[QUOTE=Ond kaja;29495928]My point is that crime like this can fought other ways than with direct confrontation with firearms. There are political actions that can be taken to evade you from winding up in circumstances that will eventually lead you to trying to kill this woman.[/QUOTE]
What political action?
I feel like it's a pipe dream to assume that ridding the world of poverty will be the magical cure-all for the problem of violence.
Violence will always exist. It may be lessened, but it will never go away. People will always want what someone else has, and hell, some people will do violent things just because they can, or are mentally unstable.
To say that someone should be expected to rely on less-lethal means (And stun guns and tazers can sometimes kill as well) is a bit silly.
When someone comes into your home with the intention of harming you (and it's never safe to assume they just want your things and to be on their way) then you should be able to respond in a way that keeps you safe. It's sad but true. Guns are a solution.
Because they are the only real way to distance yourself from the attacker, and end the altercation. Unfortunately with deadly results sometimes.
But there's also the idea that someone may have a gun that could help prevent a break in in the first place.
Less lethal is nice as an idea, but until it gets perfected to the point of actually being able to render an attacker non-lethal themselves, it's just not a valid idea.
Even with a security system, you still have 5 to even 30 minutes depending on where you live, to fend for yourself until help arrives. That's time i don't want to spend with someone who for all i know, is bat shit insane.
[QUOTE=Roo-kie;29494772]gun culture sucks
it's whats wrong with america
the rest of the world doesn't have anywhere near as much gun related crime or violence, seems it comes down to america having the constitutional right to own guns[/QUOTE]
Gun culture most certainly does suck, and I'm completely for regulating them, but I just can't bring myself to support sweeping bans or anything
I don't want the guns laws changed in the UK. I feel safe enough as it is and I don't want to see a dramatic relaxation of gun laws because who knows how it'll affect us until it actually happens.
I don't know much about the situation in the US but here in France we don't really need guns to protect our family from a possible aggression because it is very unlikely to happens. Possessing a gun only because you are afraid of an attack would just be paranoia, especially if you've never been attacked before.
I don't own any weapon and I feel safe. Why would the US people need guns that much to feel protected?
[QUOTE=pedrus24;29496916]I don't know much about the situation in the US but here in France we don't really need guns to protect our family from a possible aggression because it is very unlikely to happens. Possessing a gun only because you are afraid of an attack would just be paranoia, especially if you've never been attacked before.
I don't own any weapon and I feel safe. Why would the US people need guns that much to feel protected?[/QUOTE]
Well people who think guns are necessary for protection are the part of gun culture that everyone finds so annoying, but gun bans interfere with hunters, sport shooters, or collectors so they're still not a good idea
[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;29495674]So, your idea is that a woman, say she's about 100 pounds, and 5 foot 5 inches, has a guy my size, 6'2" and 200 pounds break in at night, and pepper spray is supposed to keep me from killing her? It may be uncomfortable, but it's definitely not going to end the confrontation. She would have to somehow spray them, and then manage to avoid the person long enough to call 911, then make it for the 10, possibly 20 minutes she's alone. This also assumes i don't have a knife, or anything like that, or worse still, a gun i got illegally, that she can't defend against, because she thinks pepper spray will save her.
That's the problem, pepper spray, mace, tazers, are all meant to incapacitate someone, to allow them to be brought under control. They aren't an end to an engagement, only a means to it.[/QUOTE]
She can escape while the dude is stunned and call for help.
It's fun to watch people argue about issues I don't care much about.
[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;29494359]Is your computer needed for your job, or to support your life?
Oh, it's not? Well, guess you don't need it. Time to pitch that fucker out the window.[/QUOTE]
Can I use my computer to kill several people in rapid succession? No? Then there isn't a reason why you should be denied the ability to buy it.
[editline]28th April 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Jo The Shmo;29494983]I think there should be more gun control, especially on pistols.
Guns are perfectly fine for responsible people to have, and I think there should definitely be plenty of guns to go around. It's part of being American.
If you are a responsible gun owner, having stricter gun control laws shouldn't impede your ability to purchase guns, because you will easily be able to prove that you know how to handle owning a gun.
However, this [i]would[/i] help to prevent irresponsible people from getting their hands on guns.
About the pistol thing, they are the leading cause of firearm related death by a longshot, and I think they should be treated with the same amount of danger-level as other firearms.[/QUOTE]
Good to see a worthwhile post here. This thread has been taken over by angsty teenagers who don't realize more freedom can be a bad thing.
