Criticism and Censorship of Hotline Miami 2 - General

Why is it bad to try and guarantee that someone sees a warning like that, though? Is a 3-second boost in your video game launch speed really worth potentially inducing a PTSD attack on someone?

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858399]and if you got the game without a box? all i am suggesting is a small warning lol[/QUOTE] Games with boxes aren't the only ones with ratings, nor is it hard to find them online.

[QUOTE=NuggetWarmer;41858395]Okay, we get it. Having the warning is "thoughtful" in your opinion, which is all you keep repeating instead of any logical arguments. Violent video games will always be violent, but they won't always be the same violence. Rape is a form of violence so at some point it may end up in a violent video game. Just like coffee can be anywhere from really hot to ice cold, a video game can be anywhere from really violent to tame. Hotline Miami is a game known for it's ultra violence. I don't see how including rape changes that. It's just more forms of violence packed into a game already regarded as extremely violent. Is your argument that, because rape is rarely depicted in video games, it should have a warning letting users know that it does? Because it already has that warning, so that argument is invalid. Is your argument that it would be a nice thing for the developers to do? Because that's completely based on opinion, so there's really no point in continuing your argument unless you want to prove exactly why it's necessary without restating yourself over and over again. Obviously that isn't working. Is your argument that PTSD only can severely affect rape victims? Because it is true that nearly anything can cause PTSD, and you seem to have acknowledged that, in which case the argument of putting a specific warning for rape victims becomes irrelevant, as you can't cater to every single type of sufferer of PTSD. I'm not really sure what you're trying to do other than pick out bits and pieces of other's posts in order to find a reason to aggravate them into dragging this stupid argument(over what exactly I'm not too sure) even longer.[/QUOTE] i dont think rape can be just shuffled under "violence". there is far more to it than that. also the "anything can cause ptsd" thing again. I've addressed this three times now, maybe more. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] and then an attack on me at the end. what a surprise.

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858399]and if you got the game without a box? all i am suggesting is a small warning lol[/QUOTE] ok if you bought a game third hand without a box you should be doing some fucking research anyhow, and most online distributors show ESRB ratings when you're on store pages, and i've even seen some that go out of their way to say "warning this shit's p. brutal so watch out"

[QUOTE=Mr Flexi;41858404]Games with boxes aren't the only ones with ratings, nor is it hard to find them online.[/QUOTE] okayyyy so why not include a warning at the beginning of the game if you are the one of 10000 games that depicts rape. you're all sidestepping around the core concept of what i am saying by saying "look up the esrb"

[QUOTE=KingOfScience;41858402]Why is it bad to try and guarantee that someone sees a warning like that, though? Is a 3-second boost in your video game launch speed really worth potentially inducing a PTSD attack on someone?[/QUOTE] I'm not saying it's an awful suggestion, I'm saying there's no need for it because we already have a warnings system in place that everyone who knows the term "video game" knows about.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858411]ok if you bought a game third hand without a box you should be doing some fucking research anyhow, and most online distributors show ESRB ratings when you're on store pages, and i've even seen some that go out of their way to say "warning this shit's p. brutal so watch out"[/QUOTE] so why not say "warning, this shit has rape in it" lol [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858420]I'm not saying it's an awful suggestion, I'm saying there's no need for it because we already have a warnings system in place that everyone who knows the term "video game" knows about.[/QUOTE] yeah, i dont think you need to do it, im just saying i think you should. that's it

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858415]okayyyy so why not include a warning at the beginning of the game if you are the one of 10000 games that depicts rape. you're all sidestepping around the core concept of what i am saying by saying "look up the esrb"[/QUOTE] You're sidestepping all of our arguments by "but why cant you just put it there anyways????" of course it's thoughtful and noble, but why should I as a content creator slap more warnings then i need to onto my game? I expect the audience understands what "sexual violence" means and if they don't then they're probably not in a state to be playing my game anyhow.

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858415]okayyyy so why not include a warning at the beginning of the game if you are the one of 10000 games that depicts rape. you're all sidestepping around the core concept of what i am saying by saying "look up the esrb"[/QUOTE] What is the point of having a warning at the beginning of the game by the way? If you were really trying to avoid a rape scene in a video game, why would you want to be warned after you've bought it?

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858421]so why not say "warning, this shit has rape in it" lol [/QUOTE] because I don't need to as a content creator, I've done my job to inform the public? perhaps i should have tool tips on my loading screens "remember this game has rape in it!" because that wont detract from your playtime either

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858429]You're sidestepping all of our arguments by "but why cant you just put it there anyways????" of course it's thoughtful and noble, but why should I as a content creator slap more warnings then i need to onto my game? I expect the audience understands what "sexual violence" means and if they don't then they're probably not in a state to be playing my game anyhow.[/QUOTE] the problem is youre not even arguing with me! sure, you should look up esrb ratings! sure, you can expect your audience to understand that! i do not caaaare about any of those things, you are right as far as I am concerned but for the small percentage of people who dont do those things, it would just be nice to have a warning. it's not a big deal. why should you do it? it'd be nice. that's literally ALL there is to it.

