[QUOTE=Im Crimson;22417992]This can't be the entire truth, because there are many people who continue to smoke even though they know each cigarette brings them one step closer to lung cancer. I think the question is what keeps them going when they truthfully know that they shouldn't? Do they have a tiny "oh fuck it"-moment before every smoke break, or what is the deal?[/QUOTE]
Well, logically I'd say it's a disconnect from the reality of lung cancer. Even though you know and believe that it's slowly killing you, you don't feel it killing you and so there is a disconnect with the fact and your actions.
However, I know people who have oxygen tanks that kept smoking, and had it blow up in their face, and yet continue to smoke, so that can't be all of it.
Hence, I fall back to:
[quote]As the brain continues to adapt to the presence of the drug, regions outside of the reward pathway are also affected. Brain regions responsible for judgment, learning and memory begin to physically change or become "hard-wired."
Once this happens, drug-seeking behavior becomes driven by habit, almost reflex. This is how a drug user becomes transformed into a drug addict.[/quote]
[url]http://learn.genetics.utah.edu/content/addiction/drugs/[/url]
"However, I know people who have oxygen tanks that kept smoking, and had it blow up in there face, and yet continue to smoke, so that can't be all of it."
Death wish or stupidity. I can't decide. I'm falling back on addiction is for the weak-willed. Stop enabling yourself and the problem is fixed. You can call it what you want, but I'm just not feeling it. It's a simple concept, like you said.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22418100]"However, I know people who have oxygen tanks that kept smoking, and had it blow up in there face, and yet continue to smoke, so that can't be all of it."
Death wish or stupidity. I can't decide. I'm falling back on addiction is for the weak-willed. Stop enabling yourself and the problem is fixed. You can call it what you want, but I'm just not feeling it. It's a simple concept, like you said.[/QUOTE]
I presume it was just not caring. She was already old and dying from other things, probably didn't give a fuck.
It has little to do with will-power, though, as that link I posted would explain. I'm not going to try to push addiction on you, though, just trying to explain why people do what they do, using my experiences with addiction.
[QUOTE=Ultra Violence;22418167]I presume it was just not caring. She was already old and dying from other things, probably didn't give a fuck.
It has little to do with will-power, though, as that link I posted would explain. I'm not going to try to push addiction on you, though, just trying to explain why people do what they do, using my experiences with addiction.[/QUOTE]
Nah, your point is taken. I understand.
I still disagree though, it's entirely based on willpower. If you know you don't really require something, commonsense should kick in and allow you to produce some sort of willpower to stop yourself from lighting that cigarette or whatever you're doing, right?
[QUOTE=MonkeyMan44;22413848]That's like saying you're going to constantly avoid water just so there is no chance you will drown in it. That you're never going to touch a car, so there's no chance to crash in it.[/QUOTE]
Water is a life necessity, and cars are becoming very neccessary in modern society (It's hard to take a bus across the country.)
Drugs and Cigarettes on the other hand, are just wants that ruin lives and people get addicted to them. Not worth trying, even once. You think "Oh, it's fine. I'll have them once, won't like it, blah blah" but if you do like it, and be like "Oh, just one more time."
Bam. Now you're hooked. It's how the industry works, how drug dealers make money, and how selling Cigarettes is a multi-billion dollar industry.
People have fapping addictions. It's mainly because any sort of habitual activity has become a part of their life, almost like a hobby.
Great thread, OP. Next you should tell people with PTSD that they're sissies despite never having been to war.
I'm addicted to Oxygen, so yes I need it or I die.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22412260]First off, I understand the chemical [U]dependency[/U] of some addictions, and I am NOT referring to that type of addiction. I'm referring to cigarettes and the like. [B]Edit:[/B] I mean dependancy as in you'll die if you don't have it any more. Nicotine is a want chemical, not a need.
I would like to start by saying I think people have addictive personalities, which makes it hard for them to let go of it. Maybe they like doing it and need an excuse to continue doing it. People can do what they want, I'm not saying they should stop. I'm just trying to understand how they can be "addicted" if they really do want to quit. Me? I don't really have a problem with addiction, I've never been addicted to anything. As a result, I don't understand people who find themselves addicted.
