• A Warning to All Game Developers (YandereSim)
    245 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Thlis;51715690]Please arbiter of moral decency in fiction, tell us all the things that can and can't be done in fictional entertainment. Tell us what meanings are justification for horrible things and what aren't in FICTIONAL entertainment.[/QUOTE] -snip moving away from original point- Sure, twitch is stupid for not banning other similar games, but this is a popular game. Twitch banned this for a reason, I am not going to argue the morals or justification of this, I am trying to say twitch was in the right for banning this, stupid to not say why, but it's fairly clear this was going to happen.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715706]Right so it makes it okay because it's a videogame? Are you seriously trying to justify "Yes! The mechanic to bully a girl into suicide should stay because... uhh.. it's entertainment!"[/QUOTE] The mechanic that allows you to bully people into suicide but is not NECESSARY as an end goal to that mechanic. And yes. Why not? Explain why it shouldnt be. Murder, assault, battery, robbery, kidnapping, ransom, torture, grand theft auto, espionage, corporate espionage, trespassing, animal abuse, destruction of property, harassment, these are all crimes you're capable of committing in video games, sometimes you can commit ALL of them in one game, whats the difference here? Explain to me your reasoning, give me an argument, do something. [QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715706]Yeah, you can kill prostitutes in GTAV. But that's not part of the goal of the game. It's a stupid sandbox.[/QUOTE] Hey, you stole my argument. [QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715706]So is this. I am trying to say that THAT OPTION in particular is where it is being taken too far, and that's WHY twitch banned it. [/QUOTE] But WHY. WHY is it. Explain WHY. [i]WHY[/i] is it bad.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715706]Right so it makes it okay because it's a videogame? Are you seriously trying to justify "Yes! The mechanic to bully a girl into suicide should stay because... uhh.. it's entertainment!" It's not entertainment, it's downright a creepy murder [B]fantasy[/B] that the game has coded in, not "something that can happen" - it's something that was purposely coded in as a feature. [/QUOTE] It is subjectively entertainment, and it is literally fictional. We can end this argument to focus on the banning. [QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715706]I am trying to say twitch was in the right for banning this[/QUOTE] How on earth do you know that? You yourself state you have no idea why they banned it. You just automatically believe that they were right for banning it.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715723]The mechanic that allows you to bully people into suicide but is not NECESSARY as an end goal to that mechanic. And yes. Why not? Explain why it shouldnt be. Murder, assault, battery, robbery, kidnapping, ransom, torture, grand theft auto, espionage, corporate espionage, trespassing, these are all crimes you're capable of committing in video games, sometimes you can commit ALL of them in one game, whats the difference here? Explain to me your reasoning, give me an argument, do something. Hey, you stole my argument. But WHY. WHY is it. Explain WHY. [I]WHY[/I] is it bad.[/QUOTE] Why is rape bad but murder okay? Why is full on porn not allowed but torture okay? Context. Twitch's rules. AGAIN, YES, twitch is in the wrong for not explaining this. The creator of the game SHOULD HAVE seen this coming. I am seeing where twitch is coming from for the reason of the ban [QUOTE=Thlis;51715733]It is subjectively entertainment, and it is literally fictional.[/QUOTE] Snipped that argument because it's entirely personal opinion and irrelevant to discussion.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715706]-snip moving away from original point- Sure, twitch is stupid for not banning other similar games, but this is a popular game. Twitch banned this for a reason, I am not going to argue the morals or justification of this, I am trying to say twitch was in the right for banning this, stupid to not say why, but it's fairly clear this was going to happen.[/QUOTE] No they're not in the right when other games do similar if not worse shit all the time. In Hitman: Absolution you at one point kidnap a mentally slow man and have the choice of leaving him to die in the desert or execute him in cold blood, perfectly fine. Torture in GTA? Perfectly fine. MGSV has child soldiers? Its fine. Why is this different? What makes this inherently different and bad compared to those. Especially given the self aware over the top tone. You have yet to explain this. [editline]23rd January 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715737]Why is rape bad but murder okay? Why is full on porn not allowed but torture okay? Context.