[QUOTE=Jordax;46622988]
Also, I can see why Schaffer and McIntosh/Anita are such buddy-buddy as of late. Both can't keep themselves to a deadline and both don't deliver on a project they got multiple times their asking rate for.[/QUOTE]
Glad to see I'm not the only one making this connection. Adam Sessler is an idiot that labeled his few remaining fans misogynists. He also got butthurt that #gamergate started telling publishers not to use his consulting firm because he was anti-consumer. Also that stupid songwriter in the video...
[video=youtube;bnbNY1oFZ3o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnbNY1oFZ3o[/video]
[video=youtube;-K4s7cV4Us4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K4s7cV4Us4[/video]
[QUOTE=Korova;46622987]Constantly harassed? Go onto any Counter Strike/Call of Duty match and use your microphone. You will be harassed regardless of whether you have a penis or not. I don't feel comfortable playing with public groups either and I'm a straight white male.
Find a decent group that won't pull this kind of shit. Problem solved.[/QUOTE]
Go use a voice changer then and see what the difference is in the harassment you receive. Both in frequency and type. I think you will learn something.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46622963]Why would you apply for a field that you feel that you'll be constantly harassed in?
[/QUOTE]
Never saw this in college when I went into classes, if anything women were more admired by most men than harassed.
Sure there are basement welder stereotypes, but they are just few and far between; regardless all job fields have assholes who will dislike you for any number of reasons. If you can't get over the fact their are jerks in the world and how to ignore, you are going to never get anywhere far in life.
I watched the whole thing
That privilege shit has to stop.
Also the video is about sexism, but then they mention the benefits are for a straight white male?
So gamers are sexist, racist and homophobes now?
[QUOTE=Korova;46622987]Constantly harassed? Go onto any Counter Strike/Call of Duty match and use your microphone. You will be harassed regardless of whether you have a penis or not. I don't feel comfortable playing with public groups either and I'm a straight white male.
Find a decent group that won't pull this kind of shit. Problem solved.[/QUOTE]
ive been pubbing for years and haven't had it happen once and i talk like a motherfucker
that obvious teleprompter usage though
[QUOTE=Jordax;46622988]I can safely say that I never have seen a female getting harassed in a game over her gender.[/QUOTE]
cool, I guess this video and the whole feminist movement within gaming must be pointless then.
[QUOTE=JohnFisher89;46623042]Never saw this in college when I went into classes, if anything women were more admired by most men than harassed.
Sure there are basement welder stereotypes, but they are just few and far between; regardless all job fields have assholes who will dislike you for any number of reasons. If you can't get over the fact their are jerks in the world and how to ignore, you are going to never get anywhere far in life.[/QUOTE]
Why is it the responsibility of women to "ignore" sexist jerks instead of the rest of society telling those jerks they should fuck off and reform their views? This stupid defeatist attitude is why this problem exists in the first place.
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;46623041]Go use a voice changer then and see what the difference is in the harassment you receive. Both in frequency and type. I think you will learn something.[/QUOTE]
Of course a woman's voice is going to stand out and is going to receive harassment. It's not right but no amount of shaming of straight white men is going to change that. No amount of social justice will change that. No law will change that. No moderation will change that. It sucks but it's just the way it is.
[editline]2nd December 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;46623078]Why is it the responsibility of women to "ignore" sexist jerks instead of the rest of society telling those jerks they should fuck off and reform their views? This stupid defeatist attitude is why this problem exists in the first place.[/QUOTE]
Anyone that attacks women based on their gender is already told to fuck off by rational and decent people.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46622963]Why would you apply for a field that you feel that you'll be constantly harassed in?
