry Crashes, and the reason it crashes is because of people like Anita, Zoe, Brianna and basically Anti-Gamergate. Then people will see that you can't have everything your fucking way.[/QUOTE] I think the only thing that'll cause another gaming crash is the AAA development system collapsing. It's already having serious issues with comically huge budgets that require games to sell like hotcakes in order to be profitable. Despite what the game press wants to believe, it's AAA games that drive the industry, not indie games. If AAA games go down, then bad shit will happen. The neon-haired faux-progressive indie devs that make "artistic" indie games are barely a blip on the radar on the long term, despite the drama they drum up in order to make people pay attention to them and the press going gaga for them. The only long-term impact they have on gaming is when one of their games, like How Do You Do It?, crawls to Steam under the impression it'll help the game's image, but is completely humiliated by comedy reviews and people calling the developer a faggot on the game's Steam forum. I don't think the GDC slowly falling to the faux-progressive types isn't as bad as it seems. I'm sure comapnies like Riot and Blizzard have their own plans that don't require GDC. Worse comes to worse, another and similar event can be started.
[url]https://twitter.com/indiedevil[/url] Oh man, this guy is a riot. I assume he is Pro-GG. I thought I'd post it in case anyone here was in a bad mood. [editline]6th March 2015[/editline] Another Dev comes out as Pro-GG. Sorry if this is late. [img]http://puu.sh/goGXB/c1d865117e.png[/img]
Sampson came out as pro-GG back in January.
There's probably going to be another Facepunching GamerGate stream this weekend: [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkooCuQ9aNs[/url] [video=youtube;GkooCuQ9aNs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkooCuQ9aNs[/video] Same rules as always.
[URL=https://gitgud.net/gamergate/gamergateop/tree/master/Current-Happenings]Whenever you feel low on morale, just remember how much we're accomplishing.[/URL]
[QUOTE=NapyDaWise;47266871]There's something I never understood with theses so called feminists : they want their problems solved immediately. But I don't see how that's possible : if you have 100 applicants for 20 jobs, 90 of them being men, does this mean 10 women and 10 men should be hired? It'll always result in inequity no matter what. So why isn't anita, wu, Quinn, spending all their money and energy on "anti harassment" campaigns and associations and not on funding school programs that would make more women want to get in the tech industry? How can none of theses agg followers ask themselves this question? Pretty sure they'd have a lot of support too.[/QUOTE] Even then I don't really see what that would bring to the table when it comes to equality. It's not that women are being forced out of the industry, it's that it doesn't seem attractive to them in the first place. Where does the problem lie if everybody gets to pursue the career they want to? Then again, I don't have anything in particular against promoting game-related jobs to women, seeing as it doesn't bring any inherent harm whatsoever, I simply don't see how it would be a victory in any form for feminism.
[QUOTE=Monkah;47268770][URL=https://gitgud.net/gamergate/gamergateop/tree/master/Current-Happenings]Whenever you feel low on morale, just remember how much we're accomplishing.[/URL][/QUOTE] Heh, with all that's been happening I think morale is the last thing to worry about.
A little late on this, but before Snake7 posted, some people in this thread had said they would like to see an AGG perspective and some civil discussion. Whenever I have seen someone AGG post in this thread, I don't think it's a good discussion at all. They have about 10 or so people piling on them, some posters might be pretty fair about it, then there are others just looking to take a dump on them. Expecting them to reply to every point that's been made aswell is a big ask in a thread they probably want nothing to do with. You can't justify giving them shit because their arguments are horrible, you wanted AGG and you got it. So of course you're right, but this is a pro-GG thread and it can afford to make a few concessions when talking with the unreasonable opposition. I understand why people get frustrated with these posters since their posts and the opinions they hold are quite frankly apalling, but heated reactions, or a page of people telling them why they're full of shit is not going teach us very much. It would be nice to have someone come in and argue in this thread with some sound logic, but if you take Snake7 for example they came into the thread at least believing there were going to be the rational AGG opinion people wanted, and well because they made a crap job of it they're banned.