[QUOTE=Optional Pirate;29493246]Fuck everyone, I want guns so I can be like FPS Russia.[/QUOTE]
osst vorry gooood wehpon
[editline]28th April 2011[/editline]
My house is protected by shotguns 3 days a week, you guess which 3
Basically where we are now in US seems ok
No full autos since thats just silly
less bans on "scary" guns
NO fucking ban on importing shotguns (what the fuck man)
No 6 month period between each handgun purchase
Bayonettes? why the fuck not!
Supressors? Why the fuck not!
500 round magazines? Yes i had a heart attack too
[QUOTE=c0nk3r;29497416]osst vorry gooood wehpon
[editline]28th April 2011[/editline]
My house is protected by shotguns 3 days a week, you guess which 3
Basically where we are now in US seems ok
No full autos since thats just silly
less bans on "scary" guns
NO fucking ban on importing shotguns (what the fuck man)
No 6 month period between each handgun purchase
Bayonettes? why the fuck not!
Supressors? Why the fuck not!
500 round magazines? Yes i had a heart attack too[/QUOTE]
Wait what counts as a "scary" gun?
[QUOTE=Big Orca;29497626]Wait what counts as a "scary" gun?[/QUOTE]
from what i can tell anything that looks like it could be used in a war
barrel shrouds :3:
I think there should be very little restrictions in terms of gun control, so long as there are permits one must obtain to own them, i.e. a permit for handguns, rifles, and shotguns, and maybe a separate permit for more dangerous firearms, such as those of higher calibers and/or automatic weapons. But once you've proven that you've got a clean record, and are not a dumbass, I think you should be able to get just about anything.
I think you should have to jump through some hoops, mandatory classes, a license, etc. to own Guns. I'm completely against banning guns of ANY type, but I'm all for regulations as to who can own them. Rate me what you like, that's my opinion.
what does itt mean
[QUOTE=James Dean;29498064]what does itt mean[/QUOTE]
in this thread
[QUOTE=pedrus24;29496916]I don't know much about the situation in the US but here in France we don't really need guns to protect our family from a possible aggression because it is very unlikely to happens. Possessing a gun only because you are afraid of an attack would just be paranoia, especially if you've never been attacked before.
I don't own any weapon and I feel safe. Why would the US people need guns that much to feel protected?[/QUOTE]
It's three birds with one stone for me.
I have a fascination and curiosity with firearms and how they work, I like collecting them and if shit gets bad I can use them for defense.
My favorite answer for when someone asks 'Why do you have guns?'
A: Because I can.
Has anyone ever heard of the "Arm everyone with a handgun" theory? I'm not advocating it (so don't hit that 'dumb' button just yet) I'm just wondering what everyone thinks about it. It basically consists of having mandatory classes in school and rigorous training programs on gun use and control, as well as situational awareness and deciding when (if ever) is the correct time to use a gun. Supposedly this would eliminate the irrational fear of guns some people have and maybe if someone's psychological profile dictated they weren't fit to have a gun then they wouldn't get one. Everyone else would be issued a handgun to carry at all times. Supposedly it would act as a deterrent to bank robberies and rampages because once someone starts shooting anyone around them would take them down using their gun and their situational training. It also makes a counter point to the criticism that people might become enraged and use their gun out of anger by saying that even if the theory wasn't in place they would still have the motivation to get a gun and use it, and intensive training would minimize the chance of this happening to begin with. I don't agree with that because most states have a waiting period of several days when purchasing handguns, and since it is unlikely that someone would go postal with a hunting rifle or a Mosin Nagant I think that the current laws take care of situations like that very well right now and strapping a gun to everyone would make that occur more often.
[QUOTE=Big Orca;29497151]Can I use my computer to kill several people in rapid succession? No? Then there isn't a reason why you should be denied the ability to buy it.
[editline]28th April 2011[/editline]
Good to see a worthwhile post here. This thread has been taken over by angsty teenagers who don't realize more freedom can be a bad thing.[/QUOTE]
You could use your computer to commit crime, like identity theft or hacking and stealing information.
Everything can have a bad use. It's stupid to ban it for that reason.
[QUOTE=Big Orca;29497151]Can I use my computer to kill several people in rapid succession? No? Then there isn't a reason why you should be denied the ability to buy it.[/QUOTE]
With the right experience and planning you could kill several people in rapid succession with a compound bow or a katana, but no one is jumping on those.
[QUOTE=rivershark;29498727]With the right experience and planning you could kill several people in rapid succession with a compound bow or a katana, but no one is jumping on those.[/QUOTE]
Exactly. People seem to live in some fantasy world, where banning firearms makes everything better. Bad guys no longer have them, and crime disappears.