People need to stop just passing the buck on to women and try to figure out what they can do to actually bring them into the field. What sort of message are we sending when any sort of feminist critique comes out and you've got all these chuckleheads coming out of the woodwork to say WOW HOW FUCKING STUPID IS THIS SHIT RIGHT GUYS????
do you think that sort of atmosphere is in any way shape or form conducive to bringing in a group of people?[/QUOTE]
Do you really think saying how shit women have it all the time in talks and on twitter and videos is helping or swaying any women to get in the game industry? Because thats all femfreq is and does. Travel around, teleseminars, youtube vids, and tweets on how women have it bad all the time. Seriously femfreq is SO goddamn negative all the time that if I was a women I wouldnt even want to join.
Thing is, industry isnt as bad as they make it, Anita hasnt ever worked in the industry for fucksakes, and who the fuck is she getting credible information from on how the industry is so shit and anti-women?
Can you name me 3, decently known indie/AAA that refused to hire women because of women, or had major issues with women? We have had amazing women and successful women in the game industry since the fucking dawn of it.
You also need to stop acting like "Feminist" is untouchable if it has that label applied to it.
Want to know why people critique this shit? Because its fucking empty garbage dude, its getting you all wrilled up with emotions with anecdotes, and information that seems fair, yet has 0 substance and only a preconceived notion you painted in your head on just how bad this shit is.
Not because its "feminist", Anita or John are not fucking Feminists when they think Sexism against Men doesnt exist BECAUSE FEMINISM IS FOR EQUALITY AND THAT IS THE TEXT BOOK EXAMPLE OF SEXISM AND NOT FOR EQUALITY.
You are actually a bigger problem to women if you treat them as untouchable goddesses, especially if they hide behind something like feminism.
Non shithead women really really hate that shit, its the shit actual feminists fought for, to not be these pampered, delicate house wives and be seen as weak and needing more "special" care. Not to be treated as some alien or specialty, just to be seen as a fucking individual as a human being.
Anita and FemFreq are shit dude, by how personal you seem to get from this you clearly care about this which is noble, but try and find someone better than Anita and this garbage if you really care, these people will just hold you back.
It certainly grabs attention though.
I want more women in gaming and game development but I don't think this is the way to do it. We keep hearing how "gamers hate women" all the fucking time these days and we're at the point where people actually believe it. That shit isn't going to attract women. It's only going to push them away.
I just wish femfreq or anyone at all would actually DO something instead of just pointing fingers. Organize a huge game jam to promote inclusivity or something. Show people the positive side of gaming instead of giving attention to the negative.
[QUOTE=Korova;46623090]Of course a woman's voice is going to stand out and is going to receive harassment. It's not right but no amount of shaming of straight white men is going to change that. No amount of social justice will change that. No law will change that. No moderation will change that. It sucks but it's just the way it is.[/QUOTE]
Ok go take your apathetic defeatism elsewhere? Some people are actually interested in discussing solutions to this problem you know?
some of these dudes look straight out of a tim and eric video
[QUOTE=Korova;46623090]Of course a woman's voice is going to stand out and is going to receive harassment. It's not right but no amount of shaming of straight white men is going to change that. No amount of social justice will change that. No law will change that. No moderation will change that. It sucks but it's just the way it is.[/QUOTE]
this isn't some immutable law of the universe.
Fucking #24.
"HEY LOOK AT ME I LIKE TO DEFLECT CRITICISM AND CREATE A BITCHFEST."
Holy shit all most of these answers are pants on head retarded.
[QUOTE=qwea00;46623112]I want more women in gaming and game development but I don't think this is the way to do it. We keep hearing how "gamers hate women" all the fucking time these days and we're at the point where people actually believe it. That shit isn't going to attract women. It's only going to push them away.
I just wish femfreq or anyone at all would actually DO something instead of just pointing fingers. Organize a huge game jam to promote inclusivity or something. Show people the positive side of gaming instead of giving attention to the negative.[/QUOTE]
i don't care about what the persons gender is, i just want better people in gaming
can someone be nice enough to write down all 25 reasons so we don't give them views?
the best way to make this crap go away is to ignore it
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46622963]Why would you apply for a field that you feel that you'll be constantly harassed in?
