Corruption in gaming journalism discussion and update thread.
15,084 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Ithon;46852687]the woman who spilled coffee and got a million bucks, a character assassination that was in part to push tort reform.[/QUOTE]
Covered that one in law class.
I dont recall the all the details but it would be a good idea to link so people know what its about.
[editline]3rd January 2015[/editline]
At this point it would be cruel to elect anyone be leader of Gamer-gate the amount of undeserved hatred and abuse they would get would be ridiculous.
Besides the point there are too man factions and sub-factions present to really effectively organize anything.
GG has made me think a lot about how our media is currently structured. The fact that GG is considered a hate movement just goes to show how true reporting has fallen to the wayside in the name of larger profits. Clickbait will be the death of proper reporting.
It's unfortunate too, because the people writing these clickbait articles are seemingly unaware of the kind of damage they're capable of. It's certainly not a conspiracy (though it's arguable that certain groups involved with GG use this total lack of proper research among news services to their advantage, as is quite evident with Mojo Jojo) but the influence it's had is irrefutable.
I keep coming back to the fact that gender studies and related fields are considered a legitimate course in school. Now just saying that out loud seems like it would be a good idea, I believe having scientific knowledge of how genders are "made" and how they interact is a fantastic thing. but the evidence points to the contrary. What jobs does it provide? How does it benefit society? What category would these benefits fall under (social, financial, etc)? To me, the only visible effect it's had so far is negative. The feminist label is largely considered a joke now because of it. It's given hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people a useless degree and a very strange and outright wrong worldview, and they don't believe otherwise because it's what was taught to them in school (nothing taught in school is EVER wrong, right?)
I suppose it would all be fine and dandy if these courses were built upon scientifically factual information, but it seems that they're mainly built upon theories. I hear "Social/Cultural Marxism" thrown around a lot, but I'm not too familiar with Karl or his theories. As I understand it, his ideas are mostly economic, so I don't see the connection... it's irrelevant though, as these courses seem to be purely ideological, and that's the problem. No matter the ideology in question, it leads to conflict. Being ideological seems to lead to ignorance against anything that doesn't comform to the logic of the idea itself, whatever it may be.
This is evident in any ideology as well, just look throughout history. Christians being pursued in the early AD centuries, themselves becoming the pursuers by the time of Charlemagne.. Anything contrary to the ideas of the primary source of knowledge are suppressed, building tension until it's released through conflict, historically physical, and in GG's case, entirely rhetorical. The opposition largely plays (and reacts to) on the emotions of the readers, whereas pro GG reacts based on logic (again, mostly. I feel the need to add this because GG has been abused by third party people who just wanna troll some folks).
So why do schools offer these courses? Well, how else are you supposed to make fat stacks of cheddar? Easy ass courses serve both the students who don't really give a shit what they study and the schools themselves for all of that delicious tuition money. It's an unfortunate degradation of schooling today, and I wouldn't be surprised if there were even more useless courses available in some schools.
I don't have a problem with schools teaching theories and ideologies per se, but the effect it has had seems counterintuitive to society. Perhaps those vocal on these "social issues" are just idiots projecting their worldview, further enforced by these courses, onto things that aren't really an issue but could be "seen as" one in the right light, AKA a social issue like GG. It's laughably ironic some times (you play games? Clearly misogynist. You can't be racist toward white people. Etc etc) but it's unfortunate at the same time.
... It's depressing how interested I am about learning more about the courses themselves. If I had the free time and throwaway cash, perhaps I'd take a course or two just to deconstruct them and try to understand them and the general mode of thought that they seemingly teach.
I think understanding the differences between genders is an important field, but the current information in the field seems more comparable to a "listen and believe" mentality rather than a system based on fact and reason. Hilariously ironic too considering MJs use the phrase unironically, as if they already understand this and decided to address it outright.