[/QUOTE] Jesus Christ thats not a fucking argument, i literally just pointed out that you took that whole mechanic out of context to shit on it, dont give me that crap. [QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715737] Snipped that argument because it's entirely personal opinion and irrelevant to discussion.[/QUOTE] No, its entirely relevant, you just snipped it because its good for arguing against you.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715706]-snip moving away from original point- Sure, twitch is stupid for not banning other similar games, but this is a popular game. Twitch banned this for a reason, I am not going to argue the morals or justification of this, I am trying to say twitch was in the right for banning this, stupid to not say why, but it's fairly clear this was going to happen.[/QUOTE] You are outright saying, "I don't know why they banned it but it was for the right reasons"
Its only ok if games that I like do something games that I don't like aren't allowed to do that thing I don't like please ban all games I don't like thank you
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715737]The creator of the game SHOULD HAVE seen this coming. I am seeing where twitch is coming from for the reason of the ban[/QUOTE] No he fucking shouldnt because nothing in the game is inherently worse than any of the examples he's given. There is a game allowed on twitch in which the whole point behind combat is to strip ambiguously aged minor looking anime people into their skivvies so they can be killed by sunlight. Thats fine? How? They didnt even give a reason for the ban, how can you possibly sit there and type out the words "I am seeing where twitch is coming from for the reason of the ban" when we dont KNOW their reasoning.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715743] You have yet to explain this. [editline]23rd January 2017[/editline] Jesus Christ thats not a fucking argument, i literally just pointed out that you took that whole mechanic out of context to shit on it, dont give me that crap.[/QUOTE] This is a dumb discussion. We can go back and forth all day about personal opinion about the morals of sandbox games but twitch was in the right. There is a line to be crossed and IMO I see where twitch saw the line crossed. I'm not going to go back and forth, that's just my opinion. Again, yeah, twitch is dumb for not explaining it. I still think the creator should have seen it coming.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715770]This is a dumb discussion. We can go back and forth all day about personal opinion about the morals of sandbox games but twitch was in the right. There is a line to be crossed and IMO I see where twitch saw the line crossed. I'm not going to go back and forth, that's just my opinion. Again, yeah, twitch is dumb for not explaining it. I still think the creator should have seen it coming.[/QUOTE] EXPLAIN. Fucking[i] EXPLAIN.[/i]
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715770]This is a dumb discussion. We can go back and forth all day about personal opinion about the morals of sandbox games but twitch was in the right. There is a line to be crossed and IMO I see where twitch saw the line crossed. I'm not going to go back and forth, that's just my opinion. Again, yeah, twitch is dumb for not explaining it. I still think the creator should have seen it coming.[/QUOTE] "we can go back and forth but in the end I'm right lol"
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715769] There is a game allowed on twitch in which the whole point behind combat is to strip ambiguously aged minor looking anime people into their skivvies so they can be killed by sunlight. Thats fine? How? [/QUOTE] Maybe it's not that there is too much nudity in YandereSim but that there's not enough.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715777]EXPLAIN. Fucking[I] EXPLAIN.[/I][/QUOTE] LINE CROSSED = BULLYING GIRL INTO SUICIDE That's my opinion if you don't like it I really don't care. That's my last reply I don't want to argue. Dumb me all you want if you think I am wrong. [editline]a[/editline] Also please calm down holy shit lol. Sorry for hurting your feelings or something. [editline]a[/editline] Oh my [I]god.[/I]
