Can you ban for ideology? - General

WRONG WRONG Garry has ultimate power not starpluck, i'm pretty sure garry didn't say "ban anybody you disagree with". The guy wasn't being racist or anything, he was just defending himself when called a nazi. I bet if some guy was banned for being liberal you all would be against starpluck. [editline]6th April 2013[/editline] "Oh you have a differant opinion than me? BANNED" The guy even said himself he wasn't a nazi. Whats the point of SH if you can't post your thoughts on the article. Nobody should be banned for opinions unless by garry, since he pays like $4000 on FP servers.

[QUOTE=Iago;40186615]WRONG WRONG Garry has ultimate power not starpluck, i'm pretty sure garry didn't say "ban anybody you disagree with". The guy wasn't being racist or anything, he was just defending himself when called a nazi. I bet if some guy was banned for being liberal you all would be against starpluck. [editline]6th April 2013[/editline] "Oh you have a differant opinion than me? BANNED" The guy even said himself he wasn't a nazi.[B] Whats the point of SH if you can't post your thoughts on [/B]the article. Nobody should be banned for opinions unless by garry, since he pays like $4000 on FP servers.[/QUOTE] case closed guys, he said he didn't do anything wrong nothing to see here [editline]6th April 2013[/editline] btw the guy is definitely a nazi [url]http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1259048&p=40164836&viewfull=1#post40164836[/url]

Permabanning is pushing it a bit.

if nazism is bannable then so too should be communism communism caused an order of magnitude more deaths

[QUOTE=Faz;40186211]You can get banned for having an opinion that conflicts with a mods or the majority of a thread. So you better start having the same opinion as all the super liberal atheists on here or else :smile:[/QUOTE]Yeh I know, it's so super liberal to be hating on a mass-murdering bastard who left half the world in ruins, and those misguided fools that think he was in the right.

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;40187603]if nazism is bannable then so too should be communism communism caused an order of magnitude more deaths[/QUOTE] Yeah but no. Communism killed millions through economic failures and political suppression, not the ideology itself preached, or implied killing millions. Whereas nazism was fixated with doing away undesirables and promoting self-destructive militism. Lets compare a basic wiki snippet of each ideology. [quote]Nazism claimed that an Aryan master race was superior to all other races.[12] To maintain what it regarded as the purity and strength of the Aryan race, Nazis sought to exterminate Jews and Romani, and the physically and mentally disabled.[13] Other groups deemed "degenerate" or "asocial" received exclusionary treatment, including homosexuals, blacks, Jehovah's Witnesses and political opponents.[13] The Nazis supported territorial expansionism to gain Lebensraum ("living space") as being a law of nature for all healthy and vigorous peoples of superior races growing in population to displace peoples of inferior races; especially people of a superior race facing overpopulation in their given territories.[14] Nazism rejected democracy because it believed Jews used it for their self-preservation.[/quote] [quote]Communism (from Latin communis - common, universal) is a revolutionary socialist movement to create a classless, moneyless[1][2] and stateless social order structured upon common ownership of the means of production, as well as a social, political and economic ideology that aims at the establishment of this social order. [...] Marxist theory holds that pure communism or full communism is a specific stage of historical development that inevitably emerges from the development of the productive forces that leads to a superabundance of material wealth, allowing for distribution based on need and social relations based on freely associated individuals.[5][6] The exact definition of communism varies, and it is often mistakenly, in general political discourse, used interchangeably with socialism; however, Marxist theory contends that socialism is just a transitional stage on the road to communism. Leninism adds to Marxism the notion of a vanguard party to lead the proletarian revolution and to secure all political power after the revolution for the working class, for the development of universal class consciousness and worker participation, in a transitional stage between capitalism and communism.[/quote] I know which one sounds more bannable.

