Ask creationists why people get new flu shots every year
[sp]Evolution[/sp]
[QUOTE=mike;24611006]all the people in the thread who are saying creationism shouldn't be taught in schools need to get off their high horses and stop being fucking idiots.[/QUOTE]
Yeah those people who want their kids to be taught fact and not blatant lies are elitist idiots
[QUOTE=mike;24611152]the first amendement of the american constitution specifies freedom of religion - people are free to believe whatever they want to believe. probably partly because of this america is lucky enough to be a pretty multicultural nation with many different religions.
not only is learning about other religions interesting and a rewarding experience, it's pretty much the only thing that has the ability to reduce religious intolerance easily at a young age - this is what OFSTED said in 2007 about it:
“At its best, RE equips pupils very well to consider issues of community cohesion, diversity and religious understanding. It contributes significantly to pupils’ academic progress and their personal development. This is one reason why pupils’ attitudes towards the subject have improved. Older pupils, in particular, believe that RE provides opportunities to discuss issues which matter to them and encourages them to respect differences of opinion and belief.”
if you've misunderstood my post i apologise - it's not intended as a method to preach to young people and shove religion down their necks, it's an objective subject that aims to educate young people on other religions and their history and belief system.
i found my studies in the subject rewarding and interesting. i was also lucky enough to have friends drawn from many religions and having a greater understanding of their beliefs really was fantastic.[/QUOTE]
Sure, but include it in history lessons so you can teach them why people made up the different religions and how it was shoved down the necks of most people in history
I asked my mom if she believed in evolution.
She said no.
I nearly smacked the skin off that bitch.
[QUOTE=Rubs10;24634129][img]http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/4611/aaaaaaaaaaaaathisthread.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
cool I never gave anyone cancer before
Well, I'll be an apes uncle.
[QUOTE=mike;24611006]all the people in the thread who are saying creationism shouldn't be taught in schools need to get off their high horses and stop being fucking idiots.
creationism absolutely needs to be taught in schools. the difference is that evolution by natural selection should be rigorously taught to the students in science lessons, with mention that various religious frameworks have different views.
there should also be a very thorough religion and philosophy program set out in such a way every student should have to take it - this should educate on many religious and views as well as covering things like intelligent design, the cosmological argument etc. having a very strong religious education program in the US can only help reduce religious prejudice and insensitivity.
while i'm revising the schools program in the US in my head i think i'll ban abstinence only sex education while i'm there.[/QUOTE]
Well see here's the thing, Evolution at this point is pretty much solid fact. Creationism is still belief.
If there's any teaching of creationism it must be from an observational standpoint, not actually giving the belief as an option. It's a school, not a happy factory full of mysticism and wonder. They teach facts. If people want to be educated in creationism they can go to a religious school.
pokemon is epic proof
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;24636085]Well see here's the thing, Evolution at this point is pretty much solid fact. Creationism is still belief.
If there's any teaching of creationism it must be from an observational standpoint, not actually giving the belief as an option. It's a school, not a happy factory full of mysticism and wonder. They teach facts. If people want to be educated in creationism they can go to a religious school.[/QUOTE]
The very fact that evolution and science in general are taught in public schools and not creationism should be an indication as to the validity of the claims made in creationism; ie., they're bullshit.
[QUOTE=mike;24611006]all the people in the thread who are saying creationism shouldn't be taught in schools need to get off their high horses and stop being fucking idiots.
creationism absolutely needs to be taught in schools. the difference is that evolution by natural selection should be rigorously taught to the students in science lessons, with mention that various religious frameworks have different views.
there should also be a very thorough religion and philosophy program set out in such a way every student should have to take it - this should educate on many religious and views as well as covering things like intelligent design, the cosmological argument etc. having a very strong religious education program in the US can only help reduce religious prejudice and insensitivity.
while i'm revising the schools program in the US in my head i think i'll ban abstinence only sex education while i'm there.[/QUOTE]
No, don't bother mentioning religious myths about origins in science classes. Save it for a bloody religion class. Teach [i]science[/i] in science classes.
