• Kinect: The dark age of Xbox
    61 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Water-Marine;50190619]That's been happening since the 360 though, right? I'm surprise very few Xbox One games capitalized on its utilities without making the entire game into a gimmicky mess.[/QUOTE] I just dont think it's very fun or intuitive enough for gaming. It's a pretty fantastic piece of technology for serious applications though.
Honestly by itself it's awful for gaming, you need a controller or something else so that you can do more than rely on flailing around like a dumbass. And for some reason most of the developers that made Kinect-only games for it really fucked up the coding or something because most of the games are way too sensitive or just don't work properly.
[QUOTE=l337k1ll4;50189834]The Kinect is one of those moments that makes you wonder what the fuck is going through the minds of the people who created it. Especially the minds of the people who wrote those fucking unbelievably cringeworthy stage presentations.[/QUOTE] "Nintendo make this thing that sold for millions and god damn it we're gonna latch on and try to make money of this motion control craze too!".
[QUOTE=RikohZX;50190668]Honestly by itself it's awful for gaming, you need a controller or something else so that you can do more than rely on flailing around like a dumbass. And for some reason most of the developers that made Kinect-only games for it really fucked up the coding or something because most of the games are way too sensitive or just don't work properly.[/QUOTE] The technology just isn't really there yet. I think that a much more advanced Kinect-like peripheral is a foregone conclusion for a truly immersive VR (gaming) experience.
i unironically love the galactic dance-off in star wars kinect its perfect
[QUOTE=Duck M.;50190681]The technology just isn't really there yet. I think that a much more advanced Kinect-like peripheral is a foregone conclusion for a truly immersive VR (gaming) experience.[/QUOTE] The Xbox One's Kinect was pretty good tech wise, but it was a couple years too late. Microsoft put that technology to greater use with the hololens in order to do something actually revolutionary vs something half baked like the OG kinect.
My favorite part of the dark ages was this [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbPuDq0hvKI[/media] Regardless of your opinion of angry joe that moment there highlights sums up the shit show pretty well for me.
The thing is the Kinect can most definitely be used now, like holy shit do you know how good that shit will be in VR. Its like a leapmotion but on steroids.
I remember when my friend came over to play it for the first time and the Kinect couldn't detect him most of the time due to him having darker skin :v:
But 360/Xbone are still in the dark ages??? I think the Xbone is like the worst console since the "new generation"(2000-16). Though maybe its not that MS is just making a shitshow of things as usual and Sony is being as shit in that regard.
Like what the others said, Kinect was a good piece of technology in theory. Reality was it didn't break any expectations in my opinion, and really MS kept shoving Kinect games and practically made all their exclusives have or require it. If they worked on it a bit more and shown an excellent game that uses Kinect well(and Kinect was actually working) or required it, then it might convince people to give it a second chance or buy one.
It's so weird a company made a product nobody wanted What a waste
[QUOTE=notlabbet;50191333]It's so weird a company made a product nobody wanted What a waste[/QUOTE] well i guess other than it selling 24 million units sure
[QUOTE=MightyLOLZOR;50190561]The best thing to come out of the Kinect was using it in Gmod.[/QUOTE] Kicking melons and roping props to your arm then swinging them around was great, way better than any actual game that got made for kinect
[QUOTE=Duck M.;50191339]well i guess other than it selling 24 million units sure[/QUOTE] It's weird that Kinect was an odd sales success yet simultaneously it's synonymous with garbage when actually used for games.