People need to stop just passing the buck on to women and try to figure out what they can do to actually bring them into the field. What sort of message are we sending when any sort of feminist critique comes out and you've got all these chuckleheads coming out of the woodwork to say WOW HOW FUCKING STUPID IS THIS SHIT RIGHT GUYS????
do you think that sort of atmosphere is in any way shape or form conducive to bringing in a group of people?[/QUOTE]
[URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkGRw1zYAvQ&list=UUkop4F44-FV6N92-PNAYzxA#t=497"]It's not that bad.[/URL] Harassment within the workplace is dealt with adequately, as in any other professional zone. As for fans directly harassing a female developer, the only example I can think of is Jennifer Hepler; however she made herself a target by [B]literally[/B] saying she doesn't like video games, and wants the combat to be entirely skippable.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46623023]i'd be interested to hear some examples of this to be honest, and i mean this genuinely not in some "i don't think you can do it" sort of way
because as someone who's been gaming for my entire life - and online for about half of it - i've almost never come across a group of people harassing a male gamer because of the fact that they're male. i've seen male gamers harass male gamers regarding their sexuality, and i've seen transitioning people harassed for it too. ive seen enough female gamers get stalked and harassed with barrages of comments and attention regarding their sex that it's quite clear to me as an individual that there's a pretty serious problem that needs to be addressed within various online gaming communities.[/QUOTE]
I've come across both men and women in games who has bombarded others including me with dehumanizing comments and over the mic in the vast amount of multiplayer games i've played.
I've also had a woman who "stalked" me in counter-strike when she figured out which servers i played on because i killed her too often.
She eventually was banned from a few of those servers because of the sick comments and threats she made.
Sure i was offended by that and made some comebacks at her before she got banned, but i didn't go out of my way to stalk someone and harass them just because i died too often in competitive games.
But that incident happened a few years ago.
Doesn't matter what games you play on because when those kind of people feel like being obnoxious to others, they will.
These sweeping generalizations that would immediately be called upon as anti-woman or hate filled if aimed at the opposite gender are fucking disgraceful. I'm not going to point out all of the flaws in this (literally every single point made) as people are going to do that already, and these same points have been argued in the past. But whatever people say will be completely fucking ignored and the same shit will be spouted by these people at every opportunity.
I've been cat called, physically harassed, called out for being a guy and playing games (but it doesn't matter because you're a guy! People calling you an acne covered virgin faggot nerd because you play games isn't the same! People using homophobic insults doesn't matter because you're a guy!) and while I don't like making a deal out of it, I've been sexually assaulted in day to day life away from gaming (physically, mind you-none of this verbal sexual assault shit) as well as in two games and comic/anime related conventions in the last three years. I've also been stalked by creepy guys over the internet.
Why the fuck can't these shitheads try and just universally solve these problems? Why does it HAVE to only be women or only be men? I really want to shit on every single point made, but again, people have done it and will do it but they'll continue to be ignored by prancing fucknuts.
There's one nice little gem that speaks for the intelligence of the people behind shit like this, though.
"I will never ask or be expected to speak for all other gamers who share my gender" he says while generalizing an entire gender some absurdly bias and frankly fucked up "privilege" shite. There's just so much wrong about this. They even go as far as to say that males don't "generally" have to put up with people discussing how attractive they are or their relationship status.
Have any of these numbnuts played video games in the last ten years? Every time there is anything remotely resembling a conflict in games with VOIP some of the first things that get aimed at me and I aim at others is their completely made up appearance, relationship status and how many dicks they can fit in any of their numerous holes.
Good lord.
[QUOTE=HoodedSniper;46622968]Holy shit this is the worst video femfrequency has ever put out. I dont even know where to begin, I saw this shit earlier and my sides still havent come back down.