Furthermore, I understand that it's chemical based. I'm not asking how addiction works, I'm asking why people have such a hard time with it.
Normally I write tl;dr threads, so I'll keep this one short.
Addiction? Your thoughts?[/QUOTE]
Yes there are dependencies that if not dealt with correctly or if you go cold turkey they will kill you.
Alcohol dependency is one of them.
[editline]07:50PM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22417957]It's not that the concept of addiction is complicated... What's complicated is understanding that people have a hard time quitting something they know is killing them (maybe). If you know it's bad for you, and you don't enjoy it, why continue doing it? Isn't a couple days/weeks/whatever of "suffering" worth it to better yourself?[/QUOTE]
...That's what addiction does, you know its killing you but because it messes with the chemistry of your brain and body you don't ever want to lose it, and you start to love what it is, you form a mental addiction that tells you "this is good it keeps you level it keeps you sane without you're lost man."
[QUOTE=Dashiel;22412268]It's real and it only happens to idiots who have no self control.[/QUOTE]
Well look at this, a 12 year old doctor and his interns rating him agree
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22413925]Correct me if I'm wrong (and I probably am) but most people seem to be more addicted to the habit, than the nicotine. Which explains why patches and gum rarely work. Wouldn't this imply cigarette addiction is HEAVILY habit based, and chemicals are just an easy rope to grab? Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying chemicals aren't part of it. But I think it's overplayed a lot.[/QUOTE]
It's not just a habit. I am able to kinda feel when I need my nicotine "fix". For example: When I need a cigarette I go outside and light one. When I'm nearing the filter I (usually) feel better, and my craving for nicotine is gone. So it [I]is [/I]a chemical addiction.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22418218]Nah, your point is taken. I understand.
I still disagree though, it's entirely based on willpower. If you know you don't really require something, commonsense should kick in and allow you to produce some sort of willpower to stop yourself from lighting that cigarette or whatever you're doing, right?[/QUOTE]
Do you not understand the concept of a chemical addiction or are you just trolling
I was once a smoker and quit after some time and now I can smoke a half pack and treat it like nothing. It's not like I'll start again.
i smoke cigs when i want, and that's not often
i think that you can rationally avoid addiction to an extent
[QUOTE=Crackatowa;22421375]I was once a smoker and quit after some time and now I can smoke a half pack and treat it like nothing. It's not like I'll start again.[/QUOTE]
Assuming this is truth, I imagine it would ring some type of bell with you guys that chemicals are just an easy excuse for lack of willpower. You don't really seem to get the concept of "some people [B][U]can[/U][/B] actually control themselves enough to not do what they don't want to do."
Until I actually have the honors of experiencing addiction, I'm going to continue to believe some people just don't have the ability to fight off the urges. I've never had a problem with any type of addiction (that is directly bad for me) in my life. I just can't relate to it, and it's not because I haven't tried either. A shame, I was really hoping for a deeper grasp of what causes it, but all you say is the same repeated answer that roughly translates to no willpower to fight off the urges. Call it what you want, it's hardly deniable though. If you don't wanna do something, don't do it (even if you think it's going to make you feel better, you will still know it's bad for you). Pretty easy concept I'd say. Or maybe it's just the lack of care for their own health and they just need some justifiable reason to kill themselves off without getting judged in the same way.
[quote=Zeke129]Do you not understand the concept of a chemical addiction or are you just trollin[/quote] With all the A+++ threads I make, the answer to that should be very clear. I'm dead set in what I think. It's not a lack of understanding just because I have a different opinion than your own.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22429033]With all the A+++ threads I make, the answer to that should be very clear. I'm dead set in what I think. It's not a lack of understanding just because I have a different opinion than your own.[/QUOTE]
Your opinion is contrary to that of every respected physician in the world. Therefore, it isn't an opinion - it's just you being wrong. For example, "I believe gravity pulls objects away from each other" isn't an opinion, it's [b]factually inaccurate[/b].
