[QUOTE=OvB;18056515][img]http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/4836/20070824rz1apnukeenergy.jpg[/img]
Just throwing this out there...[/QUOTE]
Look more into nuclear energy dude...There is still waste from it from what I was told / read there is a shit ton of nuclear waste and the half life for it is ridiculous so it just builds up. (That seems to be the only con next to a nuclear meltdown) :dance:
[editline]10:05PM[/editline]
I got ninja'd D:
[QUOTE=Master_Jeeves;18056532]Look more into nuclear energy dude...There is still waste from it from what I was told / read there is a shit ton of nuclear waste and the half life for it is ridiculous so it just builds up. (That seems to be the only con next to a nuclear meltdown) :dance:
[editline]10:05PM[/editline]
I got ninja'd D:[/QUOTE]
Well for the time being it's a lot better than coal and oil power plants. And it would alleviate pressure on the oil refinery's so we could devote more production into fuels for vehicles and not powering our homes.
It's an extremely viable resource while we develop/build better solar and wind collectors.
[QUOTE=OvB;18056569]Well for the time being it's a lot better than coal and oil power plants. And it would alleviate pressure on the oil refinery's so we could devote more production into fuels for vehicles and not powering our homes.
It's an extremely viable resource while we develop/build better solar and wind collectors.[/QUOTE]
This is were politics gets involved / funding / all that egotistical bullshit that needs to be thrown aside...If people would look at the bigger and more important picture we wouldn't have to deal with a lot of retarded shit like alternative fuels etc.
For example if Nikola Tesla didn't get shunned because "his work is ludicrous and it's from the devil" and all that other hoopla we would have electronics that wouldn't need to be plugged into a power socket...everything would be via Tesla Towers (Just imagine that... that would be fucking awesome) And than again electric cars come into play!
[QUOTE=TH89;18056396]Rapid shifts in global climate do cause instances of extreme weather in both directions, much like jerking a cup of coffee to the right will cause it to slosh out both sides.
~=~analogy king~=~
Again, you're thinking of changes that happened over millenia, not decades. The kind of shift we're talking about is unprecedented save for natural disasters like meteor strikes and similar phenomena. Nobody's saying all life is going to be wiped out, but the fact that some fish species will survive doesn't mean the fishing industry won't suffer severe losses, which will effect both food production and jobs. In poor parts of the world that rely on fishing to get by it would be catastrophic.[/QUOTE]
Nice analogy! I like.
I still don't see the problem. Food sources can be and have been shifted before. Here in the U.S., just a few decades ago, we made a major shift to a corn-based food economy. They'll find other species to fish. Perhaps additional rain in places will be more conducive to farming. Our species deals with change on a daily basis. Changes in the economy, changes in technology, changes in infectious disease. It all just seems to boil down to "stuffs gonna change". Even if it happens in a matter of decades, it's still plenty of time to re-tool and go for another strategy. We're the cockroaches of the mammal order. We'll get by.
I so agree with the above cartoon. Nuclear energy is the way to go no doubt. It's a shame so many are fearful of radioactive waste. Bury it under a mountain where it came from and be done with it. We even have facilities ready to go for exactly this purpose!
edit: Aww hell.. Here come the boxes from the anti-nuclear nuts...
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18056668]Nice analogy! I like.
I still don't see the problem. Food sources can be and have been shifted before. Here in the U.S., just a few decades ago, we made a major shift to a corn-based food economy. They'll find other species to fish. Perhaps additional rain in places will be more conducive to farming. Our species deals with change on a daily basis. Changes in the economy, changes in technology, changes in infectious disease. It all just seems to boil down to "stuffs gonna change". Even if it happens in a matter of decades, it's still plenty of time to re-tool and go for another strategy. We're the cockroaches of the mammal order. We'll get by.[/QUOTE]
I hope you like Fillet o' fish because that's all that will be available.
[img]http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/2379/pollock1.jpg[/img]
That dude on the right, that's what you will be like when you realize Alaskan Pollock is the only sustainable fish on the planet in 100 years.
People need to pay more attention in science class
[QUOTE=OvB;18056710]I hope you like Fillet o' fish because that's all that will be available.
[img]http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/2379/pollock1.jpg[/img]
That dude on the right, that's what you will be like when you realize Alaskan Pollock is the only sustainable fish on the planet in 100 years.[/QUOTE]
I'm partial to [img]http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:0vOthjruaFsswM:http://bluesoul.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/bread.jpg[/img] and [img]http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:jRtIC2WgvxseqM:http://www.leamington.ca/general/images/tomaotes.jpg[/img] and maybe some this delicious looking creature [img]http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:_SDNrUep3A-qKM:http://www.rawmilktruth.com/images/cow.jpg[/img]. Warm weather means less ice and more viable farmland! Yay agriculture!