Kind of a long, generally unrelated and broad rant, but the entirety of the situation, compounded by Sargon's videos, has made me acutely aware of just how damaging this could be in the long run. It's social degradation into a one track mind, which is completely poisonous to humanity. All of the factors seem to be contributing to a sort of mass stupidity. People are people, there's always going to be a bunch of idiots, but radicalization is a bad thing no matter what cause they defend.
But hey, I'm just some dude on the internet. I don't know what I'm talking about lol.
Has anyone who frequents the thread taken any gender study courses, or happens to know someone who has? I'd like to know more about your mentality toward the situation, general worldview, and how the course may have effected both. Most people I see post here are typically not ideologues but I figured I'd ask anyway.
Again, sorry for the wall.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/Xf5yKF7.jpg[/t]
compare to a november version of the same request
[URL]http://i.imgur.com/7rWvtDl.jpg[/URL]
edit:
and as a added bonus, diversity in the games media
[URL]https://medium.com/@cainejw/on-diversity-in-games-media-245336e7c50[/URL]
[QUOTE]15% of identified staff are females. 2.8% of staff are Hispanic/Latino(a), 4.7% are Asian, 4.7% are of unknown ethnicity, 0% were Black/African-American. 0% are Native American. 1% are multiethnic or multiracial. 1% are Indian. 1% are queer. 1.8% are LGBT.
85% are White. 85% of staff at these sites are males. While ages are not listed, most appeared to be between the ages of 20 to 30.[/QUOTE]
GG isn't even a movement, it doesn't make sense for it to be.
Watergate was a scandal, the people who wanted Nixon impeached were not Pro-Watergate and their opponents Anti-Watergate. It was simply Americans who wanted a corrupt president to go.
Gamergate is the scandal of Game Journalists being a corrupt group of agenda pushers that actually attacked their own consumer. The people who are angry with them are Gamers for betraying the medium for their own agendas.
The biggest mistake Gamers made was accepting that rather than Gamergate be an event that it is their label instead. So now Journalists have an easier target to attack and label and claim it's just a group of right wingers angry at ~Social Progress~ and Gaming become more ~inclusive~ (BECAUSE APPARENTLY GAME STORES HAVE A BAN ON MINORITIES NOW).
That's why I like some people are starting to push were Pro-Gamer and they're Anti-Gamer. These people don't want games to ever depict or represent anything they disagree with. Gameplay and other important components do not matter as long as you broadcast their message. They just want control of a medium to use a propaganda. That is why they declared the Gaming identity dead.
[QUOTE=Psycho9182;46851559]really stretching it there.[/QUOTE]
Really? Cause that's exactly what Alexander did in the Day instance, and it stuck, complete with top-10 google result pushing from the guardian and time-warner interns. Pretty sure her blog is still in top 20 results sort, if not higher.
Context is a fickle bitch.
[quote] Social/Cultural Marxism [/quote]
Is a misnomer derived from incorrect interpretations of 60's groupthink techniques and pressuring strategies that were attempted by the left, but actually utilized by the right successfully, (see: Kent State aftermath) mainly because the right used them from positions of civil and political authority.
[quote] benefit [/quote]
This one is rather simply cut and dried. Electronic storytelling is an open field that now generates absolutely enormous amounts of money and [B]logistical influence[/B] and by the next gen of gamers will begin to exhibit very very strong cultural influence, ala television in the mid-late 60s and movies in the mid 30s; and in much like the times when these things were omnipresent in those fields, if you manage or make content for the medium thereof, your ass is quite potentially literally on the line, and not just in a short term fashion, but in the very very very real possibility of being permanently blacklisted in what might be the only vocational field you are qualified to be employed in to make reasonable means for yourself and your family.
If you're a consumer, you have the luxury of being neutral or simply not giving a shit.