[QUOTE=Zeke129;22429119]Your opinion is contrary to that of every respected physician in the world. Therefore, it isn't an opinion - it's just you being wrong. For example, "I believe gravity pulls objects away from each other" isn't an opinion, it's [B]factually inaccurate[/B].[/QUOTE]
Yeah... But mine is arguable because there ARE people who don't get addicted to stuff. Doesn't that seem suspicious to you in the least? It's almost like a placebo effect, everyone hears how bad addiction is then next thing you know everyone's addicted. And that just doesn't make sense to me.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22429191]Yeah... But mine is arguable because there ARE people who don't get addicted to stuff. Doesn't that seem suspicious to you in the least? It's almost like a placebo effect, everyone hears how bad addiction is then next thing you know everyone's addicted. And that just doesn't make sense to me.[/QUOTE]
Did it ever occur to you that perhaps the people NOT getting addicted are the exception
[QUOTE=Zeke129;22429220]Did it ever occur to you that perhaps the people NOT getting addicted are the exception[/QUOTE]
Then I will consider myself lucky. I will also consider that the part where willpower comes in.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22429273]Then I will consider myself lucky. I will also consider that the part where willpower comes in.[/QUOTE]
Willpower can overcome pain, doesn't mean pain doesn't exist. Replace "pain" with "addiction" in the case of this thread.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;22429289]Willpower can overcome pain, doesn't mean pain doesn't exist. Replace "pain" with "addiction" in the case of this thread.[/QUOTE]
Then you agree, it's entirely based on the persons willpower. As I said, I'm not questioning the cause of addiction, I'm questing why it's so hard for people to quit.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22429354]Then you agree, it's entirely based on the persons willpower. As I said, I'm not questioning the cause of addiction, I'm questing why it's so hard for people to quit.[/QUOTE]
Because it's a really strong need. Can you hold your breath until you pass out? Some can, most can't. Same with addiction. Some can beat it, some can't.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22429354]Then you agree, it's entirely based on the persons willpower. As I said, I'm not questioning the cause of addiction, I'm questing why it's so hard for people to quit.[/QUOTE]
No, willpower is not wanting to go to the gym today, but doing it anyway.
Addiction is something else entirely; willpower is only a piece of a much, much larger picture.
I'm a caffeine addict.
I never get any sleep.
Question: If you get addicted to cigarretes, or any drug for that matter, can you just quit by not using the drug again? Or is rehab really necessary?
[editline]08:52PM[/editline]
Assuming you have the self control not to touch the drug again.
OP needs to get high on opiates everyday for two or three weeks and then stop cold turkey. Then come back and tell us about addiction.
[QUOTE=rathat48;22412367]I tried pot once, it was horrible and i couldn't move my body for an hour, than I ate 2 boxes of my friends cookies and threw up, but
I still kind of want it and think about it every day.
Everything smells like it now, wish it were legal.[/QUOTE]
Pot has no physical addiction you tard
[editline]03:24AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=MonkeyMan44;22413848]That's like saying you're going to constantly avoid water just so there is no chance you will drown in it. That you're never going to touch a car, so there's no chance to crash in it.[/QUOTE]
No not really
If psychological addictions aren't real then I guess that the old ladies at the pokies just enjoy losing obscene amounts of money and breaking apart families.
[QUOTE=Bloodshed16;22429354]Then you agree, it's entirely based on the persons willpower. As I said, I'm not questioning the cause of addiction, I'm questing why it's so hard for people to quit.[/QUOTE]
No, it's not entirely based on willpower. Read further into what I said.
Not all pain can be overcome with willpower just like not all addiction can. It depends on the strength of the person's willpower and the strength of their addiction.
Remember, your initial question was "Is addiction real", not "Can addition be overcome".
The answer to the former is yes and to the latter is yes given certain circumstances.
There are two kinds of addiction. Chemical addictions that actually get the brain accustom to certain chemicals (Like opioids). There also is a mental addiction that is coupled with any action or item that creates happiness (IE, using the internet, masturbating, eating cake, ectect).
Yes, addiction is very real, and some people are genetically predisposed to have addictive personalities. I work at a Methadone clinic and have to deal with those people on a daily basis.
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