What it means to be theist / deist / atheist / religious - General

[QUOTE=thrawn2787;32460476]I fail to see how "I have no belief in a deity" isn't the same as "I believe no deity exits." Maybe it's just me? I guess I can see how the second can be interpreted as possibly apatheism or agnostic (not atheism), but if you expand it to "I have no belief that a deity exits" then I fail to see how it's different. Why is the first just as dumb as theists? I think if you say "I know there is no god" that is as dumb theists who say "I know there is a god." I agree die-hard atheism is as bad as die-hard theism, but I don't see how saying "I believe" is being die-hard? You can have your belief, accept it, and accept that others have their own belief. But when you assert that you know, that's when you cannot accept that others have their own beliefs. That to me is die-hard. It also seems to be that by that definition of die-hard there are no not die-hard theists (moderate theists?). The very last is agnostic which again I do not feel is a legitimate answer to the question of whether or not you believe a deity exists. Also i before e except after c except for weird words. Atheist and deity. :p[/QUOTE] The difference is: Not having a belief in god does not preclude the existence of god. You might not believe but that does not mean you can entirely discount that there is not one. Without evidence, however we should not act on the assumption that there is a god. Believing in no god is having faith with absolutely no evidence that there is no god. This is a dumb position, you do not know there is no god, and what if suddenly evidence emerged that there was a god? This position is just as flawed as a theist. Finally, the idea that whether or not there is a god is unknowable is perfectly fine of an answer to the question. It's the one that makes the most sense. There is no way to test for or against a god, there for it is impossible to know if there is a god.

[QUOTE=Jawalt;32460813]The difference is: Not having a belief in god does not preclude the existence of god. You might not believe but that does not mean you can entirely discount that there is not one. Without evidence, however we should not act on the assumption that there is a god. Believing in no god is having faith with absolutely no evidence that there is no god. This is a dumb position, you do not know there is no god, and what if suddenly evidence emerged that there was a god? This position is just as flawed as a theist. Finally, the idea that whether or not there is a god is unknowable is perfectly fine of an answer to the question. It's the one that makes the most sense. There is no way to test for or against a god, there for it is impossible to know if there is a god.[/QUOTE] I'd say there's a difference between believing and knowing, I'd say believing is more like thinking ("I think there is no god"). You can have thoughts and not push them on to others and not be aggressive about them. I see beliefs as I do opinions and biases: everyone has an opinion and bias on everything, even if they won't admit it. Again, you can change beliefs. I'd say it's much harder to change what you "know." I take the position that I believe there is no god, but if some old guy came flying down out of the clouds, claiming to be god, and somehow proved it to me, I wouldn't doubt it. I'd change my beliefs (well, if It could prove it then I'd say I'd know It existed, but then that would prove all agnostics wrong and that's another story). And again "Do you believe there is a deity" is a yes or no question, saying something else is just bullshit imo. You can say "No, [B]but [/B]I also think we won't ever know for sure." Hence why I think that everyone is agnostic unless ill and that there's no problem in saying agnostic atheist. I feel like you are perhaps a bit afraid of admitting what you think (no offense). There's nothing wrong with thinking there is no god, just as there's nothing wrong with thinking there is (the problem lies where you start pushing beliefs on to others). You may also think that no person will ever know for sure, but why should that stop you from thinking or guessing? I see it as kind of like a weatherman reporting that he doesn't know what the weather will be for sure, so he decides to end his broadcast and leave it at that. EDIT: Agnostic is more of a Epistemology issue than it is theism. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epistemology[/url] EDIT2: Skip to like 3 minutes in. I feel Penn does a good job of explaining it as I have a similar view to him on this subject [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTWlQaZ0DWo[/media] Note that I've had these views since before I've seen this video, in fact ever since I asked a peer of mine a few years ago if there was a deity to which they replied that they were agnostic (and at the time I didn't know what it meant so I asked etc)

I'm not religous, I really don't care, but I sometimes pray to god for some occasions. I don't know why but I feel like there is some kind of god or somethin

