Are video games sexist? - General

[QUOTE=Str4fe;46038275]This, i mean i have a female friend that plays a lot of games, and she is the one that's picking the sexualized characters.[/QUOTE] same I love playing sexualized characters, maybe they want to look badass and sexy at the same time. Moxxi from the borderlands franchise is great at doing that

[QUOTE=leoshig;46042417]I thought people liked that guy.[/QUOTE] the people who didnt got banned by him

Amazing video :) I really enjoyed it

[QUOTE=MaxOfS2D;46039977]Misogyny and sexism isn't necessarily "rawr i hate women >:(" [highlight](User was permabanned for this post ("Was Warned" - Craptasket))[/highlight][/QUOTE] OH SHIT BASED CRAPTASKET

Discussion about video games and feminism -> MaxofS2D Sausage Party -> ??

[QUOTE=rebel1324;46043551]Discussion about video games and feminism -> MaxofS2D Sausage Party -> ??[/QUOTE] Maybe we can permaban someone else?

[QUOTE=Cabbage;46041773][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-5TI0c_iL4[/media][/QUOTE] [IMG]http://puu.sh/bIJpM.png[/IMG] Max watched this lmao

Didn't know this video would start such a clusterfuck.

I don't think video games are sexist or the vast majority of people who consider themselves part of the "games community" are sexist. So that being established, does anyone else feel suspicious about a conservative think tank all the sudden jumping into videos about video game politics?

[QUOTE=Raidyr;46043871]I don't think video games are sexist or the vast majority of people who consider themselves part of the "games community" are sexist. So that being established, does anyone else feel suspicious about a conservative think tank all the sudden jumping into videos about video game politics?[/QUOTE] Capitalism. If there is a desire for this kind of video out there that overcomes the suspicion of it coming from a conservative think tank, the market is there and they'll jump in. Really it's just the issue that has gotten a lot of attention at the moment and like everyone else, they'll probably move on before long. I don't think they've changed much, but while it's convenient and on an issue that shares some common ground there's no need to turn them away.

[QUOTE=Devodiere;46044003]Capitalism. If there is a desire for this kind of video out there that overcomes the suspicion of it coming from a conservative think tank, the market is there and they'll jump in.[/QUOTE] Obviously. Being told by the "Factual Feminist" (indeed) that you aren't a sexist is appealing for a lot of people regardless of the source. I agree with most of what she said, but it's still unnerving.

[QUOTE=Raidyr;46044028]Obviously. Being told by the "Factual Feminist" (indeed) that you aren't a sexist is appealing for a lot of people regardless of the source. I agree with most of what she said, but it's still unnerving.[/QUOTE] Yeah, there's some stupid shit that happens in a lot of far right-wing stuff. So much ego pandering and appeals to absolute truth, reminds me of how arrogant the Internet Aristocrat's name is. Who cares though, you've got enough sense to not get conned by that kind of thing and with so many people falling into other traps on the far-left side, this isn't anything new.

[QUOTE=MaxOfS2D;46039977]Misogyny and sexism isn't necessarily "rawr i hate women >:(" [highlight](User was permabanned for this post ("Was Warned" - Craptasket))[/highlight][/QUOTE] [IMG]http://puu.sh/bIPPs/a40ad9dcdb.png[/IMG] BASED

[QUOTE=Raidyr;46043871]So that being established, does anyone else feel suspicious about a conservative think tank all the sudden jumping into videos about video game politics?[/QUOTE] A conservative think tank and Breitbart working with gamers to fight against gamer injustice. It's very suspicious.

[QUOTE=NoobSauce;46037120]Why does everyone have to be a pussy and be offended by everything Why can't people create games without other people flipping their shit and wanting them to restrict creativity. Just, why[/QUOTE] thats why I LOVE jap game devs. They don't really give a fuck about demographics and just make god damn games. Most eastern game devs laugh in people's faces when they said they were offended.

