World War Two; Who Won it? - General

Everyone assumes Russians used shitty clusterfuck tactics. That was very untrue. There were very rare times when Soviets just charged into the open field. Up until the results of the battle of Stalingrad the deaths of a soviets were only slightly greater than the axis, (Approximately 1.26 soviet per german) and that was because the majourity of the army was poorly trained and unprepared. Near the end of the war, the most soviets remaining on the front lines have already travelled the whole expanse, and had been completely veteran from fighting for years, and the casualties soared up to almost 2 dead axis for every soviet. Kapish? [editline]07:31AM[/editline] Soviets had the best snipers, excluding that badass Finnish guy, and the best urban assault troops (The OzNaz). [editline]07:33AM[/editline] Very experienced tank crews as well, cruising around in their T34s taking out Panthers and King Tigers.

[QUOTE=Teh Soviet;15994022]Everyone assumes Russians used shitty clusterfuck tactics. That was very untrue. There were very rare times when Soviets just charged into the open field. Up until the results of the battle of Stalingrad the deaths of a soviets were only slightly greater than the axis, (Approximately 1.26 soviet per german) and that was because the majourity of the army was poorly trained and unprepared. Near the end of the war, the most soviets remaining on the front lines have already travelled the whole expanse, and had been completely veteran from fighting for years, and the casualties soared up to almost 2 dead axis for every soviet. Kapish? [editline]07:31AM[/editline] Soviets had the best snipers, excluding that badass Finnish guy, and the best urban assault troops (The OzNaz). [editline]07:33AM[/editline] Very experienced tank crews as well, cruising around in their T34s taking out Panthers and King Tigers.[/QUOTE] I'm doubtful they took out many king tigers as only 500 or so were ever built.

[QUOTE=Eli_r;15906103]World War II lasted until 1990 when it really ended, in the end Germany is the big loser and Western Europe is the big winner.[/QUOTE] ... 1989, and yes most of eastern europe lost out to the warsaw pact, fucking Churchill. [editline]02:36PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Teh Soviet;15994022]Everyone assumes Russians used shitty clusterfuck tactics. That was very untrue. There were very rare times when Soviets just charged into the open field. Up until the results of the battle of Stalingrad the deaths of a soviets were only slightly greater than the axis, (Approximately 1.26 soviet per german) and that was because the majourity of the army was poorly trained and unprepared. Near the end of the war, the most soviets remaining on the front lines have already travelled the whole expanse, and had been completely veteran from fighting for years, and the casualties soared up to almost 2 dead axis for every soviet. Kapish? [editline]07:31AM[/editline] Soviets had the best snipers, excluding that badass Finnish guy, and the best urban assault troops (The OzNaz). [editline]07:33AM[/editline] Very experienced tank crews as well, cruising around in their T34s taking out Panthers and King Tigers.[/QUOTE] You also had very good mass murderers. Also the T34/85 was a badass gun there will be no denying that.

In a production and military advancement standpoint, Germany even though everynation moved amazingly in the timespan of ww2. But think of modern weaponry, The Ak47 looks like a sleek version of the Sturmgewher 44 (Mp44, Stg44) and the waffen SS was pretty much our modern rangers. but from a who won more battles and who won the war overall. most people would say the Allied Forces of the Soviet Union.

Faggots Australia did the most work in ww 2

[QUOTE=DeadorK;15997592]Faggots Australia did the most work in ww 2[/QUOTE] I beg to differ.

[QUOTE=DeadorK;15997592]Faggots Australia did the most work in ww 2[/QUOTE] Staring at Japan pissing yourself afraid of getting bombed isnt much.

no one because it was the world's bloodiest conflict and left millions dead, regardless of who won the war humanity as a whole lost. Militarily however, I think without the soviets the allies would've lost in Europe and without the US we would've lost in the pacific.

[QUOTE=evilweazel;16000417]Staring at Japan pissing yourself afraid of getting bombed isnt much.[/QUOTE] Yeah I mean they weren't at the D-day landings at all.

Considering that at the start of the war, Britain faced Germany all by itself for a long time, as France surrendered after only 6 weeks. Also to the guy a few pages back saying that without the Americans and the D-Day landings we all would've been invaded, the RAF were the ones who prevented Germany invading Britain via Operation Sea Lion. Germany in no way had the manpower to invade everyone at that stage in the war.

[QUOTE=lmaoboat;15906085]Without the US, it would have probably been a Pyrrhic victory.[/QUOTE] This It isn't about who WOULD have won, but at what cost. If we had just sat back and let the Rusians use their "tactics" (4 da muthahland!!! Rush at machine guns and lose millions) then the casualties would have been far greater. Also, what? How in God's name was Britain more important than the U.S.?

the ALLIES won

[QUOTE=RBM11;15924358] Sweden also helped the Finns with volunteers and refugee areas.[/QUOTE] But didn't help much in the winter war (which by the way was in 1939 not 1940) by not letting british and french expeditionary forces through their soil from Norway to help Finland.

The allies won.

