[QUOTE=ScoutKing;24506549]this sums up my reply to hostel, im tired of reasoning with his glenn beck like logic.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=feB7Oc8rw1o[/media]
/thread
[editline]02:48AM[/editline]
if your going to call me out on my grammar LEARN THE DIFFERENCE FROM BE AND ME[/QUOTE]
There's a difference between typos, and those who have their sentences full of errors on purpose. That difference between you and him is very obvious. His saying that you're grammar is making you lose credibility is right, because all the while I was reading your arguments, I couldn't stop from cringing at the thought that I was reading something a twelve year old would have written.
Also, whether or not I agree with Hostel, he did bring up good arguments, and he actually took time to write up a clear response as opposed to your fast-typing-getting-a-point-across-as-fast-as-possible-while-ignoring-sound-arguments, so please stop acting like your word is the absolute truth.
[QUOTE=ScoutKing;24507919]yeah people getting sensitive over Muslims over 9/11 is illogical seeing it was radicals that did it.
I mean abortion clinic bombings and shootings are not tainted with Christians.
so let me rephrase it, look at it from their stand point, why should they have to work around people feelings, giving up some of their rights, their right to build a mosque and worship on the land they bought for peoples feels and sensitivity over the issue that is illogical to begin with?[/QUOTE]
From your perspective, Muslims do have the right to practice their religion, and they already do. At this point, building the community center should do two things, establish our freedom of religion in the United States, but also reassures radical Islamists (not extremist) that we are soft and pushovers in their perspective, and it will give them more confidence in doing other provocative things.
OH MY GOD, to those who replied to my post (excluding Scoutking), I did NOT say that the mosque represents the terrorists, nor that all Muslims are responsible for 9/11. Did you even read my entire post?
[QUOTE=Run&Gun12;24508059]OH MY GOD, to those who replied to my post (excluding Scoutking), I did NOT say that the mosque represents the terrorists, nor that all Muslims are responsible for 9/11. Did you even read my entire post?[/QUOTE]
The logic they have, and I agree to an extent if I parallel it, is that if the people who are trying to build the community center are not linked to the terrorist in any way, why does it offend people?
[QUOTE=ScoutKing;24507919]yeah people getting sensitive over Muslims over 9/11 is illogical seeing it was radicals that did it.
I mean abortion clinic bombings and shootings are not tainted with Christians.
so let me rephrase it, look at it from their stand point, why should they have to work around people feelings, giving up some of their rights, their right to build a mosque and worship on the land they bought for peoples feels and sensitivity over the issue that is illogical to begin with?[/QUOTE]
You make a great point, I would imagine that the victims' families would be affected by the depression and "shock value" of the whole situaiton, and because of that they might feel a bit entitled to a slight bending of the rules to remain sensitive to their pain. This is understandable, but rights are rights. I guess all we could really ask for would be to move the mosque at least a block or two away, but it seems it's far too late to make that compromise. If they want to build a mosque, them built it, but was it completely necessary to intentionally land the build site right next to the twin tower's site? If the non-radicals wanted to show their peacefulness and non-extremism, one way they could is by moving it back a little, out of respect for the country. But, as I said before, it's probably too late for that anyway.
how dare they build something they have every right to
[QUOTE=Hostel;24508058]From your perspective, Muslims do have the right to practice their religion, and they already do. At this point, building the community center should do two things, establish our freedom of religion in the United States, but also reassures radical Islamists (not extremist) that we are soft and pushovers in their perspective, and it will give them more confidence in doing other provocative things.[/QUOTE]
I wouldn't be surprised if the FBI/CIA kept tabs on who went through the community center with this much press and fear of radicalism.
You can let them build it, if you feel like its going to help radicals, go to the community center and keep a eye on it, see shit like people plotting to do shit, report it.
Now im not saying you should move to new york, but someone should keep a eye on them if the country is so paranoid, but thats a different debate.
[editline]04:18AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Run&Gun12;24508133]You make a great point, I would imagine that the victims' families would be affected by the depression and "shock value" of the whole situaiton, and because of that they might feel a bit entitled to a slight bending of the rules to remain sensitive to their pain. This is understandable, but rights are rights. I guess all we could really ask for would be to move the mosque at least a block or two away, but it seems it's far too late to make that compromise. If they want to build a mosque, them built it, but was it completely necessary to intentionally land the build site right next to the twin tower's site? If the non-radicals wanted to show their peacefulness and non-extremism, one way they could is by moving it back a little, out of respect for the country. But, as I said before, it's probably too late for that anyway.[/QUOTE]
6 blocks isn't right next to the twin towers... I mean next thing I know I could say a bank in that 6 block radius is being bad tastes cause its next door... the bank isn't associated with 9/11, and neither are Muslims.. RADICALS are.
people need to distinguish logically the difference between Muslims and radicals that hide behind Islam
[editline]04:20AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=NightmareXx;24508166]how dare they build something they have every right to[/QUOTE]
exactly, and if you disagree, your a illogical,intolerant, bigot.
No exceptions, they have the right, there is a reason there is the bill of rights.
Stop trying to have your feelings, illogical paradoxes and intolerance cloud it.
The entire situation is derp.