If you are a content creator, things are very rapidly becoming a much more [I]interesting[/I] landscape at a lot of companies, and those employees and companies have very long memories and contact lists. I cannot overstate how badly this is right now and actually, not conjecturally or theoretically fucking up the industry right as it becomes a [B]globally[/B] important cultural sounding board and broadcaster.
There are two options RE Gamergate being a 'hate group':
A: We are the absolute least effective hate group ever, targeting... about 10 people, not doing a very good job of it at that, and somehow still having hundreds of thousands of members.
B: We're not a hate group because the very small amount of people who spout hatred are dwarfed by the huge number who are trying to, in some way, improve the games industry and gaming journalism.
[QUOTE=Teddybeer;46853974]Could be just because of things like the intern thing going on.[/QUOTE]
where's vox media in that, though I just woke up.
So, question of the day: Do you think that the majority of the public will ever turn around and realise what Gamergate is actually about? If so, when?
Frankly, I don't think it's ever going to happen. We're going to be stigmatised forever and remembered as a hate group for the rest of the history, with anything we do being totally forgotten whilst the games industry slowly crumbles into another mid-80s, and [I]maybe[/I] in like 20 years people might realise what we were actually trying to do. But maybe that's just a bit pessimistic.
[QUOTE=Jamsponge;46855264]So, question of the day: Do you think that the majority of the public will ever turn around and realise what Gamergate is actually about? If so, when?[/QUOTE]
It won't. But honestly? I don't care, so long as AGG keeps ruining their reputation like this. They have a lot more to lose.
[QUOTE=Jamsponge;46855264]So, question of the day: Do you think that the majority of the public will ever turn around and realise what Gamergate is actually about? If so, when?
Frankly, I don't think it's ever going to happen. We're going to be stigmatised forever and remembered as a hate group for the rest of the history, with anything we do being totally forgotten whilst the games industry slowly crumbles into another mid-80s, and [I]maybe[/I] in like 20 years people might realise what we were actually trying to do. But maybe that's just a bit pessimistic.[/QUOTE]
you can, but you got to fight for it. There are ways, but it hasn't been attempted yet, a sane person leading a civil group making a stance.
One thing I am happy about is that I think it's quite easy to turn people one-at-a-time. My friend (the one whose sister's girlfriend is Laura K) chatted with me about it and we were basically in total agreement once I explained to him what Gamergate is actually about. Apparently Laura is actually less anti-GG than her girlfriend, so if I can manage to chat to her about it (not likely, we never really see each other) then I might be able to talk to Laura, or at least help her understand.
[url]http://kazerad.tumblr.com/post/107147839003/in-fact-lets-just-make-this-a-game-i-call-it[/url]
Kazerad challenges both Gamergate supporters and Gamergate opposers to convince him that you aren't evil.
[QUOTE=Jamsponge;46855264]So, question of the day: Do you think that the majority of the public will ever turn around and realise what Gamergate is actually about? If so, when?
Frankly, I don't think it's ever going to happen. We're going to be stigmatised forever and remembered as a hate group for the rest of the history, with anything we do being totally forgotten whilst the games industry slowly crumbles into another mid-80s, and [I]maybe[/I] in like 20 years people might realise what we were actually trying to do. But maybe that's just a bit pessimistic.[/QUOTE]
You're greatly overestimating the popularity of SJWs. The sole reason they've been this successful is because they somehow managed to infiltrate the press, most people on the outside know they are raving lunatics
Gamergate? Probably won't change anytime soon, but I don't expect the gaming industry and the perception of gamers to change one bit
[QUOTE=EmperorVagak;46857188][url]http://kazerad.tumblr.com/post/107147839003/in-fact-lets-just-make-this-a-game-i-call-it[/url]
Kazerad challenges both Gamergate supporters and Gamergate opposers to convince him that you aren't evil.[/QUOTE]
Well for starters GG provided a lot of support for various charities.
So it seems that anti-GG turned against Pixelgoth.
[img]http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b196/Starmenclock/image_zps3cf3491c.jpg[/img]
Dunno if this is a good or bad thing yet.
