Dan Savage discusses bible at High School Journalism convention - General

[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35777875] Rom6:14 "For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace."[/quote] It's not saying anything about the old testament or law of Moses. [quote]Heb9:15 "And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance."[/quote] You really missed the point lol He's saying the first covenant as a time thing, not that anyone who followed that is wrong. Do you fucking read what you quote? [quote]Also if Christianity is so much like Islam, what are the other parallels apart from the fact that both religions follow a messiah?[/QUOTE] That is LITERALLY the only difference. They have the same god, same stories, same gospel, same everything.

[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35779710] That is LITERALLY the only difference. They have the same god, same stories, same gospel, same everything.[/QUOTE] Um.... Muslims read from the Qu'ran, which is pretty different from the New Testament which Christians focus on. So no, they don't have the same gospel nor do they have the same stories.

Good, now a perfectly funny and intellectual video has turned into an argument. Gawd dangit.

high school journalisum convention, if you're leaving because someone speaking disagrees with your beliefs which upsets you instead of sitting down with a pen and paper trying to create an unbaised article. Maybe you shouldn't be a journalist.

[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35777875] Also if Christianity is so much like Islam, what are the other parallels apart from the fact that both religions follow a messiah?[/QUOTE] They are both Abrahamic religions. (Both religions have roots tracing back to Abraham). Also, you claimed that Old testament's laws are not relevant to the religion (Post #8), which is plain silly. The old testament contains the 10 commandments, and the "New" Testament's foundations basically are derived from the Old Testament's, where they got rid of a lot of the "Nasties" which makes Christianity seem violent. Even if the Old Testament isn't followed as rigorously as it had previously been, that does not make it irrelevant.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;35779761]Um.... Muslims read from the Qu'ran, which is pretty different from the New Testament which Christians focus on. So no, they don't have the same gospel nor do they have the same stories.[/QUOTE] Yeah you haven't read either. [editline]1st May 2012[/editline] Obviously I'm not fucking saying it's a verbatim copy, like fuck, OBVIOUSLY. First of all, the god in all three Abrahamic religions is the same. The story of Nazareth is the same, Jesus is mentioned many times in the Quran, there are countless similarities.

[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;35778854]I disagree with trying to push your beliefs on to students who aren't even out of high school yet about religion. Whether it's for or against it.[/QUOTE] It wasn't a blind, encompassing tirade against religion, it was a well-reasoned point as to why using the Bible as the moral compass for our society is fucking terrible idea.

[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35779710]It's not saying anything about the old testament or law of Moses. You really missed the point lol He's saying the first covenant as a time thing, not that anyone who followed that is wrong. Do you fucking read what you quote? That is LITERALLY the only difference. They have the same god, same stories, same gospel, same everything.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Azza;35780613]Also, you claimed that Old testament's laws are not relevant to the religion (Post #8), which is plain silly. The old testament contains the 10 commandments, and the "New" Testament's foundations basically are derived from the Old Testament's, where they got rid of a lot of the "Nasties" which makes Christianity seem violent. Even if the Old Testament isn't followed as rigorously as it had previously been, that does not make it irrelevant.[/QUOTE] The law is a characteristic thing to the old testament, note how in the quote from John 1:17 it states that Moses brought the law, now this quote says that we are not under the law. As for the second quote, it doesn't state anything about the covenant being a time thing, or that those who used to follow it were wrong. Under the law when somebody sinned they had to sacrifice something living in order to gain forgiveness as something had to die for the sin(usually livestock of some sort). It states Christ as the mediator of the new covenant since he was the one that died for all of our sins as a sacrifice. It goes on to state that through sacrifice for the forgiveness of our sins, the price has already been paid, we don't have to follow any laws or sacrifice anything anymore, as Christ died for any sin already and as long as we accept that there's no use for the old covenant. [editline]1st May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35781024]Yeah you haven't read either. [editline]1st May 2012[/editline] Obviously I'm not fucking saying it's a verbatim copy, like fuck, OBVIOUSLY. First of all, the god in all three Abrahamic religions is the same. The story of Nazareth is the same, Jesus is mentioned many times in the Quran, there are countless similarities.[/QUOTE] I'm just asking that you offer some examples as to how they're the same.

Haha. They're at a journalism convention. Nice to know our countries news will soon be reported by people who can't have the courage to sit and consider points that are contrary to their own brainwashed egoic nonsense, but instead walk out in a disgusted act of defiance and make Dan Savage out to be a bad man.

[QUOTE=SCopE5000;35782129]Haha. They're at a journalism convention. Nice to know our countries news will soon be reported by people who can't have the courage to sit and consider points that are contrary to their own brainwashed egoic nonsense, but instead walk out in a disgusted act of defiance and make Dan Savage out to be a bad man.[/QUOTE] Fox already had a teacher on complaining about how Savage was "bullying" Christians and praising his students for being strong examples to their peers for leaving. Nothing says "strong" quite like dipping out as soon as someone has an entirely valid, opposing viewpoint to the idea that he is a sinner because he likes dudes.