I just went about a week and a half back in Lindsey Ellis (Nostalgia Chick)'s twitter history and I don't see anything bad enough to justify calling her a "full on SWJ". The worst thing I see her do is retweet some things that FemFreq said (and those specific things are not things I disagree with). Since people like Snake7 aren't really doing a good job at critiquing GG, I think I'll give it a shot. I feel like, in the more intelligent places that are "pro-GG" there are a few common trends that are worrying. First of all, the term "SWJ" is often used way too loosely. Secondly, a few people seem to deny sexism as a problem with the gaming community. I've seen people argue that "people that harass you for being a woman would also harass you for something else if you weren't" and I don't think that's always, or even usually, the case, especially on the internet. Thirdly, I think there's too much backlash against people who have a problem with things like ridiculous outfits and body proportions in games like the recent Soul Calibers. I don't want games to be censored any more than most of you, and some games that get criticized for it don't deserve it (like Bayonetta), but people get shit for expressing their distaste of things like this or saying that they're bad. Again, this seems to be a backlash against people who admittedly go WAY too far in that direction, but I feel like it wasn't very long ago (before Gamergate or this SWJ nonsense that's happening) that the gaming community were pretty much uniformly sick of and pointing out the ridiculousness of games like Soul Caliber. If someone pointed out the fact that, in that series, breasts were getting bigger and outfits skimpier to an absurd degree, no one really argued against it being a bad thing. That's just a few thoughts I've had. I left out the general pettiness and shallow insults towards people on the opposition (which I admit I might be somewhat guilty of as well) because that occurs with pretty much any group on the internet.
I saw an archived polygon article from yesterday that just had me speechless with the (obvious) narrative it's trying to push. The article was written to try and tell the "industry" that its "leaving money on the table" by not having more female protags. It uses a survey done by a teacher on ~1,500 11-18yo boys and girls. The statistics were that while ~60% of girls prefer to play as female protags compared to 38% of boys preferring male protags, 20% of boys base their purchases on protag gender, while 28% of girls base their purchases on protag gender. Presenting the statistics in this manner makes it look like they are missing out on money by not having a female protag. However, if you flip the statistics, it shows: A) 80% of boys and 72% of girls don't base their purchases off of protag gender B) 62% of boys and 40% of girls don't care or don't prefer playing as their own gender So let me ask you guys a few questions. [B]Let's assume, for the sake of argument, that the sample size and diversity were actually satisfactory enough to represent these groups, and that all respondents regularly purchase and play video games.[/B] I'm gonna use some abbreviations. "FOP" stands for "Female Only Protag", and describes games where the only protag choice is female. "MOP" stands for "Male Only Protag", same as FOP, but with the male gender. "FLP" stands for "Fluid Protag", and describes games like Dragon Age where the player can create or choose their own protag of any race/gender/sexuality". 1) Why is the gender of a protag so important to "journalists" when only 24% of consumers care enough to base their purchasing decisions on it? 2) If you advocate for fixing "gender issues", why would you be also advocating for games to have certain features to appeal to a specific gender? If we are all equal, does gender matter? 3) Why isn't gaming journalism like Polygon pushing for more FLP games? I know that a lot of games won't be able to implement this due to the story, but there are still a LOT that can. I think that it's down right stupid to not push more character customization, but push for one specific type of character instead. It just seems to me that their method of bringing in more diversity is not only helping bring diversity up, but by also trying to bring established games down. Honestly, while I may dislike Wu because of the shit she's done concerning gamergate, I love what she's doing with Giant Spacekat because at least with Giant Spacekat, she's trying to bring in more diverse games by actually making them. She's not sitting on her ass and demanding the industry change to make what she wants, she's actually making it. Shes bringing in an industry positive. While it may not be as great as a AAA title quality wise, it's trying, and I can respect that.
If you want something done, do it yourself [img]http://i.imgur.com/SGEIDf6.jpg[/img] So I did
[QUOTE=Fangz;47267971]So Tim Schafer is not only blocking anyone who is talking about his sockpuppet negatively, seriously or jokingly, but anyone who favorites them or retweet them. I personally just got blocked, but a lot of neutrals like psychicpebbles are as well.[/QUOTE] Doesn't he use the block bot? I'm fairly certain he had me blocked before all this.