[QUOTE=Doug52392;15905860]Because America prevented Communists from controlling Germany and the land it controlled.[/QUOTE] Yeah that's right , just leave the brits out. All the americans did that I could see was have a war with Japan.

When you said jumped on germany i imagined a balding russian man at a UN table with hitler in the corner just pouncing on hitler like a tiger

[QUOTE=Hemroid_Man;16013101]Yeah that's right , just leave the brits out. All the americans did that I could see was have a war with Japan.[/QUOTE] Oh god wow.

[QUOTE=Da Bomb76;16009826]This It isn't about who WOULD have won, but at what cost. If we had just sat back and let the Rusians use their "tactics" (4 da muthahland!!! Rush at machine guns and lose millions) then the casualties would have been far greater. Also, what? How in God's name was Britain more important than the U.S.?[/QUOTE] The Russians never used those tactics. Also Britain did a lot more fighting than the US though it was sustained because of American supply. I would say they were about equal in their contributions to the allied victory.

[QUOTE=Rhodes;15905907]Winners of WW2: Finland, Russia (won Germany, lost Finland) The worst loser of WW2: Germany, lost to two countries in the same war.[/QUOTE] They lost basically to themselves due to the fall of hitlers germany

[QUOTE=Da Bomb76;16009826]This It isn't about who WOULD have won, but at what cost. If we had just sat back and let the Rusians use their "tactics" (4 da muthahland!!! Rush at machine guns and lose millions) then the casualties would have been far greater. Also, what? How in God's name was Britain more important than the U.S.?[/QUOTE] While the US didn't do a thing until they were attacked, Britain were already assisting the French Underground and fighting in Africa. America were supplying Britain with some useful stuff, but seeing as the convoys had to go by sea, quite a few ships ended up on the bottom.

We can assume that Hitler's Germany lost. As to the issue of Britain, it took almost the full force of the German army until someone reminded Hitler he was in charge and he declared war on everyone. If Britain had fallen then the war could easily have taken a different course.

Heh, I like reading these things about Finland in this thread :D That's why there's going to be a history lesson: First of all, Finland was not fascist, Finland was a social democracy as it is today. And the USSR, after they invaded eastern Poland in [B]17th of September 1939[/B], they then moved on to the Baltic states, and then it was about to be Finland's time to fall into Soviet aggression and influence. Finland refused their demands after lots of discussions, but then the [B]Soviet Union declared war upon Finland[/B]. It was clear that they wanted all of Finland, but after months of fighting, both sides were so exhausted that a peace treaty had to be signed. Finland lost alot of territory for the Soviets but kept it's independence. Now, Finland did not turn nazi or fascist, but as Germany informed the Finnish government about their plans to invade the Soviet Union, Finland de facto allied with Germany, but kept relations with the USA, Britain and France. 2 days after the Operation Barbarossa began (23rd of June 1941), Finland launched a massive offensive against the Soviet Union, and quickly retook the lost territories of the 1940 treaty. In order to keep relations with the USA, Finland didn't participate in the Siege of Leningrad, and did not attack the Murmansk railway which brought Western supplies for the Soviets. The Germans were occupying Northern Finland though, and they made unsuccesful attempts to capture the Kola Peninsula and Murmansk. Finland did occupy parts of the Soviet Union though. For example, the city of Petrozavodsk. Then the offensive turned into trench warfare, and there was not much action in 1943 for example... In the summer of 1944, after the Allies had landed in Normandy and Germany was pushed out of Russian territory, the Soviet Union started a huge offensive attack against Finland. It didn't take long until they had almost advanced into the actual Finnish territory, but Finnish troops halted their advance with heavy casualties. A new peace treaty was signed, but Finland didn't lose as much territory as they had before, just the access to the Arctic Ocean. The peace treaty forced German troops to move out of Finland, but they REFUSED. That's why the Finnish troops had to take up arms and attack the Germans. In the so-called "Lapland War", German troops were pushed into Norway, and out of Finland.

Only Russia won,the other allies didn't give a shit about the war. Germany could won WW2,but it had too many enemies,trying to conquer Russia was the biggest mistake they made.

World War II was a Pyrrhic victory for the Allies. The end.

because us americans are nationalist fucks [editline]3rd January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Osiris24;27177501]Only Russia won,the other allies didn't give a shit about the war. Germany could won WW2,but it had too many enemies,trying to conquer Russia was the biggest mistake they made.[/QUOTE] Dammit I hate you

Allies, nothing more than that.

[QUOTE=dcalde78;15905883]Simply because, without the American's help, D-Day would not have happened, and we would have been most likely, invaded.[/QUOTE] look at the number of troops from USA during the beach landings, 80% of the planning and landing force was British and Canadian.

America DID win, along with Russia, England, and any other Allied country. We say we won, but most other countries take the claim too. We did win over Japan, however, without European assistance.

[QUOTE=Osiris24;27177501]Only Russia won,the other allies didn't give a shit about the war. Germany could won WW2,but it had too many enemies,trying to conquer Russia was the biggest mistake they made.[/QUOTE] Was I really the first to notice that this guy bumped a thread from mid-2009?

Uh, guys, have you seen the date of this thread.