[QUOTE=Mr Flexi;41858434]What is the point of having a warning at the beginning of the game by the way? If you were really trying to avoid a rape scene in a video game, why would you want to be warned after you've bought it?[/QUOTE] this too, you failed as a content creator if people are buying your game only to be informed by a splash screen.

[QUOTE=Mr Flexi;41858434]What is the point of having a warning at the beginning of the game by the way? If you were really trying to avoid a rape scene in a video game, why would you want to be warned after you've bought it?[/QUOTE] in case you missed the other ones, or so you can learn more about it and avoid it when playing the game, etc. so that you can become aware of it and then DECIDE what YOU want to do about it.

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858437]the problem is youre not even arguing with me! sure, you should look up esrb ratings! sure, you can expect your audience to understand that! i do not caaaare about any of those things, you are right as far as I am concerned but for the small percentage of people who dont do those things, it would just be nice to have a warning. it's not a big deal. why should you do it? it'd be nice. that's literally ALL there is to it.[/QUOTE] the small group of people who dont do that need to learn to be more responsible then.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858436]because I don't need to as a content creator, I've done my job to inform the public? perhaps i should have tool tips on my loading screens "remember this game has rape in it!" because that wont detract from your playtime either[/QUOTE] ugh no shit you dont need to make a fucking videogame in the first place.

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858421]so why not say "warning, this shit has rape in it" lol [/QUOTE] Because thats what the sexual violence tag means. Sexual violence in games, pretty much boils down to rape. (although i acknowledge that sexual harassment and such is counted as sexual violence, esrb has different ratings for that, so they just use sexual violence for rape) If there is rape in a game its going to get branded with sexual violence. Which will appear on a box OR the page you are buying the game from.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858420]I'm not saying it's an awful suggestion, I'm saying there's no need for it because we already have a warnings system in place that everyone who knows the term "video game" knows about.[/QUOTE] But what if someone doesn't know about the ESRB, or forgets to check? Would a slight annoyance like that on your part REALLY make much of a difference to you? No, it more than likely would not, whereas it might help some rape victim somewhere avoid an incredibly uncomfortable and mentally painful experience.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858444]the small group of people who dont do that need to learn to be more responsible then.[/QUOTE] maybe they should. that doesn't change anything.

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858442]in case you missed the other ones, or so you can learn more about it and avoid it when playing the game, etc. so that you can become aware of it and then DECIDE what YOU want to do about it.[/QUOTE] At the end of the day, you're arguing that it wouldn't take much to add something to warn a group of people, however at the same time it doesn't take much time to research the thing you're paying for. We all lose.

[QUOTE=EnlightenDead;41858451]Because thats what the sexual violence tag means. Sexual violence in games, pretty much boils down to rape. (although i acknowledge that sexual harassment and such is counted as sexual violence, esrb has different ratings for that, so they just use sexual violence for rape) If there is rape in a game its going to get branded with sexual violence. Which will appear on a box OR the page you are buying the game from.[/QUOTE] here's the esrb thing again. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Mr Flexi;41858457]At the end of the day, you're arguing that it wouldn't take much to add something to warn a group of people however at the same time, it doesn't take much time to research the thing you're paying for. We all lose.[/QUOTE] well the people who won't be triggered by rape depiction who missed the esrb thing or whatever for whatever reason will win, and i dont get who "loses" by adding a small warning other than "people who dont feel like adding a warning to their game"

[QUOTE=KingOfScience;41858452]But what if someone doesn't know about the ESRB, or forgets to check? Would a slight annoyance like that on your part REALLY make much of a difference to you? No, it more than likely would not, whereas it might help some rape victim somewhere avoid an incredibly uncomfortable and mentally painful experience.[/QUOTE] Jesus christ you people are supporting yourselves off of such tiny what if's your argument is literally falling in on itself sure i can put a warning infront of my game, i can put a warning every level if i felt like it, but why the fuck should i do that for that small of a minority. If someone ends up getting triggered from my product, I'll definitely write an apology and add measures in the future, but the fucking odds of it happening are so miniscule you may as well be operating on theory

its not even an argument you dont get that its a suggestion because why not, it will help some people. also 1/5 women have been sexually assaulted so i think there is much more than "miniscule" odds.

this is what i mean when i say being thoughtful. this is a significant portion of the population [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Primigenes;41858473]Whats the point of even separating the two? Don't say that because rape is rarely depicted in video games either. Sexual violence is rarely depicted or tagged on Games. Anyway what I'm saying is sexual violence tag may as well be a huge trigger warning in itself. Anything that would most likely trigger a rape victim goes under "Sexual violence" or "Sexual Assault". It covers depictions or rape and what would most likely cause a rape victim to trigger. You either research or stay away from the game. Anything else is unnecessary[/QUOTE] sexual violence is a warning, and its a good one. i am saying another would not hurt. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] and look, I agree! its not necessary. it's NICE.

