Corruption in gaming journalism discussion and update thread. - General

[QUOTE=TheJoey;46388627]from 8chan yeah i dunno. thoughts?[/QUOTE] My honest thoughts is that whoever believes anything posted by an anon in a chan is dumb.

[QUOTE=Wii60;46387948]Riot games employee takes stance on GG. can you guess which side? [URL="http://i.imgur.com/ohoitxr.jpg"] http://i.imgur.com/ohoitxr.jpg[/URL][/QUOTE] Maybe I'm a little dense but I'm not sure what's so condemnable about this. The guy saying he wouldn't hire GG supporters is dumb, sure. I feel his reason for disliking GG (that it's been tainted by harassers) is wrong too. But it seemed like he was really open to reasonable discussion, and even straight up said "let's agree that [the douchebag harassers in GG] are a minority and that you are not ok with what they do." At which point Moltar said "it's offensive to even suggest that I'm ok with that!!" and started bringing up Islamaphobia, the IRA, and basque nationalism. Then called Riot as a whole a bunch of Stalinists. Like, what? I don't even like League and I think that's ridiculous :v:

[QUOTE=Midna;46388893]Maybe I'm a little dense but I'm not sure what's so condemnable about this. The guy saying he wouldn't hire GG supporters is dumb, sure. I feel his reason for disliking GG (that it's been tainted by harassers) is wrong too. But it seemed like he was really open to reasonable discussion, and even straight up said "let's agree that [the douchebag harassers in GG] are a minority and that you are not ok with what they do." At which point Moltar said "it's offensive to even suggest that I'm ok with that!!" and started bringing up Islamaphobia, the IRA, and basque nationalism. Then called Riot as a whole a bunch of Stalinists. Like, what? I don't even like League and I think that's ridiculous :v:[/QUOTE] I don't think not hiring open supporters of GG is dumb, personally. If I were part of the same company they'd just get me into trouble, like it or not. Why would I hire such a person? Also yeah that Moltar guy is an idiot. And all the people saying "yeah riot is full of cunts i'm quitting LoL because they don't support GG" are pathetic, frankly. It's like if people said "I'm quitting Rust because one of the FP mods showed his ass once". It's illogical.

[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;46388042]Riot has always been a shithole. It was created by a bunch of guys who leeched all their ideas off of others and it has honestly continued to do so. I remember I got permabanned from LoL like four years ago or so because I was smashing the shit out of Pendragon (if I remember correctly that was his name) on the other team and called him an 'inflatable dolphin fucker.' He didn't take that quite well :v:[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Wii60;46387948]Riot games employee takes stance on GG. can you guess which side? [URL="http://i.imgur.com/ohoitxr.jpg"] http://i.imgur.com/ohoitxr.jpg[/URL][/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Solo Wing;46388057]My opinion of Riot until now has largely been: meh. After this shit? I'm happy I quit LoL.[/QUOTE] Just asked the lead client engineer of Riot Games on skype about this. This guy is a no-name player-support and doesnt represent Riot Games at all. His 'colleagues' are people who dont care enough about gg (which a majority of the internet doesnt either) Good job finding some some stupid shit to bag on a company of over 1000 people you know nothing about lmao. oh, ps kane. Tell me your league username and I'll see why you were banned personally. They dont permaban people for flaming/threatening others. Unless ya feel like your little anecdote is enough? :^)

[QUOTE=zerothefallen;46389064]Just asked the lead client engineer of Riot Games on skype about this. This guy is a no-name player-support and doesnt represent Riot Games at all. His 'colleagues' are people who dont care enough about gg (which a majority of the internet doesnt either) Good job finding some some stupid shit to bag on a company of over 1000 people you know nothing about lmao. oh, ps kane. Tell me your league username and I'll see why you were banned personally. They dont permaban people for flaming/threatening others. Unless ya feel like your little anecdote is enough? :^) [/QUOTE] One usually assumes that if a company hires a person to represent the company to the consumer base they would make sure that they are competent and not liable to say dumb shit. Honestly the tone of your message sounds like your taking it personally.

