Anita Sarkeesian bullshitting about how it feels to be a gamergate target - General

[QUOTE=dark soul;46962606]Lol very nice, so theirs so many you needed to google it and click on the 1st search link rather then be able to list some off on top of your head?[/QUOTE] That invalidates my point how..? Do I have to say them myself in order for it to be valid? [editline]a[/editline] Alright, this time I won't use a list since that's sooo bad. Prototype 2's main character Resident evil 5 Left for dead 2 More?

[QUOTE=Wootman;46962470]I like to post my friend.[/QUOTE] Just not to add anything to the discussion of any value

epic zinger [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Shitposting, Last chance" - Craptasket))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;46962480]Before she began criticizing it, she admitted in one of her first college seminars that she had never played a video game other then Super Mario Bros. It's not necessarily she hasn't worked in video-games - more like, she's never really been playing them at all in the first place... Since then, she has only electively chosen to play games (As evidenced by her video's) which fans suggest or gift to her, which they believe to be sexist. She has never put any game into positive light - if you actually read or listen to her criticisms, you would know that under her rules, no game could possibly have any gender involved lest it be sexist. Even when she showed people her "own" perfect game - it contradicted her own statements.[/quote] wasn't that seminar like, 2-3 years before she got into games journalism? i'd say that's plenty of time to get into videogames. she also mostly criticizes the social aspect that the games put forth, not necessarily their gameplay. again, i'm not saying she's good at it, i dislike her videos too, but i think people focus on the wrong things when criticizing her

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46962723]wasn't that seminar like, 2-3 years before she got into games journalism? i'd say that's plenty of time to get into videogames. she also mostly criticizes the social aspect that the games put forth, not necessarily their gameplay. again, i'm not saying she's good at it, i dislike her videos too, but i think people focus on the wrong things when criticizing her[/QUOTE] It was 1 week before her kickstarter, your right it's not about gameplay - it's about how she looks at it, but if your purposely looking for all the sexist or violent things in a video game and saying "We have to change that!" Your not playing the videogame, your mistaking a virtual world for the real one, implying one has an effect on the other. This is gonna be my last reply, I'd like to go into it but haven't finished researching her stuff heavily enough. [editline]a[/editline] P.S I don't think it's sexism - I think it's because girls are turned off at a young age from videogames, not because the males are sexist pigs who don't want no females.

[QUOTE=dark soul;46962533]Expect people have debunked her points and nothing has changed, she still gets a crap load of money to do interviews. So how about we start treat her like the joke she is and ignore her ,maybe then people will stop giving her credible. Tbh the whole video game feminism movement is a joke and if you've actually worked in the industry you would know there are a lot of females that work in the industry. There are FAR less black people in the industry and they are far less represented in video games yet you don't see them complaining about it because they have real inequality to worry about, not this joke bs. How many black main characters do you know that aren't from the hood or act like from the ghetto and represent an average black person?[/QUOTE] "there are a lot of females in the industry" means sexism can't possibly exist? what's the male to female ratio in the gaming industry, exactly? and yeah, there's a racism problem with videogames, but that doesn't mean there's not a problem with sexism too. what world do you live in where you absolutely have to choose "who has it worse" and not focus on multiple issues instead?

All those posts about fucking are what I'd expect in reddit or the rust section lmao.

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46962759]"there are a lot of females in the industry" means sexism can't possibly exist? what's the male to female ratio in the gaming industry, exactly? and yeah, there's a racism problem with videogames, but that doesn't mean there's not a problem with sexism too. what world do you live in where you absolutely have to choose "who has it worse" and not focus on multiple issues instead?[/QUOTE] The problems of the industry still do not justify sensationalist falsifications and labelling those who criticise the critics as immediately sexist or opposed to equality.

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46962759]"there are a lot of females in the industry" means sexism can't possibly exist? what's the male to female ratio in the gaming industry, exactly? and yeah, there's a racism problem with videogames, but that doesn't mean there's not a problem with sexism too. what world do you live in where you absolutely have to choose "who has it worse" and not focus on multiple issues instead?[/QUOTE] Unbalanced male-to-female ratio =/= sexism in the industry. That's jumping to conclusions.

[QUOTE=_Axel;46962824]Unbalanced male-to-female ratio =/= sexism in the industry. That's jumping to conclusions.[/QUOTE] well it's not like neanderthal women were genetically predisposed against developing video games, there has to be some kind of social bias going on down the line somewhere

Social bias is not sexism nor is it confined to, or in any way related to videogames Social bias implies a choice, conscious or otherwise, to conform to what's perceived normal. Sexism is different treatment from others depending on your gender.