[QUOTE=_Axel;46857313]Well for starters GG provided a lot of support for various charities.[/QUOTE]
If there's one criticism I have to agree with, it's that donating to charity is so cheap and common, it's pretty hard to see it as anything but buying cheap good image points.
[QUOTE=Mingebox;46857396]If there's one criticism I have to agree with, it's that donating to charity is so cheap and common, it's pretty hard to see it as anything but buying cheap good image points.[/QUOTE]
But that actually gets things done, unlike pretending to care about these issues, so I don't see why it would actually matter. The KKK could be donating money towards charities, that doesn't mean they don't accomplish a good deed by doing so.
How is donating to a cause "cheaper" than spending some of your own time helping? That money was earned by committing to one's work in the first place, so it's equivalent. Heck, it's probably even more efficient to donate money to trained professionals who'll make a more efficient use of it.
And I don't even understand how "common" is supposed to be a criticism here. What, do we get bonus points by contributing to a cause in an original manner?
What's the highest scoring AGG charity? The biggest I saw was the 350 USD going to Ryulong, and i'm not entirely sure if that counts.
Adding the dosh from this [url=https://media.8chan.co/gamergate/src/1420370053573.png]image here[/url] (only the ones specifically labeled Gamergate though) we get about 15K, if you add the [url=https://twitter.com/TFYCapitalists/status/504012966568931328]13k[/url] you get 28k, add the [url=http://wwf.worldwildlife.org/site/TR/PandaNation/Panda-Nation?team_id=53922&pg=team&fr_id=1182]sea lion[/url] you get 33k in total from GG
Pro-Gamers support the needy and projects that benefit many people
Anti-Gamers throw money at the Patreons of professional victims so they don't have to work hard in life. And corrupt wikipedia editors.
One of the first times I have seen KiA without a single-target "Look at this feminist!" post on the front page, it looks great!
So Ms. Harper just did a major dox against Gamergate, calling it a Gamergate blacklist:
[img]http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b196/Starmenclock/image_zps06047df2.jpg[/img]
espn2 did a thing on gamergate because ???
[video=youtube;2d9yPQuxr9c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2d9yPQuxr9c[/video]
[QUOTE=Fangz;46857577]So Ms. Harper just did a major dox against Gamergate, calling it a Gamergate blacklist:
[img]http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b196/Starmenclock/image_zps06047df2.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
"Major dox" again. Publicly available information which people directly put their names beside "gamergate" is not inherently a dox, calling it a "industry blacklist" is bullshit though.
[QUOTE=Wii60;46857580]espn2 did a thing on gamergate because ???
vid[/QUOTE]
And almost immediately people figured out they've got connections to Tortilla, Kotaku at large, and Alexander
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/y45jrbE.jpg[/IMG]
Fucking hell does San Francisco exist in a vacuum or did they put something in the water to make people lose grip to reality
Seriously when South Park did the joke about the San Francisco smug I thought it was.. well, a joke.
-snip-
Anyway, I am still surprised how bad AGG is in covering their tracks properly. It is like each of them has a small cemetery worth of skeletons in their closet.
They all think the title feminist makes them above reproach,it doesnt you can be a raging asshole no matter what title you take ,hell it should be evident by the reputation that they are painting gamers with titles dont work well as a shield.
[QUOTE=EmperorVagak;46857188][url]http://kazerad.tumblr.com/post/107147839003/in-fact-lets-just-make-this-a-game-i-call-it[/url]
Kazerad challenges both Gamergate supporters and Gamergate opposers to convince him that you aren't evil.[/QUOTE]
That comes after [URL="http://kazerad.tumblr.com/post/106964074503/agency"]this[/URL] and [URL="https://archive.today/XAgcN"]a few reactions to it[/URL] (archived to link to the current first few posts), I think.
I can relate to the sentiment.
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