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;50190181]I always thought the kinect was useless even for the most casual use. Not mentioning that the games were shit, let's say I just want to use it simple, for star trek style controlling of the console. What I would do to test it, is I would go to the far end of the room, and say loudly, and clearly, "XBOX, TURN OFF", repeating slowly, and walking slowly towards the console. 9 times out of 10 I could turn the console off faster than the Kinect. It really was, even in it's second generation, a pathetic piece of shit that almost nobody actually wanted, a failed response to the Wii which has in the long term been a failure as well (since the WiiU is such a flop). Just get motion controls the fuck out of here, nobody wants them and no game dev wants to develop for them. Like, I can't name you a third party WiiU game that uses motion controls, aside from like ZombiU. Even when you look for a Nintendo game, Smash doesn't use it, Mario doesn't use it, Kirby doesn't use it, I think Splatoon has it but I'm sure it'd be fine or improved without it. It just seems barely used an unnecessary, and frankly, it shouldn't have taken us a full decade to realize it. Fuckin' 1990s, virtual boy comes out and shit gets canned immediately because nobody liked it.[/QUOTE] I've seen hiccups in the voice recognition, but my cousin's X-Box One is pretty great in voice recognition. My little brother and I often mess with him by screaming through the wall and controlling his X-Box while he's trying to watch his show. If it can hear me through a wall, it's probably doing a good job. [QUOTE=Janus Vesta;50190163]I'm going to have to completely disagree with this. The problem with the Kinect wasn't a lack of killer apps, it wasn't the latency, and it wasn't the fact that it has problems tracking people if they move in weird ways, though those are/were problems it suffered. The problem with Kinect, and the Wii and Playstation Move to a lesser extent, is that the human body is a fucking terrible controller. Humans are tool using creatures, we make tools so we can do things that we can't do normally and a controller is no different. By constraining control to the motions of the human body you put an unreasonable constraint on the mechanical complexity and artistic freedom of a game. You have a number of problems when you do this. You have the issue that regular people aren't physically capable of doing most of the things their characters do in games, meaning you have to either map the character movements directly to player movement making everything look awkward and restricted, or you have to use the player's movement as an approximation of commands for the character to execute in which case it just becomes a more clumsy way of doing what controllers already do perfectly. You also greatly limit the possible types of games to ones which emulate human motions, meaning anything where you do complex movements or precision movements are entirely out of the question. You couldn't possibly control a character action game or a strategy game with the Kinect. Even games which were designed with Kinect's limitations in mind had issues with the device not correctly recognising player actions at times. The main problem with Kinect is that it is a backwards 'solution' to a problem that has been solved from the very beginning, though a fundamental misunderstanding of what the 'barrier' to entry is. The basic idea behind Kinect, and all motion controls, is that a player should be immersed and that there should be nothing standing between the player and the game. What the developers saw as the barrier between the player and the game is the controller, when in reality the controller is the key connection for the player and the game. The most important thing to immersion is the transformation of thoughts into actions, you want to shoot the gun and the gun shoots, you want to kick the ball and the ball is kicked. With a controller the time between thought and action is minimal, you think, you push button, character acts. With a motion controller you extend the time and effort between thought and action and almost universally receive an inferior result, you think, you perform a motion, the character tries to mimic or extrapolate that movement. As far as a piece of technology the Kinect is pretty cool, but as a gaming device it is flawed in its very concept. And that's not to say all motion controls are garbage, the motion controllers for VR headsets are a much smarter implementation of the technology. Rather than being used as a replacement for a controller they transform the controller into an extension of the player's hands. They are used to place the player in the game world rather than turning the player into a marionettist in control of a digital marionette. Though I'm not personally sold on VR I can at least respect the transformation of failed concepts the Occulus and Vive are attempting to do.[/QUOTE] I think the big issue that I have with motion tracking is that it doesn't feel like I'm doing anything. It totally feels like I'm just miming what I want to do, but in no way does it feel immersive. Inaccuracies only add to the problem, which could only be multiplied by the conditions of my room. But above all else, it doesn't feel like I'm picking up anything. It doesn't feel like I'm running. Instead, it feels like turning off the console and playing Quake with a keyboard and mouse. Tactile response is important for me as a ganer, and important for my family as human beings. Buttons are satisfying - we register them as being an input that will cause an output. We don't necessarily need buttons for that, though. We have touch screens, and we know that touching a touch screen produces a response. What about waving your hand in the air? Do you get any confirmation from that? No. With a Wiimote and Nunchuck, you have buttons. You can hold the Wii as a gun and the nun-chuck as the trigger, for instance. For a Kinect, though? You've got nothing. And with nothing, you can't suspend disbelief, because suspension requires far more than just motion tracking. You spend all of your time wishing you were doing the actual thing you're pretending to do by holding your hands in the air. And that's the problem.