[QUOTE=ScoutKing;24508191]6 blocks isn't right next to the twin towers... I mean next thing I know I could say a bank in that 6 block radius is being bad tastes cause its next door... the bank isn't associated with 9/11, and neither are Muslims.. RADICALS are.
people need to distinguish logically the difference between Muslims and radicals that hide behind Islam[/QUOTE]
Really, 6 blocks? I'm not so sure how close that is, technically speaking. Still, people demand "action", and they're going to fight claw and teeth to oppose this, so I guess this was expected.
Geez, I've never talked like this in a long time. This is why I hate politics, there's never an easy solution to the actions and arguments revolving around them. I always try to just avoid them, without trying to sound blatantly ignorant of shallow here. The sad truth is, I know that eventually I will be forced to follow these stories, as much as I detest some of them...
[QUOTE=ScoutKing;24508191]
exactly, and if you disagree, your a illogical,intolerant, bigot.
No exceptions, they have the right, there is a reason there is the bill of rights.
Stop trying to have your feelings, illogical paradoxes and intolerance cloud it.[/QUOTE]
The Bill of Rights and the first amendment doesn't protect all forms of freedom of speech, expression, etc. There was been special times when congress has limited peoples rights.
If the opposition keeps on getting looked at as people getting offended because of 9/11 almost 10 years ago, you might as well just build a huge Mosque palace right on top of whatever memorial they have at ground zero, because that is the opposition that is full of illogical zealots. I think the better word is Zealot, a bigot also expresses great animosity to differing opinions.
[QUOTE=Hostel;24500453]Keep the "you kids" out of this please. It's like what Pat said, even though we have the right to bear arms, we still need a license and even then we may not be able to own a gun or carry it anywhere. So, we does something become so provocative and outspoken that not even our first amendment will protect it?[/QUOTE]
Never, hopefully.
[editline]04:54AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Run&Gun12;24508575]Really, 6 blocks? I'm not so sure how close that is, technically speaking. Still, people demand "action", and they're going to fight claw and teeth to oppose this, so I guess this was expected.
Geez, I've never talked like this in a long time. This is why I hate politics, there's never an easy solution to the actions and arguments revolving around them. I always try to just avoid them, without trying to sound blatantly ignorant of shallow here. The sad truth is, I know that eventually I will be forced to follow these stories, as much as I detest some of them...[/QUOTE]
There is no hope. Just tell everyone to fuck off any go live in the mountains while they choke on their own feces.
[QUOTE=Hostel;24508131]The logic they have, and I agree to an extent if I parallel it, is that if the people who are trying to build the community center are not linked to the terrorist in any way, why does it offend people?[/QUOTE]
some bullshit about them conquering america
[editline]01:14AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Run&Gun12;24508133]You make a great point, I would imagine that the victims' families would be affected by the depression and "shock value" of the whole situaiton, and because of that they might feel a bit entitled to a slight bending of the rules to remain sensitive to their pain. This is understandable, but rights are rights. I guess all we could really ask for would be to move the mosque at least a block or two away, but it seems it's far too late to make that compromise. If they want to build a mosque, them built it, but was it completely necessary to intentionally land the build site right next to the twin tower's site? If the non-radicals wanted to show their peacefulness and non-extremism, one way they could is by moving it back a little, out of respect for the country. But, as I said before, it's probably too late for that anyway.[/QUOTE]
I honestly think anyone who is opposed to the building of the community center is a disrespect to America and what it stands for.
[editline]01:14AM[/editline]
"freedom"
this guy is a dick, he needs to relax and smoke a J
[img]http://www.cracked.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/map2.jpg[/img]
What the fuck is wrong with that location? It's not right across the street or anything.
[QUOTE=vagrant;24512691][img]http://www.cracked.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/map2.jpg[/img]
What the fuck is wrong with that location? It's not right across the street or anything.[/QUOTE]
From the best of my knowledge, the prayer room is built in a place so it is visible from ground zero.
The fact that it wouldn't even be discussed to be built elsewhere should mean something to people. The developer is not your average American Muslim, he is a traditional Islamist which means he follows the Quran text accurately. He is a supporter of Sharia Law and he is not putting this community center down 500 feet away from Ground Zero to exercise religious freedom in the United States, he is doing it to prove to him and others like him that America has become culturally sensitive. He is dipping his toe in the water so to speak. There are some Muslims who oppose building the community center because they have taken notice of this. Before long in our lifetime, some Islamic scholar or politician will come along and propose Sharia Law in the United States. Sharia Law has been around for two years in the UK despite having only an 8% Muslim population.
So to set the record straight, there are some Islamist that I do oppose because of the fact they are radical and hold values and ideas that clash with America's standards. On the other hand, there are also many Muslims in America who interpret the Quran differently and do not embrace this Sharia Law which is supposedly "God's Law".
No, you can't even see the place from ground zero.
[editline]11:32AM[/editline]
here's a better picture though
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7e/World_Trade_Center_Site_9-23-01_with_Cordoba_House_location.jpg/600px-World_Trade_Center_Site_9-23-01_with_Cordoba_House_location.jpg[/img]
[editline]11:33AM[/editline]
also stop calling him an islamist. He's not one of them.
this entire argument is stupid. they have the rights, end of. stop complaining.
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