Woman suffering from epilepsy held against her will by hospital in rural Kentucky. - General

[QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31869943]Sounds like you don't understand the concept of suicide watch. I don't think anyone here really understands just how damaging suicide is to surrounding friends and family in all but very specific circumstances.[/QUOTE] um ya trapping someone in a small barred room is really helpful. its the persons fucking choice to kill themselves, if they want to leave the hospital and kill themselves the hospital has no right to stop them, if they want to leave the hospital and not kill themselves the hospital has no right to stop them the point of suicide watch is to give help to those who need it. you cant force someone to get help, a person must first decide they want help, otherwise any "help" given is a waste of time and resources.

This thread is so depressing. Because people are getting so mad at the hospital. It's amazing seeing 15 year olds contesting a law that they are showing they don't even understand. You guys are just using black and white logic and looking at it from one perspective. Fucking as. Canuhearmenow, Tetsmega, Busterblulth, Pepin, and ultra violet. I commend all you guys for not being so mono-perspective of this video, and believing everything said in the video to be fact. This thread is pathetic at how facepunchers can be so black and white on a situation, even after it was proven that she was actually suicidal and that the fat bald guy was tricked into believing she was "kidnapped"

[quote] using your logic we shouldn't give anyone who has a mental issue treatment, because a large majority are so delusional they don't think anything is wrong. [/quote] no because they CHOOSE to seek help. or they are a danger to OTHER PEOPLE by not getting help. no one has a right to force another person to get help. [editline]22nd August 2011[/editline] i mean then those camps that kidnap gay people and try and force them to be straight are A-OK by your logic

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871155]um ya trapping someone in a small barred room is really helpful. its the persons fucking choice to kill themselves, if they want to leave the hospital and kill themselves the hospital has no right to stop them, if they want to leave the hospital and not kill themselves the hospital has no right to stop them the point of suicide watch is to give help to those who need it. you cant force someone to get help, a person must first decide they want help, otherwise any "help" given is a waste of time and resources.[/QUOTE] You're retarded bro. A large majority of people who are suicidal DON'T WANT HELP. Again, go talk to someone who got help against their will and is now "cured", they will tell you that they're thankful someone interjected before they killed themselves. [editline]22nd August 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=yawmwen;31871182]no because they CHOOSE to seek help. or they are a danger to OTHER PEOPLE by not getting help. no one has a right to force another person to get help. [editline]22nd August 2011[/editline] i mean then those camps that kidnap gay people and try and force them to be straight are A-OK by your logic[/QUOTE] Being gay isn't destructive. Being gay doesn't cause you to hurt people in your actions, being gay doesn't make you mentally unstable. being gay isn't anything negative. Holy fuck you're retarded, you have no understanding of anything. I am done talking to you, you're just depressing to talk to, to know that someone out there is that stupid is sad.

Guys I am gay and suicidal, am I gonna get arrested?

[QUOTE=ScoutKing;31871220]You're retarded bro. A large majority of people who are suicidal DON'T WANT HELP.[/quote] um no most people who are suicidal DO WANT HELP WHICH IS WHY THEY TRY AND SLIT THEIR WRISTS AND CALL THE HOSPITAL AFTERWARDS. really? do some research on suicide, just about all suicide attempts are a cry for help by people, and the people use slow acting methods(like taking pills or cutting wrists) so that they wont die. [quote]Again, go talk to someone who got help against their will and is now "cured", they will tell you that they're thankful someone interjected before they killed themselves.[/QUOTE] "against their will" is more like it. again, most people who try and commit suicide dont actually want to die, they want help. they seem reluctant to get help because suicide is so shameful to so many people. if the person was serious about dying and didnt want help any amount of forced help would NOT work. [editline]22nd August 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=BigOwl;31871291]Guys I am gay and suicidal, am I gonna get arrested?[/QUOTE] if scoutking was in charge you would be

Holy hell you're retarded. All suicide attempts are a cry for help! hur hur! If they don't end up killing themselves right away it is definitely a cry for help hur hur. Has it ever occurred to you that people who are suicidal are not mentally sound and may not know the best method of offing themselves? I will agree a large majority of people who cut themselves are a cry for help, but they don't even know it. When confronted by someone they will hide them away, and say they don't want help. But according to you, they want help! But they refuse to get help still. So what does the state do? fucking 72 hour hold. Tough shit, if they are suicidal and "want to die" than they don't need to be going to the ER to begin with. They have the choice to go to the ER in most cases. By going to the ER they are getting help by choice, regardless if they consciously know it or not.