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18056668]Nice analogy! I like.
I still don't see the problem. Food sources can be and have been shifted before. Here in the U.S., just a few decades ago, we made a major shift to a corn-based food economy. They'll find other species to fish. Perhaps additional rain in places will be more conducive to farming. Our species deals with change on a daily basis. Changes in the economy, changes in technology, changes in infectious disease. It all just seems to boil down to "stuffs gonna change". Even if it happens in a matter of decades, it's still plenty of time to re-tool and go for another strategy. We're the cockroaches of the mammal order. We'll get by.[/QUOTE]
You seem like a reasonable dude, but "getting by" seems like an awfully low standard to set. It's easy to forget what an amazingly cushy, indulgent lifestyle we're accustomed to in the West, and how much of that is contingent on structures that are going to be undermined
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18056668]I so agree with the above cartoon. Nuclear energy is the way to go no doubt. It's a shame so many are fearful of radioactive waste. Bury it under a mountain where it came from and be done with it. We even have facilities ready to go for exactly this purpose!
edit: Aww hell.. Here come the boxes from the anti-nuclear nuts...[/QUOTE]
Agreed. The waste IS an issue (and I don't think burying it is going to solve the problem haha) but people being the innovative creatures we are that seems like the least of our worries compared to the disastrous consequences of fossil fuels.
I really don't want to see something like this album cover again.
[img]http://static.rateyourmusic.com/album_images/e1620ca2f2ccc211f9a6ecfdced5a83c/37282.jpg[/img]
Damn that's depressing.
[QUOTE=thisispain;18056983]I really don't want to see something like this album cover again.
[img]http://static.rateyourmusic.com/album_images/e1620ca2f2ccc211f9a6ecfdced5a83c/37282.jpg[/img]
Damn that's depressing.[/QUOTE]
I want to see more like this:
[img]http://blogs.villagevoice.com/statusainthood/archives/images/bigbear.jpg[/img]
Now that's a vision of the future I can get behind
[QUOTE=TH89;18057000]
Now that's a vision of the future I can get behind[/QUOTE]
Something we can all agree on.
[QUOTE=TH89;18057000]I want to see more like this:
[img]http://blogs.villagevoice.com/statusainthood/archives/images/bigbear.jpg[/img]
Now that's a vision of the future I can get behind[/QUOTE]
[img]http://bayimg.com/image/cangiaabc.jpg[/img]
I like bears too
[editline]11:10PM[/editline]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fe-IkkLT3u8[/media]
I know for sure that we will get a huge energy crisis once this scam comes to an end.
[QUOTE=TH89;18054204]What are you talking about? Their "agenda" is to DO SCIENCE TO FIND OUT THINGS ABOUT THE CLIMATE
Do you think biologists have an "evolution agenda" and physicists have a "gravity agenda?" and they're all trying to ~hide the truth~? How does that make any sense at all?[/QUOTE]
why do you make my posts out to be conspiracy i'm merely stating the other side of the argument that we don't make a significant contribution to global warming
how is that a conspiracy theory?
[QUOTE=TH89;18056949]You seem like a reasonable dude, but "getting by" seems like an awfully low standard to set. It's easy to forget what an amazingly cushy, indulgent lifestyle we're accustomed to in the West, and how much of that is contingent on structures that are going to be undermined[/QUOTE]
I would consider "getting by" as the bare minimum of what the human race will do. From what I've seen in our history, constantly thriving despite crushing adversity, we will continue to advance and thrive.
Hehe.. This will probably come as a surprise to ya.. I've got a 1000 square foot garden outside and grow a minimum of 25% of what we eat here. I compost all biological waste save for sewage of course (free fertilizer.. why not?). I drive a 23 year old Honda Civic that still gets 35mpg and I service the thing myself, regularly. I make many of the things we use in daily life from electronics (I love to solder) to dishes (yes I fire my own pottery), furniture to tools. I rarely throw anything out and I almost never buy anything new. Hell.. Both of our big TVs I found on the side of the road and repaired. We've got cat-5 network cable in every room for each of our 4 computers, most of which were built from customers old parts or found on the roadside. Even the cable was scrap from a construction site I reused! Recycling at its best. I even make my own bread, often with wheat I grew and ground myself and yeast I cultured in a bucket in my kitchen. I'm an avid gun nut and hunter though but I even make the ammunition I use, casting my own bullets and reloading my own cartridges. (I would understand if you were skeptical about any of this (my lifestyle is pretty far from the norm in the western world) so by all means, ask me about any of the processes I've described here and I'd be happy to thoroughly explain to confirm that I'm not bullshitting you.)