Video in the OP is against criticism which is dumb, because all media that wants to be taken seriously should be okay with even feminist critics. If it means we'll get better writing in the long run, it's fine. Are all critics perfect? Nope but doesn't mean we should stop critics. Also, it's pretty much impossible for any media to not have sexism, so it's fine to point it out.

[QUOTE=Cl0cK;46044482]Video in the OP is against criticism[/QUOTE] How can it be against criticism when it criticizes critics?

[QUOTE=RichyZ;46037292]are you seriously trying to argue that videogames are well written lol[/QUOTE] Uhm, Halo had an fantastic lore with plenty of female marines and Spartans (ignoring Kat's ass she had good backstory). The persona/shin megami tensei series had good characters and dialogue. Half Life 2 and portal 1/2. Even blops 1/2 had a really neat campaign with decent writing. Uncharted series with likable characters and writing, same with Last of us. Almost all of Rockstar's games had good characters because of the writing. Deus Ex had neat conspiracy plots with excellent writing in the second. All the fallout games are equally good. Any of Kojima's games period (mother fucking Boss as one of the best female characters i think ever). Paper's please/The Stanley parable are amazing at writing and conveying games as an art. Theres plenty of games out there with amazing writing and lore if you really care. Thanks to technology today we can hold fucktons of dialogue while conveying emotions with graphics, compared to early game history when you were lucky to even get a synopsis of the plot anywhere in the game.

alright, i'm back from sleep and work. i'm actually going to use capital letters and done some hardcore thinking and pseudo-research so watch the heck out The distinction she makes between hardcore and casual gamers is faulty because the crux of her argument relies on her idea that women themselves are just not psychologically willing to play these games. I haven't personally read her books, but a bunch of dudes who have have told me that that's basically the entire argument right there: women just don't wanna... because... If you accept that the statistics represent a distinction between genders then you have to explain why many women are into what she terms “hardcore” games but cite the toxic atmosphere around them as one of the main reasons as to why they don't participate in the community. Super counter intuitive. She also misrepresents and defaces the arguments of critics (surprise) by slandering them with personal attacks, and not actually going through their arguments and calling them “gender police” that want to eliminate male culture behind games, which isn't an actual thing any major critic has ever said. She also misrepresents the things “feminists” are critical of as being things inherent to being male which tie into the big message behind her books (that dismissive shit I mentioned earlier) completely ignoring that many males enjoy and develop games that aren’t in that category and both casual male and female gamers outnumber her definition of “hardcore gamers”. arent male gamers who are gay tired of non-gay representation too? I think they are and you can’t just write them off as feminists. In short the reason shes wrong is because the crux of her argument is entirely based on her opinion that women as a GENDER shouldnt enjoy these games and that they want to destroy something which is MALE. This is super gender-essentialist and basically throws out both female “hardcore gamers” and male “casual gamers” (which are people that really exist believe it or not). This is exactly what people are criticizing, the idea that violent videogames with boobs are endemic to being male and antithetical to being female. She’s just calling games a boys thing, which is not true at all.

[QUOTE=codemaster85;46044525]Uhm, Halo had an fantastic lore with plenty of female marines and Spartans (ignoring Kat's ass she had good backstory). The persona/shin megami tensei series had good characters and dialogue. Half Life 2 and portal 1/2. Even blops 1/2 had a really neat campaign with decent writing. Uncharted series with likable characters and writing, same with Last of us. Almost all of Rockstar's games had good characters because of the writing. Deus Ex had neat conspiracy plots with excellent writing in the second.[B] All the fallout games are equally good.[/B] Any of Kojima's games period (mother fucking Boss as one of the best female characters i think ever). Paper's please/The Stanley parable are amazing at writing and conveying games as an art. Theres plenty of games out there with amazing writing and lore if you really care. Thanks to technology today we can hold fucktons of dialogue while conveying emotions with graphics, compared to early game history when you were lucky to even get a synopsis of the plot anywhere in the game.[/QUOTE] Lets not pretend fallout 3 had good writing

[QUOTE=EnlightenDead;46044593]Lets not pretend fallout 3 had good writing[/QUOTE] it was okay if you avoided the main quest and people related to the main quest. NV's writting was 100x better overall though.

