[QUOTE=Wealth + Taste;39605245]I thought you only did that with foreign words or at the end of a native word?[/QUOTE]
Loanwords in Japanese, assuming you're saying them as they're written, don't have any parts omitted.
So ストーブ 'su-toh-bu' for "heater" would still include the 'bu' even though it is derived from the English word 'stove' in which there is no end 'u' sound at all.
[QUOTE=Megafan;39604846]Even then I think you'd hear more of a 'k-' where the 'ku' would have been.[/QUOTE]
If it was a whispered (pronounced but not voiced) 'u' sound, then you'd still write the く in writing. I am referring to the complete omission of く (for i-adjectives) or に (for na-adjectives), e.g. あつくなる->あつなる, へんになる->へんなる. It can only be used in colloquial speech and I think its use varies by region.
[QUOTE=jA_cOp;39605917]If it was a whispered (pronounced but not voiced) 'u' sound, then you'd still write the く in writing. I am referring to the complete omission of く (for i-adjectives) or に (for na-adjectives), e.g. あつくなる->あつなる, へんになる->へんなる. It can only be used in colloquial speech and I think its use varies by region.[/QUOTE]
Well yeah, that's obviously colloquial.
Just started learning japanese 3 days ago. Already OK at it, I can say a dozen different words and identify half a dozen hiragana.
[QUOTE=GmanIsJoker;39634874]Just started learning japanese 3 days ago. Already OK at it, I can say a dozen different words and identify half a dozen hiragana.[/QUOTE]
がんばれ
[QUOTE=jA_cOp;39597660]The inflection of 高い(たかい) here is not correct. You probably meant either:
建物は[B]高い[/B]です。(the building is [B]tall[/B])
or,
建物は[B]高くなった[/B]です。(the building [B]became tall(er)[/B])
(the above translations are not entirely accurate because Japanese does not have articles, and "building" could also be plural)
[/QUOTE]
Forgive me, I'm still a fledgling in Japanese, but wouldn't
[quote]
建物は高くなったです。(the building became tall(er))
[/quote]
actually mean "The building was not tall"? (Or is it purposefully missing the か?) I'm still new to な-adjective and　い-adjective conjugation so this might be one of those exceptions I'm not aware of yet.
Also, I'm curious how long people spend per day studying Japanese. I'm taking a class on campus thats an hour a day, but I'm not sure if that's too much or too little. :s
I actually have an app (Tae-Kim's guide to learning Japanese) on my phone, when I'm bored I read random articles to try an absorb random grammar information. Later, when I have more time, I go through the guide sequentially and take detailed notes. So I have a basic understanding of most of the language, but a more specialized understanding of the basics, and I'm currently working my way up. Other than that, I play Pokemon Gold in Japanese (I posted the pics earlier in the thread) and so far it's helping me a lot with vocab. Once I get better with grammar and overall vocab, I'm going to start learning more kanji. I can identify about 12 different kanji by sight, I just can't write them. I guess writing them isn't terribly important right now, I might learn to later, but for right now I'm going for identification.
[QUOTE=Vaught;39637978]actually mean "The building was not tall"? (Or is it purposefully missing the か?) I'm still new to な-adjective and　い-adjective conjugation so this might be one of those exceptions I'm not aware of yet.
Also, I'm curious how long people spend per day studying Japanese. I'm taking a class on campus thats an hour a day, but I'm not sure if that's too much or too little. :s[/QUOTE]
Actually, "the building was not tall" would be 建物は高くなかったです。
And jA_cOp, is the です in 建物は高くなったです misplaced?
It seems like it should be 建物は高くなったんです or 建物は高くなりました, so perhaps you can clarify.
[QUOTE=Megafan;39640748]
It seems like it should be 建物は高くなったんです or 建物は高くなりました, so perhaps you can clarify.[/QUOTE]
「のだ、のです」and their less formal (as in less 硬い) variants「んだ、んです」are used when the statement is already known or apparent, or when explaining a situation. Conversely, it can also be used in questions where the asker already knows the yes/no of the answer, but wants it confirmed or elaborated upon:
背が伸びた[B]ん[/B]ですか。
はい、10センチほど伸びた[B]ん[/B]です。
The asker suspects the other person to have grown, so 「んですか」 is natural. If the same conversation were to occur over the phone, the answerer would have reason to worry about how the asker knew he had grown (of course, he could have heard from someone else, etc).