You clearly see me, Thlis, and J!NX disagree with you, and yet you KEEP saying "it crossed a line" "twitch was right" "he should have seen this coming". No. No i dont fucking see how it crossed a line. No i dont fucking see how twitch was right. No i dont fucking see how he should have seen this coming. You know why? You havent explained it. You havent given an argument, you expect your whole opinion, your whole stance, to be accepted on the basis of mysterious hurt feelings.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715784]LINE CROSSED = BULLYING GIRL INTO SUICIDE That's my opinion if you don't like it I really don't care.[B] Like honestly lol you guys are taking this way too seriously. [/B]I'm just saying I think twitch is in the right.[/QUOTE] Oh come on, this clearly isn't going to do any favors for the argument. Yes, it is clearly your opinion. We were just debating that opinion.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715784]LINE CROSSED = BULLYING GIRL INTO SUICIDE[/QUOTE] How is that worse than any of these > "Murder, assault, battery, robbery, kidnapping, ransom, torture, grand theft auto, espionage, corporate espionage, trespassing, animal abuse, destruction of property, harassment" that i listed before? How does this change that you're taking the mechanic out of context and twisting it to make it seem like it exists solely to bully people into suicide when thats not a necessary outcome? What the fuck are you doing. [QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715784]That's my opinion if you don't like it I really don't care. Like honestly lol you guys are taking this way too seriously. I'm just saying I think twitch is in the right.[/QUOTE] [i][b]WHY DO YOU THINK TWITCH IS RIGHT. YOU HAVE YET TO ACTUALLY EXPLAIN WHY YOU THINK THEY'RE IN THE RIGHT. [/b][/i] [editline]23rd January 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715784] Also please calm down holy shit lol. Sorry for hurting your feelings or something.[/QUOTE] Im getting frustrated because arguing with you on this point is like trying to explain to a piece of plywood how cars are built.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715799]How is that worse than any of these > "Murder, assault, battery, robbery, kidnapping, ransom, torture, grand theft auto, espionage, corporate espionage, trespassing, animal abuse, destruction of property, harassment" that i listed before? How does this change that you're taking the mechanic out of context and twisting it to make it seem like it exists solely to bully people into suicide when thats not a necessary outcome? What the fuck are you doing. [I][B]WHY DO YOU THINK TWITCH IS RIGHT. YOU HAVE YET TO ACTUALLY EXPLAIN WHY YOU THINK THEY'RE IN THE RIGHT. [/B][/I] [editline]23rd January 2017[/editline] Im getting frustrated because arguing with you on this point is like trying to explain to a piece of plywood how cars are built.[/QUOTE] I just don't know how to explain it properly right now. [I just wanted to state my opinion.. I went back too fast without thinking and I apologize for that] Like look dude going all bold italics caps just makes me go "okkkaayyy I don't really want to say anything anymore." I'm just gonna take my dumbs and move on, but then that makes it look like "HAH! YOU LOST THE ARGUMENT!" Yeah it sucks. But if your wondering why I am not saying anything more, this is why.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715826]I just don't know how to explain it. [/QUOTE] Then why did you even bother? And, on that point, how can you justify having an opinion you cant explain the reasoning of? How can you justify Twitch being in the right when they never gave a ban reason? How can you justify that YandereDev "should have seen this coming" if you cant prove how these elements are inherently worse than other game mechanics?
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715833]Then why did you even bother? And, on that point, how can you justify having an opinion you cant explain the reasoning of? How can you justify Twitch being in the right when they never gave a ban reason? How can you justify that YandereDev "should have seen this coming" if you cant prove how these elements are inherently worse than other game mechanics?[/QUOTE] You're trying to reason him out of an opinion he clearly didn't use reason to come to.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715826]I'm just gonna take my dumbs and move on, but then that makes it look like "HAH! YOU LOST THE ARGUMENT!" Yeah it sucks. But if your wondering why I am not saying anything more, this is why.[/QUOTE] To be fair you were never winning the argument to begin with.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715826]I just don't know how to explain it properly. Like look dude going all bold italics caps just makes me go "okkkaayyy I don't really want to say anything anymore." I'm just gonna take my dumbs and move on, but then that makes it look like "HAH! YOU LOST THE ARGUMENT!" Yeah it sucks.[/QUOTE] When you make a statement, attempt to debate it, end up not providing any counter-arguments other than opinion, and then claim to leave the discussion then it does make you look like you lost the argument. It's perfectly fine to have an opinion but you are clearly not trying to avoid further arguments when posting things like "Also please calm down holy shit lol. Sorry for hurting your feelings or something."