[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35781024]Yeah you haven't read either. [editline]1st May 2012[/editline] Obviously I'm not fucking saying it's a verbatim copy, like fuck, OBVIOUSLY. First of all, the god in all three Abrahamic religions is the same. The story of Nazareth is the same, Jesus is mentioned many times in the Quran, there are countless similarities.[/QUOTE] No the story is not the same. For one, Allah denies creating a son. Number two, Jesus never died on the cross according to the Qur'an, Jesus is taken straight to heaven by Allah. Also, according to the Qur'an, all men are born muslim, and are pure. According to the bible all men are born evil(original sin) and must be baptized. As many similarities you find, I can probably find differences. The ideas behind Islam and Christianity are largely different, lending to different philosophy regarding the divine and yourself.

No that is not true yawmwen, the idea that Jesus did not die on the cross in Islam is a debated and controversial topic. If you ask a Muslim they're more likely to claim jesus was sent to heaven, others will claim he was killed on a pole not a cross, others will claim he did go to heaven but was replaced by a doppelganger. It's silly and illogical leading many Muslims to purposely mistranslates verses into English so they mesh with their own interpretation, [I]"That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not: Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise" —[/I][B]Qur'an, 4 (An-Nisa) ayat 157-158[/B] The above verse appears to show he didn't die, which affirms the doppleganger theory. Though many still debate it strongly: [I]"The Qur'an is not here speaking about a man, righteous and wronged though he may be, but about the Word of God who was sent to earth and returned to God. Thus the denial of killing of Jesus is a denial of the power of men to vanquish and destroy the divine Word, which is for ever victorious"[/I] The majority of Muslims translate verb "mutawafik" (متوفيك) "to terminate after a period of time" while others translate it "to die of natural causes". Islamic scholars like Javed Ahmad Ghamidi consider it as physical death of Jesus, and hence question the return of Jesus. Different interpretations of the Qur’anic verse 19, chapter 33 and writes in his conclusion that "the cumulative effect of the Qur’anic verse is strongly in favor of a real death. Which is why like I said on the earlier page it was funny how BigFatWorm claimed his Bible was taken out of context, when every single Muslims claims the same when you give the a verse from their book, it's seems like It's almost impossible to even tell someone what a single sentence is in their own religious book. I should know being previously a Muslim. Goblin was entirely right in his statement, they are very similar, as are all Abrahamic Faiths, the story of Jesus is almost identical except he is a prophet of god and there are countless other similarities, I fail to see anything wrong about his statement. Regardless of how many differences the importance of Goblins point is that the similarities exist. Given BigFatWorm stated "what are the other parallels apart from the fact that both religions follow a messiah?" which coming from a person who already claimed he was ignorant on the Islamic religion was a ridiculous statement to make, within that single statement he already limits the parallels to being as a abstract as following a "messiah" nothing more.

[QUOTE=Drax-Quin;35784960]No that is not true yawmwen, the idea that Jesus did not die on the cross in Islam is a debated and controversial topic. If you ask a Muslim they're more likely to claim jesus was sent to heaven, others will claim he was killed on a pole not a cross, others will claim he did go to heaven but was replaced by a doppelganger. It's silly and illogical leading many Muslims to purposely mistranslates verses into English so they mesh with their own interpretation, [I]"That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not: Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise" —[/I][B]Qur'an, 4 (An-Nisa) ayat 157-158[/B] The above verse appears to show he didn't die, which affirms the doppleganger theory. Though many still debate it strongly: [I]"The Qur'an is not here speaking about a man, righteous and wronged though he may be, but about the Word of God who was sent to earth and returned to God. Thus the denial of killing of Jesus is a denial of the power of men to vanquish and destroy the divine Word, which is for ever victorious"[/I] The majority of Muslims translate verb "mutawafik" (متوفيك) "to terminate after a period of time" while others translate it "to die of natural causes". Islamic scholars like Javed Ahmad Ghamidi consider it as physical death of Jesus, and hence question the return of Jesus. Different interpretations of the Qur’anic verse 19, chapter 33 and writes in his conclusion that "the cumulative effect of the Qur’anic verse is strongly in favor of a real death. Which is why like I said on the earlier page it was funny how BigFatWorm claimed his Bible was taken out of context, when every single Muslims claims the same when you give the a verse from their book, it's seems like It's almost impossible to even tell someone what a single sentence is in their own religious book. I should know being previously a Muslim. Goblin was entirely right in his statement, they are very similar, as are all Abrahamic Faiths, the story of Jesus is almost identical except he is a prophet of god and there are countless other similarities, I fail to see anything wrong about his statement. Regardless of how many differences the importance of Goblins point is that the similarities exist. Given BigFatWorm stated "what are the other parallels apart from the fact that both religions follow a messiah?" which coming from a person who already claimed he was ignorant on the Islamic religion was a ridiculous statement to make, within that single statement he already limits the parallels to being as a abstract as following a "messiah" nothing more.[/QUOTE] That was the only parallel he mentioned at the time I asked.

His presentation caused a shitstorm, this video caused one too!