I am neutral and i strongly believe that it happened maybe
[img]http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Neutral_Planet_3236.jpg[/img]
I'm pretty sure that the Vatican states that The Creation story should be taken as a metaphorical thing, and not "word for word". (eg: Adam and Eve are the first of the human tribes or something).
It's just the Conservative Protestant Americans not letting anyone state other wise or people might start not kissing their feet.
Shame how a small group of zelot extremists can make a stereotype for a whole group of people.
[QUOTE=Whomobile;24636902]I'm pretty sure that the Vatican states that The Creation story should be taken as a metaphorical thing, and not "word for word". (eg: Adam and Eve are the first of the human tribes or something).
It's just the Conservative Protestant Americans not letting anyone state other wise or people might start not kissing their feet.
Shame how a small group of zelot extremists can make a stereotype for a whole group of people.[/QUOTE]
The problem is i don't think they had that stance before, their religion has ironically "evolved" (:smug:) into this perception of the bible.
Also the bible is aesop's fables.
[QUOTE=s0beit;24636958]The problem is i don't think they had that stance before, their religion has ironically "evolved" (:smug:) into this perception of the bible.
Also the bible is aesop's fables.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, most of the Bible is probably fake or heavy edited, The New testament is basically a document of Jesus and his comrades protesting against the people in power during his time, you know the story of him riding into town on a donkey? that was him and his followers mocking a much grander ceremony taking place at another part of town.
Once again, the point has flown over everyone's head because their too consumed with power and/or wrong ideas.
But give credit to the Vatican for trying to stick with the times.:v:
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;24636085]Well see here's the thing, Evolution at this point is pretty much solid fact. Creationism is still belief.
If there's any teaching of creationism it must be from an observational standpoint, not actually giving the belief as an option. It's a school, not a happy factory full of mysticism and wonder. They teach facts. If people want to be educated in creationism they can go to a religious school.[/QUOTE]
that's what i'm saying - religious education including creationism and all that it entails should be undertaken objectively studying all the major religions.
I didn't know Argentinians were that dumb.:v:
Oh, you mean UStaters. Not Americans.
[QUOTE=mike;24611006]all the people in the thread who are saying creationism shouldn't be taught in schools need to get off their high horses and stop being fucking idiots.[/QUOTE]
Maybe they mean "shouldn't be taught in a science class".
Then again, I haven't read the whole thread.
[QUOTE=mike;24611152]the first amendement of the american constitution specifies freedom of religion - people are free to believe whatever they want to believe. probably partly because of this america is lucky enough to be a pretty multicultural nation with many different religions.
not only is learning about other religions interesting and a rewarding experience, it's pretty much the only thing that has the ability to reduce religious intolerance easily at a young age - this is what OFSTED said in 2007 about it:
“At its best, RE equips pupils very well to consider issues of community cohesion, diversity and religious understanding. It contributes significantly to pupils’ academic progress and their personal development. This is one reason why pupils’ attitudes towards the subject have improved. Older pupils, in particular, believe that RE provides opportunities to discuss issues which matter to them and encourages them to respect differences of opinion and belief.”
if you've misunderstood my post i apologise - it's not intended as a method to preach to young people and shove religion down their necks, it's an objective subject that aims to educate young people on other religions and their history and belief system.
i found my studies in the subject rewarding and interesting. i was also lucky enough to have friends drawn from many religions and having a greater understanding of their beliefs really was fantastic.[/QUOTE]
if the kid really fucking cared about religion, he should pursue it on his own. evolution is science, it needs to be taught.
creationism isn't anything, what is there to be said about "god created everything".
[QUOTE=Jookia;24283335]Evolution hasn't been proven, there's still missing links. That's why it's called the [b]theory[/b] of evolution.[/QUOTE]
A theory means it's tried and tested and shown to be probable. It's grounded in facts, and can be observed.
A hypothesis is speculation. Anything other than evolution is just a hypothesis.
Creationism isn't even a hypothesis, because there's nothing that can be observed to even cause someone to speculate the possibility.
The existence of ghosts would be a hypothesis, since there's minimal shaky evidence.
[QUOTE=Jookia;24283335]Evolution hasn't been proven, there's still missing links. That's why it's called the [b]theory[/b] of evolution.[/QUOTE]
You deserve your boxes.
