Corruption in gaming journalism discussion and update thread. - General

[QUOTE=Tamschi;46185678]That link still gives them pageviews ⇒ [URL="https://archive.today/WggKP"]archive.today[/URL] ([editline]edit[/editline] [URL="http://web.archive.org/web/20141008184126/http://www.theverge.com/2014/10/8/6919179/stop-supporting-gamergate"]sane layout but no images on archive.org[/URL]) Holy shit, that's possibly the worst one yet. At least it's grounds for many angry emails.[/QUOTE] I really fail to understand how these people can miss so many points when this has been going on for two months now. If it all unfolded in a week and there was just some massive inflation of information flying everywhere I can understand confusion or concern, but geezus fucking Christ guys. The fact that they hate on Christina Hoff Summers, a fucking through and through left-wing feminist, or that the purpose of #notyourshield flew right over their fucking head with the excuse that it's a 4chan conspiracy, blows my God damn mind. These people are so fucking disingenuous it looks like parody. I'm constantly surprised at how much I can be blown away by ignorance.

[QUOTE=Banned?;46187214]I really fail to understand how these people can miss so many points when this has been going on for two months now. If it all unfolded in a week and there was just some massive inflation of information flying everywhere I can understand confusion or concern, but geezus fucking Christ guys. The fact that they hate on Christina Hoff Summers, a fucking through and through left-wing feminist, or that the purpose of #notyourshield flew right over their fucking head with the excuse that it's a 4chan conspiracy, blows my God damn mind. These people are so fucking disingenuous it looks like parody. I'm constantly surprised at how much I can be blown away by ignorance.[/QUOTE] Sister-company of Polygon.

[QUOTE=Banned?;46187214]I really fail to understand how these people can miss so many points when this has been going on for two months now. If it all unfolded in a week and there was just some massive inflation of information flying everywhere I can understand confusion or concern, but geezus fucking Christ guys. The fact that they hate on Christina Hoff Summers, a fucking through and through left-wing feminist, or that the purpose of #notyourshield flew right over their fucking head with the excuse that it's a 4chan conspiracy, blows my God damn mind. These people are so fucking disingenuous it looks like parody. I'm constantly surprised at how much I can be blown away by ignorance.[/QUOTE] They probably know that they're missing the points, but that's so they can twist the story in their own words. They are the corrupt journalists that we're fighting against, after all.

[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;46179508]To be honest, my eyes rolled back into my head when I saw that 'trigger warning' box. If I may put: Reimu, while I adore what you've done and agree that abuse is bad, I must respectfully disagree on the usage of such 'trigger warnings.' I find it incredibly insulting to actual PTSD victims that many of these (if I may call them) 'special snowflakes' claim to need trigger warnings on a website when reading about something that merely gets them a bit mad. I have more than a few people in my family who've been in the army and have had to face off with the consequences of it, including my father, and I can tell you right now not a god damn one of them gets 'triggered' by some website article. This is a little derailing to the threads purpose, but I think it needs to be said. I really think there needs to be a discussion about this topic at some point, but not right now obviously; there are much bigger fish to fry at the moment (GamerGate).[/QUOTE] I'm currently writing something up where I talk about Trigger Warnings, been meaning to do it for ages. I agree with everything you've said, especially when such TW's are in the tag sections of post which are at the very bottom of post, so if anyone was to get "triggered" it would've been too late. It's a really shit way to advise people about content, why people can't use a disclaimer and say that it may offend certain groups I'll never understand Sorry for going off topic

[QUOTE=fruxodaily;46187638]I'm currently writing something up where I talk about Trigger Warnings, been meaning to do it for ages. I agree with everything you've said, especially when such TW's are in the tag sections of post which are at the very bottom of post, so if anyone was to get "triggered" it would've been too late. It's a really shit way to advise people about content, why people can't use [B]a disclaimer and say that it may offend certain groups I'll never understand[/B] Sorry for going off topic[/QUOTE] That's what a trigger warning is when done right though? An incredible concise warning about the material covered in something. Trigger warnings by themselves are a totally fine concept, and actually can be quite useful. But as per normal, the tag-along wannabe social justice "activists" missed the point entirely. It has nothing to do with being a "special snowflake" like people keep spouting ad nausium, it's not demeaning to people who have actually suffered trauma (considering it's intended to warn them of possible triggers, it's helpful), it's just misused by idiots, as is a lot of stuff in social justice.

[QUOTE=fruxodaily;46187638]I'm currently writing something up where I talk about Trigger Warnings, been meaning to do it for ages. I agree with everything you've said, especially when such TW's are in the tag sections of post which are at the very bottom of post, so if anyone was to get "triggered" it would've been too late. It's a really shit way to advise people about content, why people can't use a disclaimer and say that it may offend certain groups I'll never understand Sorry for going off topic[/QUOTE] I think most people on Tumblr just block their triggers. If it's not a main feature it's definitely easily possible with XKit (which probably pretty much everyone uses since without that the site is terrible).