So Project Milo (or Milo & Kate) which is shown in the video was actually a real thing. I was at a developer interview with former Bullfrog and Lionhead devs and the devs were talking about it, and they were being real honest about everything so I see no reason they'd lie about this. They said Lionhead and Bullfrog always had so much unique stuff in development that never saw the light of day, apparently they showcased Milo & Kate to some executive guys while on a business trip and they loved it. Then that big volcano eruption that meant planes couldn't fly lead to them being stuck wherever they were and they had all these people just coming in to check out the game that were friends of the guys they originally showed it to. But obviously Peter Molyneux gotta make it weird in demos... I know the Kinect is a bit shit (although I'll admit to loving Star Wars Kinect dance off) but in all honesty there's actually some pretty dope stuff that can be done with that kind of technology. You've just got to make it not shit. Look at the HTC Vive.
[QUOTE=DrugUnit;50191071]But 360/Xbone are still in the dark ages??? I think the Xbone is like the worst console since the "new generation"(2000-16). Though maybe its not that MS is just making a shitshow of things as usual and Sony is being as shit in that regard.[/QUOTE] Ps4 is just as bad in its own way. At least Microsoft is listening to the community and are doing some pretty amazing things
Microsoft deployed it in the wrong industry, Kinect was great for motion capture and 3D scanning. To be honest I don't think Microsoft care what the customer wants, they just invent things then deploy them to wrong market and restrict the uses to how they think the product should be used.
[QUOTE=a-cookie;50190729]i unironically love the galactic dance-off in star wars kinect its perfect[/QUOTE] Literally the only good part. Should've just made that a party game instead.
However much of a failure the Kinect was, I'm glad there's still being experimented with how games can be played.
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;50190348]That's...my point, though. Also i have a wiiu, and a wii, and the tablet, and the remote and nunchuck, and the pro controller. I've used them all. They all suck dick.[/QUOTE] Ok, so I'm not a fan of the Wiimote, I feel like its use is entirely just a controller you can shake sometimes and it'd be better off just being a normal controller with the shake feature being a button. Like say in Twilight rather than having to shake the Wiimote just have an attack button. Buuut the tablet is amazing: it's a normal controller that I can also use as a screen to stream the game to. I freaking love that, sometimes I just feel like laying down in bed and playing a game rather than sitting up at my desk or something. The pro controller is just a decent controller, all round, honestly I think I prefer it ergonomically to the PS4 and the Xbone controller.
[QUOTE=redBadger;50192553]Ps4 is just as bad in its own way. At least Microsoft is listening to the community and are doing some pretty amazing things[/QUOTE] This, but part of the issue with PS4 is that at the end of the day Sony JP makes all the decisions, the biggest thing that has been asked for since PSN began on the PS3 was the option to pay to change your PSN name. I want to say some site did a really in-depth article on this and it basically came down to that Sony JP didn't understand it, something along the lines it is a very foreign concept that people would want to change their name or alias and they never built that option into the PSN framework because that is something they didn't think would be wanted.
[QUOTE=Duck M.;50191339]well i guess other than it selling 24 million units sure[/QUOTE] Yeah, 24 million grandmas bought this for their grandsons for Christmas.
[QUOTE=DrugUnit;50191071]But 360/Xbone are still in the dark ages??? I think the Xbone is like the worst console since the "new generation"(2000-16). Though maybe its not that MS is just making a shitshow of things as usual and Sony is being as shit in that regard.[/QUOTE] What are you talking about? Xbox 360 wrecked the PS3 last generation and while the Xbone isn't as good as the PS4 it's no where near as bad as the unfortunate trainwreck that is the Wii U.
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