[QUOTE=Wii60;46387948]Riot games employee takes stance on GG. can you guess which side? [URL="http://i.imgur.com/ohoitxr.jpg"] http://i.imgur.com/ohoitxr.jpg[/URL][/QUOTE] Welp, they failed. [img]http://i.imgur.com/3j6DYNd.png[/img]

[QUOTE=Thlis;46389086]One usually assumes that if a company hires a person to represent the company to the consumer base they would make sure that they are competent and not liable to say dumb shit. Honestly the tone of your message sounds like your taking it personally.[/QUOTE] No, Im just actually caring about a game I play and I think they are incorrect. I dont have the authority/havent asked to say if he'd be punished or not, and i also think he's being a dipshit, but bagging on the entire company is a dick move.

[QUOTE=Thlis;46389086]One usually assumes that if a company hires a person to represent the company to the consumer base they would make sure that they are competent and not liable to say dumb shit. Honestly the tone of your message sounds like your taking it personally.[/QUOTE] Well people started wrongly accusing an entire company of being stalinists and almost made everyone in GG look like fools in the process. I think he has every right to sound pissed.

As wrong as that guy was, I think the Moltar dude was going a little too heavy.

[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;46386712][url]http://t.co/L9FG70c8VD[/url] I wholly agree with the sentiment here. If all you can say in response to someone is "you're a misogynist" or "you're an SJW", you don't have an argument. There are reasonable people on all sides, and attacking labels just cuts off people who might have reconsidered their positions otherwise.[/QUOTE] On a (slightly) related note, Kazerad proposed something interesting: [url]http://kazerad.tumblr.com/post/101405701088/gamergate-fracture[/url] This wouldn't mean splitting the label, just to have a few conversations at the same time (which isn't actually that difficult, people are already doing it but mostly defensively). I think Operation Disrespectful Nod already goes well into an active direction in that regard though, considering it very efficiently combats (and spotlights!) the harassment done by journalists. I'm still not quite 100% sure if this is what Kazerad means, but I think the same stuff can technically be used to show the hypocrisy of the misogyny argument. There are at this point definitely a bit more than a few examples of the "feminists" being blatantly sexist (even misogynist by their own definitions), like shown in that Thunderf00t video above.

[QUOTE=Tamschi;46389413]On a (slightly) related note, Kazerad proposed something interesting: [URL]http://kazerad.tumblr.com/post/101405701088/gamergate-fracture[/URL] This wouldn't mean splitting the label, just to have a few conversations at the same time (which isn't actually that difficult, people are already doing it but mostly defensively). I think Operation Disrespectful Nod already goes well into an active direction in that regard though, considering it very efficiently combats (and spotlights!) the harassment done by journalists. I'm still not quite 100% sure if this is what Kazerad means, but I think the same stuff can technically be used to show the hypocrisy of the misogyny argument. There are at this point definitely a bit more than a few examples of the "feminists" being blatantly sexist (even misogynist by their own definitions), like shown in that Thunderf00t video above.[/QUOTE] Why are people so insistent on dividing this up. It is a terrible idea. All it will do is make it an easier target, and provide more room for infighting. The media isn't going to go "oh look here is a new group that we can get behind", they are just going to go "Oh look, see gamergate has split itself apart and created a bunch of misogynistic cell groups". And if this is just a strategic plan then it seems way too structured. I may be wrong but I think one of the biggest advantages GG has is that it is constantly testing the fence. If a weakpoint is found, then almost the entirety of it goes for it.

[QUOTE=Tamschi;46389413]On a (slightly) related note, Kazerad proposed something interesting: [url]http://kazerad.tumblr.com/post/101405701088/gamergate-fracture[/url] This wouldn't mean splitting the label, just to have a few conversations at the same time (which isn't actually that difficult, people are already doing it but mostly defensively). I think Operation Disrespectful Nod already goes well into an active direction in that regard though, considering it very efficiently combats (and spotlights!) the harassment done by journalists. I'm still not quite 100% sure if this is what Kazerad means, but I think the same stuff can technically be used to show the hypocrisy of the misogyny argument. There are at this point definitely a bit more than a few examples of the "feminists" being blatantly sexist (even misogynist by their own definitions), like shown in that Thunderf00t video above.[/QUOTE] There's a lot of issues going on and if you're going to argue, argue ideas and concepts rather than labels. Each person has their own idea on each issue and what the label as a whole means, so forget all of that shit and get down to the bare bones of what exactly you are striving for. You are not GG incarnate, just as they aren't anti-GG or SJWs incarnate, speak as a person to another person, speak for ideas rather than to progress a movement as a whole, and speak what you believe in rather than what you think the movement is. [QUOTE=Thlis;46389423]Why are people so insistent on dividing this up. It is a terrible idea. All it will do is make it an easier target, and provide more room for infighting. The media isn't going to go "oh look here is a new group that we can get behind", they are just going to go "Oh look, see gamergate has split itself apart and created a bunch of misogynistic cell groups".[/QUOTE] Bad reading mate. The goal is to make clear there are lots of ideas floating around within the GG movement and it's not all groupthink or one single issue that everyone agrees on. If someone asks what GG is about, you say there's a lot of aspects but here are the key issues.