Why is this still a thing? I thought people were over it. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Why reply?" - OvB))[/highlight]
Another thing I've been thinking about recently: is the reason that so many people latch on to Anita Sarkeesian, despite her videos being flawed and unintelligent, because she's the only one doing what she's doing? When it comes to the discussion of feminism and video games, it seems to be just her and her followers versus people that disagree with her. Where are the other feminist analyses of video games and video game culture? We had discussions about this stuff before Anita. Everyone talked about the misogyny and sexism in Metroid: Other M. Plenty of people have had problems with games like the aforementioned Soul Caliber (hell, even Moviebob had some videos on stuff like that back when, believe it or not, he wasn't nuts). When is someone (I don't even care what gender they are) who isn't just criticizing Anita or writing clickbait going to step up and make videos/articles about this subject? Someone who will not just say "look at all these things and how bad they are" but actually analyze why certain things are the way they are and offer solutions and insight? It's fucking sad that when it comes to feminism in video games, the closest I've come to seeing a video that made me think about it in a different way is Moviebob's earliest "Game Overthinker" videos (which were not very good but were lightyears better than anything he's put out since, and showed few signs of him being the idiot he's been making of himself recently).
[QUOTE=ichiman94;47269310]Why is this still a thing? I thought people were over it.[/QUOTE] Because people like little timmy over at GDC can find nothing better to do with themselves than to insult the minorities in the movement and make it grow even bigger.
[QUOTE=Helix Snake;47269071]First of all, the term "SWJ" is often used way too loosely.[/QUOTE] I think we need to make a distinction between using the term against individuals and when making generic statements. I feel the latter is simply a matter of convenience [QUOTE=Helix Snake;47269071]Secondly, a few people seem to deny sexism as a problem with the gaming community. I've seen people argue that "people that harass you for being a woman would also harass you for something else if you weren't" and I don't think that's always, or even usually, the case, especially on the internet.[/QUOTE] Since I don't speak for gamergate I'm going to give my personal thoughts on this Is there sexism in the gaming community? Yes Is it worse than any other internet-based community? Debatable, no evidence of that being the case Do women get harrassed more than men? Statistics actually say otherwise What ties it all together is this idea among the opposition that harrasssment targeting your gender (which frankly they seem to apply only to women, as being called a dickless faggot is just shit talking but calling a woman a bitch is sexist and harrassment) is ten times worse than any other form. Bollocks, I say. All kinds of harrassment is equally bad. [QUOTE=Helix Snake;47269071]Thirdly, I think there's too much backlash against people who have a problem with things like ridiculous outfits and body proportions in games like the recent Soul Calibers. I don't want games to be censored any more than most of you, and some games that get criticized for it don't deserve it (like Bayonetta), but people get shit for expressing their distaste of things like this or saying that they're bad. Again, this seems to be a backlash against people who admittedly go WAY too far in that direction, but I feel like it wasn't very long ago (before Gamergate or this SWJ nonsense that's happening) that the gaming community were pretty much uniformly sick of and pointing out the ridiculousness of games like Soul Caliber. If someone pointed out the fact that, in that series, breasts were getting bigger and outfits skimpier to an absurd degree, no one really argued against it being a bad thing.[/QUOTE] I think you might be lumping together a lot of different opinions here. There's a difference between "bikini chainmails are stupid" and "bikini chainmails are offensive". I'll completely agree with the first and oppose the second to the death. Some people (and not just men) actually like that stuff, let them enjoy it As a footnote, I'm mostly playing devil advocate here as I agree there's a problem when these things get taken too far, however I don't think these kind of generalizations hold any virtue as criticism against something as diverse as gamergate, and they become circumstantial at best as given gamergate's size each of us will have seen different people talking about different things
Well shit, one of my sisters got my IP banned from 8chan /v/ for a shit tumblr raid. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/NZ6SKOA.png[/IMG] Googled the post and found out it was actually a copy-paste job from some twitter user that has used the auto-blocker. I think I need to have a [I]long[/I] talk with 'em.