Compare
沖縄(おきなわ)に行きましたか。
and
沖縄に行ったんですか。
Using the former, the asker does not know whether the other person went to Okinawa or not, unlike the latter, where the asker has reason to believe the other person did indeed go to Okinawa.
This is one of the harder things to explain correctly (right up there with the は・が particles), but there are resources out there if you search "です んです" and similar terms. I'm sorry if it's still confusing to some.
If the person asking 「沖縄にいきましたか」 already knows or has reason to believe they went to Okinawa and wants an elaboration on that, wouldn't it be easier to ask 「沖縄にどうでしたか」? Or is this one of those cases where the person asking thinks they know but aren't entirely sure?
ごめんなさい。　日本語はちょっとむずかしいですよ。。。
[QUOTE=Vaught;39637978]I'm still new to な-adjective and　い-adjective conjugation so this might be one of those exceptions I'm not aware of yet.[/QUOTE]
高くなった is the combination of 高く(たかく) - the adverb form of 高い(たかい) - and なった, the past tense of the verb なる.
In the case of i-adjectives, adverbs are formed by changing the terminal -i to く: たかい・たかく、あつい・あつく、うつくしい・うつくしく etc.
For na-adjectives, the な changes to に: へんな・へんに、しぜんな・しぜんに、きれいな・きれいに etc.
The verb なる(成る、為る) is not easy to explain in full, but if we limit ourselves to 成る it's easy: it means to become, to result in etc.
By now you can see that 高くなる means "become tall".
As for 高く[B]なかった[/B] (was not tall): this is the combination of the same 高く with the past tense of the i-adjective ない(無い), which negates the meaning. In the present tense, it would be 高くない. This is the same as with verb conjugation, e.g. the past tense of 食べる(たべる)is 食べない (stem of たべる+ない). When conjugating any i-adjective for the past tense, the terminal -i becomes かった: たかい・たかかった、あつい・あつかった、うつくしい・うつくしかった etc. That means ない becomes [B]なかった[/B].
Sometimes these combinations are lumped in as just being inseparable parts of verb and adverb conjugation, but I think it helps to see what is actually going on; it explains why negation is conjugated the same for verbs and adverbs, and "similarly" for i-adjectives: it's all the same i-adjective conjugation.
[editline]20th February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Vaught;39647049]If the person asking 「沖縄にいきましたか」 already knows or has reason to believe they went to Okinawa and wants an elaboration on that, wouldn't it be easier to ask 「沖縄にどうでしたか」? Or is this one of those cases where the person asking thinks they know but aren't entirely sure? [/QUOTE]
To reiterate: using「沖縄にいきましたか」, the asker does not imply any particular answer. The asker "doesn't know", as it were.
If you meant「沖縄に行ったんですか」, then you are perfectly right; the asker does not want to presume the other person went, but has reason to believe it is a possibility. If the answerer did in fact [B]not[/B] go, then it would be natural for the answerer to explain [I]why[/I] he/she didn't go (or even ask why the asker had reason to believe he/she went to Okinawa, if it felt out of the blue).
As for 「沖縄[B]は[/B]どうでしたか」(に -> は), this completely presumes the other person went to Okinawa and asks for elaboration. When using 「沖縄に行ったんですか」, the asker might just want confirmation and not necessarily elaboration; it depends on the context.
Assume the asker to be someone in a position of authority over the answerer, and this example becomes natural:
今日は遅れたんですか。(おくれ)
はい、バスが来なかったんです。
From the context, we know the asker wants confirmation [I]and[/I] an explanation. The answerer uses 「んです」as he/she is explaining the situation.
そうですか。　ありがとうございます。
I think most of the confusion lay with 「高くなった」, though that's just my fault. I think I understand it better now. Thanks for the explanation!
Someone explain why 日本語 means japanese, why isn't just one kanji used for it or something. D:
[QUOTE=Inufin;39661941]Someone explain why 日本語 means japanese, why isn't just one kanji used for it or something. D:[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=DEG_fan;39359932]Well 日本語 does translate to Japanese, but it means the language specifically.
日本 (にほん) - Japan
語 (ご) - language/word
[/QUOTE]
There you are.
If you are describing something, and you say:
おもしろいくて楽しいです。
Can you 'also, it's very hard' by doing this?