[QUOTE=ScoutKing;31871220] Being gay isn't destructive.[/quote] neither is suicide [quote]Being gay doesn't cause you to hurt people in your actions,[/quote] um ya it most definitely can if you are part of a religious family [quote]being gay doesn't make you mentally unstable.[/quote] suicide sure as hell doesnt. but ya being gay can be indirectly responsible for a lot of mental problems. [quote]being gay isn't anything negative.[/quote] NEITHER IS SUICIDE [quote]Holy fuck you're retarded, you have no understanding of anything. I am done talking to you, you're just depressing to talk to, to know that someone out there is that stupid is sad.[/QUOTE] your just mad because someone else doesnt share your weird fetish in kidnapping depressed people.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871305]um no most people who are suicidal DO WANT HELP WHICH IS WHY THEY TRY AND SLIT THEIR WRISTS AND CALL THE HOSPITAL AFTERWARDS. really? do some research on suicide, just about all suicide attempts are a cry for help by people, and the people use slow acting methods(like taking pills or cutting wrists) so that they wont die. "against their will" is more like it. again, most people who try and commit suicide dont actually want to die, they want help. they seem reluctant to get help because suicide is so shameful to so many people. if the person was serious about dying and didnt want help any amount of forced help would NOT work. [/QUOTE] By your logic wouldn't the woman who went to the hospital want help on some level? So wouldn't it be the hospitals responsibility to insure the woman's saftey and too seek help for her?

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871397]neither is suicide um ya it most definitely can if you are part of a religious family suicide sure as hell doesnt. but ya being gay can be indirectly responsible for a lot of mental problems. NEITHER IS SUICIDE your just mad because someone else doesnt share your weird fetish in kidnapping depressed people.[/QUOTE] I am mad because someone believes that suicide isn't destructive, that it isn't a negative thing etc etc. If being gay can be destructive to a RELIGIOUS FAMILY, than offing yourself can be destructive to ANY kind of family. HOLY HELL! I don't even need to reply to your posts to point out how retarded you are, people just have to read you saying suicide isn't destructive to get the point I am making.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871397] your just mad because someone else doesnt share your weird fetish in kidnapping depressed people.[/QUOTE] Except this isn't kidnapping since the woman either admitted herself willingly, or was admitted by a family member. By admitting herself she agreed to the standard 72 hours of suicide watch.

[QUOTE=BusterBluth;31871420]By your logic wouldn't the woman who went to the hospital want help on some level? So wouldn't it be the hospitals responsibility to insure the woman's saftey and too seek help for her?[/QUOTE] Exactly what I said, but this guy is just brickwalling with ignorance and stupidity. I suggest no one even bothers to reply to Yawmwen, it's useless to talk about this with him, when he believes suicide isn't destructive but being gay is.

[QUOTE=ScoutKing;31871390]Holy hell you're retarded. All suicide attempts are a cry for help! hur hur! If they don't end up killing themselves right away it is definitely a cry for help hur hur. Has it ever occurred to you that people who are suicidal are not mentally sound and may not know the best method of offing themselves?[/quote] um anyone with some logic or an internet connection who was serious about killing themselves would be able to find the best way. i mean knowing to cut your wrists obviously shows you know a little bit about what causes you to die, it isnt hard to take it a step forward and use a gun or fall to your death. and yes most suicide attempts are calls for help. [quote]When confronted by someone they will hide them away, and say they don't want help.[/quote] because there is a lot of shame in suicide. [quote]But according to you, they want help! But they refuse to get help still. So what does the state do? fucking 72 hour hold.[/quote] the state shouldnt impose a hold. they should give the person resources so that they can seek help when they need it. [quote]Tough shit, if they are suicidal and "want to die" than they don't need to be going to the ER to begin with. They have the choice to go to the ER in most cases. By going to the ER they are getting help by choice, regardless if they consciously know it or not.[/QUOTE] um ya if they call the hospital and go to the er they obviously want to get help. but that help SHOULD NOT BE FORCED

[QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31871440]Except this isn't kidnapping since the woman either admitted herself willingly, or was admitted by a family member. By admitting herself she agreed to the standard 72 hours of suicide watch.[/QUOTE] Pretty much. If you girls don't like the 72 hour law/holding laws for mentally unstable patients then you can "gett oiut" Or write to your congressman and plead your case to them and ask them to try to form a bill that makes 72 hour holds illegal. I think if you did the later, you may get laughed at.

[QUOTE=ScoutKing;31871428]I am mad because someone believes that suicide isn't destructive, that it isn't a negative thing etc etc. If being gay can be destructive to a RELIGIOUS FAMILY, than offing yourself can be destructive to ANY kind of family. HOLY HELL! I don't even need to reply to your posts to point out how retarded you are, people just have to read you saying suicide isn't destructive to get the point I am making.[/QUOTE] suicide is morality-neutral. it isnt negative, and it isnt good. suicide simply happens when the pain someone feels is greater than their ability to cope with the pain. no one should be forced to stay on the earth if they dont want to. [QUOTE=BusterBluth;31871420]By your logic wouldn't the woman who went to the hospital want help on some level? So wouldn't it be the hospitals responsibility to insure the woman's saftey and too seek help for her?[/QUOTE] it would be the responsibility to provide resources so she can seek help. by imposing a hold the doctor is effectively making the person a prisoner.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871453] um ya if they call the hospital and go to the er they obviously want to get help. but that help SHOULD NOT BE FORCED[/QUOTE] I don't think you understand procedure and protocol.

[QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31871484]I don't think you understand procedure and protocol.[/QUOTE] explain

[QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31871484]I don't think you understand procedure and protocol.[/QUOTE] I don't think he understands the mental thought pattern of someone who is suicidal. People can be suicidal for lots of reasons. A bi-polar manic episode can cause suicidal thoughts. They're not suicidal because they can't cope with the "pain" they're suicidal because they've got a fucking mental condition that clouds their judgment.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871478]suicide is morality-neutral. it isnt negative, and it isnt good. suicide simply happens when the pain someone feels is greater than their ability to cope with the pain. no one should be forced to stay on the earth if they dont want to. [/QUOTE] Suicide is an incredibly selfish and self-centered way to permanently end an oftentimes temporary problem, there are so many examples of how families are destroyed by a suicide that it would be silly to try and give specifics.

[QUOTE=ScoutKing;31871522]I don't think he understands the mental thought pattern of someone who is suicidal.[/quote] lol im not going to share my stories but ya i totally understand the mental thought pattern of someone who is suicidal [quote]People can be suicidal for lots of reasons. A bi-polar manic episode can cause suicidal thoughts.[/quote] why are you telling a bi-polar person this? [quote]They're not suicidal because they can't cope with the "pain" they're suicidal because they've got a fucking mental condition that clouds their judgment.[/QUOTE] no they are suicidal because the pain they feel is worse than their ability to cope. when their judgement is clouded that effectively lowers their coping power.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871478] it would be the responsibility to provide resources so she can seek help. by imposing a hold the doctor is effectively making the person a prisoner.[/QUOTE] So instead of keeping her in the hospital, where infact they will seek professional help for her , they should let her go home with her family unaware or ignoring the fact she is suicidal and not getting help at all?

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871501]explain[/QUOTE] She admitted herself to the hospital, or was admitted by a family member. Because of this, she willingly gave up certain liberties and freedoms for a temporary period of time in exchange for help. Suicide watch is a standard 72 hour protocol given to people who admit themselves for suicide attempts. C'mon shit like this is common in all facets of society, would you say it's illegal to say a man's not allowed to smoke in a hospital room?

