Why not to send people to labour camps instead of executing them? - General

[QUOTE=Dragon Master;24572096]I think the same sort of thing too, not just with death penalty prisoners, I think they should be forced to work in line production factorys making Cars, electronics and all sorts of other stuff. I think this would benefit society more instead of letting people go insane in jail, I also think that undiscovered talent "could" be found. Like a guy that stole and burnt down a car, is forced to build car parts on an assembley line and realises that he enjoys what he is doing, He quits the life of crime and sets up a famous car building firm 40 years later. *Don't Knock it, anything is possible*[/QUOTE] Or we could keep job's open for hardworking citizens. Then rehabilitate criminals into hardworking people of society. [editline]04:02PM[/editline] [QUOTE=FreeThinker;24572119]Their opinions on the death penalty are plain retarded.[/QUOTE] Your ass is not a library. [citation needed]

-Waste of resources. -dangerous -humanitarian reasons

[QUOTE=RBM11;24572057]You literally called them retarded and said you didn't care what "some dumb old men did a long time ago." [editline]04:58PM[/editline] You haven't given any examples yet.[/QUOTE] I'm not an American, nor do I know exactly what the founding fathers of USA said, I'm British, But I know that the rules and laws across all western countries NEED to be tightened up, or else our Great nations will fall into a long period of national collapse. I mean look on the streets anywhere in a western country, You see thugs, vandals and thieves everywhere. Is this what our Grand Fathers, and Great Grandfather's fought for In the World Wars? They fought for freedom and their children's freedom!, not thuggery.

[QUOTE=papu2;24572201]-Waste of resources. -dangerous -humanitarian reasons[/QUOTE] They would produce far more profit than needed for those resources. :downs:

Why not send people to death row, and give them the ability to shoot themselves or be gassed? Oh wait. That's to cruel...

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;24572246]Why not send people to death row, and give them the ability to shoot themselves or be gassed? Oh wait. That's to cruel...[/QUOTE] Forced execution is cruel indeed.

[QUOTE=FreeThinker;24572231]They produce far more profit than needed for those resources. :downs:[/QUOTE] Let's see your compilation of independent research proving these claims.

[QUOTE=Dragon Master;24572215] I mean look on the streets anywhere in a western country, You see thugs, vandals and thieves everywhere.[/QUOTE] What about those chav fellows in winchester?

[QUOTE=OvB;24572155]Or we could keep job's open for hardworking citizens. Then rehabilitate criminals into hardworking people of society. [editline]04:02PM[/editline] Your ass is not a library. [citation needed][/QUOTE] That is not exactly what I meant, but I thought of a better Idea. Give Criminals the worst jobs in society, e.g. Making sure sewer pipes run clear of getting blocked, Litter picking around towns n cities... and any other shitty job you can think of.

[QUOTE=FreeThinker;24572265]Forced execution is cruel indeed.[/QUOTE] The death is painless, it's not cruel. [QUOTE=Dragon Master;24572283]That is not exactly what I meant, but I thought of a better Idea. Give Criminals the worst jobs in society, e.g. Making sure sewer pipes run clear of getting blocked, Litter picking around towns n cities... and any other shitty job you can think of.[/QUOTE] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_gang[/url]

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;24572246]Why not send people to death row, and give them the ability to shoot themselves or be gassed? Oh wait. That's to cruel...[/QUOTE] It would surely make them think and reconsider being a criminal anymore when there pulse is racing at 190bps and the little drop of sweat goes into their eyes blinds them, makes their lives flash infront of thier eyes. and they would say quietly, "I don't want to be a criminal when I die." Then the cattle bolt is lodged into there heads and they are sold to local kebab shops across the country.

[QUOTE=FreeThinker;24572119]Their opinions on the death penalty are plain retarded.[/QUOTE] You mean how they intentionally chose to ban "cruel and unusual punishment" so that what was banned would be what was considered cruel and unusual at the time of the crime? Therefore, as society evolved and attitudes changed, we could use the 8th amendment as an argument against capital punishment when the time came? I'd say it was a damn good amendment because the founders understood that interpretation of what was cruel could change as society changed which is why the constitution is considered a living and flexible document and which is why it has lasted so long. Back in their time it wasn't considered cruel or unusual to execute someone but they allowed the Constitution to adapt based on the interpretation by the courts as society evolved. Do you literally know nothing about the founders or the Constitution?