でも、とてもむずかしいもです。
Mo is also, and I've seen it before like this...is it what I am trying to say though?
Thanks.
[QUOTE=jA_cOp;39646729]「のだ、のです」and their less formal (as in less 硬い) variants「んだ、んです」are used when the statement is already known or apparent, or when explaining a situation. Conversely, it can also be used in questions where the asker already knows the yes/no of the answer, but wants it confirmed or elaborated upon:
背が伸びた[B]ん[/B]ですか。
はい、10センチほど伸びた[B]ん[/B]です。
The asker suspects the other person to have grown, so 「んですか」 is natural. If the same conversation were to occur over the phone, the answerer would have reason to worry about how the asker knew he had grown (of course, he could have heard from someone else, etc).
Compare
沖縄(おきなわ)に行きましたか。
and
沖縄に行ったんですか。
Using the former, the asker does not know whether the other person went to Okinawa or not, unlike the latter, where the asker has reason to believe the other person did indeed go to Okinawa.
This is one of the harder things to explain correctly (right up there with the は・が particles), but there are resources out there if you search "です んです" and similar terms. I'm sorry if it's still confusing to some.
So anyway, it would be much more likely for 「建物は高くなった[B]ん[/B]です」 to be used in a real conversation, which is why 「建物は高くなったです」sounds so unnatural. It is indeed just as correct, but with slightly different connotations. I didn't want to introduce 「のだ、のです」at the time because as you can tell, it's not related to adverb conjugation and also much harder to explain.[/QUOTE]
I know what ～んです means, it just seemed like you followed up a plain-form verb (高くなった) with です, and that was what I was curious about.
[editline]21st February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Se1f_Distruct;39664829]If you are describing something, and you say:
おもしろいくて楽しいです。
Can you 'also, it's very hard' by doing this?
でも、とてもむずかしいもです。
Mo is also, and I've seen it before like this...is it what I am trying to say though?
Thanks.[/QUOTE]
I can't answer your second question, but you made a small error in the first sentence. When conjugating i-adjectives, you need to omit the い in most cases.
So rather than 面白いくて楽しい, you'd write 面白くて楽しい.
[QUOTE=Megafan;39667573]I know what ~んです means, it just seemed like you followed up a plain-form verb (高くなった) with です, and that was what I was curious about.[/QUOTE]
Oops, fixed.
(plain form) verb + です being two consecutive verbs, is indeed nonsense.
[QUOTE=jA_cOp;39669810]Oops, fixed.
(plain form) verb + です being two consecutive verbs, is indeed nonsense.[/QUOTE]
Ah, that makes more sense then.
[QUOTE=Megafan;39667573]I know what ～んです means, it just seemed like you followed up a plain-form verb (高くなった) with です, and that was what I was curious about.
[editline]21st February 2013[/editline]
I can't answer your second question, but you made a small error in the first sentence. When conjugating i-adjectives, you need to omit the い in most cases.
So rather than 面白いくて楽しい, you'd write 面白くて楽しい.[/QUOTE]
ごめん。 I always forget to cut the い。
In other news,
らい週にしけんがありますよ。勉強しなければなりません。
Next week, there is a test. I must study for it.
[editline]21st February 2013[/editline]
Also, Megafan.
どうして日本語が上手ですか？日本人ですか？
[QUOTE=Megafan;39674306]日本人じゃありません。実は、中学校と高校で日本語を六年間勉強しました。それに、小さい時に中国語も勉強したので、日本語が等しいと思いました。
今、大学一年生に専攻分野は日本語と国際関係ですよ。[/QUOTE]
僕はあなたが日本人と思いました。あなたがとても上手です！僕は高校の三年生です。下手です。そして、たくさん漢字がしりませんよ。
I could understand that very well though, even though I have no idea what these 漢字　are:
実, 等, 専,攻,分,野,際,関,係
^－－－－－-＾ I recognize though.
More to learn, I guess!
Also, my 先生 tells me that studying 漢字 gets easier past the first 400-600. そうですか？
[QUOTE=Se1f_Distruct;39674395]僕はあなたが日本人と思いました。あなたがとても上手です！僕は高校の三年生です。下手です。そして、たくさん漢字がしりませんよ。[/quote]
今のあなたは日本語で苦手ですけど、練習はまだまだ続きますよ。
[QUOTE=Se1f_Distruct;39674395]I could understand that very well though, even though I have no idea what these 漢字　are:
実, 等, 専,攻,分,野,際,関,係
^－－－－－-＾ I recognize though.