[QUOTE=codemaster85;46044618]it was okay if you avoided the main quest and people related to the main quest. NV's writting was 100x better overall though.[/QUOTE] 100x better, but it was also unusually bland to me. It might just be the voice actors, though. Jiminy cricket, they had over a dozen voice actors for the NCR and every single one of them was as distanced from the matter as [i]Boone[/i] was.

The inclusion of a snippet of one of Maddox's videos came as a huge surprise

[QUOTE=milkandcooki;46044592]In short the reason shes wrong is because the crux of her argument is entirely based on her opinion that women as a GENDER shouldnt enjoy these games and that they want to destroy something which is MALE.[/QUOTE] She never says "women shouldn't enjoy these [hardcore] games" or anything remotely like that. She strongly suggested that hardcore gamers consisted of mostly males (citing a figure of [I]"7 to 1"[/I]). She also talked about this demographics masculine nature (because they are... [B]MEN?![/B]) and how that influences the content of games. And she never claims that women want to destroy a mans thing. It's not "the women" as you simply put it. She says that there are people (regardless of their gender) criticizing gender politics in games, and many of them [I]"want the male video game culture to die."[/I] Which I think is very true. In short, you're putting words in her mouth.

People throw the "sexism" word way too damn often even here, to just mean "something I don't like", to the point it's losing its proper definition. This is just another episode of "the boy who cried wolf" Video games (comics an art in general too) can be sexual, but sex should not be something to be afraid of. It's just a natural part of human life. I have yet to see a woman being actually offended by a fictional character with little clothing and generous assets. It's kinda ironic how it's mostly guys being the "offended" ones and speaking in the behalf of all women.

[quote=milkandcooki] and both casual male and female gamers outnumber her definition of “hardcore gamers”.[/quote] You mean hardcore mobile and facebook games moms and dads and people who played arcade 30 years ago? because that's the distinction she made.

[QUOTE=MaxOfS2D;46039977]Misogyny and sexism isn't necessarily "rawr i hate women >:(" [highlight](User was permabanned for this post ("Was Warned" - Craptasket))[/highlight][/QUOTE] I haven't used this fp account in years. But now, after all this time The beast is dead. [img]http://i.imgur.com/6RRKnmH.gif[/img]

Are you people complaining about this essentially arguing there should be game censorship banning [B]sexism [/B]and [B]microaggression[/B]in games? Because that is exactly what it sounds like. If not then what's your problem? People are different, why can't you accept that horny men is a huge demographic to make money on? look at the success of i.e scarlet blade. If you don't want to play sexist games then don't, nobody is forcing you and there is always huge companies like Ubisoft that will create politically correct games with good stories that pander to women and men who don't want sexism in their games and instead focus on story or whatever. Also why are so many focusing on the motive of AEI and conservative think tanks? Like leftist groups the motive is obviously to influence public opinion in their desired direction and make a living (money) while doing it. Again, what is you people's problem? On second thought I know exactly what your problem is, you all have a genetic defect known as the totalitarian impulse which makes it impossible for you to accept other people's culture, way of life and that they make what is in your educated opinion bad choices. Come clean and be honest, you don't want a constructive debate, you want censorship and ban a form of entertainment you do not agree with. It's obvious that this debate is about censorship.

[QUOTE=MaxOfS2D;46039977]Misogyny and sexism isn't necessarily "rawr i hate women >:(" [highlight](User was permabanned for this post ("Was Warned" - Craptasket))[/highlight][/QUOTE] get rekt

[QUOTE=Cl0cK;46044482]Video in the OP is against criticism which is dumb, because all media that wants to be taken seriously should be okay with even feminist critics. If it means we'll get better writing in the long run, it's fine. Are all critics perfect? Nope but doesn't mean we should stop critics. Also, it's pretty much impossible for any media to not have sexism, so it's fine to point it out.[/QUOTE] Pointing out that a certain line of criticism is a flaky front for an agenda =/= anti-criticism.