The idiot yuppies down the street with their service vans outside every other day and their brand new, gas guzzling SUVs and full trash cans every trash day (stuffed with boxes from shiny new crap they don't need).. Those are leading a 'cushy western lifestyle'. I find it a little too empty for my tastes. I admit that these changes may bring some problem to their lifestyle but to be honest, they might get more out of life if they had to work together a little for what goes on the dinner table, or had to stop for a moment and figure out how all this infrastructure they suckle on actually works.
Don't get me wrong though. I hardly consider myself impoverished. I've got more than enough in my investment portfolio to buy several new cars.. My wife and I agree that wealth is kind of a cancer to happiness though and is best kept out of the home. I find living the simple life a lot more rewarding. Working outside in the garden with my sons with the evening breeze on our backs.. I almost feel guilty sometimes that I enjoy my life so much, while everyone else always seems so damned miserable.. I may be living in some of that "cushy western lifestyle" but to be honest, I'd have little problem seeing it go. I'd bet if others knew what I knew, they wouldn't either.
[QUOTE=TH89;18056949]
Agreed. The waste IS an issue (and I don't think burying it is going to solve the problem haha) but people being the innovative creatures we are that seems like the least of our worries compared to the disastrous consequences of fossil fuels.[/QUOTE]
Why wouldn't burying it solve the problem? It came from the ground to begin with anyway. I've visited uranium mines here in Texas, huge rock faces of powdery yellow ore, right in the water table! Nobody dies of radiation poisoning from their wells nearby. Even the large aquifers have mild to moderate radioactive contamination from natural deposits. Tolerance to moderate radioactivity in our water is something we have already evolved with (the selective pressure has been around longer than life itself) and so low level exposure doesn't seem all that disturbing to me. It would be a simple thing to find an area below the water table to store the waste anyway. A deep mine or cave for instance.
It irritates me that these 'green' anti-nuclear loons don't know that coal itself is also moderately radioactive. Burning it releases thousands of times the radioactive material than would ever be released at an operational nuclear power plant. I think the big concrete cooling towers just scare the dumb folks and the whole "where do we put the waste?" argument just seems like an empty excuse to protest the thing they fear; nuclear power and the tiny risk of meltdown.
[QUOTE=rilez;18057153]why do you make my posts out to be conspiracy i'm merely stating the other side of the argument that we don't make a significant contribution to global warming
how is that a conspiracy theory?[/QUOTE]
You're basically all climatologists (and most other scientists) all over the world to be lying in order to get more money.
How is that NOT a conspiracy theory?
Basically all you need to know is that we are speeding up natural climate change, funnily enough people seem to think we can stop climate change altogether
[QUOTE=TH89;18061390]You're basically all climatologists (and most other scientists) all over the world to be lying in order to get more money.
How is that NOT a conspiracy theory?[/QUOTE]
I think he's saying it's in their own interests to inflate the predicted consequences of climate change. This brings more attention to the phenomenon which immediately leads to increased funding. You'll see this in other professions as well; plumbers suggesting a full reroute when a thorough (and much cheaper) line snaking would do, phone companies recommending services customers don't need/won't use, mechanics wanting to replace your cars entire cooling system when only the thermostat ($15 part) is seized up. Lawn care specialists resodding an entire lawn when a few cheap grass plugs would do.
It's called "up-sale" and when peoples livelihood is at stake, it is guaranteed to happen. Remember these scientists earn a living off the science they do. I don't think, by any means, that all their data is tainted. Just that, when called to estimate, they would choose the high side of things. It would seem wise to be a little critical of the results of their research because of this.
Man made global warming is a fact. Simple as that. I really dislike it when you have large populaces disagreeing with the scientific consensus because they're too ignorant to put two and two together.
In my opinion, nuclear fission, solar, and wind are the way to go for our power needs until fusion can replace fission. Fission does produce nuclear waste, but it can be stored deep underground in Nevada (yes the government is building a facility to do this there) and similar desert environments where it won't contaminate anything.