Theory of gravity, ever heard of that? Just a theory, so why don't you start flying this afternoon?
[editline]03:41PM[/editline]
[QUOTE=DrMortician;24647082]A theory means it's tried and tested and shown to be probable. It's grounded in facts, and can be observed.
A hypothesis is speculation. Anything other than evolution is just a hypothesis.[/QUOTE]
There needs to be a new word for theory. Too many idiots just toss it out there without understanding what it means, cross their arms and think they've won an argument.
[QUOTE=mike;24611006]all the people in the thread who are saying creationism shouldn't be taught in schools need to get off their high horses and stop being fucking idiots[/QUOTE]
Stopped right there.
[QUOTE=Scoooby;24646972]if the kid really fucking cared about religion, he should pursue it on his own. evolution is science, it needs to be taught.
creationism isn't anything, what is there to be said about "god created everything".[/QUOTE]
i'm not saying you shouldn't teach evolution - you absolutely should teach it. i believe it's the absolute truth of how life has become what it is - it's an incredibly elegant scientific solution to a fairly difficult to understand problem.
i'm making the point that students should be taught about religion and its various forms, especially those that are likely to be unfamiliar to them (so in most western countries, anything that's not christianity). religion, whether you like it or not has played an incredibly major role in the history of the world and will no doubt continue to play a role (albeit greatly diminished) in the future. i think that students should learn about them so they can understand this world better.
[QUOTE=mike;24647453]i'm not saying you shouldn't teach evolution - you absolutely should teach it. i believe it's the absolute truth of how life has become what it is - it's an incredibly elegant scientific solution to a fairly difficult to understand problem.
i'm making the point that students should be taught about religion and its various forms, especially those that are likely to be unfamiliar to them (so in most western countries, anything that's not christianity). religion, whether you like it or not has played an incredibly major role in the history of the world and will no doubt continue to play a role (albeit greatly diminished) in the future. i think that students should learn about them so they can understand this world better.[/QUOTE]
Students should be taught the basics of the major religions of the world solely for culture reasons. But they should be taught about them in the least indoctrinating method possible, like a documentary, not going to sunday school.
[QUOTE=DrMortician;24647530]Students should be taught the basics of the major religions of the world solely for culture reasons. But they should be taught about them in the least indoctrinating method possible, like a documentary, not going to sunday school.[/QUOTE]
absolutely - that's what i'm saying.
[QUOTE=mike;24647567]absolutely - that's what i'm saying.[/QUOTE]
No, you're saying that evolution and creationism should be taught in parallel.
Teaching creationism is indoctrination. Saying that, "In the absence of science, early man created many religions to explain the things they didn't understand..." and continuing on to mention creationism in that light, would be acceptable.
[QUOTE=DrMortician;24647599]No, you're saying that evolution and creationism should be taught in parallel.
Teaching creationism is indoctrination.[/QUOTE]
i never said that.
i said you should mention them when you talk about evolution. knowing about the history of science is (in my opinion) pretty important to give a greater depth of understanding about the science itself. we discussed the idea of intelligent design in biology before studying evolution - it helps to understand why darwin's ideas were very hard to stomach when they were first put forward.
[QUOTE=mike;24647675]i never said that.
i said you should mention them when you talk about evolution.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=DrMortician;24647599]No, you're saying that evolution and creationism should be taught in parallel.
[/QUOTE]
Do you not see the logical fallacy here?
No, when you say "creationism should be taught in schools" it means that students should be taught that god created life as if it were fact. What you mean to say is the [I]history or premise[/I] of creationism should be taught in schools.
Either way, it hardly seems worthwhile unless the student has taken a course on religious topics.
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;24647769]No, when you say "creationism should be taught in schools" it means that students should be taught that god created life. What you mean to say is the history of creationism should be taught in schools.[/QUOTE]
i should probably reword it to say something more like the concepts of creationism - this is probably what's creating the misunderstanding.
[QUOTE=mike;24647812]i should probably reword it to say something more like the concepts of creationism - this is probably what's creating the misunderstanding.[/QUOTE]
Do you know what the word concept means?
[QUOTE=DrMortician;24647842]Do you know what the word concept means?[/QUOTE]
yes...
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