More to learn, I guess!
Also, my 先生 tells me that studying 漢字 gets easier past the first 400-600. そうですか？[/QUOTE]
As for this, it entirely depends on your situation. If you're better at rote memorization of characters than memorizing conjugation rules, then the kanji will be the easiest part of Japanese for you. Perhaps after learning around ~500 you're about a quarter through the Jouyou Kanji, assuming that all the ones you learn are from the list of course.
一番いいだ！
[img]http://puu.sh/26peX[/img]
Ehh, 3/4 of the way through? I'm a bit flaky at remembering some of the less used ones though, I really should go back and review them.
So i've been learning japanese with the Nintendo DS "My japanese coach" and it goes pretty well. Only part is the writing is pretty hard but i write them down on a paper so i can remember.
I've learned to count to 15.
Ichi, Ni, San, Yon, Go, Roku, Shichi, Hachi, Kyuu, Juu, Juuichi, Juuni, Juusan, Juuyon, Juugo.
Now i need to write it in japanese symbols though, pretty hard to do.
And i'm learning the colors in the basics!
Shiroi = White, Kuroi = Black, Midori, Akai etc...
And i have a question, how can i type into japanese on my keyboard? (Probably has been answered already)
Arigato!
You can install the Google IME or enable the Japanese keyboard in the keyboard options of windows itself.
[B]VERY excited[/B]. I am in a taiko group (with my school) and we are going to San Francisco this year (we did last year too).
Last year we went to meet Seiichi Tanaka (the man who brought taiko to the US); we saw San Francisco Taiko Dojo practice and perform (the first taiko group in the US that Seiichi Tanaka found and teaches). We also when to the Cherry Blossom Festival in Japan Town, San Fran.
We're doing the same thing this year except we are actually performing in the Cherry Blossom Festival.
What's even more exciting is that we're going to Japan next semester's winter break. I'm so pumped!
[QUOTE=DEG_fan;39701347][B]VERY excited[/B]. I am in a taiko group (with my school) and we are going to San Francisco this year (we did last year too).
Last year we went to meet Seiichi Tanaka (the man who brought taiko to the US); we saw San Francisco Taiko Dojo practice and perform (the first taiko group in the US that Seiichi Tanaka found and teaches). We also when to the Cherry Blossom Festival in Japan Town, San Fran.
We're doing the same thing this year except we are actually performing in the Cherry Blossom Festival.
What's even more exciting is that we're going to Japan next semester's winter break. I'm so pumped![/QUOTE]
Speaking of which, is anyone else here from the Bay Area that would be interested in the Cherry Blossom Festival? I went last year and it's great fun, so I highly recommend it.
[QUOTE=Megafan;39704348]Speaking of which, is anyone else here from the Bay Area that would be interested in the Cherry Blossom Festival? I went last year and it's great fun, so I highly recommend it.[/QUOTE]
Make sure you watch taiko this year! I will be the dude with the large fro.
I seriously look like Afro Samurai when I wear my ハチマキ.
I went to the Kinokuniya bookstore for the first time. I was awestruck. The [b]whole[/b] first floor is all manga. It's pretty hard finding manga in LA now being that all the book stores are gone.
Last year I had tons of free time. I might be able to hang out for a while.
Something else that was awesome was the 餅つき(もちつき). Very fun to watch!
[QUOTE=DEG_fan;39704663]Make sure you watch taiko this year! I will be the dude with the large fro.
I seriously look like Afro Samurai when I wear my ハチマキ.
I went to the Kinokuniya bookstore for the first time. I was awestruck. The [b]whole[/b] first floor is all manga. It's pretty hard finding manga in LA now being that all the book stores are gone.
Last year I had tons of free time. I might be able to hang out for a while.
Something else that was awesome was the 餅つき(もちつき). Very fun to watch![/QUOTE]
Yeah, Japan-Town in SF is certainly the most impressive one of its kind in the US.
Can anyone recommend a kanji practice program that isn't just flashcards? I know a few hundred already but it would really help to have a way to learn more without just manually going through a dictionary or setting up hundreds of cards.
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