Trigger warnings have been ridiculously bastardized on places like tumblr. The idea behind TW's is to put disclaimers on syllabi so people don't have panic attacks (don't mean "getting nervous" but "full mental breakdown in middle of class") when engaging with course material and films. Unfortunately, one of my friends has PTSD from sexual assault, and I remember her telling me about her panic attack during the middle of class. She accidentally attended a film screening in class where someone realizes she was sexually assaulted. That triggered her trauma. In her own words, she looked and acted like an animal, and had to run out of the class sobbing. That's what TW's are for. Give students the extra information they need to understand what they'll be engaging in during class - or, better yet, whether to take a course or not. It's about academic transparency, and it's about transparency for people with debilitating mental illnesses.

[QUOTE=hexpunK;46187688]That's what a trigger warning is when done right though? An incredible concise warning about the material covered in something. Trigger warnings by themselves are a totally fine concept, and actually can be quite useful. But as per normal, the tag-along wannabe social justice "activists" missed the point entirely. It has nothing to do with being a "special snowflake" like people keep spouting ad nausium, it's not demeaning to people who have actually suffered trauma (considering it's intended to warn them of possible triggers, it's helpful), it's just misused by idiots, as is a lot of stuff in social justice.[/QUOTE] To be fair there were quite a lot of suggestions about a year ago that games should have warnings in the form of "Trigger warning: Rape!" which is just stupid. The current PEGI/ESRB content ratings are fine, if something has the "Sexual violence" marker on it it probably contains rape or something similar. People forget that they are supposed to be general warning that people can investigate themselves, not specific warning for every possible occurrence of something that might cause a panic attack.

[QUOTE=Janus Vesta;46187809]To be fair there were quite a lot of suggestions about a year ago that games should have warnings in the form of "Trigger warning: Rape!" which is just stupid. The current PEGI/ESRB content ratings are fine, if something has the "Sexual violence" marker on it it probably contains rape or something similar. People forget that they are supposed to be general warning that people can investigate themselves, not specific warning for every possible occurrence of something that might cause a panic attack.[/QUOTE] The ERSB rating system works pretty well as a trigger warning-esque thing, it's just really vague in places, I remember there being a "Sexual Violence" rating, but that does cover quite a few things, so for someone casually browsing it might be hard to actually work out if that means full on rape, or something else entirely that might not be an issue for them. Though it usually covers harassment and molestation, not many games dare play with rape as a plot device, well, explicitly stated rape anyway.

[QUOTE=Tamschi;46186967]That was an enjoyable watch, she definitely likes speaking in front of people. (I'm entirely serious.) You can tell she's very much pandering to her audience, in the parts where she calls for action of some kind. I'm not doubting she's hurt by the harassment though, unlike with Jayd3Fox that comes through clearly.[/QUOTE] [quote][video=youtube;yIpw3wHn9Sk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIpw3wHn9Sk[/video][/quote] Hm... so the stuttering she downplayed as amusement was because she was lying about it being fictional, not because of her feeling hurt. That explains why I didn't manage to match it to anything I know, people around me generally aren't that manipulative. I still consider the previous part where she cites examples to be honest though. (I'm not judging her for the manipulation btw, in my opinion that's just a tool that be used to different effects. I dislike her lying though and she's definitely responsible for a ton of collateral damage by inciting others who are less professional about this stuff.)

[QUOTE=hexpunK;46187867]The ERSB rating system works pretty well as a trigger warning-esque thing, it's just really vague in places, I remember there being a "Sexual Violence" rating, but that does cover quite a few things, so for someone casually browsing it might be hard to actually work out if that means full on rape, or something else entirely that might not be an issue for them. Though it usually covers harassment and molestation, not many games dare play with rape as a plot device, well, explicitly stated rape anyway.[/QUOTE] They do provide a more comprehensive rating on the website, enough that it even specifies what swear words are used or how the sexual violence is portrayed. They don't put it on the box since it's usually too long, but it is publicly available. Of course it's a non-issue for video games because of this system, whereas it's often without warning in other places like Academia as Reimu says. I'm still of the opinion that if you are having massive panic attacks from it, the best solution is still to get help and overcome it. It's not a permanent disfigurement, you don't have to suffer under it forever, and like any mental illness it can be helped.