[QUOTE=koekje4life;46388207][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KQrjskM.png[/IMG] i drink to forget and then this happens[/QUOTE] speaking of day of the devs [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/Ekl03BEl.png[/IMG] and our friend Nathan Grayson too! [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KUvQbMw.png[/IMG]

[QUOTE=Devodiere;46389443] Bad reading mate. The goal is to make clear there are lots of ideas floating around within the GG movement and it's not all groupthink or one single issue that everyone agrees on. If someone asks what GG is about, you say there's a lot of aspects but here are the key issues.[/QUOTE] That sounds like a breeding ground for infighting and co-opting. GG has managed to unite so many unlikely allies under one banner, is it really a great idea to try and subdivide the goals?

[QUOTE=Manibogi;46389133]Well people started wrongly accusing an entire company of being stalinists and almost made everyone in GG look like fools in the process. I think he has every right to sound pissed.[/QUOTE]I just said I was happier to have quit. Did I call Riot a bunch of shitheads, and damn their name? No, I just said I was happy to not be playing their game anymore. I don't think that constitutes as negative PR does it?

[QUOTE=Thlis;46389453]That sounds like a breeding ground for infighting and co-opting.[/QUOTE] And what's the alternative? To circlejerk and exclude people who might be more moderate? To leave it open to highjacking and people outside claiming they know it's really all about harassment? There's no doubt there are multiple issues at stake and it's far better to leave it as a discussion of multiple topics than to have solidarity as one big circlejerk. Besides, the infighting at least gets people talking about issues rather than pro-GG and anti-GG shitflinging. Without the label and with the issues at the forefront, it becomes far harder to slander it as a whole.

[QUOTE=Devodiere;46389484]And what's the alternative? To circlejerk and exclude people who might be more moderate? To leave it open to highjacking and people outside claiming they know it's really all about harassment? There's no doubt there are multiple issues at stake and it's far better to leave it as a discussion of multiple topics than to have solidarity as one big circlejerk. Besides, the infighting at least gets people talking about issues rather than pro-GG and anti-GG shitflinging. Without the label and with the issues at the forefront, it becomes far harder to slander it as a whole.[/QUOTE] It becomes far easier to slander, all they have to say is that Gamergate has fractured because of differing ideals and moral will be lost. These people claim that GG has weaponized charity, do you honestly think that they wont claim to know it's really about harassment either way?

[QUOTE=Wii60;46389452]speaking of day of the devs [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/Ekl03BEl.png[/IMG] and our friend Nathan Grayson too! [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KUvQbMw.png[/IMG][/QUOTE] DJ Phil Fish, the new genius of this generation of music.

After the set's over he cusses you out and throws the laptop at a disabled person. Classy.

[QUOTE=Zet;46389518]DJ Phil Fish, the new genius of this generation of music.[/QUOTE] I could see him saying he's more popular than jesus.

[QUOTE=Wii60;46389452]speaking of day of the devs [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/Ekl03BEl.png[/IMG] and our friend Nathan Grayson too! [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KUvQbMw.png[/IMG][/QUOTE] jesus christ what is happening to phil fish he's looking more and more like a sad john lennon

[QUOTE=Zet;46389518]DJ Phil Fish, the new genius of this generation of music.[/QUOTE] awesome i cant wait for the 3 twitter breakdowns, him being fucking done with music, and fez the album 2 being cancelled more times than we've left the solar system

[QUOTE=Thlis;46389490]It becomes far easier to slander, all they have to say is that Gamergate has fractured because of differing ideals and moral will be lost. These people claim that GG has weaponized charity, do you honestly think that they wont claim to know it's really about harassment either way?[/QUOTE] They've been claiming that it was dead for weeks with no success, claiming it has fractured certainly won't hit it any harder. No matter what the peripheral issues are, people are part of this movement to fuck over Gawker and acknowledging people supporting that are diverse in their opinion on everything else won't fracture it any more since that has always been the case. Reimu's heavily into Social Justice after all and this kind of expectation for conformity contributed to driving them away. Not to mention that fracturing is far from what I am promoting. People having their own opinions as individuals rather than labels is not fracturing, nor is discussing the ideas first and the movement second. Clearing away this bullshit of claiming this and that are what it's all about and just discussing the issues themselves will get a lot more done than all of this crap.