[QUOTE=GÃ©za!;46962801]The problems of the industry still do not justify sensationalist falsifications and labelling those who criticise the critics as immediately sexist or opposed to equality.[/QUOTE] when did i ever say they did?

[QUOTE=Cone;46962905]well it's not like neanderthal women were genetically predisposed against developing video games, there has to be some kind of social bias going on down the line somewhere[/QUOTE] Chicks aren't as encouraged to pursue tech jobs as dudes, game design is a tech job, it's somewhere around the school age part of the line

[QUOTE=Cone;46962905]well it's not like neanderthal women were genetically predisposed against developing video games, there has to be some kind of social bias going on down the line somewhere[/QUOTE] Video Games have been stigmatized as a stupid thing for nerdy male basement dwellers for several decades, with parts of the video game industry [I]still[/I] being stigmatized as such. This isn't about the video game industry as a whole being against women as much as it is society constantly labeling video games as a boy's thing. People who are working in the industry as developers, designers and such and who aren't massive scumbags aren't purposefully working against the inclusion of women in their industry, as long as they're competent, same for every other coworker.

[QUOTE=Cone;46962905]well it's not like neanderthal women were genetically predisposed against developing video games, there has to be some kind of social bias going on down the line somewhere[/QUOTE] That doesn't imply sexism. It's not like the gaming industry actively favor male applications over female ones. There's no injustice taking place, females who want to pursue a career in the videogame industry have just as much of a chance to fare well as males.

[QUOTE=Cone;46962905]well it's not like neanderthal women were genetically predisposed against developing video games, there has to be some kind of social bias going on down the line somewhere[/QUOTE] When the average woman thinks of games, they play phone and social games. Barely even 8 years ago, when the average woman thought of games they probably thought of pasty white losers because society has painted us that way for 35 or so years. Society, which unless I'm wrong, also has a strong female input, especially today. Why is gaming still considered a boys club? Because outside media determines that.

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;46963015]Video Games have been stigmatized as a stupid thing for nerdy male basement dwellers for several decades, with parts of the video game industry [I]still[/I] being stigmatized as such. This isn't about the video game industry as a whole being against women as much as it is society constantly labeling video games as a boy's thing. People who are working in the industry as developers, designers and such and who aren't massive scumbags aren't purposefully working against the inclusion of women in their industry, as long as they're competent, same for every other coworker.[/QUOTE] If anything, the developers want MORE women in developer positions. Sausage fests get old fast. It's same as engineering courses, it's not that the male students are sexist pigs, it's the opposite, they want more women in these classes.

[QUOTE=Sitkero;46962965]Chicks aren't as encouraged to pursue tech jobs as dudes, game design is a tech job, it's somewhere around the school age part of the line[/QUOTE] I was never encouraged to pursue the tech industry. Where the hell is all this encouragement for just [b]boys[/b] to join the tech industry? [editline]18th January 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=itisjuly;46963115]If anything, the developers want MORE women in developer positions. Sausage fests get old fast. It's same as engineering courses, it's not that the male students are sexist pigs, it's the opposite, they want more women in these classes.[/QUOTE] There are like two girls in my Game Development courses. They are fat.

[QUOTE=Ryo Ohki;46962936]Social bias is not sexism nor is it confined to, or in any way related to videogames Social bias implies a choice, conscious or otherwise, to conform to what's perceived normal. Sexism is different treatment from others depending on your gender.[/QUOTE] That's ridiculous. Social bias can totally become sexism when the norm is to treat other genders in an inferior way. I get saying that social bias doesn't necessarily lead to sexism, but to say it NEVER does is flat out wrong. If you're just saying that the words don't mean the same thing then in this case you're just pointlessly arguing semantics

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46963203]That's ridiculous. Social bias can totally become sexism when the norm is to treat other genders in an inferior way. I get saying that social bias doesn't necessarily lead to sexism, but to say it NEVER does is flat out wrong. If you're just saying that the words don't mean the same thing then in this case you're just pointlessly arguing semantics[/QUOTE] The point is that unbalanced gender ratios aren't indicative of sexism in the areas that fall victim to it. As itisjuly puts it, it's quite the contrary, males that are part of such spaces would gladly welcome an increase in the amount of female colleagues. The problem is that this imbalance stems not from discriminatory application treatment, but from a comparatively lower amount of female applicants in this field. If anybody's dealt a losing hand here, it's the males.

[QUOTE=Wootman;46962711]epic zinger [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Shitposting, Last chance" - Craptasket))[/highlight][/QUOTE] Shit man, most of the people who shit post on social issues are falling fast. Brings a tear to my eye.