[QUOTE=Dermock;46186415]I think its because FP mods only really do objective bans (flaming, raiding, etc) and that the mod team seems to be a group of people picked because they're good at it (minus craptasket and the now defunct maxofs2d) and not because either A: they were the first to make a subreddit with the name "/r/gaming" or "/r/shitredditsays" or B: they are friends with the guy from A[/QUOTE] tasket and rusty aren't even a [I]kind[/I] of "objective." [editline]9th October 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Banned?;46187214]I really fail to understand how these people can miss so many points when this has been going on for two months now. If it all unfolded in a week and there was just some massive inflation of information flying everywhere I can understand confusion or concern, but geezus fucking Christ guys. The fact that they hate on Christina Hoff Summers, a fucking through and through left-wing feminist, or that the purpose of #notyourshield flew right over their fucking head with the excuse that it's a 4chan conspiracy, blows my God damn mind. These people are so fucking disingenuous it looks like parody. I'm constantly surprised at how much I can be blown away by ignorance.[/QUOTE] They understand perfectly. They simply don't have to address anything salient because they have both financial/logistic and subject insulation. They don't have to be accountable until gamers start hitting their parent companies and their advertisers with thousands of emails asking them to politely stop giving them money.

[QUOTE=hexpunK;46187688]That's what a trigger warning is when done right though? An incredible concise warning about the material covered in something. Trigger warnings by themselves are a totally fine concept, and actually can be quite useful. But as per normal, the tag-along wannabe social justice "activists" missed the point entirely. It has nothing to do with being a "special snowflake" like people keep spouting ad nausium, it's not demeaning to people who have actually suffered trauma (considering it's intended to warn them of possible triggers, it's helpful), it's just misused by idiots, as is a lot of stuff in social justice.[/QUOTE] I was referring to disclaimers such as TV, movies and video game ratings. I don't understand tw when they're in the tag section or if they say tw: food or anything other which is really trivial. Also like in most cases, wouldn't saying straight up "trigger warning: rape" cause someone to have a panic attack over a rape experience? I've never really understood fully the entire purpose of the straight up method. I always prefer the "may offend some groups" or "content contains sexual harassment"

I can feel it, we will be called pirates now: [url]https://archive.today/B4oTx[/url]

[QUOTE=Ithon;46189059]I can feel it, we will be called pirates now: [url]https://archive.today/B4oTx[/url][/QUOTE]"Using #notyourshield to deflect criticism." ROFL! Where the flying fuck do they find these batshit insane people? That's the VERY tactic they've used from the start, deflecting criticism.

[QUOTE=Solo Wing;46189080]"Using #notyourshield to deflect criticism." ROFL! Where the flying fuck do they find these batshit insane people? That's the VERY tactic they've used from the start, deflecting criticism.[/QUOTE] Truthiness from the gut. If you want to see people half way in a cult mentality.

[QUOTE=Tamschi;46187989]Hm... so the stuttering she downplayed as amusement was because she was lying about it being fictional, not because of her feeling hurt. That explains why I didn't manage to match it to anything I know, people around me generally aren't that manipulative. I still consider the previous part where she cites examples to be honest though. (I'm not judging her for the manipulation btw, in my opinion that's just a tool that be used to different effects. I dislike her lying though and she's definitely responsible for a ton of collateral damage by inciting others who are less professional about this stuff.)[/QUOTE] I feel that the lack of a dialogue is what lets most of those harmful impersonations actually get big. It would be easy for her to debunk them if she just talked to people. I get the feeling that she just stonewalls any and all communication directed at her, then picks the most inflammatory comments she can find to use in her calls for action. There's bound to be assholes in both camps when there's a discussion, and you won't get anywhere by focusing on them. I think the lack of a dialogue is what has labelled her as a villain that wants to kill video games, and the fact that no "journalists" has questioned it publicly adds fuel to the fire that is gamersgate.

Well this is rich.. [url]http://www.donotlink.com/bz1e[/url]

[QUOTE=Teddybeer;46185545]Well one good thing to come out that is this. [video=youtube;ah8mhDW6Shs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ah8mhDW6Shs[/video] Didn't know it was there already.[/QUOTE] 15 minutes of pure audience pandering. "Hey, guys. I know you know love me and all, so let's look at some idiots on the internet." "Well, maybe you could actually talk about your agenda." "No. 'Idiots on the internet' it is." edit: [QUOTE]Even TotalBiscuit doesn't claim to be a reviewer, though he is very adamant about flying the banner of "critic" atop his iconic UK flag. Many people — tremendous numbers of them, going by view counts and subscriber numbers — rely on YouTubers' opinions to help make their purchasing decisions. The situation is, in other words, murky.[/QUOTE] No, it's not. :v: Just because you have a large audience doesn't automatically mean that any influence you have on a purchase decision is a review.