A fucking video of like 90% white men telling me how good I got it as a man and I should feel sorry. And SO many fucking wrong points, that shit about gamestop? the fucking personal information shit? Are you fucking kidding me?[/quote]
they're not telling you to feel sorry about being a dude. that's not what the concept of privilege is about. some people take it too far and think your opinion is worth less because of it, but hey, there's plenty of folk out there that think less of people just for being feminists. all that these people are trying to do is show in what ways your sex and gender can make certain issues invisible, and means that you've not been exposed to them.
[quote]Theres really nothing more for me to say, this is just a shit video and anyone who honestly thinks this video is right in really anyway is completely fucking stupid, this mindset this video portrays is so fucking fargone, wrong, and nothing but anecdotal, or made up, their is nothing more to it than some people in a video you trying to act like something is true.[/quote]
use your words, in what way is it wrong? without just calling it stupid?
[quote]These people alienate women FAR more than anyone else does, these videos portray them as like another fucking species to us that are just delicate little flowers and men got it the best and that women have no chance right now because of all these "Problems" they cherry pick at and make them sound like a massive problem(im not saying the treatment of women in gaming is perfect, but its not even close to what these exaggerating fucks act like it is, and thats a huge issue when trying to fix something like this)[/quote]
i disagree. i don't think these people alienate women more or less than any other group. i think, actually, that the fact that they're actively trying to campaign for them in a simple, non-destructive manner is a great way to try to connect with women in regards to these issues. what they're saying here isn't really anything combative at all. i mean you yourself right here acknowledge that there's a problem with the way that women are treated online and in gaming media. you're (i'm assuming here) not a woman, so how would you know whether or not they're exaggerating? these aren't really things that we have to worry about as dudes.
[quote]Like are they fucking serious a women cant go to gamestop without bullshit? How can you straight up fucking say shit like this as a fact?[/quote]
i think you're misunderstanding what they're saying here. they're not making the assertion this will happen to every woman that walks into a game store. they're saying that it's substantially more likely to happen to them (which let's be real it totally is)
[quote]Man John Mcintosh and Anita are just insane and im so glad femfreq has been digging its grave lately. This video, the Fuck toy Bayonetta shit Anita pulled and is pulling, and this fucking golden goose egg.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/R0N4Nll.png[/IMG]
They are getting too crazy even for the crazies that listen to them.[/QUOTE]
academically this isn't really all that absurd of a notion, it just requires that you have an understanding that there's a fundamental difference between the academic and the common meaning of racism/sexism/whatever
racism and sexism are fully defined academic concepts that do include components that relate to power in society. however that sort of stuff is generally best kept within academic circles because unless you read all of the background material for why power plays such an important role, you just sound fuckin crazy for saying shit like this. esp when you present it as fact instead of opinion
26) you can call a somone a nigger
This is probably the only good video FemFreq has put out, even if some of the people involved in the video are hypocrites at best.
Gender and skin color has nothing, I repeat, NOTHING to do with how you are perceived/treated by any person with normal sensibilities and aren't bat shit crazy. Anyone who does discriminate you for your color/gender were likely raised in a manner or developed some kind of complex that led to them having that perception of other people. It is absolutely NO reason to blame any group of people for it especially not as specifically as "Straight White Males". For example, I'm poor as shit not being able live comfortably in my home without constant fear of losing it, yet I'm straight and white? What insanity is this? I still treat everyone equally despite my admittedly shit circumstances so clearly my color/orientation doesn't automatically give me a ticket to wealth, fame, and a fancy ticket to a magical white law school where I'm trained to oppress LGBT's and women.
The lowest common denominator of people absolutely does NOT speak for the majority and if you think it does you need to get your head out of your ass. These kinds of videos spreading negativity towards ANY group of people regardless of color or gender are absolute poison and shouldn't be taken seriously by any degree.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46623023]i'd be interested to hear some examples of this to be honest, and i mean this genuinely not in some "i don't think you can do it" sort of way
because as someone who's been gaming for my entire life - and online for about half of it - i've almost never come across a group of people harassing a male gamer because of the fact that they're male. i've seen male gamers harass male gamers regarding their sexuality, and i've seen transitioning people harassed for it too. ive seen enough female gamers get stalked and harassed with barrages of comments and attention regarding their sex that it's quite clear to me as an individual that there's a pretty serious problem that needs to be addressed within various online gaming communities.[/QUOTE]
Go into any competitive online game with voice chat, and if a woman opens her mouth I bet that at least 5/10 times someone will drop some bullshit comment about how she's a woman.