[QUOTE=Thlis;46389453]That sounds like a breeding ground for infighting and co-opting. GG has managed to unite so many unlikely allies under one banner, is it really a great idea to try and subdivide the goals?[/QUOTE] They aren't even close to uniform in the first place. Pretending they are is silly. It wouldn't hurt for some people to handle one of the [I]existing[/I] topics a bit more proactively at times. (But a lot of people already do that, once you step outside of core gaming when talking about Sarkeesian it seems to go more towards how she's a really bad feminist instead of how she doesn't know games.)

[QUOTE=G-Strogg;46388354]Tim Schafer was part of what made me want to make games. Feels kinda weird, all this.[/QUOTE] All of this makes me glad my "gaming heroes", like John Romero, John Carmack, and Warren Spector, either crashed and burned a long time ago (Romero and Spector) or became irrelevant years ago (Carmack).

[QUOTE=Devodiere;46389484]And what's the alternative? To circlejerk and exclude people who might be more moderate? To leave it open to highjacking and people outside claiming they know it's really all about harassment? There's no doubt there are multiple issues at stake and it's far better to leave it as a discussion of multiple topics than to have solidarity as one big circlejerk. Besides, the infighting at least gets people talking about issues rather than pro-GG and anti-GG shitflinging. Without the label and with the issues at the forefront, it becomes far harder to slander it as a whole.[/QUOTE] Terrible reading again, no-one's proposing to abolish the label. [editline]2nd November 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Devodiere;46389574]They've been claiming that it was dead for weeks with no success, claiming it has fractured certainly won't hit it any harder. No matter what the peripheral issues are, people are part of this movement to fuck over Gawker and acknowledging people supporting that are diverse in their opinion on everything else won't fracture it any more since that has always been the case. Reimu's heavily into Social Justice after all and this kind of expectation for conformity contributed to driving them away. Not to mention that fracturing is far from what I am promoting. People having their own opinions as individuals rather than labels is not fracturing, nor is discussing the ideas first and the movement second. Clearing away this bullshit of claiming this and that are what it's all about and just discussing the issues themselves will get a lot more done than all of this crap.[/QUOTE] It seems I interpreted your first post wrong, but I still think getting rid or diminishing the "brand" is a pretty bad idea. You can hold up the label just fine while, when arguing, just going with the topic and invalidating the opposing claim without deflecting by disassociation.

[QUOTE=Ziron;46389593]All of this makes me glad my "gaming heroes", like John Romero, John Carmack, and Warren Spector, either crashed and burned a long time ago (Romero and Spector) or became irrelevant years ago (Carmack).[/QUOTE] John Carmack isn't exactly irrelevant considering he is on board with Oculus Rift VR considering VR is getting bigger in the gaming industry.

[url]http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sdr131[/url] top kek

I've been away from this whole ordeal for about a month, I was wondering if I could get a couple things cleared up. I thought when I stopped reading, [i]the whole controversy[/i] was called Gamergate. Like, whether you wanted to talk about corruption or whether you wanted to talk about harrassment or whatever else. Did it become pro-GG vs. anti-GG because the "anti" side has made so many attempts to say "Gamergate is over" and "gamergate is dead" and "gamergate is not even a real thing" and "stop using #gamergate"? Also, what is LW1, LW2, LW3, etc.? And is it connected to the pissing contest i saw a few pages ago where quinn and wu were fighting over who is the biggest victim?

[QUOTE=mcattack1092;46389617]John Carmack isn't exactly irrelevant considering he is on board with Oculus Rift VR considering VR is getting bigger in the gaming industry.[/QUOTE] Carmack has a realistic approach to all this social justice stuff though, if he even talks about it at all. I don't think Ziron has to worry in that regard [URL="http://knowyourmeme.com/videos/97735-cringeworthy"]:v:[/URL]