[QUOTE=sp00ks;40187293] btw the guy is definitely a nazi [url]http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1259048&p=40164836&viewfull=1#post40164836[/url][/QUOTE] lol actual quote by this guy: [quote]Hitler was one of the most patriotic men of his time, he loved Germany and it's people.[/quote] glad he's gone

[QUOTE=Zeke129;40187816]lol actual quote by this guy: glad he's gone[/QUOTE] technically he's right I mean hitler did love germany and its people he just wanted to kill literally everything else

[QUOTE=killerteacup;40187861]I mean hitler did love germany and its people he just wanted to kill literally everything else[/QUOTE] No he didn't. He killed hundreds of thousands of germans who didn't fit into his warped ideal of what a german actually was. [I]"First they came for the communists, and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist. Then they came for the socialists, and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Catholic. Then they came for me, and there was no one left to speak for me"[/I] - Martin Niemöller

[QUOTE=killerteacup;40187861]technically he's right I mean hitler did love germany and its people he just wanted to kill literally everything else[/QUOTE] all those jews and gays and other people he killed were germans

[QUOTE=Zeke129;40187907]all those jews and gays and other people he killed were germans[/QUOTE] what about those french and dutch and belgian and danish and norwegian and polish and austrian and czechoslovakian and romanian and hungarian and greek and russian and latvian and lithuanian and estonian and croation and bosniak and serbian and kosovar and slovenian people [editline]7th April 2013[/editline] [img]http://www.andyross.net/images/nazi_empire.jpg[/img] this is considerably bigger than germany

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;40187937]what about those french and dutch and belgian and danish and norwegian and polish and austrian and czechoslovakian and romanian and hungarian and greek and russian and latvian and lithuanian and estonian people[/QUOTE] Yeah well that wouldn't be relevant to his rebuttal now would it?

[QUOTE=Zambies!;40183774] I'm curious if you actually can. If this should be moved to FT go for it, but I want some discussion on this.[/QUOTE] Will we miss him, or anyone else that spouts such malignant thought? The only way to keep a tumor from spreading is to either cut it out or blast it with radiation (radiation/chemo in this case being universal ridicule and loss of credibility.)

[QUOTE=NoDachi;40187801]Yeah but no. Communism killed millions through economic failures and political suppression, not the ideology itself preached, or implied killing millions. Whereas nazism was fixated with doing away undesirables and promoting self-destructive militism.[/QUOTE] you can't compare marx's writings on communist theory with how nazism was done in practice nazism proper was a relatively young ideology so we really only have the deathcamps to look at, but communist apologists have half a century's worth of theory to draw upon so they can ignore everything that happened after 1917 if you're going to be completely fair you should either compare communism's results with nazism's results, or compare marxist theory to nazi theory or its closest analogue.

[QUOTE=NoDachi;40187801]Communism killed millions through economic failures and political suppression, not the ideology itself preached, or implied killing millions.[/QUOTE] [quote]Send to Penza To Comrades Kuraev, Bosh, Minkin and other Penza communists Comrades! The revolt by the five kulak volost's must be suppressed without mercy. The interest of the entire revolution demands this, because we have now before us our final decisive battle "with the kulaks." We need to set an example. 1.You need to hang (hang without fail, so that the public sees) at least 100 notorious kulaks, the rich, and the bloodsuckers. 2.Publish their names. 3.Take away all of their grain. 4.Execute the hostages - in accordance with yesterday's telegram. This needs to be accomplished in such a way, that people for hundreds of miles around will see, tremble, know and scream out: let's choke andstrangle those blood-sucking kulaks. Telegraph us acknowledging receipt and execution of this. Yours, Lenin P.S. Use your toughest people for this."[/quote] It's not like political purges and trying to "re-educate" enemies of the state by throwing them in prison camps or suppressing scientific inquiry or trying to wipe out entire ethnic groups are alien concepts to the Soviet Union, China, Cuba or many other Communist failures.

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;40188006]you can't compare marx's writings on communist theory with how nazism was done in practice nazism proper was a relatively young ideology so we really only have the deathcamps to look at, but communist apologists have half a century's worth of theory to draw upon so they can ignore everything that happened after 1917 if you're going to be completely fair you should either compare communism's results with nazism's results, or compare marxist theory to nazi theory or its closest analogue.[/QUOTE] But you can compare communist theory with nazi theory. You'll find that Nazism was practised entirely as was intended. You might as well throw in the millions who died under failed capitalism and capitalistic driven imperialism if you're going to be like this.