Apparently thinking otherwise makes you "an angsty teen"
[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;29498803]Exactly. People seem to live in some fantasy world, where banning firearms makes everything better. Bad guys no longer have them, and crime disappears.
Apparently thinking otherwise makes you "an angsty teen"[/QUOTE]
Big Orca isn't calling people who don't want guns banned angsty teens. He's saying that no gun control is a bad thing, which I agree with.
I'd rather have everyone owning a gun rather then only the criminals having guns. Then again, it depends on how mature the society is. A place like Japan could probably pull it off, Switzerland already does it, but I doubt a place like NA or other places could handle it seriously.
[QUOTE=ChilColdCoolaid;29498965]Big Orca isn't calling people who don't want guns banned angsty teens. He's saying that no gun control is a bad thing, which I agree with.[/QUOTE]
Fair enough, my miss-read.
I think there should definitely be tight gun control.
I would even be willing to say they need to find some way to deal with the gunshow sales (Though that may be tough, considering some only last a day or two, which is too short for a background check. Maybe pre-screening then you are required to register to attent and purchase?).
It just gets old hearing the same "BUT SOME COUNTRIES DON'T HAVE GUNS AND NO ONE EVER DIES!" argument.
[QUOTE=TheSupahero;29493459]Gun control is a fool's dream. Strict gun control only makes good citizens into even better victims. Do you honestly believe that a criminal would abide by the law in order to purchase a firearm and then commit a crime? No, they wouldn't. They acquire them through illegal means. So Joe Average that is about to get mugged or have his house broken into in the middle of the night will have a difficult time protecting his family and property with strict gun laws. I'm not saying there should be no restriction, not at all. But they could be a bit lighter for the law-abiding citizens.[/QUOTE]
Pretty negligible amount of gun crime in Australia with our heavy regulation, it's not a pipe-dream, but it would certainly be hard to implement in a country with the mindset that because something is a right, it is somehow necessary and inhumane to have taken away.
I get annoyed when people assume the situation in X country is the same as in Y country.
[QUOTE=JohnStamosFan;29498803]Exactly. People seem to live in some fantasy world, where banning firearms makes everything better. Bad guys no longer have them, and crime disappears.
Apparently thinking otherwise makes you "an angsty teen"[/QUOTE]
A katana isn't a mass produced weapon available at department stores for $100.
If I'm not mistaken, knife crime in Britain went up dramatically after the stricter gun laws were implemented, up to the point where Labour were thinking of banning pointed knives. If someone really wants someone else dead, they will find a way to kill them, no matter what is legal/accessible. You get rid of guns, they'll use knives. Get rid of those, they'll use blunt objects, rope, cars, hell they may even use water to kill them. A mystical crime-free utopia cannot and will not ever exist, because there will ALWAYS be at least one bad person who'll come along eventually.
I believe that gun [i]control[/i] and gun [i]ban[/i] are two different things completely, unlike most "gun control" advocates in Canada. I believe you can have excellent gun control without a single gun being technically "banned," only very difficult to get, through things such as restricting certain types of guns (autos) to people who are either ex/current-military/police, and/or can provide some hell of a reason and undergo some hell of regulation (inspection, even GPS tracking of the firearm and its actions) to possess more "high-risk" firearms, which may have to include some way to disable or track the firearm if it is reported stolen. The issue with this is laying out a plan to people that involves the ability to technically get more guns. Because of some ridiculous bias that the media and a lot of politicians in Ontario against guns (they flipped shit when a gun club auctioned off a pistol to someone with the appropriate license) most people treat gun as a sort of "devil's word" that can only possibly be associated with evil, and they've heard it so much that it's the only opinion they seem to believe anymore, and almost never listen to the opposition on the issue.
Personally, I'd like to see the Hughes Amendment of FOPA '86 repealed (not all of FOPA, since it's mostly a good piece of legislation). It was snuck in, essentially, and serves no real purpose.
To anyone who doesn't know exactly what I mean, the Hughes Amendment is the one that forced the registration of all full-autos and stopped any more from entering the market.
Contrary to popular belief, full-auto capability isn't all that dangerous. The *only* things it's good for are suppressive fire and very, [i]very[/i] close-quarters combat.
[QUOTE=BrQ;29493422]Guns are illegal here (except for hunting and sports, obviously only with a permit) and from what I know and hear, gun violence is pretty rare here and I think it's fine if we keep it this way.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=3083618&page=1[/url]
If you take away guns from the general public, who will be left with guns? The people that don't follow the laws, the people that would use the guns to hurt people. And guess what, If the criminals know that none of the general public has guns, they won't be afraid of committing those crimes.
You can't stop guns from getting into the country, it's just not viable.
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