[QUOTE=thrawn2787;32462076]I'd say there's a difference between believing and knowing, I'd say believing is more like thinking ("I think there is no god"). You can have thoughts and not push them on to others and not be aggressive about them. I see beliefs as I do opinions and biases: everyone has an opinion and bias on everything, even if they won't admit it. Again, you can change beliefs. I'd say it's much harder to change what you "know." I take the position that I believe there is no god, but if some old guy came flying down out of the clouds, claiming to be god, and somehow proved it to me, I wouldn't doubt it. I'd change my beliefs (well, if It could prove it then I'd say I'd know It existed, but then that would prove all agnostics wrong and that's another story). And again "Do you believe there is a deity" is a yes or no question, saying something else is just bullshit imo. You can say "No, [B]but [/B]I also think we won't ever know for sure." Hence why I think that everyone is agnostic unless ill and that there's no problem in saying agnostic atheist. I feel like you are perhaps a bit afraid of admitting what you think (no offense). There's nothing wrong with thinking there is no god, just as there's nothing wrong with thinking there is (the problem lies where you start pushing beliefs on to others). You may also think that no person will ever know for sure, but why should that stop you from thinking or guessing? I see it as kind of like a weatherman reporting that he doesn't know what the weather will be for sure, so he decides to end his broadcast and leave it at that. EDIT: Agnostic is more of a Epistemology issue than it is theism. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epistemology[/url] EDIT2: Skip to like 3 minutes in. I feel Penn does a good job of explaining it as I have a similar view to him on this subject [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTWlQaZ0DWo[/media] Note that I've had these views since before I've seen this video, in fact ever since I asked a peer of mine a few years ago if there was a deity to which they replied that they were agnostic (and at the time I didn't know what it meant so I asked etc)[/QUOTE] Except that I don't think there is no god. I don't believe there is a god, nor do I believe there is not a god. Science can't prove the origins of the universe, and how something came of nothing seems like something a god would handle, it's just as likely as the other option: "It just did". We have evidence for niether and we never will.

An interesting thing I've noticed about "atheist", "nonreligious", etc. By definition, nonreligion means not having a religion. Atheism means not having a god. You can have a godless religion, so "nonreligion" is a stronger term than "atheism". In society, however, "nonreligion" is a weaker term, and "atheist" the stronger term, with negative connotations. Example: Someone might say: [I]"Oh he calls himself nonreligious, but he'd [U]never[/U] say he was an atheist."[/I] However, you'd [I]never[/I] hear: [I]"Oh he calls himself an atheist, but he'd [U]never[/U] say he was nonreligious."[/I]

I'm an atheist, but I feel that a lot of existence is so far-fetched that there is a faint possibility of there being a higher power, but not one that affects our lives. I'm open to religion, but not truly a believer.

Theist, for the record.

[QUOTE=Elecbullet;32468491]An interesting thing I've noticed about "atheist", "nonreligious", etc. By definition, nonreligion means not having a religion. Atheism means not having a god. You can have a godless religion, so "nonreligion" is a stronger term than "atheism". In society, however, "nonreligion" is a weaker term, and "atheist" the stronger term, with negative connotations. Example: Someone might say: [I]"Oh he calls himself nonreligious, but he'd [U]never[/U] say he was an atheist."[/I] However, you'd [I]never[/I] hear: [I]"Oh he calls himself an atheist, but he'd [U]never[/U] say he was nonreligious."[/I][/QUOTE] I don't believe Atheism is Dis-believing in god, but simply not being so arrogant to pretend they know either way. basically, it's admitting what we do and don't know based on logic and scientific reasoning.

Thanks for this. I never considered my self fully Atheist, but now I realize I am either a Deist or Theist.

[QUOTE=SIRIUS;32654004]I don't believe Atheism is Dis-believing in god, but simply not being so arrogant to pretend they know either way. basically, it's admitting what we do and don't know based on logic and scientific reasoning.[/QUOTE] fixed it

I fall under the 'spiritual' atheist category, it's really hard to explain my exact views on the area

[QUOTE=The DooD;32446819]I assume for your description of an Atheist being allowed to still be spiritual you mean like, they don't believe in God(s), but they could still believe in luck/karma/something along those lines. I wouldn't disagree with that, but I would usually find it weird that someone would reject religion but still believe in "hocus pocus".[/QUOTE] Not all of that pocus is so hocus, if ya know wut I mean.

Ugh. thrawn2787 is such an idiot. Seriously, 'atheism is the belief that no god exists'? No, it's not. Atheism is the lack of belief in gods, not the belief that there's a lack of gods.

Im an atheist and i dont like the idea of there being a God that actively watches and interferes. It gives me some form of inner strength knowing that I and everyone alive today got here through shear hard work and no God to help them. Even if there actually is a God. I dont need him/her/it. We should be driven by belief in ourselves, not by belief in some mystical force, deity or higher power.

I am an atheist/nonreligious for the sheer fact that it makes more sense to me that the world was formed according to certain universal laws, and those laws govern our physical existence in constant and quantifiable ways. If someone was to try and ascribe some kind of religion or belief system to me, (which I don't have) then I'd tell them I put my faith in science or empirical observation or something like that.