[QUOTE=killerteacup;40187861]technically he's right I mean hitler did love germany and its people he just wanted to kill literally everything else[/QUOTE] Hitler loved the Aryan race. Everything else was a target.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;40188015]It's not like political purges and trying to "re-educate" enemies of the state by throwing them in prison camps or suppressing scientific inquiry or trying to wipe out entire ethnic groups are alien concepts to the Soviet Union, China, Cuba or many other Communist failures.[/QUOTE] But that is just political intriguing and power gaming. Its not unique to any ideology.

[QUOTE=NoDachi;40188049]But that is just political intriguing and power gaming. Its not unique to any ideology.[/QUOTE] (you're casually dismissing genocide)

[QUOTE=NoDachi;40188049]But that is just political intriguing and power gaming. Its not unique to any ideology.[/QUOTE] Leninist ideology literally calls for a dictatorship to be established. Stalin was just carrying out the logical conclusion of Lenins handiwork.

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;40187937]what about those french and dutch and belgian and danish and norwegian and polish and austrian and czechoslovakian and romanian and hungarian and greek and russian and latvian and lithuanian and estonian and croation and bosniak and serbian and kosovar and slovenian people [editline]7th April 2013[/editline] [img]http://www.andyross.net/images/nazi_empire.jpg[/img] this is considerably bigger than germany[/QUOTE] I'm addressing the Nazi's argument that "Hitler loved Germany and its people" so I'm obviously only going to refer to all the Germans he massacred

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;40188083]Leninist ideology literally calls for a dictatorship to be established. Stalin was just carrying out the logical conclusion of Lenins handiwork.[/QUOTE] Oh so leninist ideology, sure throw that in with Nazism and Stalinism. [editline]7th April 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;40188069](you're casually dismissing genocide)[/QUOTE] By recognising that genocide often transcends specific political circumstance?

[QUOTE=NoDachi;40188089]By recognising that genocide often transcends specific political circumstance?[/QUOTE] i'm not quite sure of your point? if nazism is bad because genocide then surely communism must be bad too

The funny thing is, by suppressing free commerce within the Soviet Union, Lenin and his successors did so much damage that it's difficult to actually realize the extent of it. Just imagine what Russia would be like if the Tsars managed to cling onto power and allowed it to gradually reform into a democracy.

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;40188124]i'm not quite sure of your point? if nazism is bad because genocide then surely communism must be bad too[/QUOTE] Nazism is bad because its ultimate purpose was genocide and ethnic cleansing. You can't quite put communism in that same league regardless how many starved to death or how many perceived threats Stalin murdered. Because surely you've realised that this thread is about measuring [I] ideologies[/I]. Not history. Otherwise we'd ban all the Catholics too.

[QUOTE=NoDachi;40188160]Nazism is bad because its ultimate purpose was genocide and ethnic cleansing. You can't quite put communism in that same league regardless how many starved to death or how many perceived threats Stalin murdered. Because surely you've realised that this thread is about measuring [I] ideologies[/I]. Not history. Otherwise we'd ban all the Catholics too.[/QUOTE] i guess i can see your point the closest analogue we have to nazi theory (like marx to communism) is really nationalism, reactionary thought and irredentism, not the stuff that was written immediately before and during the nazi's power. stuff like mein kampf is more analogous to the propaganda printed out during communist rule to justify what they were doing rather than the stuff leading up to it

Nazism would be good for the spoiled kids to get some manners. That's just my opinion..

[QUOTE=Miricx;40188359]Nazism would be good for the spoiled kids to get some manners. That's just my opinion..[/QUOTE] [img]http://codoh.com/sites/default/files/JHR-1-1-Walendy-11.jpg[/img] look at all the manners he gives.

One of the original rules was no nazis.

[QUOTE=NoDachi;40188371][img]http://codoh.com/sites/default/files/JHR-1-1-Walendy-11.jpg[/img] look at all the manners he gives.[/QUOTE] Spoiled kids are pretty much dead inside their head anyways Also, are you sure that all the kids are jewish, eh?