[QUOTE=yuki;24572308]The death is painless, it's not cruel. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_gang[/url][/QUOTE] Exactly, All who have caused suffering to others should suffer themselves the full consequences.

[QUOTE=FreeThinker;24572231]They would produce far more profit than needed for those resources. :downs:[/QUOTE] Lets say we have 100 murderers, Which have committed so terrible and cruel murders that they should be executed. So, According to your plan well figure out something they could do. Now the first problem is that they're COMPLETE LUNATICs, There's something fucking wrong with them. Doesn't really matter WHY they murdered those people, They are murderers. They had a motivation and were ready to slaughter men to achieve something, They are ready to do it again. Lets say we'll put them work in the mines, Jesus christ. Well have to let them use equipment which is DANGEROUS in the hands of such lunatics. And even if they were doing shit jobs in the mines and the professionals were dealing with the pontentially dangerous equipment you'd still risk lives of many good men. You can take any job you'd like to put them in and the result is: ITS FUCKING DANGEROUS IN A WAY OR ANOTHER TO LET THEM DO IT. EVEN THE NAZI KIND OF LABOUR CAMPS COULD BE POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS IF THOSE LUNATICS WOULD GET ON LOOSE, BESIDES YOU'D HAVE MILLION FUCKING HIPPIES RUNNING aROUND CHAINING THEMSELVES AROUND THOSE MURDERERS AND THEN GETTING THEIR GUTS RIPPED OUT AMD THEIR BODIES FILLED WITH LEAD BECAUSE FRANKLY THE GUARDS ARE NOT SHARP SHOOTTERS AND THE SITUATION IS OUT OF CONTROl. THINK ABOUT IT. [b]WHAT A FUCKING MESS.[/b] If a job is shitty theres a reason why its so fucking shitty, Can you comprehend this? Its either dangerous or hard. If its just hard work then theres a risk of good men getting hurt by these lunatics or that they refuse to work. So what did you think you'd do? Make a deal that they'll get 100 kilos of ammunation, guns and explosives if they'd just do what you ask? And you know why they're locked up in seperated cells? Because they're fucking lunatics, They'll kill each other or come up with somekind of plan to start a war against everything. [b]These men are 99.9% all fucking evil, You'd not hire a maid that has slaughtered 20 people and eaten them for shits and giggles, And then taken whats left of them to the local playground and hanged the corpses all over the place? Why'd you suggest that anyone else would hire one of these guys? Are you fucking stupid?[/b]

chill the fuck out. And no, mining picks are not equipment you need professionals for. You pretty much let them work for food and if they die, so be it. that's the idea of a labour camp. Doesn't matter who you put in it. It will always work out well. They either die early or do something productive.

[QUOTE=sami-pso;24572756]chill the fuck out. And no, mining picks are not equipment you need professionals for. You pretty much let them work for food and if they die, so be it. that's the idea of a labour camp. Doesn't matter who you put in it. It will always work out well. They either die early or do something productive.[/QUOTE] You do realize that now you're absolutely pulling this discussion back to the point which was already made, It's not cost effective in todays world, Even if everything would be automated(lets say that no one would ever fucking attack this labour campt fort of somekind and the people working in it would get shot by turrets or something, Doesn't really go that way but lets play along) You can't feed them corpses of their dead mates. And if you'd do that, You'd have the flower power guys raiding the camp.

[QUOTE=FreeThinker;24571676]Slavery would make profit unlike forced execution. Rated box.[/QUOTE] So just because it's better for society that means it's the best option?

If you use Penal labor then it would cost just as much as putting a man to death. Legitimate workers and workers that have no crime records would be pissed that a murder would be putting them out of a job.

[QUOTE=L'ordinateur;24571293]You need to take care of them, waste of resources.[/QUOTE] You have to feed people in jail as well.