[QUOTE=uber.;46189663]15 minutes of pure audience pandering. "Hey, guys. I know you know love me and all, so let's look at some idiots on the internet." "Well, maybe you could actually talk about your agenda." "No. 'Idiots on the internet' it is." edit: No, it's not. :v: Just because you have a large audience doesn't automatically mean that any influence you have on a purchase decision is a review.[/QUOTE] Except, you know, Videogame Reviews aren't like scientific/academic reviews, they are, by and large, opinion pieces. It's all opinion, being a critic or a reviewer is basically putting forth your opinion, while (ideally) being as objective as possible, but at the end of the day, they all boil down to being opinion pieces. TB simply plays games, says what he likes, says what he doesnt like and doesn't pull any punches in either regard and put them forwards honestly and straightforward. Frankly, that's exactly how reviews SHOULD be, with the onus on the consumer to not just blindly trust one source of reviews/criticism etc etc, but to collate a picture from multiple different sources.

[QUOTE=Ithon;46189059]I can feel it, we will be called pirates now: [url]https://archive.today/B4oTx[/url][/QUOTE] I posted a comment on that article responding to "Gamergaters aren't interested in discussion or explanation." and trying to explain my view point and the admin didn't let it be published.

[QUOTE=Deathbane;46189643]Well this is rich.. [url]http://www.donotlink.com/bz1e[/url][/QUOTE] This - still gives them clicks. - is terribly nondescript. Here's an archive link: [URL="https://archive.today/CETB9"]Kotaku: The Messy Story Behind YouTubers Taking Money for Game Coverage By Nathan Grayson on 09 Oct 2014 at 7:00AM[/URL]

[video=youtube;a7FqXi7SydA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7FqXi7SydA[/video] are people paying for the GG video's or is tyrone doing it for a giggle?

[QUOTE=waylander;46190766][video=youtube;a7FqXi7SydA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7FqXi7SydA[/video] are people paying for the GG video's or is tyrone doing it for a giggle?[/QUOTE] People are pretty obviously paying for them.

[QUOTE=Tamschi;46190629][...] [URL="https://archive.today/CETB9"]Kotaku: The Messy Story Behind YouTubers Taking Money for Game Coverage By Nathan Grayson on 09 Oct 2014 at 7:00AM[/URL][/QUOTE] As someone who likes good reads, I'm actually offended by how badly this is written. Content-wise it's unproblematic though, except for the sensationalist headline that only relates to a small part of the article. [editline]9th October 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=adnzzzzZ;46190298]I posted a comment on that article responding to "Gamergaters aren't interested in discussion or explanation." and trying to explain my view point and the admin didn't let it be published.[/QUOTE] You got email notifications for this, right? If you have no problem with disclosing your email address and it's a DKIM containing the text you can actually prove stuff like this by uploading the .eml file. (I'm not necessarily asking you to do it but it may be useful and would be strong proof of censorship.)

whats with the dumb rating [url]https://secure.jotformeu.com/dignity14/TyroneVideos[/url] that kotaku article seems pretty reasonable but i cant take it seriously being written by grayson and published on a site who refuse to discus 5th estate ethics

[QUOTE=hexpunK;46187867]The ERSB rating system works pretty well as a trigger warning-esque thing, it's just really vague in places, I remember there being a "Sexual Violence" rating, but that does cover quite a few things, so for someone casually browsing it might be hard to actually work out if that means full on rape, or something else entirely that might not be an issue for them. Though it usually covers harassment and molestation, not many games dare play with rape as a plot device, well, explicitly stated rape anyway.[/QUOTE] ESRB and other entertainment-covering rating systems are fine as they are, being vague. It's not hard to find out what "sexual violence" means if done a bit of a research on any given instance. Descriptive trigger-warnings should only be placed on stuff that might be mandatory (say, in education) and stuff where further investigation might not be easily done.

[QUOTE=waylander;46190968]whats with the dumb rating [url]https://secure.jotformeu.com/dignity14/TyroneVideos[/url] that kotaku article seems pretty reasonable but i cant take it seriously being written by grayson and published on a site who refuse to discus 5th estate ethics[/QUOTE] Authorship shouldn't affect the merit of the work, people mixing up the two are one of the main tactics getting on my nerves here (on both sides, but obv. coming from anti-#GG it's much more pronounced since there are no core statements they can discredit effectively). It's badly made but still has a good amount of informational value. [editline]9th October 2014[/editline] [quote][...] Blurry lines. That's the big problem here. And as all of us — from journalists and video-makers to gamers who just want to know what's worth their time and money — try to navigate through the cloudy waters of YouTube ethics and paid coverage, [B]total transparency may be the only way to stay afloa[/B]t.[/quote][emphasis mine] The irony of this coming from Grayson is a different matter though :v:

I never thought I would run into any of these people from friends I know. we were originally talking about how depression quest is completely mediocre in terms of writing. [img]http://puu.sh/c5y5N/95e7ceae10.png[/img]

wicked sick burn m8