[QUOTE=BusterBluth;31871565]So instead of keeping her in the hospital, where infact they will seek professional help for her , they should let her go home with her family unaware or ignoring of the fact she is suicidal and not getting help at all?[/QUOTE] According to him, you can only get help if you want it. But he fails to understand mental disorders can cloud your judgment and hold you back from getting help, regardless if you want it .

[QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31871526]Suicide is an incredibly selfish and self-centered way to permanently end an oftentimes temporary problem,[/quote] all action that has ever been taken is self-centered. there is no selfless act and the person who doesnt look out for himself first cannot look out for others. [quote]there are so many examples of how families are destroyed by a suicide that it would be silly to try and give specifics.[/QUOTE] yea, death is painful to the people left behind, that isnt a reason to force someone to stay alive.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871560] no they are suicidal because the pain they feel is worse than their ability to cope. when their judgement is clouded that effectively lowers their coping power.[/QUOTE] So you're saying someone without the ability to give proper judgement is allowed to make heavy decisions such as suicide? Next you'll be telling me it's perfectly fine to have sex with someone who's extremely drunk. [editline]21st August 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=yawmwen;31871588] yea, death is painful to the people left behind, that isnt a reason to force someone to stay alive.[/QUOTE] If it's an unnecessary death, yes it is.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871560]lol im not going to share my stories but ya i totally understand the mental thought pattern of someone who is suicidal why are you telling a bi-polar person this? no they are suicidal because the pain they feel is worse than their ability to cope. when their judgement is clouded that effectively lowers their coping power.[/QUOTE] I would consider your "coping" power being lowered a criteria to having a clouded judgment.

[QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31871578]would you say it's illegal to say a man's not allowed to smoke in a hospital room?[/QUOTE] this is way different. it would be like telling a healthy man he cant leave the hospital room so he can smoke a cigarette. [QUOTE=BusterBluth;31871565]So instead of keeping her in the hospital, where infact they will seek professional help for her , they should let her go home with her family unaware or ignoring the fact she is suicidal and not getting help at all?[/QUOTE] tell the family that they think it was a suicide attempt, if a psychologist or counselor is on duty(almost always at least one) let the "victim" talk to the counselor. give references to psychologists and support groups. thats all that should be done. [editline]22nd August 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=ScoutKing;31871610]I would consider your "coping" power being lowered a criteria to having a clouded judgment.[/QUOTE] and your consideration is wrong. its the other way around. [QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31871599]So you're saying someone without the ability to give proper judgement is allowed to make heavy decisions such as suicide? [/quote] YES! if they feel they cant cope then they shouldnt be forced to! [quote]Next you'll be telling me it's perfectly fine to have sex with someone who's extremely drunk. [/QUOTE] SUICIDE IS ACTION TAKEN UPON ONESELF! what part of this dont you understand?

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871619]this is way different. it would be like telling a healthy man he cant leave the hospital room so he can smoke a cigarette. [/QUOTE] Except this isn't someone mentally healthy and it isn't something as simple as smoking a cigarette.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;31871619]this is way different. it would be like telling a healthy man he cant leave the hospital room so he can smoke a cigarette. tell the family that they think it was a suicide attempt, if a psychologist or counselor is on duty(almost always at least one) let the "victim" talk to the counselor. give references to psychologists and support groups. thats all that should be done.[/QUOTE] Well congrats, if things ran like that, then there be a lot more people killing themselves. A LOT more.

and guys im assuming you feel marijuana, alcohol, and cigarettes should all be illegal right? [editline]22nd August 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Canuhearmenow;31871637]Except this isn't someone mentally healthy and it isn't something as simple as smoking a cigarette.[/QUOTE] THEN WHY DID YOU MAKE THE STUPID COMPARISON?! [QUOTE=ScoutKing;31871642]Well congrats, if things ran like that, then there be a lot more people killing themselves. A LOT more.[/QUOTE] ok