Isn't it hilarious witnessing the horrors of what nature is. So entertaining i wish we could force people to jump off beachy head because there is not enough horror in this world to entertain me further.
[QUOTE=codemaster85;35198858]:suicide:[/QUOTE]
OH GOD WHAT THE FUCK
This isn't really as cruel as some of you are making it out to be, since insects and arachnids don't have brains complicated enough to experience "pain" as we understand it; in fact they are only SORT OF conscious by the standards of higher animals. If something cannot understand or even experience the cruelty it's being exposed to, then is it really cruelty?
Well it's one of them questions that you can't actually say whether they do have consciousness or not. I thought we even had a hard time explaining what consciousness means because there are arguably many components that can define being conscious. Alot of this talk about pain is between two factors. One reflexive response and the other is direct feeling of the pain through experience. Us as humans could be mindful to say that there's a risk and fear to eating at this moment and then you could say well, maybe i'll wait a few hours until the beasties are out of the pictures before i go out into the field. I mean that kind of thing. So if thats the orgin of in my opinion, the only real value of this pain feeling thing is because it allows us to store a memory to learn. That's the key thing. So of all the lowest forms, they have found that earth worms can learn. It's really crude but they can learn left and right.
If you take an earth worm and let it have a choice in going two different directions and one direction gets a hot light that dries it up, and the other direction gets its food, it'll eventually learn just to go in the direction where the food is. It won't bother wasting its time going left anymore so its learning something even with its minute brain. so i suppose it can be argued that it must feel something or might be because it's not reflexively acting anymore its somehow aquired a memory or its learned something and that learning i think would have to be attached to a feeling. A brain encourages when it successfully comes up with something and then its frustrated when its wrong or when theres something not quite right, theres something negative that we can rationalise things. We feel the little emotions trickle in there when you can't quite validate a thought because we have a suspicion that it's bullshit. So anyway, it does get kind of complicated. I guess you could say when we were young, our conciousness wasn't quite as acute we could say and aren't tied to any real hard feelings compared to when your older but we still experience something. I think feeling is a primative feature that alot of organisms have the capacity to 'feel' vaguely somewhat. There is a nice wiki on pain in invertebrates which makes a good read.
To me through i just find it obnoxious that we supposedly as intelligent people do this mundane kind of crap. Our lives are so comfortable that we can just irritate the shit out of any other organism.
[QUOTE=EmperorVagak;35199851]Now imagine a tarantula hawk that goes after humans.[/QUOTE]
NOPE
UNINSTALL_LIFE.EXE
While you people are arguing about Bugs being forced to "fight" there's genocide happening in Darfur.... Honestly they're just bugs. There are bigger problems in the world then bug fighting.
[QUOTE=thefreeman;35232093]While you people are arguing about Bugs being forced to "fight" there's genocide happening in Darfur.... Honestly they're just bugs. There are bigger problems in the world then bug fighting.[/QUOTE]
They are just bugs because you don't put it into any kind of ethical equation. Say a turantula was a pet of yours and some asshole comes along and squashes it laughing saying its just a bug. The scenario changes quite a bit. Dogs fighting naturally in russia -no big deal, but force pitbulls to fight there is something to criticize about. But in a human situation, suddenly your argument becomes ethical on the basis that genocide is bad and there are worse off affairs. You use a human ethic in your argument because it hits us more simply because we are capable of reconciling oneself and other individuals in that environment better than a dog or any other species.
Take the ethic out... "These genocide victims are just nobodies to me so why should i care?"
Daemon, this shit happens all the time in the wild. I don't think pitting a few bugs against each other has any real ethical implications, as it doesn't really make a dent in the population.
I'm just saying thats all. I'm not a bug empathiser i just like to get the facts straight. :)
See, with ethics you could just say a few genocides here and there doesn't make a dent into our population it's nothing to worry about. But we see beyond what it is but you can't say we can do that for any other living thing unless it responds very much in a way that we can recognise. Skepticism is neato.
as i entered this thread, my feet left the floor
Damn nature, you awesome.
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