[QUOTE=Thlis;51715848]When you make a statement, attempt to debate it, end up not providing any counter-argument's other than opinion, and then claim to leave the discussion then it does make you look like you lost the argument. It's perfectly fine to have an opinion but you are clearly not trying to avoid further arguments when posting things like "Also please calm down holy shit lol. Sorry for hurting your feelings or something."[/QUOTE] to be fair he was posting in all caps, italics and bold. At least it's better then people telling me to kill myself on my visitor board.
[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;51715854]to be fair he was posting in all caps, italics and bold.[/QUOTE] Cool excuse.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715859]Cool excuse.[/QUOTE] To say calm down? That seemed like a perfectly reasonable time. [editline]a[/editline] Okay for real I am suppppppper derailing the thread and Im sorry mods. I won't post again I'm sorry. Please. and Im sorry to everybody else I have been really depressed lately and I shouldn't be posting. I'll formulate my thoughts in a way that doesn't offend better next time. And yeah, I lost the argument. Ill concede.
lmao fuck this dude. Makes like the most disgusting game ever, then makes a whiny video blaming ~sjw's~ for getting his already abhorrent game banned. Maybe don't make what is essentially a serial killer simulator if you want to be treated like a normal developer???
It's really jarring to see Yandere Simulator paired with titles like RapeLay and HuniePop in a comprehensive list of banned games, sure, but that doesn't mean that Yandere Sim was banned because of explicit sexual content (which it doesn't [I]have[/I] to the levels of the latter titles)/the acts of violence themselves (which "every" popular game on Twitch has to some degree). Twitch banned the game probably because it went against a sponsor's policy on depicting the severe and active harming of minors or something. Either that, or someone at Twitch [B]really[/B] hates the idea of creepy anime murder games, or they're afraid that Yandere Simulator might escalate to some unknown level of "inappropriateness" in a new development which sounds overly cautious but definitely possible. We really need an official statement to make any sort of debate on this subject. The TOS and Community Guidelines are inconclusive. There's no discernible pattern for how games are judged in Twitch's [I]court[/I] of streamable games. What can we do but wait? EDIT: I didn't consider the final mission of Postal 1 which has you mass murdering a school.
[QUOTE=Wafflemonstr;51715905]lmao fuck this dude. Makes like the most disgusting game ever, then makes a whiny video blaming ~sjw's~ for getting his already abhorrent game banned. Maybe don't make what is essentially a serial killer simulator if you want to be treated like a normal developer???[/QUOTE] Holy shit can you actually give anyone an argument behind your opinion. Also the SJW thing is a possibility, not a reality, in his mind. Nobody told him the ban reason, so he's speculating, jesus christ. [editline]23rd January 2017[/editline] Also Hitman is LITERALLY A SERIAL KILLER/MURDER SIMULATOR AND NOBODY GIVES A SHIT.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715921] Also Hitman is LITERALLY A SERIAL KILLER/MURDER SIMULATOR AND NOBODY GIVES A SHIT.[/QUOTE] Honestly I really do think that there is the chance of an anti-anime bias when it comes down to the treatment of games. Not necessarily related but I think I remember talk of the ESRB being visibly stricter when it comes down to foreign games.
[QUOTE=Thlis;51715938] Not necessarily related but I think I remember talk of the ESRB being visibly stricter when it comes down to foreign games.[/QUOTE] Technically speaking Hitman, most Square Enix games, Eidos stuff, etc. are foreign titles so i dont know how true that is.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;51715950]Technically speaking Hitman, most Square Enix games, Eidos stuff, etc. are foreign titles so i dont know how true that is.[/QUOTE] Only technically. It has a very western style.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.