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18061720]I think he's saying it's in their own interests to inflate the predicted consequences of climate change. This brings more attention to the phenomenon which immediately leads to increased funding. You'll see this in other professions as well; plumbers suggesting a full reroute when a thorough (and much cheaper) line snaking would do, phone companies recommending services customers don't need/won't use, mechanics wanting to replace your cars entire cooling system when only the thermostat ($15 part) is seized up. Lawn care specialists resodding an entire lawn when a few cheap grass plugs would do.[/QUOTE]
The difference being that more funding doesn't mean higher salaries, it just means more money to spend on research. Plus, research is subject to peer review by a group that has no interest in the funding of the researchers whose work they're reviewing, so they would have no motivation to go along with fraudulent data.
If you've talked to many scientists, there's a very common mentality of wanting to find "the truth," to the point of obsession. Remember that all data and analysis is made public in research journals, and for every scientist spinning a story to get more funding, there'd be 5 more wanting to expose him for being a fraud. The atmosphere of the scientific community just doesn't lend itself to widespread campaigns of misinformation.
[QUOTE=rilez;18052564]Of course climatologists are going to agree with global warming. If you were one, would you not push your own agenda? Some scientists say that we Humans have little or nothing to do with contributing to global warming. But belief in global warming is the more profitable choice, or so it seems, and who doesn't want to make money? Even your graph says more climatologists say no or not sure than publicized climatologists, does that not say something?[/QUOTE]
oh those highly educated scientists with their [i]agenda[/i] :smugdog:
They're trying to KILL JESUS
[QUOTE=TH89;18062031]The difference being that more funding doesn't mean higher salaries, it just means more money to spend on research. Plus, research is subject to peer review by a group that has no interest in the funding of the researchers whose work they're reviewing, so they would have no motivation to go along with fraudulent data.
If you've talked to many scientists, there's a very common mentality of wanting to find "the truth," to the point of obsession. Remember that all data and analysis is made public in research journals, and for every scientist spinning a story to get more funding, there'd be 5 more wanting to expose him for being a fraud. The atmosphere of the scientific community just doesn't lend itself to widespread campaigns of misinformation.[/QUOTE]
I mostly agree with you. The vast majority of scientists do have that innate need for truth. Still, there are always going to be people trying to manipulate the system, the data, their peers, whoever to line their pockets. We are greedy, self-interested animals and not all of us have managed to suppress that basic instinct completely, even scientific communities. Yes, I know increased funding doesn't lead to increased salary directly. It does however lead to increased prestige which inevitably leads to more pay.
Attention -> More funding -> More prestige -> More pay.
Again, It's obvious that we're having an impact on the climate here on this rockball. For millions of years, energy from the sun has been stored up by plants in hydrocarbons under the surface in the form of oil, gas, and coal. Suddenly we come along and start releasing massive amounts of it back into the system, circumventing the natural balance plants had struck with CO2 levels.. People who spout that it's all a conspiracy get put on my 'too dumb for me to listen to' list as the basic principal is so damned simple to comprehend. Still, and I can't help but notice that your avatar features one of the most famous skeptics of modern time, skepticism is a required component of science. The whole "Day after Tomarrow" scenario and similar predictions are a result of a failure to think critically when dealing with the data and they strike me as sensationalist cries for more funding..
I don't see what's so hard to understand; expulsion of CO2 from fossil fuels traps heat, therefore raises temperatures in certain places. that is global warming.
why don't people understand this
I for one welcome global warming, I'm welsh, It rains so much we've got webbed feet.
In Noah and his boat it said that there was 40 days and 40 nights of rain, and that's the best summer I remember.
[media]http://test.scoilnet.ie/res/crosswords/desert.jpg[/media]
I've never seen a blue sky [I]in my life[/I] I want some of ^ that.
please for my sake pump more CO2 into the atmosphere.
[QUOTE=Psycho0124;18062284]words[/QUOTE]
That I can agree with.
High five.
drown the third world drown the third world DROWN THE THIRD WORLD DROWN IT DROWN ITTTTTTT
[QUOTE=Kingy_who;18062678]
In Noah and his boat it said that there was 40 days and 40 nights of rain, and that's the best summer I remember.
[/QUOTE]
Because that totally happened.
Also the problem with global warming is that we don't know its effect on various parts of the world. The recent cooldown of the UK has been attributed to global warming.
why do 99% of people not "get" how global warming works
its not that complicated
[QUOTE=PoodleSlayer;18054771]as I've posted in another of these threads, they've already figured out what causes global warming
[img]http://wackyiraqi.com/update/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/global_warning.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
Oh what will they think of next?
[b] This just in, Farting accelerate global warming![/b]
[editline]03:52AM[/editline]
And then people will go batshit insane not to let loose a flatulence
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