Street Fighter professional gets upset when he loses to a beginner's unpredictability
46 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Chief Martini;45010146]This counts for a lot of games. New players who haven't really gotten the game mechanics under control tend to be really differing in their techniques than average/pro players, kinda catches you off-guard.[/QUOTE]
Yes I can attest to this.
There's the randomness factor of not abiding to optimal strategies. So they're less predictable, however on the flip side this means you can get away with a lot more things due to their ignorance of the game so it works both ways.
As the commentators said, he should of just waited for the Ryu player to fuck himself over and then punish his mistakes.
[editline]6th June 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=AtomiCal;45011898]I have no idea about anything in street fighter, but a couple of year ago me and a couple of friends attended an anime convention where a bunch of "pros" were playing. So my friend taught me how to be really cheesy with zangief with his jump+headbutt, down swipe and spin.
I managed to beat this japanese guy out of the tournament who got really fucking mad at me because he had practiced a lot.
video related
[video=youtube;o-gImf_1YRY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-gImf_1YRY[/video][/QUOTE]
As someone who doesn't even play SF4 much, I only had to watch this video for 8 seconds to know you're full of shit. Namely the fact that he's going for tatsus rather than just anti airing you with c.HP which is a staple of playing her.
[QUOTE=ashxu;45014496]Yes I can attest to this.
There's the randomness factor of not abiding to optimal strategies. So they're less predictable, however on the flip side this means you can get away with a lot more things due to their ignorance of the game so it works both ways.
As the commentators said, he should of just waited for the Ryu player to fuck himself over and then punish his mistakes.
[editline]6th June 2014[/editline]
As someone who doesn't even play SF4 much, I only had to watch this video for 8 seconds to know you're full of shit. Namely the fact that he's going for tatsus rather than just anti airing you with c.HP which is a staple of playing her.[/QUOTE]
This video isnt of the match he was talking about, just showing the technique he used to clown his way through the game, if I understand correctly. Or perhaps just general Zangief clownyness.
Is that how beginners play Street Fighter?
welp, guess I'm a beginner then
Surely one of the objectives of being a pro should be to have all of the advantages of the beginner play unpredictability while not having any of its disadvantages? Because being unpredictable seems like a seriously crucial thing to master, especially in fighting games. It's sort of like differentiating between martial arts approaches, and figuring out which ones will teach you a very pretty and organized but useless dance and which ones will actually teach you how to fight in atleast a RELATIVELY realistic scenario, which works against other people than the other ones that were also trained in exactly the same discipline.
I just feel that one of the marks of a professional should be mastery over chaos.
[QUOTE=genkaz92;45016151]Surely one of the objectives of being a pro should be to have all of the advantages of the beginner play unpredictability while not having any of its disadvantages? Because being unpredictable seems like a seriously crucial thing to master, especially in fighting games. It's sort of like differentiating between martial arts approaches, and figuring out which ones will teach you a very pretty and organized but useless dance and which ones will actually teach you how to fight in atleast a RELATIVELY realistic scenario, which works against other people than the other ones that were also trained in exactly the same discipline.
I just feel that one of the marks of a professional should be mastery over chaos.[/QUOTE]
Of course, being predictable means your habits and go to moves are easy to figure out and people will say you're easy to expose or "download".
The guy in the OP's video gave too much respect for the other player and he could of easily won by baiting out his moves and punishing.
[QUOTE=ashxu;45016499]Of course, being predictable means your habits and go to moves are easy to figure out and people will say you're easy to expose or "download".
The guy in the OP's video gave too much respect for the other player and he could of easily won by baiting out his moves and punishing.[/QUOTE]
I guess some people could argue that being courteous and noob friendly is actually more insulting than openly wrecking the new player's shit.
[QUOTE=genkaz92;45016605]I guess some people could argue that being courteous and noob friendly is actually more insulting than openly wrecking the new player's shit.[/QUOTE]
"respecting" someone in fighting games is more assuming that they won't do cheap stuff like do an Uppercut when rising up all/most the time for example. Doing an Uppercut all the time and succeeding will slowly win the game sure but if they block it they can do a full combo that will do heavy damage.
[QUOTE=TestECull;45013233]I've seen the odd Starcraft 2 match go balls up because of that as well. Pros love to get stuck into a rhythm and it lets noobs like swoop in and succeed with some batshit bonkers strat like a battlecruiser rush or something stupid. It's a large part of why I don't like e-sports all that much, it's too predictable, and when I watch two pros go at it I can see all sorts of ways where out-of-the-meta strats would wreak untolds amount of havoc going completely unnoticed.[/QUOTE]
In starcraft you see people pull crazy metagame shit a lot more often in major tournaments. For ladder you always play safe.
There are a couple of reasons for this. When you know who you are up against, you can metagame their playstyle. "Standard" Play is all about taking the route that is "good enough" to get to any point. As long as you have no glaring weaknesses, it's perfect. More on that in a moment. In tournaments, not only do you have more information to make the bet odds better, but you may be in a position where you have to gamble or you know you will get eliminated (especially single elimination brackets).
Now, in terms of basic counterplay that you see. You have to keep in mind that a lot of build orders literally do not give the slightest fuck what your opponent does for 5-6 minutes (ingame time). They can handle everything from 6 pool and 2 rax to double expand before gas. Additionally, even when someone makes a play that can be exploited, properly doing so would have required the other player to have made a build order change beforehand. Then you add on the fact that a good player will know what you are doing and adapt accordingly, and you are left with very little reason not to play as standard as possible during ladder. Standard is about pitting your mechanical strength against someone else. When you play standard, you are saying that you believe you will make fewer little mistakes over time, and will thus incrementally build up an advantage. If you are actually the better player, it's about minimizing risk.
The people getting caught out by unorthodox shit typically play standard, but aren't good enough to handle weird shit. Generally weird shit is either outright inferior in some big way, or is stupidly easy to hardcore metagame against. Rock paper scissor tactics will get you thrown into a dumpster at higher levels where people can read you like a book.
Stuff like battlecruiser rush. It's garbage. A good player will see that you have less than nothing with their first poke, which could be as early as 4-5 minutes and as late as 10 depending on which choices up the standard tree they made. They will smoothly transition into a large aggressive push, maybe with +1, and you will loose. A mediocre player will not process this information in time and lose.
I'd assume this is similar for fighting games, though the applications of the ideas are slightly different.
Surprised this wasn't another DSP thread.
It's like getting killed by random pipes from an F2P Demoman in TF2.
lol the guy who got mad looks like such a scrub
Street Fighter 3rd Strike (Online edition) is by far my favorite SF game. So many amazing moments in those matches.
Commentary guys should have been professional and given the guy some respect for winning, instead of going on about how its hard to play against noobs. Perhaps being unpredictable is superior to raw skill?
What headset are those people commentating using in the first video.
fsp was too worried about not losing lol look at his salty expressions
he didn't even try and connect anti-airs and was option selecting tech throws. i'm sure there's more but those are 2 things that i noticed right off the bat. if fsp had just focused i'm sure he would've won.
fgc.gif
gandhi was just following the ken flowchart
[img]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_v4BnOvWsCM0/S8sNOIlt4OI/AAAAAAAAA1c/eYxQj2KzK-4/s1600/Ken+Flowchart.jpg[/img]
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