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;46623116]Ok go take your apathetic defeatism elsewhere? Some people are actually interested in discussing solutions to this problem you know?[/QUOTE]
What is the solution? There isn't one and if there is, telling ALL white male gamers that they need to treat women better isn't going to do anyone on either side any favors. Assholes will be assholes anonymously online. Even if you take away their anonymity, they'll probably still continue. There are plenty of men who aren't harassing women.
Treat the harassers for what they are, a minority because i'm sick of this overblown idea that I should be ashamed of myself because I'm white, I'm male and I play video games. This is nothing but SJW original sin.
[editline]2nd December 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Derpmeifter;46623125]this isn't some immutable law of the universe.[/QUOTE]
When you can come up with a solution that won't result in even more vitriol between both sides of the argument, I'll be here.
I don't think it's about being ashamed of yourself as much as it is being aware that life is different for you, as a white male. I don't think that's too much to ask.
[QUOTE=EskillV2;46623160]I've come across both men and women in games who has bombarded others including me with dehumanizing comments and over the mic in the vast amount of multiplayer games i've played.
I've also had a woman who "stalked" me in counter-strike when she figured out which servers i played on because i killed her too often.
She eventually was banned from a few of those servers because of the sick comments and threats she made.
Sure i was offended by that and made some comebacks at her before she got banned, but i didn't go out of my way to stalk someone and harass them just because i died too often in competitive games.
But that incident happened a few years ago.
Doesn't matter what games you play on because when those kind of people feel like being obnoxious to others, they will.[/QUOTE]
see the thing is here - and you've just said it - is that she stalked you because you killed her too often. i'm in no way minimizing stalking because i've been stalked in real life by one woman and one man - both were fucking awful. but this lady apparently followed you around because you killed her, not because you were a dude. that is fundamentally different from what they're talking about.
it doesn't make it any worse or better - just different.
that's really the critical element to a lot of these things - they comment on it a couple of times throughout the video, it's the specific intent behind what's being said and done to gamers at different levels. ive never been harassed online, but if i would be, it would unlikely be due to my sex. how many times have i gone into a CSS server and heard a female sounding voice pop up and suddenly everyone's on the voice chat going OH HEY HEYYYY and chat becomes uncomfortably focused on one individual? too many times.
and what if that voice was a dude? well they'd dump on the kid for having a girly voice, which is another thing that feminists are critical of. the producers of this video made a folly in not touching upon those subjects.
i think the biggest issue with a lot of these videos is that they only appear to tackle feminism as a one sided issue. instead of focusing on the use of the word fag and bitch and wimp and wuss and all this other shit that's designed specifically to target manhood, they focus only on womens issues. thats not what feminism is about. and for people like me who have a holistic understanding of feminism, its not a problem because i already know all that shit and i know the benefits feminism offers men. but they don't make it clear enough in these vids
[QUOTE=Korova;46623268]When you can come up with a solution that won't result in even more vitriol between both sides of the argument, I'll be here.[/QUOTE]
The funny thing is that in order to come up with the solution, dialogue must be heard. I mean, think about it.
"We need a solution to this problem, let's talk about this."
"There isn't currently a solution to this problem, I won't talk to you."
But.. solutions won't come unless we talk and think about it. Imagine if instead of trying to get to the moon people said "Well... We don't know how to get to the moon, so why should we even try?"
[QUOTE=Bathtub;46623143]i don't care about what the persons gender is, i just want better people in gaming[/QUOTE]
Very true. I expressed myself poorly.
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