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858405]i dont think rape can be just shuffled under "violence". there is far more to it than that. also the "anything can cause ptsd" thing again. I've addressed this three times now, maybe more. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] and then an attack on me at the end. what a surprise.[/QUOTE] There's far more to most triggers of PTSD. What's your point? It's a form of sexual violence. It's an attack (act of violence) in which sex is forced (a sexual act). It causes mental and emotional trauma, yes, but why does that make it more important than other things that can cause mental and emotional trauma? You can't single it out just because you feel like it. You may see it as more important, but does that mean the rest of the world does? Give me some solid proof other than your opinion as to why rape constitutes a secondary warning while everything else gets ignored. [QUOTE]and then an attack on me at the end. what a surprise.[/QUOTE] Ahaha oh my God do you like to play the victim or what? I was merely stating an observation. Many people have brought up many good points, but all you have done thus far is repeated yourself and picked out what you wanted from most of the arguments here. Usually including sarcastic statements in an attempt to make the other person or persons look stupid. Sarcasm isn't an argument, and when used in one it is just asking for trouble. That wasn't an "attack" on you, and your statement of [QUOTE]what a surprise.[/QUOTE] just proves my point.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858436]perhaps i should have tool tips on my loading screens "remember this game has rape in it!" because that wont detract from your playtime either[/QUOTE] Nobody in this thread has said "put rape warnings on the screen at all times" just an extra, non-intrusive precaution to maybe help out a few people while minimally effecting everyone else

oh ho ho ho you're really gonna throw that number out there without filing it down to be relevant? Take that 1/5, cut it down to group who purchase games for personal use, then cut it down to the number of people who don't know what the ESRB. You'll get a much finer number than 1/5 of women [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=KingOfScience;41858486]Nobody in this thread has said "put rape warnings on the screen at all times" just an extra, non-intrusive precaution to maybe help out a few people while minimally effecting everyone else[/QUOTE] but why not have it on every loading screen? it wont effect my other customers and it'll nail in the warning for my consumers who apparently don't know how to read obvious warnings.

[QUOTE=NuggetWarmer;41858482]There's far more to most triggers of PTSD. What's your point? It's a form of sexual violence. It's an attack (act of violence) in which sex is forced (a sexual act). It causes mental and emotional trauma, yes, but why does that make it more important than other things that can cause mental and emotional trauma? You can't single it out just because you feel like it. You may see it as more important, but does that mean the rest of the world does? Give me some solid proof other than your opinion as to why rape constitutes a secondary warning while everything else gets ignored. Ahaha oh my God do you like to play the victim or what? I was merely stating an observation. Many people have brought up many good points, but all you have done thus far is repeated yourself and picked out what you wanted from most of the arguments here. Usually including sarcastic statements in an attempt to make the other person or persons look stupid. Sarcasm isn't an argument, and when used in one it is just asking for trouble. That wasn't an "attack" on you, and your statement of just proves my point.[/QUOTE] [img]http://i.imgur.com/2PsyxLM.png[/img] also any "sarcasm" on my part is in direct response to someone saying i am "stupid" or "trolling" which is an attack. i fight fire with fire on the internets [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=No Party Hats;41858488]oh ho ho ho you're really gonna throw that number out there without filing it down to be relevant? Take that 1/5, cut it down to group who purchase games for personal use, then cut it down to the number of people who don't know what the ESRB. You'll get a much finer number than 1/5 of women [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] but why not have it on every loading screen? it wont effect my other customers and it'll nail in the warning for my consumers who apparently don't know how to read obvious warnings.[/QUOTE] oh ho ho if you dont want to do it dont do it. its not an argument. have it every other warning screen if you want, or dont have it at all. if you did have it, it would be nice and people would appreciate it, if you didnt, then thats that.

[QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858498][img]http://i.imgur.com/2PsyxLM.png[/img] also any "sarcasm" on my part is in direct response to someone saying i am "stupid" or "trolling" which is an attack. [b]i fight fire with fire on the internets[/b][/QUOTE] then you're in the wrong. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Vedicardi;41858498][img]http://i.imgur.com/2PsyxLM.png[/img] also any "sarcasm" on my part is in direct response to someone saying i am "stupid" or "trolling" which is an attack. i fight fire with fire on the internets [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] oh ho ho if you dont want to do it dont do it. its not an argument. have it every other warning screen if you want, or dont have it at all. if you did have it, it would be nice and people would appreciate it, if you didnt, then thats that.[/QUOTE] Here's my suggestion. if you're part of the small populous of rape victims who frequent video games, get educated before purchasing games because "oh boy this cover sure looks pretty!!!"

i'll live. thanks, though. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] okay, that's a nice suggestion. i am suggesting something different.

also i love how you backed off the 1/5 thing once i pointed out how stupid it was