[QUOTE=Sentinel Shadow;24577062]You have to feed people in jail as well.[/QUOTE] The thread is about people about to be executed, not simply serving time. Also OP is basically suggesting slavery as punishment for murder, what jobs could these people possibly do without fucking it up or require too much safe personnel? You seem to think there would be lines of hundreds of murderers chained to one another hacking away in a coalmine. People could never accept that, they would need more normal jobs and kept seperate for each others safety, that means more surveillance, more costs and more controversy. (I apologize if this post is really dumb its 4 in the morning)

[QUOTE=yuki;24571694]Your point? We had this neat thing called the "Civil War" over the concept of slavery. We concluded it was unjust and outlawed it after beating the shit out of the southern states. You can't force someone to work, it's simply not ethically correct.[/QUOTE] Slavery of innocent people either taking into work or born into it is different than someone who committed a heinous crime and has to work the rest of their life for it.

Why not both. Look how Soviet Russia ended up [sp]kidding[/sp]

[QUOTE=FreeThinker;24571707]Who cares what some dumb men did a long time ago?[/QUOTE] Wow? you really don't think alot do you? [editline]05:38AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Grahamcracker;24571753]OP is 12. On another note, Slavery is wrong and outlawed across the globe. And like I said before; if you killed my family, I'm watching you fry.[/QUOTE] Britain Ended it about 30 years before America!

Resources =/= profits They are not interchangeable with one another. So even IF the prisoners produce profit, they are still sucking up resources from innocent civilians. Prepare for an economic mess.

This isn't about resources and profits. It's quite obvious that people who would be sent to work almost anywhere without pay will turn up a large profit for their superior, even if a few guards must be hired. Also, if I'm not mistaken, this kind of thing kind of already exists in some prisons, where the prisoners work each day at several things, this doesn't only help society, but also the prisoners themselves as it gives them something to do instead of sitting in their cell all day and prepares them for normal civilian life.

[QUOTE=Novistador;24571542]I like how someone with the name freethinker has just come up with the idea of gulags.[/QUOTE] He has a history of shit-posting. I just dislike the idea that Prison has become almost like a hotel for people who just don't feel like (Or can't in some cases) getting by in society. Cable TV, 3 square meals a day. I'm not saying it's a cake walk, or any place i would like to be. But then again when a guy gets laid off at his job and has to go homeless, while someone shoots up a store and gets an air-conditioned cell, with a TV, and 3 meals a day. Something about that doesn't sit well with me. I think menial labor isn't at all cruel and unusual punishment. Making someone work back a debt to society is fine by me. You murder someone and get a ton of bills built up in lawyer fees and court costs, you should have to work it off. Tax payers are already paying your bills, and getting you fed and clothed. Some of the people paying for prisoners live in shittier surroundings. I just feel like prison should be terrible. It's not like there's a hidden list of things you go to jail for. People know it. It's like the kid who you repeatedly tell "Don't tough the stove, it's hot" and sure enough the kid does it. Do you feel bad for the kid that he touched the stove, despite you telling him repeatedly not to?

[QUOTE=yuki;24571694]Your point? We had this neat thing called the "Civil War" over the concept of slavery. We concluded it was unjust and outlawed it after beating the shit out of the southern states. You can't force someone to work, it's simply not ethically correct.[/QUOTE] It's not really Slavery is it. If someone murders a bunch of people then they are at a debt to society, in my opinion, and thus working in a work camp would be repaying that debt to society. Slavery was just kidnapping people from other countries and forcing them to work, this is more of a repayment. [QUOTE=Brt5470;24578731]Slavery of innocent people either taking into work or born into it is different than someone who committed a heinous crime and has to work the rest of their life for it.[/QUOTE] ^ This.

How would it help? They will go back to their original ways on the streets. Execution says otherwise.

People would rather choose to work instead of being executed. Also it's better that they contribute to society after what they've done. They wouldn't do anything "dangerous" while working because they know what would happen then. The list goes on about how this is much better than death penalty. Would you choose to be sent to labour camp or execution?

[QUOTE=orgornot;24613077]People would rather choose to work instead of being executed. Also it's better that they contribute to society after what they've done. They wouldn't do anything "dangerous" while working because they know what would happen then. The list goes on about how this is much better than death penalty. Would you choose to be sent to labour camp or execution?[/QUOTE] I would choose to be sent to a labour camp and kill myself if I wanted to. I realized how dumb the majority of Facepunch really is after making this thread.