[QUOTE=JohnnyGoGo;47269004]A little late on this, but before Snake7 posted, some people in this thread had said they would like to see an AGG perspective and some civil discussion. Whenever I have seen someone AGG post in this thread, I don't think it's a good discussion at all. They have about 10 or so people piling on them, some posters might be pretty fair about it, then there are others just looking to take a dump on them. Expecting them to reply to every point that's been made aswell is a big ask in a thread they probably want nothing to do with. You can't justify giving them shit because their arguments are horrible, you wanted AGG and you got it. So of course you're right, but this is a pro-GG thread and it can afford to make a few concessions when talking with the unreasonable opposition. I understand why people get frustrated with these posters since their posts and the opinions they hold are quite frankly apalling, but heated reactions, or a page of people telling them why they're full of shit is not going teach us very much. It would be nice to have someone come in and argue in this thread with some sound logic, but if you take Snake7 for example they came into the thread at least believing there were going to be the rational AGG opinion people wanted, and well because they made a crap job of it they're banned.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;47197625]Most of the debates are amongst pro-gg users anyway. There really aren't many anti-gg users who come in here who aren't just trying to shitpost. They need to understand something: you may get a lot of people arguing against you if you post, but if you're right then you are right. You're going to get vetted hard, but if you're right the people here will actually accept that. But if you fail the vetting, you're not going to be looked on kindly. And if your immediate response is to get your back up and defensive instead of trying to prove your case, you've failed the vetting. So if you've got a legitimate point, just stand your ground, your case will shine through. No one will have a problem with that.[/QUOTE] As I said before, if an AGG user wants to make a point, they have to stand up to the vetting, its a rigorous routine of questions and answers, citing, and more. It will be from multiple people because there are a lot of people involved in the movement and they all have a right to have their say, and everyone will bring their own unique concerns to the table. The complaints about piling on are ridiculous, they have to be able to take staunch criticism and it isn't a secret that there are a lot of people involved. If they want nothing to do with the thread then why are they here? If they're not willing to actually back up their arguments then why are they here? If they come in and make awful arguments, they absolutely deserve to be shit on. If they don't want to be shit on, then they have to start making legitimate, substantive arguments. At no point will I apologize for requiring them to make a valid argument.
[QUOTE=TomatoFlakes;47269470]Well shit, one of my sisters got my IP banned from 8chan /v/ for a shit tumblr raid. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/NZ6SKOA.png[/IMG] Googled the post and found out it was actually a copy-paste job from some twitter user that has used the auto-blocker. I think I need to have a [I]long[/I] talk with 'em.[/QUOTE] Get a VPN connection or setup a proxy on a shit-tier VPS that has decent bandwith.
[QUOTE=Ryo Ohki;47269446]What ties it all together is this idea among the opposition that harasssment targeting your gender (which frankly they seem to apply only to women, as being called a dickless faggot is just shit talking but calling a woman a bitch is sexist and harassment) is ten times worse than any other form. Bollocks, I say. All kinds of harassment is equally bad.[/QUOTE] That is actually a really important point. I get called male-targeted shit all the time and never think anything of it. Hell AGG calls us basement dwelling virgins and the implication (and occasional explicit statement) that I'm a white cismale virgin who lives in his parent's basement never even fazed me. This has just been the nature of the internet for so long that I felt no need to argue it or correct them because I honestly don't give a shit. Now I'm starting to think that maybe I should. Harassment happens online but instead of doing anything about it, AGG simply perpetuates it while blaming it on us. They call us racist and sexist while fixating on our race/sex. They call us bigots while they blanket label an entire group of people. They accuse us of whitewashing while calling all of #NYS sockpuppets. You know what? AGG is right, we do need to do something about the harassment in public spaces of the internet. I say we start with them.
[QUOTE=ichiman94;47269310]Why is this still a thing? I thought people were over it.[/QUOTE] I'll be over it when the industry can own up to their mistakes and favors/cash are no longer exchanged for good reviews and press.
[QUOTE=Tamschi;47269240]Doesn't he use the block bot? I'm fairly certain he had me blocked before all this.[/QUOTE] I am on the blocklist and until yesterday, Tim never had me blocked.
He probably started using it yesterday, considering the amount of people tweeting at him. This is how people get radicalized.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;47269918]He probably started using it yesterday, considering the amount of people tweeting at him. This is how people get radicalized.[/QUOTE] Like I said yesterday, he was also blocking people not on the blocklist and neutrals just for the act of retweeting.
[QUOTE=Fangz;47269956]Like I said yesterday, he was also blocking people not on the blocklist and neutrals just for the act of retweeting.[/QUOTE] These are some of the things he's been favoriting on twitter lately; [t]http://a.pomf.se/iisnmc.png[/t] [URL="https://twitter.com/TimOfLegend/favorites"]Source[/URL]
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