[QUOTE=_Axel;46963226]males that are part of such spaces would gladly welcome an increase in the amount of female colleagues.[/quote] [quote]If anybody's dealt a losing hand here, it's the males.[/QUOTE] You condemned me a minute ago for jumping to conclusions, but you're making some pretty big assumptions there

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46963082]When the average woman thinks of games, they play phone and social games. Barely even 8 years ago, when the average woman thought of games they probably thought of pasty white losers because society has painted us that way for 35 or so years. Society, which unless I'm wrong, also has a strong female input, especially today. Why is gaming still considered a boys club? Because outside media determines that.[/QUOTE] yes outside media is very important to the issue, but i think less directly than you expect. cos it seems to me that when everyone since the 90's has thought of games as an exclusively all-boys club, it sounds very plausible for people in the industry to start thinking the same thing? or at least find it really bizarre when people try to discourage sexism with anything stronger than just vague and unsubstantiated statements against it. outside media is as far from a closed system as you can get

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46963281]You condemned me a minute ago for jumping to conclusions, but you're making some pretty big assumptions there[/QUOTE] Is it a big assumption to say that being in a female-scarce space fucking sucks for males? Do you know people in engineering fields?

Look, it's a pretty big jump to go from "guys in male-dominated fields would like to see more chicks around" to "tech jobs mostly controlled by men are welcoming to women". Why? Because it encompasses more than that-- of course a male engineering student would love to be somewhere that's not a sausagefest, but is an employer going to have an open mind when it comes to hiring female workers when he's always been in a "boys club" type of job? Are women gonna have the same opportunities when it comes to their talent being reconized, when most of the successful workers in the market are male? Saying the industry is welcoming to women just because the guys you know in that industry or similar ones would like to be in a classroom or an office with more girls is a HUGE assumption

The other thing is that women have been pushed into trying out STEM field courses and at the end of the day they don't want to be there because it simply doesn't interest them. Christina Sommers talked a bit about this on CSPAN I think.

the biggest problem as to why there aren't as many women in tech jobs aren't because businesses aren't hiring women because they are women, it is that from birth, if you are a girl you're discouraged from the tech field. if a boy says they're interested in computers, they're far less likely to be told "that's weird" than a girl. because of this, it is far more difficult to find a woman with the same amount of skill and experience as a man, they're just not as plentiful. this isn't something that can be fixed in a generation, or even two. it is a long-term problem that has to be fixed by the root, not by the leaves.

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46963420]Look, it's a pretty big jump to go from "guys in male-dominated fields would like to see more chicks around" to "tech jobs mostly controlled by men are welcoming to women". Why? Because it encompasses more than that-- of course a male engineering student would love to be somewhere that's not a sausagefest, but is an employer going to have an open mind when it comes to hiring female workers when he's always been in a "boys club" type of job? Are women gonna have the same opportunities when it comes to their talent being reconized, when most of the successful workers in the market are male? Saying the industry is welcoming to women just because the guys you know in that industry or similar ones would like to be in a classroom or an office with more girls is a HUGE assumption[/QUOTE] I think the assumption here is that they do discriminate against women who apply for the job. Is there anything that corroborates that statement? So far the only thing you provided is the gender ratio.

[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;46962211]Stop quoting that dude's weird sex fantasy with your own. It's fucking weird.[/QUOTE] I have no idea what's going on with this whole "sex fantasy" stuff. I simply commented saying I think she's attractive. On one side, it's misogyny, and on the other side it's apparently a creeper move. The point I was trying to make is that it's the only thing going for her. It's ironic. She wants people to be known for more than their appearances but she's pretty empty and uninteresting on top of being manipulative.

[QUOTE=_Axel;46963490]I think the assumption here is that they do discriminate against women who apply for the job. Is there anything that corroborates that statement?[/QUOTE] Sure! [url=http://www.nature.com/news/elite-labs-hire-more-men-than-women-1.15483]Elite labs hire more men than women[/url] [url=http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-08-28/women-graduating-from-business-school-get-fewer-job-offers-than-men]Women graduating from business school get fewer job offers than men[/url] [url=http://www.pnas.org/content/111/12/4403.abstract]Study on how managers are twice as likely to hire a man over a woman in science fields[/url] [url=http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2014/03/12/3396151/women-bias-math-stem/]Women are less likely to get hired in math jobs even when they perform as well as men[/url] Also: [url=http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/women.aspx]Women who succeed in male-dominated careers are often seen negatively, suggests study[/url] [url=http://fortune.com/2014/08/14/when-competing-in-a-male-dominated-field-women-should-man-up/]When competing in male-dominated fields, women do better when playing up skills associated with men[/url] Now, I'd love to see a study that proves your point instead!